Frodo or the Ring? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Gwaihir the Windlord · 01-02-2001, 08:43 PM

<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Essence of Darkness
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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/onering.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Frodo or the Ring?

Either Frodo or the Ring spoke a (minor) prophecy. How could Frodo have performed this? Not by himself, I think.
Sauron was an Ainu, and therefore took part in the Music and saw the Vision. He would consequently have some, if not very much, capacity to foretell future events. Frodo was wearing the object containing the greater part of Sauron's native strength; this could mean one of two things.

a) The Ring, holding Sauron's power of prophecy, spoke, or

b) Frodo, weilding Sauron's power of prophecy and unwittingly aided by it, spoke.

I'm inclined to think that the latter of these is true. Why would the Ring keep silent although it passed through the clutches of Nazgul, Orc-companies and Easterlings?

However, in Bag End ( The Shadow of the Past), Gandalf talked to Frodo about the Ring.
<blockquote>Quote:<hr> '..even so, he (Bilbo) could not have just forsaken it, or thrown it aside. It was not Gollum, Frodo, but the Ring itself that decided things. The Ring left him.'

'What, just in time to be picked up by Bilbo?' said Frodo. 'Wouldn't an Orc have suited it better?'

'It is no laughing matter,' said Gandalf. 'Not for you. It was the strangest event in the whole history of the Ring so far: Bilbo's arrival just at that time, and putting his hand on it, blindly, in the dark.
'There was more than power at work, Frodo. The Ring was trying to get back to it's master. It had slupped from Isildur's hand and betrayed him; then when a chance came it caught poor Deagol, and he was murdered; and after that Gollum, and it had devoured him. It could make no further use of him: he was too small and mean; and as long as it stayed with him he would never leave his deep pool again. So now, when it's master was wide awake once more and sending out his dark though from Mirkwood, it abandoned Gollum. Only to picked up by the most unlikely person imaginable: Bilbo Baggins from the Shire!'<hr></blockquote>

In this passage it is suggested that

a) The Ring had a mind of it's own

b) Sauron had some magical mmagnetic power that was drawing the Ring, by whatever means, to him

There is just too much evidence on both sides. I can't make up my mind whether it was Frodo or the Ring that spoke on Mount Mindolluin.

(Well done, Mithadan!)

Gwaihir the Windlord http://www.barrowdowns.comthe barrow-downs</A>
<FONT size="2.5">'Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor,
for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever,
and the Dark Tower is thrown down.'
</p>

01-02-2001, 08:43 PM	#1
Gwaihir the Windlord Essence of Darkness Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Evermore Posts: 1,420	<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Essence of Darkness Posts: 642</TD><TD><img src=http://www.geocities.com/gwindlord/eagle.jpg WIDTH=60 HEIGHT=60></TD></TR></TABLE> <img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/onering.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Frodo or the Ring? Either Frodo or the Ring spoke a (minor) prophecy. How could Frodo have performed this? Not by himself, I think. Sauron was an Ainu, and therefore took part in the Music and saw the Vision. He would consequently have some, if not very much, capacity to foretell future events. Frodo was wearing the object containing the greater part of Sauron's native strength; this could mean one of two things. a) The Ring, holding Sauron's power of prophecy, spoke, or b) Frodo, weilding Sauron's power of prophecy and unwittingly aided by it, spoke. I'm inclined to think that the latter of these is true. Why would the Ring keep silent although it passed through the clutches of Nazgul, Orc-companies and Easterlings? However, in Bag End ( The Shadow of the Past), Gandalf talked to Frodo about the Ring. <blockquote>*Quote:<hr> '..even so, he (Bilbo) could not have just forsaken it, or thrown it aside. It was not Gollum, Frodo, but the Ring itself that decided things. The Ring left him.' 'What, just in time to be picked up by Bilbo?' said Frodo. 'Wouldn't an Orc have suited it better?' 'It is no laughing matter,' said Gandalf. 'Not for you. It was the strangest event in the whole history of the Ring so far: Bilbo's arrival just at that time, and putting his hand on it, blindly, in the dark. 'There was more than power at work, Frodo. The Ring was trying to get back to it's master. It had slupped from Isildur's hand and betrayed him; then when a chance came it caught poor Deagol, and he was murdered; and after that Gollum, and it had devoured him. It could make no further use of him: he was too small and mean; and as long as it stayed with him he would never leave his deep pool again. So now, when it's master was wide awake once more and sending out his dark though from Mirkwood, it abandoned Gollum. Only to picked up by the most unlikely person imaginable: Bilbo Baggins from the Shire!'<hr></blockquote> In this passage it is suggested that a) The Ring had a mind of it's own b) Sauron had some magical mmagnetic power that was drawing the Ring, by whatever means, to him There is just too much evidence on both sides. I can't make up my mind whether it was Frodo or the Ring that spoke on Mount Mindolluin. (Well done, Mithadan!) Gwaihir the Windlord http://www.barrowdowns.comthe barrow-downs</A>* <FONT size="2.5">'Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor, for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever, and the Dark Tower is thrown down.' </p>