Game Thread: TIG XCII - Disaster by the Lake

[A Little Green]

Originally Posted by Nog

An innocent fears everyone as an innocent doesn't know the roles of others. Thus an innocent can't give a free pass to anyone. An innocent can't afford to say "never mind that person".

Nog, you're reaching. Lottie never said "never mind that person" but rather "never mind that particular point against that person" - which is something an innocent can afford to say.

[Inziladun]

Hmm. I may have to vote here in a bit, and not much clue who to go for.

Bom is just too easy of a target, on Day 1 especially.

Greenie's been bringing up some interesting points about Nog..

Then there's Kit and Sally who have been very quiet.

Agan makes me nervous, no surprise there.



x/d with Agan

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Aganzir

Where? What makes it look like that?
Yes statistics say so and all, but it's just as likely there was no wolf. Saying "a wolf was probably involved here or there" is entirely arbitrary and works only to cast suspicion on a certain group of players without reason - it's almost as good as saying "there's probably a wolf within the first third of the player list".

Not the first three, but the earlier talk about Bom. See what I wrote in #27.

Originally Posted by Aganzir

As for a), I wouldn't have to give credit to Bom's reveal. It would be a convenient situation for a wolf to alert the cobbler (or the other way round), whoever she is. The cobbler and/or the wolves surely being smart and all, they will keep an eye on me until I do something overtly innocent, and we'll see who laughs last.
And b)... have I actually done that?

a) Thanks for the education. b) Didn't you forget a there? Seriously, yes, I've at least once seen you trying to look like a cobbler to the wolves and/or vice versa.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by LupineGreen?

to sum up - he's reaching, first with Gal, then with Lottie. Both are known to be easy early lynches. I don't like it.

I was not reaching with Galadriel as I only asked from what role would she say that?

Also, I think I made it clear why I think Lottie looks suspicious. Greenie seems to have had no time or wish to comment on my explanation on that (#47). And what I said in #55 doesn't make Greenie look any better.

But seeing Inzil's eagerness to jump on what Greenie has been preparing looks not the less suspicious. Blah... the clock is ticking and I need to go to sleep...

[Aganzir]

Out of the two, Greenie looks more nit-picky while Inzil looks opportunistic, but then again it's Inzil who's already been voted for... except I'm not sure if it was ever going to turn into a bandwagon. Hmm.

Vote count in a minute.

[Aganzir]

Gal - Nerwen
Kath - Inzil
Inzil - Nog
Greenie - Nog 2 (xed with Zil's vote)

Left: Agan, Bom, Kit, Lottie, Nog, Nerwen, Pitch, sally, Shasta

[Loslote]

I am not especially happy with Zil's vote, but I'm also not especially happy with the arguments against him earlier in the Day. Neither am I happy with Nog's case against me, which is not only based on a exageration of a misinterpretation of an early Day 1 comment, but I think it's also a bit silly if you think about it. I'm not convinced of the furriness of either of them, but they are currently my choices for lynchdom - probably Nog more than Zil, but I not sure if that's just me being grumpy.

Edit: Xed with Shasta's vote

[Aganzir]

If Lottie is a wolf, which would've been the most sensible/typical course for her: to keep going after Bom (and hopefully eventually get an innocent lynched, assuming he's one); or take the careful path and drop the suspicion so she wouldn't be suspected herself?

If Lottie is a wolf, how did Bom's "reveal" affect what she said of him?

Reading back trying to find an answer for these questions brought me to this:

Originally Posted by Greenie

Cobbler? He doesn't look any more cobblerish than usual. (Not taking into account, of course, that his occupation is "cobbler" - but I think we should forget that before somebody, somewhere, gets confused.) Seriously now, I don't think we can deduce much anything from Bom's posts this far since they have not, at least in my opinion, differed in any remarkable way of the way he plays whatever his role.

Why single out cobbler? Does she want to say, "No, see here, Bom is not the cobbler!!"
And Lottie's reply:

I don't think I've played with him enough yet - I didn't realize this was standard Bom. Never mind, then.

So how did it become about the cobbler? As I see it, Lottie originally also offered two other options! It looks like they're both reading too much into it: first Greenie grasps at a part of a sentence, then Lottie immediately backs off.
Weirdos.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

From the phone - I don't know what to make of Agan's little slip just now, in regards to.... Was it Lottie? It is so difficult to work on this thing. It had to do with Agan pointing out that someone looked Gifted, which is odd (the cobblery kind).

Right now though -

++Inzil

++Inzil

I can't remember which format is right, so there's both.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Clarification - Agan in regards to Lottie thinking "unusual" means "wolfish", post 50.

[Bom Tombadillo]

Even after rereading the thread I'm somewhat confused, but I just get that way sometimes, so meh. I'll make a final decision on who to vote for later.

EDIT: X'd with everyone since Nog.

[Nogrod]

Darn deadline. I should go to sleep but then again the game is finally turning out interesting - and the whisper in my ear says "it's only 40 minutes, c'mon"...

If I would need to vote right now not caring about the probabilities of who's actually going to get lynched, I'd say Greenie. But I'm going to think about the other possibilities as well as connections for a moment then.

Lottie: sure, when Greenie gives you the line that makes your comment less suspicious it is clear you say that is the one you meant - and I mean in both cases; if you're an innocent or if you're a wolf.

I do smell some wisdom from the Owl of Minerva here (afterthought, wisdom after the facts, whatever way you have of saying it in English).

[Loslote]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Lottie: sure, when Greenie gives you the line that makes your comment less suspicious it is clear you say that is the one you meant - and I mean in both cases; if you're an innocent or if you're a wolf.

No, this isn't a case of trying to avoid suspicion. At this point I don't really get surprised at Day 1 suspicion. That's not what bothers me here. I simply don't see how you could think I would do that at all, wolf or innocent. Free passes are not something I (or anyone else, I should think!) give out on basis of one line of reasoning being cut off. Your argument makes no sense to me because I wouldn't do that, no matter what role I happen to have.

EDIT: xed thrice

[Loslote]

Originally Posted by Aganzir

And why would a wolf do that?

To look like the cobbler, which I actually said in my first post about him.

EDIT: xed with Shasta

[Kitanna]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Then there's Kit and Sally who have been very quiet.

I did say I wasn't going to be around until an hour before DL.

But I am back and I've skimmed and Lottie's name looked bolded a lot and I see two votes for Nog. I'm going to do the best I can to read and comment in the time I have.

[Kitanna]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Be known that Galadriel55 is a sneaking, backstabbing wretch! Let none sample her cooking!

I bet she says the same thing about you Nerwen.

Originally Posted by Nog

So even if I see what Greenie and some others say, I'm not going to let Bom slip by just for that being "normal" to him.

I find it more telling how Bom reacts when people accuse him based on goofy posts.

Originally Posted by Nog

If Galadriel were a gifted she wouldn't have then slipped that "I can actually participate a bit more are Nights" -thing. That would be far too reckless. But could she slip it as a wolf? Or is it just an ordo talking things that are not necessarily to the point regarding the game (as ordos have nothing to do by Night)?

I read this as an innocent statement saying she has no time during the Day phase right now. I think a lot of us fall into this category toDay.

In post #24 I like what Nog has to say about the after posts from Inzil and Lottie regarding Bom. I still feel their remarks about Bom were made in jest, but they backed away in seriousness when before things had been light Day 1 jargon.

Originally Posted by Bom

Lastly, Nerwen? Would you mind providing an explanation for why G55's vote is "backstabbing?" Perhaps you had agreed not to do wolf-on-wolf, or some such thing . . .

This is reading too much into an IC joke post for my taste.

Originally Posted by Pitch[/quote

Kit #12 supposes that both Zil & Lottie weren't serious because of smilies in their post. Why say that when nobody had yet questioned the whole matter? Wasn't it a bit early in the Day to be so concerned for peace in the village, while in the same breath complaining there was nothing going on?

It wasn't meant to defend or accuse them, but to state the fact that that was all that was happening at the time. I didn't want to disappear for 12 hours and have everyone wondering where I went.

Originally Posted by Bom's response to Pitch

True, but on most of the occasions when I've seen the phrase used, it's been in cases of treachery. It may have different connotations to others of course.

What kind of wolf openly accuses another one of backstabbing in public?

Originally Posted by Kath

G55, Kitanna and Bom should be the three wolves. One wolf says 'well we could start with silly list posts' but unfortunately they all three did it!

I so rarely get to do the silly list thing. I always show up too late and stuff has actually happened. How I relished the idea of doing it, only to have two more following immediately. I'm so sad. /lamenting sarcasm In seriousness, I wish I hadn't even bothered.

Originally Posted by Bom

I'm still suspicious of Nerwolf, though Wolfrod makes some good points about Wolf-zilla. I might vote for either of them (either of Nerwolf or Wolf-zilla, that is). Galadriwolf55 still doesn't seem that terribly suspicious to me, though that opinion is subject to change

Color me stupid, but who is Wolf-zilla? Godzilla's hairy cousin? Are you suspicious of Nerwen solely on her "backstabbing post"? And I'm reading fast and missing things, but when did Nog get on people's radars?

Originally Posted by Bom

And is there any problem with being suspicious of someone based on things another pointed out?

This was a response to Shasta. And this right here is why I fall to suspecting you. You get so very defensive when people question you and your reasonings. I've learned from the past not to jump on this defensive behavior on Day 1, but I have other reasons for suspecting you. I'm curious about this suspicions of Nerwen. She hasn't said anything but her IC post and a quick rebuttal. Please correct me if I'm wrong about that. Why is she your suspect? Why is Nogrod your suspect? Explanations please!

Originally Posted by Nog

An innocent fears everyone as an innocent doesn't know the roles of others. Thus an innocent can't give a free pass to anyone. An innocent can't afford to say "never mind that person".

This is an interesting point, not only in relation to Lottie, but in general. I don't have time to sit and pick apart Lottie's posts, especially the ones in question.

Originally Posted by Greenie

Nog, you're reaching. Lottie never said "never mind that person" but rather "never mind that particular point against that person" - which is something an innocent can afford to say.

This is the first thing I've seen that suggests Nog may be up to no good. I.E. putting words in Lottie's mouth to lean the lynching to her?

Originally Posted by Inzil

Like I said, I think Greenie's noticed a couple of things, and now it looks like he may be turning to my bandwaggon.

Bandwagon? As in he's trying to get one on you?

Inzil's vote for Nog seems like a piggyback on Greenie's suspicious. Aside from Nog, she's made the best case for a lynch candidate and it's not even that strong. (I don't expect any to be that strong toDAy though)

Greenie makes a decent point about Nog. If I had time to scrutinize I could judge for myself, however I find myself lamenting my time crisis over and over when there's nothing to be done about it. So I'm making my decision now, as best I can based on the little information I've gained in less than an hour.

And even now as I hit "refresh" thing are being said of note! Ah!

[Kitanna]

I desperately want to read Lottie and Nog, but there's no time.

++ Inzil

He jumped on Greenie's point about Nog so fast and that was just way too opportunistic, especially with Nog trying to build his own case for Inzil.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Kitanna

This is the first thing I've seen that suggests Nog may be up to no good. I.E. putting words in Lottie's mouth to lean the lynching to her?

Greenie makes a decent point about Nog.

...by putting words into her mouth as well... but of the kind Lottie will like.

More wolvish than not.

[Aganzir]

++Inzil

[Nogrod]

++ Inziladun

[Aganzir]

And now to bed, Noggins!

[Kitanna]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

...by putting words into her mouth as well... but of the kind Lottie will like.

Isn't twisting words and pointing fingers the true spirit of WW?