Strider the Ranger is back - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Nilpaurion Felagund · 10-05-2003, 09:11 PM

Quote:

'Look!' said Pippin. 'Strider the Ranger has come back!'
'He has never been away,' said Aragorn. 'I am Strider and Dunadan too, and I belong both to Gondor and the North.'

What does this mean?

tinewelt · 10-05-2003, 09:32 PM

Quote:

'Look!' said Pippin. 'Strider the Ranger has come back!'
'He has never been away,' said Aragorn. 'I am Strider and Dunadan too, and I belong both to Gondor and the North.'

He is simply stating that he is both loyal to the Rangers (dunadain) and also Gondor. Although he is now going to become king of Gondor, he also shows his love and respect for his Rangers, which he was a part of for most of his life. During the battles, he was fighting on behalf of both Gondor and the Rangers. I tried to find it in the book, so that I could explain it better. But I am sure someone else will do that.

Legolas · 10-05-2003, 09:43 PM

Could you be a little more specific with the question? What part of the passage is confusing you?

Nilpaurion Felagund · 10-05-2003, 10:03 PM

Quite sorry. I was asking about Pippin's comment. What, didn't he recognise Aragorn before that, or did he think Aragorn's mood just reverted to the Strider they met at Bree?

Arwen1858 · 10-05-2003, 10:37 PM

I think it was that he saw the same attitudes as Strider the Ranger. Pippin saw him more as Strider the Ranger than Aragorn the King. That's how I took it, anyways.
Arwen

Maéglin · 10-05-2003, 11:30 PM

Well Pippin was introduced to Aragorn as Strider, a ranger of the wild who did not exactly look pleasant because of his experiences. Yet more and more, Pippin saw a side of Aragorn that was more lordly and dignified so when he saw Strider with his legs on the table smoking pipe weed (where the quote comes from) he was reminded of the Strider he first "knew."

Gwaihir the Windlord · 10-06-2003, 01:46 AM

Hmm, did you think then, Nilpaurion, that Pippin actually thought Aragorn was someone else? It was just a lighthearted comment. Aragorn at this point seemed to have reverted from his kinglike image to his old, worn Ranger of Eriador appearance; Strider had indeed returned.

As for North and South, these were the two kingdoms that Aragorn was setting out to reunite. The North-kingdom of old, Arnor, and the South-kingdom of Gondor. He was king of both of them.

dancing spawn of ungoliant · 10-06-2003, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Pippin was introduced to Aragorn as Strider, a ranger of the wild who did not exactly look pleasant because of his experiences. ... when he saw Strider with his legs on the table smoking pipe weed (where the quote comes from) he was reminded of the Strider he first "knew."

So, was Pippin "insulting" Aragorn or what?
I understand your point, actually I agree with you, Maéglin but it is kind of weird to say to someone that:" hey, you don't look like a king anymore...you look like a dirty, smelling ranger!"

Finwe · 10-06-2003, 05:49 PM

As Gandalf said to Pippin, right before they met Denethor,

Quote:

If you have walked all these days with closed eyes and mind asleep, wake up now!

Pippin had absolutely no idea of "Strider's" true history and identity until Gandalf told him straight out in Minas Tirith.

Arwen1858 · 10-06-2003, 05:56 PM

Good point, Finwe. I had forgotten about that. Pip probably felt like Strider wasn't acting like himself. He was acting more like a high, important, royal person instead of the Ranger that Pippin knew him as. I don't think he was insulting him, though. If anything, Pippin probably meant it as a compliment, because he felt it was the real, down-to-earth Strider.

ArathorofBarahir · 10-08-2003, 01:23 PM

When Pippin saw Aragorn again he saw Strider not the King, he saw Aragorn as a Ranger.

Birdland · 10-09-2003, 11:09 PM

Quote:

So, was Pippin "insulting" Aragorn or what?

Far from it! Remember that Pippin comes from a society that has little truck with royalty (Ever hear of a King of the Hobbits?) Pippin would have regarded his comment as a compliment, in a way. Aragorn's enjoyment of a pipe with some old friends shows that he can still fit in with "just folks", and that all this talk of kingship has not gone to his head.

I imagine that Pippin was a little relieved to see the old "Strider", and perhaps Aragorn was a little relieved to assume that role again - if only for a little while.

Gwaihir the Windlord · 10-10-2003, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Remember that Pippin comes from a society that has little truck with royalty (Ever hear of a King of the Hobbits?)

The Thane was like to a Baron of some sort, but this is close enough to royalty. And they certainly acknowledged the King of Arnor in the two periods that he existed.

Birdland · 10-10-2003, 07:31 AM

Mmmmm, perhaps. I always thought of the Thain as more the head of whatever militia the Shire may have had. He kept no standing army, and though his advise may have been sought, he made no laws, nor passed out rulings or punishments on the citizens. And unlike a king, I imagine he spent his share of time down at the local pub.

As for acknowledging the King of Arnor, Hobbits did ask his permission when seeking to establish their own country, but after that you get the feeling they were left to their own devices, at least within their borders.

No, Hobbits really don't seem to be much into this whole "King" business, all in all. Even Merry, who loved and admired King Theoden, did so because he just liked Theoden, not because he was a mighty warrior or powerful ruler.

doug*platypus · 01-14-2004, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Pip probably felt like Strider wasn't acting like himself. He was acting more like a high, important, royal person instead of the Ranger that Pippin knew him as.

Between Bree and leaving Rivendell, we find out that "all that is gold does not glitter", that within the body of a grubby ranger can dwell a great king. The episode at Isengard shows us that the opposite is true as well: the most high and mighty nobleman even in an epic fantasy still has a kernel of basic human nature within him, and the desire to just sit back and smoke a pipe. Nice symmetry.

It also shows us the heartening thought that Strider has not completely disappeared, and that Aragorn will still retain some of his humble roots. As an aside, I always liked Gandalf the Grey slightly better than Gandalf the White, but he seems to have disappeared even more than Strider has by the end of the story.

Finwe · 01-14-2004, 10:03 PM

Aragorn had been forced to "grow up," as you will, in a very short period of time. He had to take on numerous responsibilities, that he would never have taken on if he had been back North. Kings are responsible for an entire city, and in a city as big as Minas Tirith, there are thousands of people. Aragorn was probably so caught up in his "duties," that he had no time to spend with his "old friend," Pippin. Besides, Pippin was a member of the Citadel Guard, who were trained to serve and look up to the Steward (and technically, the King). It was Pippin's job to treat Aragorn as "Aragorn," but in that moment, he treated him as "Strider," merely an old friend.

Lost One · 01-15-2004, 05:39 PM

I think people tend to overlook the fact that hobbit society is pretty stratified, and a small group of leading families dominate the scene: these are essentially the families related to Bilbo as enumerated in the party chapter. The Bagginses are the 'gentry' for Hobbiton, for example. Right at the top are the two very rich and powerful hereditary figures of the Took and Thain and the Brandybuck Master of Buckland (whose family were formerly the Oldbucks, and Thains before the Tooks). Pippin and Merry are the eldest sons and heirs of these figures. They actually are 'princes of the halflings'. Social relations in the Shire are fairly good, but still although the Gamgees, Cottons, Sandymans and the rest may gossip about 'the quality' in the safety of the pub, they are deferential enough to their faces, while Merry and Pippin on their home ground are breezy and confident despite their youth, as their status would encourage.

Nilpaurion Felagund · 01-16-2004, 12:42 AM

This is the second thread of mine revived. Aside from stoking my ego(seeing my name on the Books thread is good for the self), it makes me feel weird. So ignore this post.

10-05-2003, 09:43 PM	#3
Legolas A Northern Soul Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Valinor Posts: 1,847	Could you be a little more specific with the question? What part of the passage is confusing you? __________________ ...take counsel with thyself, and remember who and what thou art.

10-05-2003, 10:03 PM	#4
Nilpaurion Felagund Scion of The Faithful Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: The brink, where hope and despair are akin. [The Philippines] Posts: 5,312	Quite sorry. I was asking about Pippin's comment. What, didn't he recognise Aragorn before that, or did he think Aragorn's mood just reverted to the Strider they met at Bree? __________________ フェンリス鴨 (Fenrisu Kamo) The plot, cut, defeated. I intend to copy this sig forever - so far so good...

10-05-2003, 10:37 PM	#5
Arwen1858 Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Gondor Posts: 516	I think it was that he saw the same attitudes as Strider the Ranger. Pippin saw him more as Strider the Ranger than Aragorn the King. That's how I took it, anyways. Arwen __________________ Will Turner: "This is either madness or brilliance." Jack Sparrow: "It's remarkable how often those two traits coincide." ~ Pirates of the Caribbean

10-06-2003, 05:56 PM	#10
Arwen1858 Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Gondor Posts: 516	Good point, Finwe. I had forgotten about that. Pip probably felt like Strider wasn't acting like himself. He was acting more like a high, important, royal person instead of the Ranger that Pippin knew him as. I don't think he was insulting him, though. If anything, Pippin probably meant it as a compliment, because he felt it was the real, down-to-earth Strider. __________________ Will Turner: "This is either madness or brilliance." Jack Sparrow: "It's remarkable how often those two traits coincide." ~ Pirates of the Caribbean

10-08-2003, 01:23 PM	#11
ArathorofBarahir Wight Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Crickhallow Posts: 247	When Pippin saw Aragorn again he saw Strider not the King, he saw Aragorn as a Ranger. __________________ King of the Dead: The dead do not suffer the living to pass. Aragorn: You will suffer me.

10-05-2003, 11:30 PM	#6
Maéglin Haunting Spirit Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 99	Well Pippin was introduced to Aragorn as Strider, a ranger of the wild who did not exactly look pleasant because of his experiences. Yet more and more, Pippin saw a side of Aragorn that was more lordly and dignified so when he saw Strider with his legs on the table smoking pipe weed (where the quote comes from) he was reminded of the Strider he first "knew."

10-06-2003, 01:46 AM	#7
Gwaihir the Windlord Essence of Darkness Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Evermore Posts: 1,420	Hmm, did you think then, Nilpaurion, that Pippin actually thought Aragorn was someone else? It was just a lighthearted comment. Aragorn at this point seemed to have reverted from his kinglike image to his old, worn Ranger of Eriador appearance; Strider had indeed returned. As for North and South, these were the two kingdoms that Aragorn was setting out to reunite. The North-kingdom of old, Arnor, and the South-kingdom of Gondor. He was king of both of them.

10-10-2003, 07:31 AM	#14
Birdland Ghastly Neekerbreeker Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: the banks of the mighty Scioto Posts: 1,751	Mmmmm, perhaps. I always thought of the Thain as more the head of whatever militia the Shire may have had. He kept no standing army, and though his advise may have been sought, he made no laws, nor passed out rulings or punishments on the citizens. And unlike a king, I imagine he spent his share of time down at the local pub. As for acknowledging the King of Arnor, Hobbits did ask his permission when seeking to establish their own country, but after that you get the feeling they were left to their own devices, at least within their borders. No, Hobbits really don't seem to be much into this whole "King" business, all in all. Even Merry, who loved and admired King Theoden, did so because he just liked Theoden, not because he was a mighty warrior or powerful ruler.

01-14-2004, 10:03 PM	#16
Finwe Deathless Sun Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Royal Suite in the Halls of Mandos Posts: 2,609	Aragorn had been forced to "grow up," as you will, in a very short period of time. He had to take on numerous responsibilities, that he would never have taken on if he had been back North. Kings are responsible for an entire city, and in a city as big as Minas Tirith, there are thousands of people. Aragorn was probably so caught up in his "duties," that he had no time to spend with his "old friend," Pippin. Besides, Pippin was a member of the Citadel Guard, who were trained to serve and look up to the Steward (and technically, the King). It was Pippin's job to treat Aragorn as "Aragorn," but in that moment, he treated him as "Strider," merely an old friend. __________________ But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.

01-15-2004, 05:39 PM	#17
Lost One Haunting Spirit Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 67	I think people tend to overlook the fact that hobbit society is pretty stratified, and a small group of leading families dominate the scene: these are essentially the families related to Bilbo as enumerated in the party chapter. The Bagginses are the 'gentry' for Hobbiton, for example. Right at the top are the two very rich and powerful hereditary figures of the Took and Thain and the Brandybuck Master of Buckland (whose family were formerly the Oldbucks, and Thains before the Tooks). Pippin and Merry are the eldest sons and heirs of these figures. They actually are 'princes of the halflings'. Social relations in the Shire are fairly good, but still although the Gamgees, Cottons, Sandymans and the rest may gossip about 'the quality' in the safety of the pub, they are deferential enough to their faces, while Merry and Pippin on their home ground are breezy and confident despite their youth, as their status would encourage.

01-16-2004, 12:42 AM	#18
Nilpaurion Felagund Scion of The Faithful Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: The brink, where hope and despair are akin. [The Philippines] Posts: 5,312	This is the second thread of mine revived. Aside from stoking my ego(seeing my name on the Books thread is good for the self), it makes me feel weird. So ignore this post. __________________ フェンリス鴨 (Fenrisu Kamo) The plot, cut, defeated. I intend to copy this sig forever - so far so good...