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05-28-2002, 12:12 PM | #1 | |
Pile O'Bones
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 22
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Gillete, The Best Cirdan Can Get!
well, I have a notion all the elves in ME are beardless, yet Cirdan the Shipwright is described as follows:
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any opinions? |
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05-28-2002, 01:39 PM | #2 |
Haunting Spirit
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: In a terrible paradise
Posts: 93
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perhaps it is to make him seem old and wise like he was. (he was the 2nd best elf in my opinion.
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All that is gold does not glitter, Not all that wander are lost; The old that is strong does not wither, Deep roots are not reached by the frost. From the ashes a fire shall be woken, A light from the shadows shall spring; Renewed shall be blade that was broken, The crownless again shall be king. Bilbo Baggins Describing Aragorn Son of Arathorn Heir of Elendil,Elessar-Elfstone of his people |
05-28-2002, 06:07 PM | #4 | |
Eldar Spirit of Truth
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Land of the FREE, Home of the BRAVE
Posts: 794
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Quote:
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*~*Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.*~* |
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05-28-2002, 08:03 PM | #5 |
World's Tallest Hobbit
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Where the view is long
Posts: 2,117
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I know you'll all probably laugh at me, but the very first time i read the books, I imagined Legolas having a beard..hahahaha
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05-28-2002, 09:10 PM | #6 |
Shadow of Malice
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3 life cycles of the elves. Not remembering where I read it, if I read it at all. But I think it reasonable to assume the first is childhood, lasting about 50 years from birth. Then the second cycle takes over where the elf is mature and it seems to last indefinately. The third is the one Cirdan.
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05-31-2002, 09:02 PM | #7 |
Animated Skeleton
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 27
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um no. when elves become extremely old they grow beards, i.e. elrond and cirdan.
cirdan i beleive was there when the elves were first come to ME in Cuivienen. |
06-01-2002, 09:53 AM | #8 |
Sword of the Spirit
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Well, thank You, latando angaina , and Durelen.I guess you learn something everyday .Forgive my ignorance, but I thought Elves didn't have beards because the were unable to grow them, not because they prefered not to have them.
And, Durelen if you are able to come up with the 3rd Elven life stage I would be interested in learning about that too. Thanks
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Blessed be the Lord my Strength, Who trained my hands for war and my fingers to fight. Psallm 144:1 |
06-01-2002, 11:22 AM | #9 |
Wight
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Paths of the Dead
Posts: 108
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Hey, galadriel was an old elf also, much older than Elrond who was born near the end of the first age. Does this mean she had a beard and JRRT forgot to mention it? Or seeing as how she's female, did she have varicose veins and wear push-up bra? Sorry, just couldn't resist doing this after reading that ld elves have beards.
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06-01-2002, 12:08 PM | #10 |
Shadow of Malice
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Elrond didn't have a beard, Tarthang. I don't know what Heen is talking about. Cirdan was probably not one of the first elves to awaken at Cuivienen.
The funny thing is, that is pretty much it on the Three Cycles of life. I am sure there is more on it, probably not published as of yet, because the little snipit in question is from Vinyar Tengwar 41. And as long as CT keeps handing over material to them, new stuff will keep popping up. [ June 01, 2002: Message edited by: Durelen ] |
06-01-2002, 03:33 PM | #11 |
Sword of the Spirit
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Thank You Durelen
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Blessed be the Lord my Strength, Who trained my hands for war and my fingers to fight. Psallm 144:1 |
06-01-2002, 03:41 PM | #12 |
Animated Skeleton
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 27
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sorry, *** was i thinking about Elrond and a beard?lol
and im pretty sure that Cirdan was part of the people who stayed in middle earth when the other elves went west because they were looking for Elwe in the woods or something. |
06-02-2002, 04:22 AM | #13 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Denmark
Posts: 713
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Cirdan was one of the first elves, since Osse convinced him and some of the Teleri to stay behind and not go to the West as the Valar asked. So Falas is actually one of the oldest kingdoms in ME.
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01-09-2003, 03:20 AM | #14 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wolverhampton, England
Posts: 716
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Actually, most of the original elves were dead, since they couldn't control their fea and all of the original 144 had wives,and children, yet their is no mention of Cirdan's psouse or descendants. Maybe losing the ring of power led to Cirdan's beard, and where does it say that Beleg had a beard?
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01-09-2003, 03:29 AM | #15 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Why couldn't the the first 144 control their Fea? Please ellaborate!
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Legends of Middle Earth |
01-09-2003, 03:34 AM | #16 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wolverhampton, England
Posts: 716
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Well, I haven't got the books with me, since I am posting from school, but J.R.R says something about them not beign used to it, hence the lake of first generation Elves on the great journey. Ingwe had a sister, so he couldn't be a first generation, I would say he is second generation, Elwe had quite a few realtives, such as Cirdan and two brothers, Olwe and Elmo, so I would say he is 3rd to 4th generation and he olny ever married Melian and Finwe's first wife was born in Valinor. Does anyone know of the fates of Imin, Tatya and co?
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“If I’m more of an influence on your son as a rapper then you are as a father then you've got to look at yourself as a parent” ~>Ice Cube. "Life is so beautiful"->Don Vito Corleone |
01-09-2003, 03:37 AM | #17 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wolverhampton, England
Posts: 716
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cirdan was probably of a mature enough age to be convinced by Osse, or the Valar as one essay puts it to stay. I think that the Elves reached Beleriand 390 odd years after their awakening?
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“If I’m more of an influence on your son as a rapper then you are as a father then you've got to look at yourself as a parent” ~>Ice Cube. "Life is so beautiful"->Don Vito Corleone |
01-09-2003, 03:08 PM | #18 |
Dead Man of Dunharrow
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In a painting by Professor Tolkien, Beleg is shown with a beard.
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01-10-2003, 07:26 AM | #19 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wolverhampton, England
Posts: 716
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I thought that it appeared that he had a beard and that there was no confimation?
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“If I’m more of an influence on your son as a rapper then you are as a father then you've got to look at yourself as a parent” ~>Ice Cube. "Life is so beautiful"->Don Vito Corleone |
09-15-2004, 01:51 PM | #20 |
Deadnight Chanter
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it seems this is the most fitting place for the question
I'm being mordant, but, do 'Laws and Customs among the Eldar' or any similar piece indicate balding process among the elves? With regards to agent Elrond of the movie, you know. The question is half sarcastic only, though, I'm not only being mordant, but being curios too - anyone remembering anything of the kind?
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09-15-2004, 02:12 PM | #21 | |
Laconic Loreman
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Left when all did.
Heen:
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09-15-2004, 02:33 PM | #22 | |
Bittersweet Symphony
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: On the jolly starship Enterprise
Posts: 1,814
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Quote:
But on topic, I don't recall anything about balding elves anywhere. Many of them are described by their beautiful hair, so I can't see elves being bald at all. If they don't really show any other signs of aging (aside from the occasional beard) then it doesn't seem logical that they would start to lose their hair. I'm no expert, though, so maybe the answer is tucked away in a Letter or a volume of HoME which I haven't gotten to yet. |
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09-15-2004, 07:11 PM | #23 | |
Corpus Cacophonous
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: A green and pleasant land
Posts: 8,390
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The bald Elves of yore ...
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09-16-2004, 11:10 AM | #24 |
Pilgrim Soul
Join Date: May 2004
Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle...
Posts: 9,458
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Well it could be explained by his human ancestry.......... btw Hugo has always had a high hairline even when he was 23 and had masses of hair (cf Bodyline).....
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