Anyone seen Red Book of Westmarch? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

watson107 · 05-13-2011, 01:45 AM

I heard about this project a while back, and it sounds intriguing. A fan pieced together a more canonical version of the movies by rearranging scenes and using deleted footage. The trilogy is split into six movies, each bearing the original title of Tolkien's six books of LotR.

Thoughts? Comments? I would be interested in watching them if they are more faithful to the original.

Estelyn Telcontar · 05-13-2011, 07:15 AM

I haven't heard of this project yet and will be interested in any responses that come. Since the question refers to a movie rather than a book version of Tolkien's story, I'm moving the thread to the Movies forum. Please continue to read and post there - thanks!

oddkins · 05-13-2011, 03:10 PM

This project was discussed at length on TheHallofFire.net...

Here's link to the thread for the first "Book" The Return of the Shadow,

http://www.thehalloffire.net/forum/v...=200424#200424

watson107 · 05-13-2011, 07:40 PM

Hmmm... I need to watch these at some point. With the level of devotion and detail that some fans put into their own works, it's a pity that more directors do not embrace the "experts". Although, I must give PJ credit for openly stating that the fans were now able to go in and do their corrections. While I was not a fan of the changes, PJ did make an excellent choice on location for the movies (considering his limitation of working on Earth). After all, location is at the heart of Tolkien's mythology.

Eönwë · 09-06-2011, 11:20 AM

I have downloaded all six 'books' and watched the first all the way through, and I have to say, I was quite impressed.

I have a few comments:
1. The intro is the only part not taken from the original films, and features Christopher Lee (I believe) reading the Ring-Verse.
2. The pacing was a bit strange, though I suppose it was mostly because I'm used to the normal versions.
3. It follows a narrative closer to the EE than the standard version.
4. I was quite surprised by how smoothly the music was cut, considering that a lot was taken out.
5. The whole thing has been cut down massively (considering it's from the EE) to about 7 and a half hours. Obviously there were some things they had to keep, such as Arwen taking Frodo to Rivendell, but it is definitely cut down a lot.

So basically, I enjoyed it and recommend it, and I'll just have to see how the others are.

For anyone who's interested, this is the official page of the fan edit. It also tells you where you can download it from (I can't say here because I don't want to get the Barrow-Downs in trouble. While I'm sure most of us do have the EE, which makes it legal to download this version, if you don't it's not, so I'm not taking the risk on behalf of the Barrow-Downs).

So yeah, I'm giving it the thumbs up and I'd like to see what anyone else here thinks of it (If you get the time to watch it).

mark12_30 · 11-01-2011, 08:04 AM

Interested, but time may not be kind. Better not wait for me. I'll catch up when & if I can....

Rune Son of Bjarne · 11-01-2011, 04:11 PM

Thanks for the links, this is a must see for me (and I do own the EE). I am a quite busy at the moment though, so it might have to wait until after December 13th.

Eönwë · 11-27-2011, 04:23 AM

Would anyone be interested in a Chapter-by-Chapter/Scene-by-Scene style thing with this, i.e. Book-by-Book?

There are 6 of lengths varying between 47 minutes and 1 hour 45 minutes.

Eönwë · 01-02-2013, 06:09 PM

Ok, I finally got round to watching them all. On the whole, they're a pretty good job. Pretty seamless editing, using the complete recordings, EE, etc.

Books I and II (FOTR) are good. Not much is lost overall (I believe it still reaches over 3).
Books III and IV suffer a bit, because most of the TT is pretty uncanonical. So there are some pacing issues, and they're not really satisfying to watch separately.
V and VI are also short (even shorter, in fact), but even so, they seem to flow better.

General comments:

Almost all the Gimli jokes are cut, so he becomes a pretty serious character, but some of the enemy-to-friend banter feeling between him and Legolas is lost because of this.
Narrative is split more like book, so III-V only follow one group each, intro is moved, etc.
There are some awkward cuts in an attempt to make it more book-like. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.
Most of moany (and therefore most of) Elrond is cut.
No Saruman Uruk-Hai spawning from mud.
Far less Saruman scenes, but at least his final scene appears.
The EE flet-scene is gone, which I thought was kind of a pointless cut.
Faramir doesn't really get tempted by ring- but is therefore cut a bit too much for us to feel anything. I think that keeping the Boromir/Faramir flashback scene may have been useful.
Denethor gets very very cut, but is far more canonical.
There are some sneaky/clever edits to avoid some scenes, but I'll leave those as a surprise.

All in all, very good. Though I'd recommend that if you have 7ish hours, you should watch it all in one go the first time.

05-13-2011, 01:45 AM	#1
watson107 Newly Deceased Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 3	Anyone seen Red Book of Westmarch? I heard about this project a while back, and it sounds intriguing. A fan pieced together a more canonical version of the movies by rearranging scenes and using deleted footage. The trilogy is split into six movies, each bearing the original title of Tolkien's six books of LotR. Thoughts? Comments? I would be interested in watching them if they are more faithful to the original.

05-13-2011, 03:10 PM	#3
oddkins Pile O'Bones Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 16	LotR Fan Edit This project was discussed at length on TheHallofFire.net... Here's link to the thread for the first "Book" The Return of the Shadow, http://www.thehalloffire.net/forum/v...=200424#200424 __________________ Sometimes in heaven a fable is born..nobody knows where it comes from; it gives us strength and it tells us of love, and everyone of us is touched in their hearts...

09-06-2011, 11:20 AM	#5
Eönwë Flame Imperishable Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Right here Posts: 3,928	I have downloaded all six 'books' and watched the first all the way through, and I have to say, I was quite impressed. I have a few comments: 1. The intro is the only part not taken from the original films, and features Christopher Lee (I believe) reading the Ring-Verse. 2. The pacing was a bit strange, though I suppose it was mostly because I'm used to the normal versions. 3. It follows a narrative closer to the EE than the standard version. 4. I was quite surprised by how smoothly the music was cut, considering that a lot was taken out. 5. The whole thing has been cut down massively (considering it's from the EE) to about 7 and a half hours. Obviously there were some things they had to keep, such as Arwen taking Frodo to Rivendell, but it is definitely cut down a lot. So basically, I enjoyed it and recommend it, and I'll just have to see how the others are. For anyone who's interested, this is the official page of the fan edit. It also tells you where you can download it from (I can't say here because I don't want to get the Barrow-Downs in trouble. While I'm sure most of us do have the EE, which makes it legal to download this version, if you don't it's not, so I'm not taking the risk on behalf of the Barrow-Downs). So yeah, I'm giving it the thumbs up and I'd like to see what anyone else here thinks of it (If you get the time to watch it). __________________ Welcome to the Barrow Do-owns Forum / Such a lovely place

11-01-2011, 08:04 AM	#6
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Interested, but time may not be kind. Better not wait for me. I'll catch up when & if I can.... __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

11-27-2011, 04:23 AM	#8
Eönwë Flame Imperishable Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Right here Posts: 3,928	Would anyone be interested in a Chapter-by-Chapter/Scene-by-Scene style thing with this, i.e. Book-by-Book? There are 6 of lengths varying between 47 minutes and 1 hour 45 minutes. __________________ Welcome to the Barrow Do-owns Forum / Such a lovely place

05-13-2011, 07:15 AM	#2
Estelyn Telcontar Princess of Skwerlz Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: where the Sea is eastwards (WtR: 6060 miles) Posts: 7,500	I haven't heard of this project yet and will be interested in any responses that come. Since the question refers to a movie rather than a book version of Tolkien's story, I'm moving the thread to the Movies forum. Please continue to read and post there - thanks! __________________ 'Mercy!' cried Gandalf. 'If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more do you want to know?' 'The whole history of Middle-earth...'

05-13-2011, 07:40 PM	#4
watson107 Newly Deceased Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 3	Hmmm... I need to watch these at some point. With the level of devotion and detail that some fans put into their own works, it's a pity that more directors do not embrace the "experts". Although, I must give PJ credit for openly stating that the fans were now able to go in and do their corrections. While I was not a fan of the changes, PJ did make an excellent choice on location for the movies (considering his limitation of working on Earth). After all, location is at the heart of Tolkien's mythology.

01-02-2013, 06:09 PM	#9
Eönwë Flame Imperishable Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Right here Posts: 3,928	Ok, I finally got round to watching them all. On the whole, they're a pretty good job. Pretty seamless editing, using the complete recordings, EE, etc. Books I and II (FOTR) are good. Not much is lost overall (I believe it still reaches over 3). Books III and IV suffer a bit, because most of the TT is pretty uncanonical. So there are some pacing issues, and they're not really satisfying to watch separately. V and VI are also short (even shorter, in fact), but even so, they seem to flow better. General comments: Almost all the Gimli jokes are cut, so he becomes a pretty serious character, but some of the enemy-to-friend banter feeling between him and Legolas is lost because of this. Narrative is split more like book, so III-V only follow one group each, intro is moved, etc. There are some awkward cuts in an attempt to make it more book-like. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't. Most of moany (and therefore most of) Elrond is cut. No Saruman Uruk-Hai spawning from mud. Far less Saruman scenes, but at least his final scene appears. The EE flet-scene is gone, which I thought was kind of a pointless cut. Faramir doesn't really get tempted by ring- but is therefore cut a bit too much for us to feel anything. I think that keeping the Boromir/Faramir flashback scene may have been useful. Denethor gets very very cut, but is far more canonical. There are some sneaky/clever edits to avoid some scenes, but I'll leave those as a surprise. All in all, very good. Though I'd recommend that if you have 7ish hours, you should watch it all in one go the first time. __________________ Welcome to the Barrow Do-owns Forum / Such a lovely place