Tolkien - The Big Game - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Lalwendë · 11-24-2008, 05:04 AM

Another of the papers I was reading in the Tolkien 2005 proceedings has given me another topic to discuss!

One of the papers asks why Lord of the Rings is so popular, and one of the suggestions is that it is like 'A big game'. Meaning that Tolkien did more than just create a novel or an alternate world, he created somewhere for us all to play!

I really, really like that idea. It covers all sorts of things that we are inspired to do from reading Tolkien's work - writing in RPGs, creating faux newspapers, mucking around dressed in cloaks, playing Werewolf...

Do you think Tolkien's work is like one huge game? If it is, then it's probably the best game of all time (yeah, even better than The Sims!).

The Might · 11-24-2008, 07:14 AM

Well, of course the whole genre of fantasy has mainly that as intention - to give you a place to escape reality, a fairytale reflection of the world we live in, a place fun and interesting to explore.

But, it isn't of course only fun and games, there are deeper messages within his work as well. Or take the Narnia series as an even better example - a game as well, but also carrying deeply Christian messages.

So, yeah, LotR is a big game, a game you see and play differently depending on your age.

Bêthberry · 11-24-2008, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Might

Well, of course the whole genre of fantasy has mainly that as intention - to give you a place to escape reality, a fairytale reflection of the world we live in, a place fun and interesting to explore.

But, it isn't of course only fun and games, there are deeper messages within his work as well. Or take the Narnia series as an even better example - a game as well, but also carrying deeply Christian messages.

So, yeah, LotR is a big game, a game you see and play differently depending on your age.

Well, I'm not sure I would agree that fantasy is a place to escape reality, or that gaming is an escape from reality.

Reality includes imagination, leisure, music, art, drama, song, dance, story, play. Play is crucial to children's (and puppies' and kittens') development and remains essential to adults' well being.

So perhaps it is more appropriate to say that Tolkien gave us a tonic, a tonic to good health, rather than a game.

Lalwendë · 11-24-2008, 08:34 AM

Well as I keep reading in child development books and whatnot, play is a serious business! It's how we learn. And without 'play' of any kind it would be quite depressing being a grown up too. Our adult 'games' can be very serious - satire isn't kids' stuff after all - and can exist in part to convey a message. In fact fairy tales often have moral messages, so Tolkien's creation being like a 'big game' doesn't mean it's not serious!

What excites me about this idea is that what Tolkien made provides a great space for us to play our games of imagination in, and he also gives a shape to that space.

Inziladun · 11-24-2008, 09:29 AM

I don't really see Tolkien's works as a game, any more than other books I've read. I'm not a 'genre' reader, in that I don't care much for other fantasy books. For some reason, I tend to only enjoy individual authors that may write about certain things on a regular basis, while being totally unimpressed by other writers of the same genre. For instance, though I obviously greatly admire Tolkien's works, I have never read anything by C. S. Lewis. I also like Stephen King, but couldn't stand the one Dean Koontz novel I tried. I'm a fan of Lovecraft, but not Arthur Machen or Poe. I could go on, but my point is that I read Tolkien for the same reason I read other authors: I like the subject matter, the prose, the ideas. Tolkien's work particularly stands out to me because it is so well written from a linguistic point of view, and Tolkien's deeply held religious convictions and moral messages that are so apparent in his works are an additional bonus.
If I did see it all as a glorious game, I think I would be more enthused about RPGs and ME themed computer games, and so forth.

Morthoron · 11-24-2008, 02:17 PM

Oh, Tolkien's Middle-earth is certainly the greatest game-world ever created. Go to nearly any fan-fic site, and Tolkien-related stories outnumber all others by staggering margins. It is the conciseness and millenial nature of the chronology, the enormity and precision of the maps, and the unparalleled depth of the story itself that causes so many acolytes, mavens, fans and freaks to wish to 'live the experience'.

It is unfortunate that none of the actual online games (like Turbine's Lord of the Rings Online) have even the slightest allure for me, because the developers took the original premise of the story, bastardized it, stretched it to fit a preexisting and generic game mold, and then took mechanisms, magic and malarkey from outside Middle-earth, and plopped the offal right into downtown Bree, while all the while beating their breasts righteously and claiming they truly care for the lore. Bah!

Lalwendë · 11-24-2008, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inziladun

I don't really see Tolkien's works as a game, any more than other books I've read. I'm not a 'genre' reader, in that I don't care much for other fantasy books. For some reason, I tend to only enjoy individual authors that may write about certain things on a regular basis, while being totally unimpressed by other writers of the same genre.

I'm like you, most definitely not a genre fan. And even though I've taken an enjoyable part in some RPGs on here, I've never really played D&D or anything like that (not for want of trying...but nobody wanted me to join in - how's that for Billy-no-mates eh, being rejected by the D&D crew?

), and I've never got on that well with RPG computer games either as I prefer either strategy, skating or motor racing games.

However, I do see something in this 'game' idea, mostly as I see much of what I get from the books and some of the things I have done as pure play. Yes, even writing long posts and reading dry academic texts, that's 'play' to me as it's my hobby.

Mind that probably says a lot about me, as even the things I am serious about are things I wouldn't do if I found them too serious.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morthoron

It is unfortunate that none of the actual online games (like Turbine's Lord of the Rings Online) have even the slightest allure for me, because the developers took the original premise of the story, bastardized it, stretched it to fit a preexisting and generic game mold, and then took mechanisms, magic and malarkey from outside Middle-earth, and plopped the offal right into downtown Bree, while all the while beating their breasts righteously and claiming they truly care for the lore. Bah!

This is what puts me right off the spin off games. I never even got on with Final Fantasy games, so how I'd feel about a Tolkien based one that was filled with Mary Sue Elves and having to hoarde magic points and whatnot doesn't bear thinking about.

But I haven't half had some fun because of what Tolkien did. I mean, one evening I even found myself doing experiments with custard and action figures because of Tolkien

Groin Redbeard · 11-26-2008, 05:10 PM

While Tolkien's fantasy world could be taken as a play house, but than again isn't that what fantasy should be: to transport you out of this world into new realms that are there for us to explore? I picture Tolkien's work as he intended it to be: a revival of myth. Tolkien used myth not allegorically but to express Catholicism (in a sense his own view) in the form of a myth, a sanctifying myth one might say.

Selador · 11-28-2008, 01:25 PM

A big game. Yes! It is that. The story itself throws off branches in so many directions that it seems to provide no end of inspirations for 'play'. For writing, for discussion, for artwork, for serious study - as a work of literature, or history, or of pure fantasy. Whether you are fascinated by elves, dwarves, dragons, wizards, warriors, language, poetry, storytelling, map making . . . Middle-earth can be your playground.

11-24-2008, 05:04 AM	#1
Lalwendë A Mere Boggart Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: under the bed Posts: 4,737	Tolkien - The Big Game Another of the papers I was reading in the Tolkien 2005 proceedings has given me another topic to discuss! One of the papers asks why Lord of the Rings is so popular, and one of the suggestions is that it is like 'A big game'. Meaning that Tolkien did more than just create a novel or an alternate world, he created somewhere for us all to play! I really, really like that idea. It covers all sorts of things that we are inspired to do from reading Tolkien's work - writing in RPGs, creating faux newspapers, mucking around dressed in cloaks, playing Werewolf... Do you think Tolkien's work is like one huge game? If it is, then it's probably the best game of all time (yeah, even better than The Sims!). __________________ Gordon's alive!

11-24-2008, 07:14 AM	#2
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	Well, of course the whole genre of fantasy has mainly that as intention - to give you a place to escape reality, a fairytale reflection of the world we live in, a place fun and interesting to explore. But, it isn't of course only fun and games, there are deeper messages within his work as well. Or take the Narnia series as an even better example - a game as well, but also carrying deeply Christian messages. So, yeah, LotR is a big game, a game you see and play differently depending on your age. __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

11-24-2008, 08:34 AM	#4
Lalwendë A Mere Boggart Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: under the bed Posts: 4,737	Well as I keep reading in child development books and whatnot, play is a serious business! It's how we learn. And without 'play' of any kind it would be quite depressing being a grown up too. Our adult 'games' can be very serious - satire isn't kids' stuff after all - and can exist in part to convey a message. In fact fairy tales often have moral messages, so Tolkien's creation being like a 'big game' doesn't mean it's not serious! What excites me about this idea is that what Tolkien made provides a great space for us to play our games of imagination in, and he also gives a shape to that space. __________________ Gordon's alive!

11-24-2008, 09:29 AM	#5
Inziladun Gruesome Spectre Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Heaven's doorstep Posts: 8,037	I don't really see Tolkien's works as a game, any more than other books I've read. I'm not a 'genre' reader, in that I don't care much for other fantasy books. For some reason, I tend to only enjoy individual authors that may write about certain things on a regular basis, while being totally unimpressed by other writers of the same genre. For instance, though I obviously greatly admire Tolkien's works, I have never read anything by C. S. Lewis. I also like Stephen King, but couldn't stand the one Dean Koontz novel I tried. I'm a fan of Lovecraft, but not Arthur Machen or Poe. I could go on, but my point is that I read Tolkien for the same reason I read other authors: I like the subject matter, the prose, the ideas. Tolkien's work particularly stands out to me because it is so well written from a linguistic point of view, and Tolkien's deeply held religious convictions and moral messages that are so apparent in his works are an additional bonus. If I did see it all as a glorious game, I think I would be more enthused about RPGs and ME themed computer games, and so forth. __________________ Music alone proves the existence of God.

11-24-2008, 02:17 PM	#6
Morthoron Curmudgeonly Wordwraith Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Ensconced in curmudgeonly pursuits Posts: 2,509	Oh, Tolkien's Middle-earth is certainly the greatest game-world ever created. Go to nearly any fan-fic site, and Tolkien-related stories outnumber all others by staggering margins. It is the conciseness and millenial nature of the chronology, the enormity and precision of the maps, and the unparalleled depth of the story itself that causes so many acolytes, mavens, fans and freaks to wish to 'live the experience'. It is unfortunate that none of the actual online games (like Turbine's Lord of the Rings Online) have even the slightest allure for me, because the developers took the original premise of the story, bastardized it, stretched it to fit a preexisting and generic game mold, and then took mechanisms, magic and malarkey from outside Middle-earth, and plopped the offal right into downtown Bree, while all the while beating their breasts righteously and claiming they truly care for the lore. Bah! __________________ And your little sister's immaculate virginity wings away on the bony shoulders of a young horse named George who stole surreptitiously into her geography revision.

11-26-2008, 05:10 PM	#8
Groin Redbeard Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Facing the world's troubles with Christ's hope! Posts: 1,635	While Tolkien's fantasy world could be taken as a play house, but than again isn't that what fantasy should be: to transport you out of this world into new realms that are there for us to explore? I picture Tolkien's work as he intended it to be: a revival of myth. Tolkien used myth not allegorically but to express Catholicism (in a sense his own view) in the form of a myth, a sanctifying myth one might say. __________________ I heard the bells on Christmas Day. Their old, familiar carols play. And wild and sweet the words repeatof peace on earth, good-will to men! ~Henry Wadsworth Longfellow

11-28-2008, 01:25 PM	#9
Selador Pile O'Bones Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 16	A big game. Yes! It is that. The story itself throws off branches in so many directions that it seems to provide no end of inspirations for 'play'. For writing, for discussion, for artwork, for serious study - as a work of literature, or history, or of pure fantasy. Whether you are fascinated by elves, dwarves, dragons, wizards, warriors, language, poetry, storytelling, map making . . . Middle-earth can be your playground.