Tolkien Estate Website up & running (well partially) - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

davem · 04-17-2007, 01:20 AM

Apparently the main w/s is to go on line later this year, but there's some interesting stuff here

http://www.tolkienestate.com/home/

Durelin · 04-17-2007, 07:57 PM

Oooh, I love the site design. Their choice of artwork is very interesting! The Children of Hurin and FAQ pages are especially aesthetically pleasing (to me)... I think I might love the artwork on the "Contact" page the most, though.

The flash intro is quite interesting (get rid of the "/home" on the link to see the intro)...though I think it's transition from the artwork to the "floating letters" is a little rough, and then the transition to the website obviously needs smoothing, but hey, it's temporary, and simply great to have!

I'm sorry to critique it like that...not really the point...

I find this piece of the FAQ particularly interesting:

Quote:

Can I / someone else write / complete / develop my / their own version of one of these unfinished tales ? (or any others)
The simple answer is NO.
You are of course free to do whatever you like for your own private enjoyment, but there is no question of any commercial exploitation of this form of "fan-fiction".
Also, in these days of the Internet, and privately produced collectors’ items for sale on eBay, we must make it as clear as possible that the Tolkien Estate never has, and never will authorize the commercialisation or distribution of any works of this type.
The Estate exists to defend the integrity of J.R.R. Tolkien’s writings. Christopher Tolkien's work as his father’s literary executor has always been to publish as faithfully and honestly as possible his father's completed and uncompleted works, without adaptation or embellishment. (Italics added, naturally.)

See? I knew we were okay here with our RPGs and all that.

Thanks for the link, davem!

davem · 04-18-2007, 12:20 AM

Durelin

One could highlight a different section of the statement & discover a whole other subtext to the statement.

Quote:

Can I / someone else write / complete / develop my / their own version of one of these unfinished tales ? (or any others)
The simple answer is NO.
You are of course free to do whatever you like for your own private enjoyment, but there is no question of any commercial exploitation of this form of "fan-fiction".
Also, in these days of the Internet, and privately produced collectors’ items for sale on eBay, we must make it as clear as possible that the Tolkien Estate never has, and never will authorize the commercialisation or distribution of any works of this type.
The Estate exists to defend the integrity of J.R.R. Tolkien’s writings. Christopher Tolkien's work as his father’s literary executor has always been to publish as faithfully and honestly as possible his father's completed and uncompleted works, without adaptation or embellishment.

Back in the 1990's a certain Mr Alex Lewis (co-author with his wife, Elizabeth Currie (aka Ruth Lacon) of the book The Uncharted Realms of Tolkien) produced a privately printed work entitled 'The Fall of Gondolin'. Basically Lewis took bits from the various unfinished accounts/versions of Tolkien's Gondoolin story, Ruth Lacon illustrated it & Mr Lewis decided it was good enough to put out. So he asks Priscilla, & she says 'ok' (CT & the Estate were not consulted. Lewis gets 'permission' to publish 50 copies. Many go to collectors, the rest end up on internet sites like eBay.

Of course, the Estate do not like this work being out there. Bloody furious would be a good description, but what could they do - a 'friend' of Priscilla asks her if he can print up a few copies of his book, & she says 'Alright then'.

I know of a few Tolkien collectors who have this book & say its very good. I've seen it at Tolkien 2005 in Birmingham but wasn't that impressed. I've also seen it reported as on sale for £1000 +. CT & the Estate, as I said did not want this book printed, made available at all & they do not want it around. After all, Lewis basically took Tolkien's own words without permission from the Estate (without even asking CT if it was ok come to that) & put out a 'Tolkien' book with his own name on there as 'Editor'.

Now read that bit again:

Quote:

Also, in these days of the Internet, and privately produced collectors’ items for sale on eBay, we must make it as clear as possible that the Tolkien Estate never has, and never will authorize the commercialisation or distribution of any works of this type.

Lalwendë · 04-18-2007, 02:08 AM

Most interesting seeing as over at tolkien.co.uk there has been some debate as to whether Alex Lewis should take over after CT with some saying he is an 'expert'. Well yes, he's an expert enough, as much as any of us, but nowhere near the expert that Adam is!

And after the debacle with the self-written reviews of his books under a nom de plume, shall we say, I think he may have blotted his expensive copy of The Fall of Gondolin...he is also linked with one of the best known sellers on eBay (who is expensive and who I am not fond of after he beat me to an obscure book and then had it up for sale a week later at three times what he paid for it - which was too much anyway...) who sells 'rare signed copies' of his critical work

Hmmmm.....

Child of the 7th Age · 04-18-2007, 03:04 AM

Lalwende, Davem,

Interesting.....it's certainly a small world. A few years ago I was feverishly hunting for a copy of Alex Lewis's book the Uncharted Realms of Tolkien because it had an article linking hobbits to hedgehogs.

This was before Lewis was selling on e-bay in any shape or form. It was impossible to find his book anywhere in the U.S., either in libraries or on on-line websites. On a whim I contacted Alex Lewis directly and asked him some questions about the book. I didn't know much about him except that he had served as president of the Tolkien Society sometime in the 90's. Out of the blue, he sent me a copy of his book signed by both him and his wife (the paperback Uncharted Realms...not the vastly expensive Tale of Gondolin) and didn't charge me a penny. It's still sitting on my bookshelf.

I was and am blithely ignorant of these behind the scenes things, but I was grateful to be able to get hold of a copy of that book. There is a page up on the Tolkien library site that talks about the privately printed Tale of Gondolin and another similar book they did called the Ruins of Osgiliath. Here.

Have you ever seen the 16 volumes of Nigglings that they also helped publish? What are these like? As I understand it, these are the volumes produced by the creative writing interest group from within the Tolkien Society. I assume these are published fanfictions. Perhaps that is another reason that the Tolkien family is unhappy.

To be honest, I like some of the representations by Ruth Lacon. A close friend who lives in Berkshire sent me a gift of a large paperback book entitled "The Art of Ruth Lacon." She never mentioned any of the very real "problems" that the Estate has encountered, but the pictures themselves were striking---presumably these were from the privately printed books. The illustrations have a strong Persian "feel" that I've never encountered anywhere else.

I have seen Lewis marketing on e-bay in recent years through a bookseller, but never purchased his most recent book called The Foresaken Realm of Tolkien, which also deals with Gondolin in essay form. I'll put in one good word for the bookseller (I'm pretty sure we're talking about the same seller. If not, I apologize but they definitely market the Lewis books now.) I know nothing of their other business dealings, but they are the one and only dealer from whom you can order a copy of The Children of Hurin from overseas signed by Alan Lee for about $35, which is fairly reasonable. They are having a special event/signing in Gloucestershire April 20-24 with Nasmith and Lee present.

I guess the Tolkien world is enough of a fish bowl that it's possible to bump into the same people very easily, even when you live in the hinterlands.

davem · 04-18-2007, 05:50 AM

What AL actually did was take the various versions of the Gondolin story, amalgamate them, 're-phrase' the more 'archaic' language & basically cobble together a 'version' of the story. This is borderline fanfic, yet presented as Tolkien's work with AL merely serving as editor. more here http://www.hobbit.ca/Gondolin-variations.html

Fall of Osgilliath is pure fanfic.

Durelin · 04-18-2007, 04:26 PM

Ah, I was wondering about what that part of the 'answer' was referring to. I've never heard of Alex Lewis or Ruth Lacon. Interesting... I don't think I've ever seen he and his wife's book, either.

Just the appearance of the book screams..."mimicked" or something.

Unique copy number 50 with *full color Ruth Lacon illustration*...it's 'unique,' so of course some fool will pay waayyyyy too much money for it...

04-17-2007, 01:20 AM	#1
davem Illustrious Ulair Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties Posts: 4,240	Tolkien Estate Website up & running (well partially) Apparently the main w/s is to go on line later this year, but there's some interesting stuff here http://www.tolkienestate.com/home/ __________________ “Everything was an object. If you killed a dwarf you could use it as a weapon – it was no different to other large heavy objects."

04-18-2007, 02:08 AM	#4
Lalwendë A Mere Boggart Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: under the bed Posts: 4,737	Most interesting seeing as over at tolkien.co.uk there has been some debate as to whether Alex Lewis should take over after CT with some saying he is an 'expert'. Well yes, he's an expert enough, as much as any of us, but nowhere near the expert that Adam is! And after the debacle with the self-written reviews of his books under a nom de plume, shall we say, I think he may have blotted his expensive copy of The Fall of Gondolin...he is also linked with one of the best known sellers on eBay (who is expensive and who I am not fond of after he beat me to an obscure book and then had it up for sale a week later at three times what he paid for it - which was too much anyway...) who sells 'rare signed copies' of his critical work Hmmmm..... __________________ Gordon's alive!

04-18-2007, 03:04 AM	#5
Child of the 7th Age Spirit of the Lonely Star Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 5,133	Lalwende, Davem, Interesting.....it's certainly a small world. A few years ago I was feverishly hunting for a copy of Alex Lewis's book the Uncharted Realms of Tolkien because it had an article linking hobbits to hedgehogs. This was before Lewis was selling on e-bay in any shape or form. It was impossible to find his book anywhere in the U.S., either in libraries or on on-line websites. On a whim I contacted Alex Lewis directly and asked him some questions about the book. I didn't know much about him except that he had served as president of the Tolkien Society sometime in the 90's. Out of the blue, he sent me a copy of his book signed by both him and his wife (the paperback Uncharted Realms...not the vastly expensive Tale of Gondolin) and didn't charge me a penny. It's still sitting on my bookshelf. I was and am blithely ignorant of these behind the scenes things, but I was grateful to be able to get hold of a copy of that book. There is a page up on the Tolkien library site that talks about the privately printed Tale of Gondolin and another similar book they did called the Ruins of Osgiliath. Here. Have you ever seen the 16 volumes of Nigglings that they also helped publish? What are these like? As I understand it, these are the volumes produced by the creative writing interest group from within the Tolkien Society. I assume these are published fanfictions. Perhaps that is another reason that the Tolkien family is unhappy. To be honest, I like some of the representations by Ruth Lacon. A close friend who lives in Berkshire sent me a gift of a large paperback book entitled "The Art of Ruth Lacon." She never mentioned any of the very real "problems" that the Estate has encountered, but the pictures themselves were striking---presumably these were from the privately printed books. The illustrations have a strong Persian "feel" that I've never encountered anywhere else. I have seen Lewis marketing on e-bay in recent years through a bookseller, but never purchased his most recent book called The Foresaken Realm of Tolkien, which also deals with Gondolin in essay form. I'll put in one good word for the bookseller (I'm pretty sure we're talking about the same seller. If not, I apologize but they definitely market the Lewis books now.) I know nothing of their other business dealings, but they are the one and only dealer from whom you can order a copy of The Children of Hurin from overseas signed by Alan Lee for about $35, which is fairly reasonable. They are having a special event/signing in Gloucestershire April 20-24 with Nasmith and Lee present. I guess the Tolkien world is enough of a fish bowl that it's possible to bump into the same people very easily, even when you live in the hinterlands. __________________ Multitasking women are never too busy to vote. Last edited by Child of the 7th Age; 04-18-2007 at 03:15 AM.

04-18-2007, 05:50 AM	#6
davem Illustrious Ulair Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties Posts: 4,240	What AL actually did was take the various versions of the Gondolin story, amalgamate them, 're-phrase' the more 'archaic' language & basically cobble together a 'version' of the story. This is borderline fanfic, yet presented as Tolkien's work with AL merely serving as editor. more here http://www.hobbit.ca/Gondolin-variations.html Fall of Osgilliath is pure fanfic. __________________ “Everything was an object. If you killed a dwarf you could use it as a weapon – it was no different to other large heavy objects."

04-18-2007, 04:26 PM	#7
Durelin Estelo dagnir, Melo ring Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3,063	Ah, I was wondering about what that part of the 'answer' was referring to. I've never heard of Alex Lewis or Ruth Lacon. Interesting... I don't think I've ever seen he and his wife's book, either. Just the appearance of the book screams..."mimicked" or something. Unique copy number 50 with full color Ruth Lacon illustration...it's 'unique,' so of course some fool will pay waayyyyy too much money for it...