The prefix Ara - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Araen · 02-13-2002, 09:43 AM

Okay it clearly states in the appendix that after a certain king of Gondor that every heir would have Ara at the beging of his name..... 'twasn't so with Aragorn's son. Why? Don't kill me I am a bing newbie......

***Mithadan*** · 02-13-2002, 09:54 AM

Welcome to the Barrow-Downs. Rest assured, we do not kill, shoot, or flame newbies here. I may be wrong on this but I believe that in naming his son, Aragorn returned to the old tradition of selecting names for kings in Quenya rather than Sindarin (or Adunaic in the case of Numenor). Thus Aragorn's formal name as King of Gondor was Telecontar (Strider).

Aralaithiel · 02-13-2002, 04:33 PM

No Mithadan, I believe you are correct. Now another thing to go look up! The quest of remembering where I read things, and how I comprehended them! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]
Hey newbie...welcome aboard! You'll find us very friendly here!

Starbreeze · 02-16-2002, 01:37 PM

I didn't notice that bit - me being ignorant yet again - got to read on that!

Elven-Maiden · 02-16-2002, 02:39 PM

That's really cool! I hadn't realized that! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Sillabub · 07-13-2003, 08:33 PM

The prefix 'Ar' means Royal, as one could observe in the name ARWEN [ar(royal)+wen(maiden)=arwen]. One of the numenorean kings chose to take up the name Ar-Pharazon instead of the numenorean traditional TAR-Pharazon. What Tar- means, I don't know.

Sillabub · 07-13-2003, 08:36 PM

And then there's hereditary naming, which I have no clue about. I'll just tell you that Eowyn and Eomer's father was Eomund, and Eomund's father's name started with an EO and so on and so forth. Get the pattern? I just have no clue WHY that happens. And did you know Aragorn's mother was named after a RIVER in Gondor? The river Gilraen.

Finwe · 07-13-2003, 08:53 PM

The prefix "Tar-" in Sindarin means "King" or "Ruler." It was used as a prefix by the Kings of Numenor who followed the Eldarin ways. When the Rebel Kings of Numenor took up the throne (as I like to call them), they changed their "use-names" to ones in Adunaic, and so the prefix for "King" or "Ruler" in that language was "Ar-."

If you look at it, it was also proof that no matter how hard they tried, they couldn't completely remove the Elvish influence on Numenor, no matter how hard they tried. "Ar-" in Sindarin means "Noble, Royal, Kingly, etc," so those Kings of Numenor were actually using an Elvish title, while thinking that they were using an Adunaic one. An example of a Sindarin name with "Ar-" as a prefix is "Ar-Feiniel" ("Noble White Lady (of the Noldor)") which was the epessë of Aredhel, daughter of Fingolfin.

dancing spawn of ungoliant · 07-14-2003, 02:13 AM

this may be a bit off topic (sorry) but i just noticed that the name 'Aragorn' has two elements in it. by changing the order of the letters you end up with words Aran (king in Quenya) and gor (fright or fear).
okey, now i don't have a clue why i post this here. i guess i was so excited when i noticed that kind of thing myself (though i assume that Tolkien had a better explanation for this name) [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img]

02-13-2002, 09:43 AM	#1
Araen Haunting Spirit Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 70	The prefix Ara Okay it clearly states in the appendix that after a certain king of Gondor that every heir would have Ara at the beging of his name..... 'twasn't so with Aragorn's son. Why? Don't kill me I am a bing newbie...... __________________ "Where is the horse and the rider, where is the horn that was blowing, they have passed like rain on the mountains, like wind in the meadow, the days are damned in the west? behind the hills? there are shadows... "

02-13-2002, 09:54 AM	#2
*Mithadan* Spirit of Mist Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Tol Eressea Posts: 3,383	Welcome to the Barrow-Downs. Rest assured, we do not kill, shoot, or flame newbies here. I may be wrong on this but I believe that in naming his son, Aragorn returned to the old tradition of selecting names for kings in Quenya rather than Sindarin (or Adunaic in the case of Numenor). Thus Aragorn's formal name as King of Gondor was Telecontar (Strider). __________________ Beleriand, Beleriand, the borders of the Elven-land.

02-13-2002, 04:33 PM	#3
Aralaithiel Ghost Eldaran Queen Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: A remote mountain in Valinor Posts: 353	No Mithadan, I believe you are correct. Now another thing to go look up! The quest of remembering where I read things, and how I comprehended them! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] Hey newbie...welcome aboard! You'll find us very friendly here! __________________ A lelyat, wen! (Quenya Elvish for "You go, girl!"

02-16-2002, 01:37 PM	#4
Starbreeze Ghost of a Smile Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Mirkwood - Middle Earth Posts: 389	I didn't notice that bit - me being ignorant yet again - got to read on that! __________________ Do not tamper with the affairs of wizards, they are not all that subtle - Terry Pratchett To write is to make dreams, to make dreams is to awaken the fantasy of the mind, to awaken the mind is to be a master.

02-16-2002, 02:39 PM	#5
Elven-Maiden Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 297	That's really cool! I hadn't realized that! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] __________________ Tout ce qui est or ne brille pas, Tous ceux qui errent ne sont pas perdus. Mobilis in Mobile

07-13-2003, 08:33 PM	#6
Sillabub Wight Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: GONDOR!! Posts: 138	The prefix 'Ar' means Royal, as one could observe in the name ARWEN [ar(royal)+wen(maiden)=arwen]. One of the numenorean kings chose to take up the name Ar-Pharazon instead of the numenorean traditional TAR-Pharazon. What Tar- means, I don't know. __________________ They were holding umbrellas. Not just any umbrellas- BLACK umbrellas. Not just ANY black umbrellas- these were...(knuckle-biting time) the BLACK UMBRELLAS OF DEATH!!!!! cue sinister music

07-13-2003, 08:36 PM	#7
Sillabub Wight Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: GONDOR!! Posts: 138	And then there's hereditary naming, which I have no clue about. I'll just tell you that Eowyn and Eomer's father was Eomund, and Eomund's father's name started with an EO and so on and so forth. Get the pattern? I just have no clue WHY that happens. And did you know Aragorn's mother was named after a RIVER in Gondor? The river Gilraen. __________________ They were holding umbrellas. Not just any umbrellas- BLACK umbrellas. Not just ANY black umbrellas- these were...(knuckle-biting time) the BLACK UMBRELLAS OF DEATH!!!!! cue sinister music

07-13-2003, 08:53 PM	#8
Finwe Deathless Sun Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Royal Suite in the Halls of Mandos Posts: 2,609	The prefix "Tar-" in Sindarin means "King" or "Ruler." It was used as a prefix by the Kings of Numenor who followed the Eldarin ways. When the Rebel Kings of Numenor took up the throne (as I like to call them), they changed their "use-names" to ones in Adunaic, and so the prefix for "King" or "Ruler" in that language was "Ar-." If you look at it, it was also proof that no matter how hard they tried, they couldn't completely remove the Elvish influence on Numenor, no matter how hard they tried. "Ar-" in Sindarin means "Noble, Royal, Kingly, etc," so those Kings of Numenor were actually using an Elvish title, while thinking that they were using an Adunaic one. An example of a Sindarin name with "Ar-" as a prefix is "Ar-Feiniel" ("Noble White Lady (of the Noldor)") which was the epessë of Aredhel, daughter of Fingolfin. __________________ But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.

07-14-2003, 02:13 AM	#9
dancing spawn of ungoliant Mischievous Candle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: So near to Russia, so far from Japan, quite a long way from Cairo, lots of miles from Vietnam. Posts: 1,234	this may be a bit off topic (sorry) but i just noticed that the name 'Aragorn' has two elements in it. by changing the order of the letters you end up with words Aran (king in Quenya) and gor (fright or fear). okey, now i don't have a clue why i post this here. i guess i was so excited when i noticed that kind of thing myself (though i assume that Tolkien had a better explanation for this name) [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img] __________________ Fenris Wolf