Not just a 'tender of beasts' : Radagast's connection to Slavic Mythology

[THE Ka]

I found this very interesting article while looking up Slavic Mythology and my own geneological connections (But this isn't what this thread is really about, so back on to the topic...)

Anyways, I was, just for curiousity, looking at entries on Wikipedia of Slavic Mythology, which there really isn't alot of available and I was surprised to find the name 'Radagast' listed as a god. Very interesting!

Radagast, or also refered to as Radigost, Radegast, Radogost and other similar variations, is a Slavic god: the protector of travellers, traders and foreigners, and patron of hospitality.

If a householder does not take good care of his guests, turns away those seeking shelter or harms peacefully passing foreigners and salesmen, then Radigost punishes him. To good hosts Radigost gives a blessing: as they are compassionate to strangers, they will always find hospitality and accommodation when travelling.

Radigost's name is derived from the Old Slavonic raditi (take care, look after or consider) and gost (a guest, stranger, or foreigner).

There is a statue of Radigost on the top of mount Radhošť in the Czech Beskydy mountains. There is also a Czech beer named Radegast.

**************************************************

This had me wondering... Is it possible that Tolkien knew any of this background information, or did his genius just create this character without knowing this connection?

What do you think?

~ Mythologist Ka

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

It seems likely that Tolkers knew about it. Interesting that, if he did know, he applied it to such a character as the tender of beasts.

[Encaitare]

It's a really interesting possibility, and perhaps Tolkien kept this figure in mind while creating the character. I checked the Encyclopedia of Arda, and it gave this description for the origins of his name:

In Unfinished Tales of Númenor and Middle-earth, Christopher Tolkien indicates that his father intended to change this derivation and bring Radagast in line with the other wizard-names Gandalf and Saruman, by associating it with the old language of the Men of the Vales of Anduin. No alternative meaning is provided (indeed, Tolkien stated that the name was 'not now clearly interpretable'). One possible source (a somewhat unfounded conjecture) would be Old English rudugást, 'brown spirit' (rudu strictly means 'red' or 'red-brown' - it is the source of the modern word 'ruddy').

This etymology is not definite, but it seems to make sense. Maybe what happened was that Tolkien noticed the similarities between the two words rudugást and Radigost, and decided to combine their traits: the "brown" part from the Old English word (and brown implies a closeness with the earth like Radagast had) and the aspect of "tending" (although it's animals and birds Radagast looks after, not travelers and hosts).

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

Radagast, or also refered to as Radigost, Radegast, Radogost and other similar variations, is a Slavic god: the protector of travellers, traders and foreigners, and patron of hospitality.

It seems like Beorn must have known this, maybe he WOULD have turned 13 dwarves, a hobbit, and a wizard aside if he hadn't been concerned for what Radagast might do ... make his honey rotten or something.

But anyway, it sure explains what Radagast was doing in Wilderland, so near to the great road and Mirkwood.

Protecting travellers. From spiders? Maybe. From Dol Guldur? Maybe.

[Neurion]

Originally Posted by Keeper of Dol Guldur

It seems like Beorn must have known this, maybe he WOULD have turned 13 dwarves, a hobbit, and a wizard aside if he hadn't been concerned for what Radagast might do ... make his honey rotten or something.

But anyway, it sure explains what Radagast was doing in Wilderland, so near to the great road and Mirkwood.

Protecting travellers. From spiders? Maybe. From Dol Guldur? Maybe.

Interesting. Very interesting....

[THE Ka]

Wonderful connections! I'm really surpriced people would actually add to the thread...


I'm going to see if there is any more information in Slavic mythology about Radagast. I hope I find some more that can help, though there is a dreadfully low amount of information about Slavic myth...


~ Research Ka

I live in the Beskydy mountains and have often wondered if Tolkien knew about Radegast. There is little info on ancient Slavic folklore, even in Czech, around here, sadly.

Encaitare's post makes me think the connection is coincidental...but even with the Old English connection, it seems like Tolkien could've been aware of it, being such a follower of folklore.

Dum, the dwarvish word for Mansion, apparently(Khazad-Dum, Mansion of the Dwarves) is the Czech word for "house" or "home". I doubt if that is coincidental and if not, he must've had some familiarity with Slavic things.

Although it's not strictly "on subject" I would be very interested indeed in any info you dug up on Radegast and Slavic myths.

[Galadriel55]

Ooooo, why did I not see this thread earlier? I love mythologies!

Radegast/Radigost is not as well-known as other Slavonic gods, and it's very difficult to find any good sources on Slavonic mythology in general because much of it was destroyed early on in history. But here is what I can say about Radegast on behalf of Russia:

Firstly, as was mentioned above, his name can be dissected into rad+gost' - "joy"+"guest". This would imply a welcome for travelers and etc.

However, apparently his name once was Rizvoditz, which to me kind of sounds like "splitter", "separater" (from razvod). According to the source, his name represents quarrel, strife. This source also says that his later name, Radegast, is derived from "ratniy gost'" - Warrior guest, and that overall he is both the god of war and the protector of peaceful guests.

Yet other sources say that Radegast stands for "guests of councils", "head of councils". I do not see a resemblance in any of the names that these sources give, but they just might be too Western Slavonic for me to analyze with certainty.

And yet others describe him as the god that judges deceased souls. Go figure.



So how much of this is can be related to Radagast? Not that much. And while I don't think Tolkien drew that much from Slavonic sources, Radegast is a very Western Slavonic god, and his "cult" was geographically close to modern day Germany, so it is very possible that Germanic languages preserve some reference to him.

[jallanite]

I likewise did not find much about the Slavic god Radagast in the essay “Obscure Languages” in my Introduction to Elvish, on page 175. What I wrote was only:

Early chroniclers speak of a Slavic god named Radegást ( Радега́ст ). His temple was at Rethra (earlier Radogoszsz) made of wood, and rested on animal horns. Its outside was covered with figures of the gods. Within were kept special insignia and a stabled horse. Some believe that the reference is to a different god altogether and that the name of the town has been erroneously applied to the god.

I no longer know the source of this information other than that I consulted more than a single book.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radegast_%28god%29 for further information about this god, of which little is known.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

There is indeed very little known about Radegast. I have been doing a lot of research on that, because it's sort of my area of expertise, but there isn't really much to add besides what's been said here already. The connection between the god and the Wizard is a connection every person in my home country makes when they read about Radagast in the Hobbit/LotR, because his statue and former sacred spot on Mt. Radhošť is one of the sort of classic Czech historical/cultural spots (it's anyway the only known "real" Radegast-cult place, as far as I know). Radegast was probably manifested in different ways in different places, his cult is traceable into a few randomly isolated places in today western Russia, Czech Republic, and the Baltic countries.

The Czech version of Radegast, what we know of - mostly only from writings of Christian monks, much later than the cult itself actually bloomed, so the information again may be very much distorted or most of it not remembered anymore - is that he was supposed to have something to do with sun, harvest; possibly he was a solar deity. Or that is one theory.

The etymology G55 mentioned, with the meaning "council-guest" would actually be plausible in the Western Slavonic context, from rada (council) + host (guest), but it is a very, let's say, "fringe" interpretation. Also not certain why would the name of the god come from that in the first place.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

The Czech version of Radegast, what we know of - mostly only from writings of Christian monks, much later than the cult itself actually bloomed, so the information again may be very much distorted or most of it not remembered anymore - is that he was supposed to have something to do with sun, harvest; possibly he was a solar deity. Or that is one theory.

The whole Slavic "cult" is based on the sun. All the "major" gods are directly connected to it, and quite many of the minor gods have something to do with it. But the whole major/minor thing depends on the geographic location. Since Radegast was more prominent in the West, I would not be surprised if there was more emphasis on his connection to the sun.

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

The etymology G55 mentioned, with the meaning "council-guest" would actually be plausible in the Western Slavonic context, from rada (council) + host (guest), but it is a very, let's say, "fringe" interpretation. Also not certain why would the name of the god come from that in the first place.

The source said that he was an invisible guest at all councils. His presense somehow affected the outcome, I suppose.

[Inziladun]

My knowledge of Slavic mythology is roughly equal to my ability to estimate the distance between earth and the Kuiper Belt beyond Pluto: pretty much nil.

However, Radagast the Brown's Valinorean name was Aiwendil, said to mean "lover of birds", so maybe his Mannish name was a simple counterpart, with no ulterior symbolism by Tolkien. I think it comes down to the question of which came first, the names or the character.

[jallanite]

Yes Aiwendil might mean the same as Radagast. Or it might not.

Olórin and other names ascribed to Gandalf do not all mean Elf with the Wand. Olórin is usually considered to be probably related to the Quenya word olos (pl. olori) ‘dream, vision’, this meaning being fully discussed by Christopher Tolkien in his treatment of his father’s essay on “The Istari” in Unfinished Tales.

Saruman appears to be Old English of Mercian form meaning searu, saru ‘skill, cunning, cunning device’ + mann ‘man’, derived from his original Quenya name Curumo, and also a translation of his Sindarin name Curunír, taken as a name of approximately the same meaning, from Sindarin curu ‘skill’ + -ndîr ‘-man’. See note 6 to the essay “The Istari” in Unfinished Tales, which oddly has no reference in the text in my edition.

In short, Tolkien gives no indication of what Radagast is supposed to mean anywhere and arguing by analogy with the names Gandalf (or Mithrandir) and Saruman leads nowhere.

[Galin]

JRRT once noted that in the tongue of Numenor of old, Radagast (it was said) meant 'tender of beasts', but in a late note 'Radagast is said to be a name deriving from the Men of the Vales of Anduin, 'not now clearly interpretable'.


My guess is that the meaning of the Quenya name Aiwendil was not in play in both cases. And sometimes it can be difficult to say if a name is intended to be a substitution or not: Gandalf and Saruman are substitutions, and Incánus might seem to be another substitution by Tolkien as the fictive translator for example, but in another late note Tolkien at least considers a possible Quenya derivation, as he had considered earlier as well.

[jallanite]

Originally Posted by Galin

JRRT once noted that in the tongue of Numenor of old, Radagast (it was said) meant 'tender of beasts', but in a late note 'Radagast is said to be a name deriving from the Men of the Vales of Anduin, 'not now clearly interpretable'.

I had forgotten that, till your mention reminded me.

My guess is that the meaning of the Quenya name Aiwendil was not in play in both cases. And sometimes it can be difficult to say if a name is intended to be a substitution or not: Gandalf and Saruman are substitutions, and Incánus might seem to be another substitution by Tolkien as the fictive translator for example, but in another late note Tolkien at least considers a possible Quenya derivation, as he had considered earlier as well.

Apparently I was not clear in my intention. I see Gandalf and Mithrandir and other names given to Gandalf in various languages as unrelated to the Quenya name Olórin in meaning. While Saruman appears to be a translation of that wizard’s Quenya and Sindarin into Old English, presumably representing a form originally in true Rohirric.

[Galin]

Originally Posted by jallanite

Apparently I was not clear in my intention. I see Gandalf and Mithrandir and other names given to Gandalf in various languages as unrelated to the Quenya name Olórin in meaning. While Saruman appears to be a translation of that wizard’s Quenya and Sindarin into Old English, presumably representing a form originally in true Rohirric.

Okay. I'm not sure why you think you were unclear above though.


In the part of my post that you quoted (for your response here), I simply made a guess about the meaning of Aiwendil being in play or not, and next I made a new point about being able to certainly detect a 'translation' in all cases, giving Incanus as an example (Gandalf and Saruman being cases of translations for comparison to Incanus).

:shrug:

[Sarumian]

Russian Wiki contains the next relevant information on the matter:

Some contemporary scholars consider that there was no such a Slavonic deity as Radogost. Their opinion is based on the fact that the matter was first time mentioned by Thietmar von Merseburg, who reported that there was the town of Radogoshch (Radogoszcz, Radgosc) in the land of a Slavonic tribe Redarier (a tribe of Polabian Slavs), in which they had a cult of their main god Svarozhich (Svarožič). Later chroniclers and historians, it seems, used these data only. Half a century later Adam of Bremen writes, in turn, about the town of Redar and the god Redegast. Scholars regard that he made an error and confused the names of the deity, the town and the tribe, while the name Svarozhich is missing. It is known that Svarozhich is a deity's name, common among the Slavs. It is also known that there were many Slavonic names containing -gost, while Slavs did not give their children names after their gods. Besides this, many Western-Slavonic place names end with -gost. All this says that Radogost is a town name, that such a deity did not exist; it came out to be due to chroniclers' mistake only.

Places with name Radogoszcz or Радогощь

The song Svarog by a Russian rock-band Aquarium

[Sarumian]

Just recently I have also come across Radagaisus, king of Gots. No relationship to Radagast, just some similarity in the name...

[William Cloud Hicklin]

Radagaisus and Radigost, both, are hardly new in Tolkien studies. As jallanite says, he mentioned them in his book which has been out now for a very long time, and there's a fair-sized note in Doug Anderson's Annotated Hobbit as well.

But I agree with DA when he says "Yet these similarities in name reveal nothing about Tolkien's wizard Radagast the Brown."