Minas Ithil

[Celebaglar]

I am quite interested in the fate of Minas Ithil (Morgul). Aragorn said it was not to be inhabited until its evil had washed away. But he was concerned in the restoration of the gondor of old in middle earth. Does anyone know of how it was restored and what was done with it?

[Elianna]

On their way to Morannon, Aragorn, Gandalf and a vanguard rode to Minas Ithil and destroyed its bridge and burnt the fields surrounding it. Then when speaking with Beregond after becoming King, Aragorn says "Minas Ithil in Morgul Vale shall be utterly destroyed, and though it may in time to come be made clean, no man may dwell there for many long years."

I would guess that "it" is referring to the Morgul Vale and not Minas Ithil.

So it seems that they tore down Minas Ithil because it was too infected with evilness by the Nazgûl. Aragorn thought though that in time, the area's evilness would subside.

It does seems strange to destroy Minas Ithil but then go looking through Orthanc, but then again, they can't destroy Orthanc, and perhaps hundreds of years of Nazgûl living there is worse than a briefer stay of a power-hungry wizard.

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by Elianna

It does seems strange to destroy Minas Ithil but then go looking through Orthanc, but then again, they can't destroy Orthanc, and perhaps hundreds of years of Nazgûl living there is worse than a briefer stay of a power-hungry wizard.

I never found it strange, but my perception is that what Saruman and the Nazgul did were quite different things. Saruman is described in Unfinished Tales as a packrat, he liked to rob graves and steal artefacts. For this reason, Saruman would keep Orthanc as is, and not desecrate it. It was only in the last half century or so of his life that he started perverting things, like the orks and the Shire, and things in general, although he had started going evil long before.

The Nazgul, on the other hand, were servants of Sauron, and like him they seem to have a direct effect on the places they live in, making them horrid and evil.

Another thought too is this: who knows what could have happened in Morgul Vale if there had been enough Ents to go do land reclamation?+

[Elianna]

Originally Posted by Formendacil

Another thought too is this: who knows what could have happened in Morgul Vale if there had been enough Ents to go do land reclamation?+

Maybe that would have been different since the Ents never lived near the Morgul Vale?

[Celebaglar]

What of the palantir of sauron, and the palantir within osgiliath, i have not had the pleasure of reading the unfinshed tales, so please bare with me.

[Gil-Galad]

Palantir of Sauron was more likly lost with the fall of Barad-Dur, and the Palantir of Osgiliath was lost to the sea during the kin-strife...

[dwarfguard]

i think he also wanted to wash away memory of the foul things that happened there and start off fresh

[Celebaglar]

Still, it seems like a rather noble idea to reclaim minas ithil in the name of godor, also, i do not know of what the kinstrife is, i did not read the unfinished tales, i only have an encyclopedia of middle earth, the silmarillion, and the three lotr books as well as the hobbit to draw information from.

[Elianna]

The Kin-strife was a civil war in Gondor, between the rightful son of the king and some decendents of an earlier king, who didn't like the rightful king because his mom wasn't of Númenorean descent. The son of the king eventually won and the losers went off to Umbar, which explains why the Corsairs of Umbar don't like Gondor in the LotR. The Kin-strife is told of in Appen. A of LotR, under part (iv) "Gondor and the Heirs of Anárion."

[Celebaglar]

ahhh yes, now i remember, the umbar are the black numenoreans correct? that is an oxymoron in itself, the black numenoreans don't have a society as organized as numenor or gondor. In any event, if i were aragorn, i would offer the balck numenoreans control of the morgul vale in exchange for an alliance.