Questions About Middle-earth and Numenor? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

GreatWarg · 05-25-2002, 02:03 PM

If you have ANY questions, post them up here for all to see and to repsond to! One MAJOR question I want to ask: Since there were Five Wizards that were sent to ME, what happened to the other two that went west with Saruman and never returned?

piosenniel · 05-25-2002, 02:08 PM

Were those the blue wizards?

Veritas · 05-25-2002, 02:13 PM

What are blue wizards?
I thought there was:
Sarumon the White
Gandalf the Grey
Radagast the Blue (or was it Brown)
(I don't know anyone else)

Are the blue wizards then somthing else, or am I just completely wrong?

[ May 25, 2002: Message edited by: Veritas ]

Ithaeliel · 05-25-2002, 02:36 PM

Me too, I thought there was only three wizards. BTW, what is Radagast called by the elves (like Gandalf being called Mithrandir and Saruman is Cúrunir)?

GreatWarg · 05-25-2002, 03:09 PM

There ARE blue wizards. But nobody is sure what happened to them.

lathspell · 05-26-2002, 01:09 PM

Yes, there were sent five Istari to Middle-earth. Their names were Olorin (Gandalf), Curumo (Saruman), Aiwendil (Radagast), and the two Blue Wizards (Ithryn Luin), named: Alatar and Pallando. These names are the names they had in Valinor and these are the only names which they had that are known to us for they had no names in the ME (at least not in the parts of ME of which the tales tell).
When they came to ME, Saruman went eastwards with Alatar and Pallando. Saruman returned and settled in Orthanc, Isengard. What has happened to the Blue Wizards is not known for sure, but in UT Christopher Tolkien writes the following:

Quote:

In a letter written in 1958my father said that he knew nothing clearly about 'the other two', since they were not concerned in the history of the North-west of Middle-earth.
'I think,' he wrote, 'they went as emissaries to distant regions, East and South, far out of Númenórean range: missionaries to "enemy-occupied" lands, as it were. What success they had I do not know; but I fear they failed, as Saruman did, though doubtless in different ways; and I suspect that they were founders or beginners of secret cults and "magic" traditions that outlasted the fall of Sauron.'

Olorin was sent by Manwë and Varda
Curumo was sent by Aule
Aiwendil was sent by Yavanna
Alatar and Pallando were sent by Oromë (for he had the greatest knowledge of the Valar about the far distant realms)

Ithaeliel - Aiwendil is the Quenya name of Radagast (meaning 'lover of birds'). This was his name on Aman. I don't know his Sindarin-name in Middle-earth. I doubt if it mentioned somewhere.

greetings,
lathspell

GreatWarg · 05-27-2002, 12:41 PM

Nicely put lathspell. Radagast was the Brown, but he didn't truly complete hsi Quest either because he became "obssessed" with animals and birds of ME. Only gandalf truly completed the Quest and returned to valinor.

Luineglin · 05-27-2002, 01:05 PM

yeah isnt there a theory that the 2 blue wizards started cults or somethin of the sort. Gandalf was the only one true to his task.

lathspell · 05-27-2002, 01:51 PM

GreatWarg - thank you... and yes, Gandalf was the only to complete the quest. It is (in any way not by me) not known why Radagast had was sent anyway. The only 'speculation' that I found in UT is that Yavanna wanted to sent him, I think for the protection of nature and not only of humanoids. It's the only thing I could think of.
If anyone knows the reason of Radagast being sent to ME, please tell.

Luineglin - yes, there is, as is said in the quote written above.

greetings,
lathspell

Joy · 05-27-2002, 02:04 PM

I have a question - well two actually [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

How far is it from Mithlond to Nogrod?

How far it it from Nogrod to Khazah-dùm?

Elrian · 05-27-2002, 02:20 PM

It didn't exist after the First Age, Nogrod was situated in the part of the Ered Luin that was destroyed at the end of the First Age, The lands changed and the town and harbour of Mithlond are now in that area that once was Nogrod. I had thought Belegost was the only surviver of that cataclysm since that part of the Ered Luin is still there, but that also was destroyed and it's people went to Moria. Two great books that can aid your research for your fanfic (quite good from what I've read [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] ) are The complete Guide to Middle Earth by Robert Foster and The Atlas of Middle Earth by Karen Wynn Fonstad. The first is like a Tolkien dictionary and the second has geographical maps of places and areas in different Ages of Time.

05-25-2002, 02:03 PM	#1
GreatWarg Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: May 2002 Location: East of the Misty Mountains Posts: 339	Questions About Middle-earth and Numenor? If you have ANY questions, post them up here for all to see and to repsond to! One MAJOR question I want to ask: Since there were Five Wizards that were sent to ME, what happened to the other two that went west with Saruman and never returned? __________________ "What shall we do, what shall we do!" he cried. "Escaping goblins to be caught be wolves!"

05-25-2002, 02:08 PM	#2
piosenniel Desultory Dwimmerlaik Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Pickin' flowers with Bill the Cat..... Posts: 7,779	Were those the blue wizards? __________________ Eldest, that’s what I am . . . I knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside.

05-25-2002, 02:13 PM	#3
Veritas Wight Join Date: May 2002 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 131	What are blue wizards? I thought there was: Sarumon the White Gandalf the Grey Radagast the Blue (or was it Brown) (I don't know anyone else) Are the blue wizards then somthing else, or am I just completely wrong? [ May 25, 2002: Message edited by: Veritas ] __________________ With the birds I'll share this lonely view. ~Red Hot Chili Peppers, Scar Tisue~ Laurëfin

05-25-2002, 02:36 PM	#4
Ithaeliel Cornus Caliga Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Five-hundred-twenty-five thousand, six hundred minutes from here Posts: 710	Me too, I thought there was only three wizards. BTW, what is Radagast called by the elves (like Gandalf being called Mithrandir and Saruman is Cúrunir)? __________________ That best portion of a good man's life, His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. .................William Wordsworth

05-25-2002, 03:09 PM	#5
GreatWarg Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: May 2002 Location: East of the Misty Mountains Posts: 339	There ARE blue wizards. But nobody is sure what happened to them. __________________ "What shall we do, what shall we do!" he cried. "Escaping goblins to be caught be wolves!"

05-27-2002, 12:41 PM	#7
GreatWarg Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: May 2002 Location: East of the Misty Mountains Posts: 339	Nicely put lathspell. Radagast was the Brown, but he didn't truly complete hsi Quest either because he became "obssessed" with animals and birds of ME. Only gandalf truly completed the Quest and returned to valinor. __________________ "What shall we do, what shall we do!" he cried. "Escaping goblins to be caught be wolves!"

05-27-2002, 01:05 PM	#8
Luineglin Haunting Spirit Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: In a terrible paradise Posts: 93	yeah isnt there a theory that the 2 blue wizards started cults or somethin of the sort. Gandalf was the only one true to his task. __________________ All that is gold does not glitter, Not all that wander are lost; The old that is strong does not wither, Deep roots are not reached by the frost. From the ashes a fire shall be woken, A light from the shadows shall spring; Renewed shall be blade that was broken, The crownless again shall be king. Bilbo Baggins Describing Aragorn Son of Arathorn Heir of Elendil,Elessar-Elfstone of his people

05-27-2002, 01:51 PM	#9
lathspell Regenerating Ringkeeper Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Holland Posts: 757	GreatWarg - thank you... and yes, Gandalf was the only to complete the quest. It is (in any way not by me) not known why Radagast had was sent anyway. The only 'speculation' that I found in UT is that Yavanna wanted to sent him, I think for the protection of nature and not only of humanoids. It's the only thing I could think of. If anyone knows the reason of Radagast being sent to ME, please tell. Luineglin - yes, there is, as is said in the quote written above. greetings, lathspell __________________ 'You?' cried Frodo. 'Yes, I, Gandalf the Grey,' said the wizard solemnly. 'There are many powers in the world, for good or for evil. Some are greater than I am. Against some I have not yet been measured. But my time is coming.'

05-27-2002, 02:04 PM	#10
Joy Spirit of a Warrior Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Wandering Posts: 1,012	I have a question - well two actually [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] How far is it from Mithlond to Nogrod? How far it it from Nogrod to Khazah-dùm? __________________ God bless, Joy KingdomWarrior@hotmail.com http://kingdomWarrior.jlym.com As the hart panteth after the water brooks, so panteth my soul after thee, O God. My soul thirsteth for God, for the living God: when shall I come and appear before God?

05-27-2002, 02:20 PM	#11
Elrian Eldar Spirit of Truth Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Land of the FREE, Home of the BRAVE Posts: 794	It didn't exist after the First Age, Nogrod was situated in the part of the Ered Luin that was destroyed at the end of the First Age, The lands changed and the town and harbour of Mithlond are now in that area that once was Nogrod. I had thought Belegost was the only surviver of that cataclysm since that part of the Ered Luin is still there, but that also was destroyed and it's people went to Moria. Two great books that can aid your research for your fanfic (quite good from what I've read [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] ) are The complete Guide to Middle Earth by Robert Foster and The Atlas of Middle Earth by Karen Wynn Fonstad. The first is like a Tolkien dictionary and the second has geographical maps of places and areas in different Ages of Time. __________________ ~Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.~