Hroa and Fea? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

MatthewM · 10-30-2007, 04:04 PM

The thread "Gandalf's Powers" mentioned hroa and fea. I've heard the words before, but am not sure of there meanings. What is hroa and fea? I also have heard of ofermod, but do not know what it is, although I believe it is over whelming pride? Can anybody help me out? Thanks!

William Cloud Hicklin · 10-30-2007, 07:50 PM

Hroa and fea refer to what can be called roughly (not precisely) 'body' and 'soul' in rational Incarnates. These terms do not apply to Ainur and the like, who are ealar 'spirits', who can if they choose a put on a visible form, a fana. The major exception to this is the Istari or Wizards, who were ealar physically incarnarte in hroar, with the express consent of Manwe (if not Eru Himself).

How 'physical' a fana was is rather fuzzy. Apparently certain acts, such as childbirth, would render a fana 'permanent;' this was especially the case if the Spirit in question attempted to master physical matter in that form: hence the inability over time of Morgoth and Sauron to alter their appearance- and indeed, the 'death' of Morgoth when his fana was destroyed by Mandos.

William Cloud Hicklin · 10-30-2007, 07:54 PM

Ofermod- this is an Old English word which is only attested in a couple of places, notably in the poem The Battle of Maldon. Tolkien believed (not all scholars agree with him) that it meant 'overboldness, excessive courage,' and was a word of condemnation denoting rashness. Interestingly, modern Danish overmod means 'hubris', overweening pride.

Tolkien's essay on the word and the concept appear as a codicil to his dramatic poem "The Homecoming of Beohrtnoth."

MatthewM · 11-10-2007, 05:10 PM

Thanks, William! I apprecite you taking the time and explaining it!

10-30-2007, 04:04 PM	#1
MatthewM Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: New York Posts: 628	Hroa and Fea? The thread "Gandalf's Powers" mentioned hroa and fea. I've heard the words before, but am not sure of there meanings. What is hroa and fea? I also have heard of ofermod, but do not know what it is, although I believe it is over whelming pride? Can anybody help me out? Thanks! __________________ "Loud and clear it sounds in the valleys of the hills...and then let all the foes of Gondor flee!" -Boromir, The Fellowship of the Ring

10-30-2007, 07:50 PM	#2
William Cloud Hicklin Loremaster of Annúminas Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 2,322	Hroa and fea refer to what can be called roughly (not precisely) 'body' and 'soul' in rational Incarnates. These terms do not apply to Ainur and the like, who are ealar 'spirits', who can if they choose a put on a visible form, a fana. The major exception to this is the Istari or Wizards, who were ealar physically incarnarte in hroar, with the express consent of Manwe (if not Eru Himself). How 'physical' a fana was is rather fuzzy. Apparently certain acts, such as childbirth, would render a fana 'permanent;' this was especially the case if the Spirit in question attempted to master physical matter in that form: hence the inability over time of Morgoth and Sauron to alter their appearance- and indeed, the 'death' of Morgoth when his fana was destroyed by Mandos. __________________ The entire plot of The Lord of the Rings could be said to turn on what Sauron didn’t know, and when he didn’t know it.

10-30-2007, 07:54 PM	#3
William Cloud Hicklin Loremaster of Annúminas Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 2,322	Ofermod- this is an Old English word which is only attested in a couple of places, notably in the poem The Battle of Maldon. Tolkien believed (not all scholars agree with him) that it meant 'overboldness, excessive courage,' and was a word of condemnation denoting rashness. Interestingly, modern Danish overmod means 'hubris', overweening pride. Tolkien's essay on the word and the concept appear as a codicil to his dramatic poem "The Homecoming of Beohrtnoth." __________________ The entire plot of The Lord of the Rings could be said to turn on what Sauron didn’t know, and when he didn’t know it.

11-10-2007, 05:10 PM	#4
MatthewM Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: New York Posts: 628	Thanks, William! I apprecite you taking the time and explaining it! __________________ "Loud and clear it sounds in the valleys of the hills...and then let all the foes of Gondor flee!" -Boromir, The Fellowship of the Ring