Who do you say Beorn is? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Arwen Imladris · 07-26-2002, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Some say that he is a bear descended from the ancient bears of the mountains that lived there before the giants came. Others say that he is a man desecneded from the first men who lived fefore smaug or the other dragons caame into this part of the world.

What do you think? Is there any other evedence to what he is?

Sarin Elfarmour · 07-26-2002, 02:46 PM

I say Beorn is Beorn, but as to WHAT he is i honetsly have no clue

Fingolfin of the Noldor · 07-26-2002, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Beorn is dead; see vol. I p. 241. He appeared in The Hobbit. It was then the year Third Age 2940 (Shire-reckoning 1340). We are now in the years 3018-19 (1418-19). Though a skin-changer and no doubt a bit of a magician, Beorn was a Man. -letter 144 pg 178 The Letters of JRR Tolkien

littlemanpoet · 07-27-2002, 09:05 AM

Tolkien is dipping deep into Northern lore with Beorn. 's pretty much what he did anyway, with Dwarves and Goblins and Elves and Dragons in The Hobbit. Just goes to show how fascinating Northern legends and myths are.

lmp

Orofacion of the Vanyar · 07-27-2002, 01:12 PM

To further the point made that Beorn was human, infact, he is actually distantly related to the Rohirrim, both of their ancestors lived around the area between the Misty Mountains and Mirkwood.

Luntindomeiel · 07-27-2002, 01:16 PM

In my opinion, Beorn was some kind of man. Probably, when realizing he was VERY different, he left his town and went to live in the forest [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Arwen Imladris · 07-27-2002, 01:20 PM

Wow! Thanks guys!

Quote:

he is actually distantly related to the Rohirrim,

Really? But he has black hair! Oh well!

If any one wants to say anything else go ahead!

Elrian · 07-27-2002, 01:35 PM

Where in the books does it say he is distantly related to the Rohirrim?

Morgoth Bauglir · 07-27-2002, 03:53 PM

i recall hearing that he was a descendant of the rohirrim also. i think they mightve talked about it in the begining of the fellowship (probably wrong though).

Elrian · 07-27-2002, 04:34 PM

It's not in any of JRR's books. If you do not know for sure let the person who made the statement answer, or someone who knows where the statement can be found.

[ July 27, 2002: Message edited by: Elrian ]

theWhiteLady · 07-27-2002, 04:57 PM

I also recall hearing that the Rohirrim were related to Beorn's folk... After much searching I have found it! This is the exact quote by Aragorn to Legolas and Gimli: "It was in forgotten years long ago that Eorl the Young brought them out of the North, and their kinship is rather with the Bardings of Dale, and with Beornings of the Wood, among whom may still be seen many men tall and fair, as are the Riders of Rohan."

On the subject of what was Beorn, were not some of the first men of M-e able to change shape? I am recalling an obscure reference from the Sil... though perhaps it is my imagination.

[ July 27, 2002: Message edited by: theWhiteLady ]

Elrian · 07-27-2002, 05:05 PM

Yes the Beornings but it does not say Beorn himself who was a shape shifter and probably isn't a good representative of those people. Good that you found that quote, perhaps you'd like to introduce yourself in the Novices and Newcomers forum. Welcome to the BarrowDowns!

theWhiteLady · 07-27-2002, 05:11 PM

Thank you for the kind welcome! Oro and a few others may know me by the same screen name from the White City [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] Perhaps it is there that I heard some of the first men had such power as Beorn, for I cannot find any reference in either the Sil. or Unfinished Tales...

[ July 27, 2002: Message edited by: theWhiteLady ]

Sarin Elfarmour · 07-27-2002, 08:03 PM

Beorn appered as a bear in the Bofa, i'd say he's a shape shifter

Orofacion of the Vanyar · 07-27-2002, 11:26 PM

Aiya a mae govannen White Lady,

It is good to see you here at the Barrow-Downs and thank you for finding that passage for me.

Elrian,

The Beornings ARE the descendants of Beorn, hence the name. Why would a race be named after a later member of said race? Beorn is related to the ancestors of Eorl, the men of Rhovanion. There is a bit about these people in the Appendixes following the Return of the King. I'd take a look in there.

Gandalf_theGrey · 07-27-2002, 11:33 PM

Hullo theWhiteLady,

* bows a greeting *

Perhaps one day the entire Fellowship of the Witty Word from the Tribunate of Merethrond will sail West. We can only hope. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Meanwhile, to answer your question, "On the subject of what was Beorn, were not some of the first men of M-e able to change shape?"

Well, there are werewolves in Middle Earth.

At your Service,

Gandalf the Grey

theWhiteLady · 07-28-2002, 02:32 PM

I was thinking that if a few of the first men were able to change shape, Beorn would have been directly descended from them. However, I have been unable to find the quote I was looking for to back up my original idea...

07-26-2002, 02:46 PM	#2
Sarin Elfarmour Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 43	I say Beorn is Beorn, but as to WHAT he is i honetsly have no clue __________________ Baruk Khazad! Khazad ai-menu

07-27-2002, 01:16 PM	#6
Luntindomeiel Pile O'Bones Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Hobbiton Posts: 11	In my opinion, Beorn was some kind of man. Probably, when realizing he was VERY different, he left his town and went to live in the forest [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] __________________ Tenna' ento lye omenta, «º¨± HøßßiT ± ¨º» http://www.plauder-smilies.de/poke2.gif

07-27-2002, 01:35 PM	#8
Elrian Eldar Spirit of Truth Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Land of the FREE, Home of the BRAVE Posts: 794	Where in the books does it say he is distantly related to the Rohirrim? __________________ ~Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.~

07-27-2002, 04:34 PM	#10
Elrian Eldar Spirit of Truth Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Land of the FREE, Home of the BRAVE Posts: 794	It's not in any of JRR's books. If you do not know for sure let the person who made the statement answer, or someone who knows where the statement can be found. [ July 27, 2002: Message edited by: Elrian ] __________________ ~Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.~

07-27-2002, 05:05 PM	#12
Elrian Eldar Spirit of Truth Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Land of the FREE, Home of the BRAVE Posts: 794	Yes the Beornings but it does not say Beorn himself who was a shape shifter and probably isn't a good representative of those people. Good that you found that quote, perhaps you'd like to introduce yourself in the Novices and Newcomers forum. Welcome to the BarrowDowns! __________________ ~Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.~

07-27-2002, 09:05 AM	#4
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Tolkien is dipping deep into Northern lore with Beorn. 's pretty much what he did anyway, with Dwarves and Goblins and Elves and Dragons in The Hobbit. Just goes to show how fascinating Northern legends and myths are. lmp

07-27-2002, 01:12 PM	#5
Orofacion of the Vanyar Wight Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Clayton, NC Posts: 102	To further the point made that Beorn was human, infact, he is actually distantly related to the Rohirrim, both of their ancestors lived around the area between the Misty Mountains and Mirkwood.

07-27-2002, 03:53 PM	#9
Morgoth Bauglir Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 252	i recall hearing that he was a descendant of the rohirrim also. i think they mightve talked about it in the begining of the fellowship (probably wrong though).

07-27-2002, 04:57 PM	#11
theWhiteLady Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Tennessee Posts: 116	I also recall hearing that the Rohirrim were related to Beorn's folk... After much searching I have found it! This is the exact quote by Aragorn to Legolas and Gimli: "It was in forgotten years long ago that Eorl the Young brought them out of the North, and their kinship is rather with the Bardings of Dale, and with Beornings of the Wood, among whom may still be seen many men tall and fair, as are the Riders of Rohan." On the subject of what was Beorn, were not some of the first men of M-e able to change shape? I am recalling an obscure reference from the Sil... though perhaps it is my imagination. [ July 27, 2002: Message edited by: theWhiteLady ]

07-27-2002, 05:11 PM	#13
theWhiteLady Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Tennessee Posts: 116	Thank you for the kind welcome! Oro and a few others may know me by the same screen name from the White City [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] Perhaps it is there that I heard some of the first men had such power as Beorn, for I cannot find any reference in either the Sil. or Unfinished Tales... [ July 27, 2002: Message edited by: theWhiteLady ]

07-27-2002, 08:03 PM	#14
Sarin Elfarmour Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 43	Beorn appered as a bear in the Bofa, i'd say he's a shape shifter __________________ Baruk Khazad! Khazad ai-menu

07-27-2002, 11:26 PM	#15
Orofacion of the Vanyar Wight Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Clayton, NC Posts: 102	Aiya a mae govannen White Lady, It is good to see you here at the Barrow-Downs and thank you for finding that passage for me. Elrian, The Beornings ARE the descendants of Beorn, hence the name. Why would a race be named after a later member of said race? Beorn is related to the ancestors of Eorl, the men of Rhovanion. There is a bit about these people in the Appendixes following the Return of the King. I'd take a look in there.

07-27-2002, 11:33 PM	#16
Gandalf_theGrey Visionary Spirit Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 633	Hullo theWhiteLady, * bows a greeting * Perhaps one day the entire Fellowship of the Witty Word from the Tribunate of Merethrond will sail West. We can only hope. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] Meanwhile, to answer your question, "On the subject of what was Beorn, were not some of the first men of M-e able to change shape?" Well, there are werewolves in Middle Earth. At your Service, Gandalf the Grey

07-28-2002, 02:32 PM	#17
theWhiteLady Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Tennessee Posts: 116	I was thinking that if a few of the first men were able to change shape, Beorn would have been directly descended from them. However, I have been unable to find the quote I was looking for to back up my original idea...