New Swedish translation - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Nilturiel · 10-03-2004, 11:21 AM

A new swedish translation has been released now

. The old one was realy bad.

Are there any one else from Sweden here except me? Just wondering..

Mithalwen · 10-03-2004, 12:07 PM

I think if you trawl through "Where is everybody from?" In the Barrowdowns section you may well find some compatriots

.

I believe Tolkien (who of course was in a better position to judge than most authors) was unhappy about some of the translations. Of course the task would be very challenging given the amount of thought that JRRT put into the linguistic structure of ME. JK Rowling has also disliked some of the ways names have been translated in Harry Potter ... must be a nightmare for the translator when the author is a competent linguist!!!

Anyway I hope you find the new version more satifactory

NightKnight · 10-04-2004, 12:12 AM

I'm from Sweden, and I've seen the new translation in a book store, but I haven't read it. Have you? Is it better?

Nilturiel · 10-04-2004, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NightKnight

I'm from Sweden, and I've seen the new translation in a book store, but I haven't read it. Have you? Is it better?

I have red a bit. I think its better, but they have change some names and it is quite enoying. But the names are probebly better translated then the old ones.

________

All that is gold does not glitter..

Mithalwen · 10-06-2004, 12:52 PM

On the subject of translations, albeit not Swedish ones, I have just discovered that Tolkien's grandson has translated the first two books of HoME in to French. I think that this is wonderful that there is this link from father to son to grandson.

Nenya · 10-16-2004, 06:20 PM

Talking about translations on the whole, how do you feel about translating proper names that have an actual meaning of sorts, e.g. Bag end and Brandywine? In the finnish translation of LotR most of these names have been translated, including such important ones as the Shire (which would of course propose huge problems when left untranslated) and Baggins.
The translations are almost all good - though I object to the unnecessary changing of Merry to "Merri" - and I can see the necessity for them, but it's still somehow sad to see how the wonderfully quirky names that we know Tolkien put so much time into creating have been modiefied and changed by others. Oh well, you can't have your cake and it eat too, I guess.

Mithalwen · 10-17-2004, 12:40 PM

I suppose if they are translated really well, with serious consideration of the rationale Tolkien expressed in the appendices, then it would be better to translate than not - unless you believe that the Shire has to retain it's English "feel" . Many of the hobbit names (but not Bilbo or Frodo) are similar to English names even if Toby is short for Tobold not Tobias and most of the surnames are clearly English, albeit slightly silly English.

Well the point I am trying to make is that the hobbit names are familiar to English reader in the way that the names of elves, dwarves, Gondor and even Rohan are not. It seems reasonable that the hobbit names should be rendered into things that are familiar in the translated language.

Certainly it should be done with care - the HP one that upset was making Prof Dumbledore Prof Silencio in Italian. Dumbledore is an old word for bumblebee and was chosen to suggest constant activity and a buzzing mind. Silencio picked up on the "dumb" bit only. I have the French versions of HP and I am not too keen on some of the names. I would be intrigued to see what they did with LOTR.

Guinevere · 10-18-2004, 06:45 PM

Since you are talking of translations I allow myself to give a link to my old thread here Tolkien Translations
The problems of the translated English names are discussed from post # 20 on.

On one hand I can understand the translator's reasoning that according to the fiction all the names that are supposed to be in "the common tongue" are therefore to be translated as well as the whole narrative.

On the other hand I feel not only that much local colour is lost that way (see the quotes from Tolkien's letters! The Shire is in England and nowhere else!) but in international discussions (let alone quizzes) it is very confusing to have different names for one and the same character! And since the movies people had to get used to the English names now anyhow!

I hope and think the new Swedish translation must be better - Tolkien was particularly annoyed with the first Swedish translation, as the translator seems to have taken a lot of liberties...

10-03-2004, 11:21 AM	#1
Nilturiel Animated Skeleton Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: far away (sweden) Posts: 31	New Swedish translation A new swedish translation has been released now . The old one was realy bad. Are there any one else from Sweden here except me? Just wondering..

10-03-2004, 12:07 PM	#2
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,458	I think if you trawl through "Where is everybody from?" In the Barrowdowns section you may well find some compatriots . I believe Tolkien (who of course was in a better position to judge than most authors) was unhappy about some of the translations. Of course the task would be very challenging given the amount of thought that JRRT put into the linguistic structure of ME. JK Rowling has also disliked some of the ways names have been translated in Harry Potter ... must be a nightmare for the translator when the author is a competent linguist!!! Anyway I hope you find the new version more satifactory __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace Last edited by Mithalwen; 10-03-2004 at 12:08 PM. Reason: spelling - don't want to speculate about the nature of "campetent" linguists!

10-04-2004, 12:12 AM	#3
NightKnight Lost among the Stars Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Hiding in Childhood (Sweden) Posts: 2,690	I'm from Sweden, and I've seen the new translation in a book store, but I haven't read it. Have you? Is it better? __________________ There are three kinds of people in this world. Those who can count, and those who can't.

10-06-2004, 12:52 PM	#5
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,458	On the subject of translations, albeit not Swedish ones, I have just discovered that Tolkien's grandson has translated the first two books of HoME in to French. I think that this is wonderful that there is this link from father to son to grandson. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

10-17-2004, 12:40 PM	#7
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,458	I suppose if they are translated really well, with serious consideration of the rationale Tolkien expressed in the appendices, then it would be better to translate than not - unless you believe that the Shire has to retain it's English "feel" . Many of the hobbit names (but not Bilbo or Frodo) are similar to English names even if Toby is short for Tobold not Tobias and most of the surnames are clearly English, albeit slightly silly English. Well the point I am trying to make is that the hobbit names are familiar to English reader in the way that the names of elves, dwarves, Gondor and even Rohan are not. It seems reasonable that the hobbit names should be rendered into things that are familiar in the translated language. Certainly it should be done with care - the HP one that upset was making Prof Dumbledore Prof Silencio in Italian. Dumbledore is an old word for bumblebee and was chosen to suggest constant activity and a buzzing mind. Silencio picked up on the "dumb" bit only. I have the French versions of HP and I am not too keen on some of the names. I would be intrigued to see what they did with LOTR. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

10-16-2004, 06:20 PM	#6
Nenya Wight Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: the hand of Lady Galadriel Posts: 127	Talking about translations on the whole, how do you feel about translating proper names that have an actual meaning of sorts, e.g. Bag end and Brandywine? In the finnish translation of LotR most of these names have been translated, including such important ones as the Shire (which would of course propose huge problems when left untranslated) and Baggins. The translations are almost all good - though I object to the unnecessary changing of Merry to "Merri" - and I can see the necessity for them, but it's still somehow sad to see how the wonderfully quirky names that we know Tolkien put so much time into creating have been modiefied and changed by others. Oh well, you can't have your cake and it eat too, I guess.

10-18-2004, 06:45 PM	#8
Guinevere Banshee of Camelot Join Date: May 2002 Location: Switzerland Posts: 5,830	Since you are talking of translations I allow myself to give a link to my old thread here Tolkien Translations The problems of the translated English names are discussed from post # 20 on. On one hand I can understand the translator's reasoning that according to the fiction all the names that are supposed to be in "the common tongue" are therefore to be translated as well as the whole narrative. On the other hand I feel not only that much local colour is lost that way (see the quotes from Tolkien's letters! The Shire is in England and nowhere else!) but in international discussions (let alone quizzes) it is very confusing to have different names for one and the same character! And since the movies people had to get used to the English names now anyhow! I hope and think the new Swedish translation must be better - Tolkien was particularly annoyed with the first Swedish translation, as the translator seems to have taken a lot of liberties... __________________ Yes! "wish-fulfilment dreams" we spin to cheat our timid hearts, and ugly Fact defeat!