The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Discussions > Novices and Newcomers
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-09-2004, 04:04 AM   #1
Isowen
Haunting Spirit
 
Isowen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: The blackened depths
Posts: 86
Isowen has just left Hobbiton.
Silmaril I spy with my little eye.....

Bilbo complains that the ring, "was like an eye looking at me"
When Frodo sees the eye of Sauron in Galadriel's mirror, he is frozen with fear. So just one question........why would Sauron appaer as a one eye?
__________________
I hope Butterbur sends this promptly. A worthy man, but his memory is like a lumber -room:
Thing wanted always burried, If he forgets, I shall roast him.
Isowen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2004, 06:33 AM   #2
dancing spawn of ungoliant
Mischievous Candle
 
dancing spawn of ungoliant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: So near to Russia, so far from Japan, quite a long way from Cairo, lots of miles from Vietnam.
Posts: 1,234
dancing spawn of ungoliant has just left Hobbiton.
Send a message via MSN to dancing spawn of ungoliant
After Sauron's defeat in the battle of Dagorlad, he wasn't able to embody himself. As we know, he didn't die but his spirit just couldn't take a new form. The 'Eye of Sauron', however, is a plain reference to his sleeples attentivenes and wickedness. There wasn't any gigantic eye hanging out in Barad-dûr's pinnacle. The movie makers just got a bit carried away.
__________________
Fenris Wolf

Last edited by dancing spawn of ungoliant; 08-09-2004 at 06:37 AM.
dancing spawn of ungoliant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2004, 06:34 AM   #3
Elianna
Shade of Carn Dûm
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Ad finem itineris
Posts: 384
Elianna has just left Hobbiton.
Tolkien

One great eye, lidless, wreathed in flame, whose gaze pierces cloud, shadow, earth, and flesh. If nothing else, that's kinda creepy, good scare tactic.

An eye because that means he's looking, searching everywhere, and I mean everywhere for his Ring. "You cannot hide. I see you." "If I put it on, he'll find me. He'll see."

One because that shows how single minded he is in his persuit. "He is seeking it, seeking it. All his thought is bent on it."

(Sorry I can't think of any more quotes from the book, but that why I think he's an Eye.)
Elianna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2004, 09:52 AM   #4
Eomer of the Rohirrim
Auspicious Wraith
 
Eomer of the Rohirrim's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 4,859
Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Boots

Genius symbolism.
__________________
Los Ingobernables de Harlond
Eomer of the Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2004, 12:39 PM   #5
Boromir88
Laconic Loreman
 
Boromir88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 7,518
Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.
Send a message via AIM to Boromir88 Send a message via MSN to Boromir88
1420! Great Spotlight

The spotlight of Sauron is the cheesiest thing PJ could have ever done. LOL, why don't they just sound the alarm and call SWAT (Sauron's wicked a** trolls). Anyway on to the "Eye of Sauron," since I've shown my extreme hatred towards the whole "spotlight" thing.

Most people have this covered, it was just to symbolize Sauron was watching you, even if you were a ring-bearer or not he was watching. Glorfindel points out in Rivendell,

Quote:
Council of Elrond
"But in any case" said Glorfindel, "to send the ring to him (Bombadil) would only postpone the day of evil. He is far away. We could not take it back to him, unguessed, unmarked by any spy...
That is just one quote from the book of Sauron's "watchfullness." He has his 9 riders also going around searching for the Ring "watching" for him, well did, they're horses were drowned in Bruinen.
Boromir88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2004, 09:20 AM   #6
The Perky Ent
Maniacal Mage
 
The Perky Ent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Setting sail for Umbar, with Firefoot at my side!
Posts: 3,297
The Perky Ent has just left Hobbiton.
Send a message via AIM to The Perky Ent
White Tree

Wait a minute! Are Sauron and Santa Claus related? Think about it! They see you when your sleeping. They see when you're awake! Is this some kinda North Pole -> Mordor conspiricy?
__________________
'But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.'
The Perky Ent is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2004, 11:20 AM   #7
Boromir88
Laconic Loreman
 
Boromir88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 7,518
Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.
Send a message via AIM to Boromir88 Send a message via MSN to Boromir88
1420! That's why....

So that's why I got this golden ring with a strange inscription on it for Christmas from Santa. I knew they were in this together!

Here Perky let me finish the tune.

"He knows when you are sleeping, he knows when you're awake
he knows if you've been bad or good so you better be...er...bad for badness sake"

Last edited by Boromir88; 09-06-2004 at 11:50 AM.
Boromir88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2004, 01:42 PM   #8
Elianna
Shade of Carn Dûm
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Ad finem itineris
Posts: 384
Elianna has just left Hobbiton.
Tolkien

Sorry to continue on this tangent....

Another way Santa and Sauron are related: Forcing elves to do their will! Sauron's elves just happen to already be turned into orcs. I don't think Santa's elves are far from being changed. How can the elves, lovers of nature and all things that grow, survive in the frozen desert of the North Pole?!
Elianna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2004, 07:26 PM   #9
Encaitare
Bittersweet Symphony
 
Encaitare's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: On the jolly starship Enterprise
Posts: 1,814
Encaitare is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
I wonder how long it'll be before this thread is closed, or we're reprimanded for going completely OT... but I'll jump on the bandwagon. Maybe they're stragglers from when the elves crossed the Helcaraxe. They have since evolved into smaller creatures better suited to the icy environment.
Encaitare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2004, 07:37 PM   #10
The Perky Ent
Maniacal Mage
 
The Perky Ent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Setting sail for Umbar, with Firefoot at my side!
Posts: 3,297
The Perky Ent has just left Hobbiton.
Send a message via AIM to The Perky Ent
White Tree Sheperding Back...

But back to the eye. The omni-presense of an eye looming over the world strikes more fear then
Quote:
"It's evil! Very evil! But it doesn't really exsist...well it does! But it's not in any kinda form. It's just there"
I've always thought of Santa...and Clowns for that matter to be crazy stalkers. And if Sauron has to resort to their level to be scary, then why shouldn't he?
__________________
'But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.'
The Perky Ent is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2004, 02:40 PM   #11
Son of Númenor
A Shade of Westernesse
 
Son of Númenor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: The last wave over Atalantë
Posts: 515
Son of Númenor has just left Hobbiton.
Sauron was never just an eye. And he could and did take physical form after Isildur took the Ring; specifically, he took physical form circa the years leading up to the War of the Ring.
Son of Númenor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2004, 02:48 PM   #12
Guinevere
Banshee of Camelot
 
Guinevere's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 5,830
Guinevere is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
originally posted by DancingSpawn of Ungoliant:
Quote:
After Sauron's defeat in the battle of Dagorlad, he wasn't able to embody himself. As we know, he didn't die but his spirit just couldn't take a new form.
As Son of Numenor says, this isn't so - Sauron did have a body! He's just never described, since none of the protagonists have ever seen him.
Quote:
"Then Sauron was vanquished and his spirit fled and was hidden for long years, until his shadow took shape again."
Someone has seen him, though: Gollum! He tells Frodo that
Quote:
He has only four (fingers) on the black hand, but they are enough.
In letter #200 Tolkien wrote:
Quote:
....It was thus that Sauron appeared in this shape. It is mythologically supposed that when this shape was "real" (that is a physical actuality in the world and not a vision) it took some time to build up. It was then destructible like other physical organisms. But that of course did not destroy the spirit, nor dismiss it from the wolrd to which it was bound until the end.
After the battle with Gil-Galad and Elendil, Sauron took a long while to re-build, longer than he had done after the Downfall of Númenor. (I suppose because each building-up used some of the inherent energy of the spirit, which might be called the "will" or the effetive link between the indestructible mind and being and the realization of its imagination.)
And a quote from letter #246
Quote:
Sauron should be thought of as very terrible. The form he took was that of a man of more than human stature, but not gigantic.
__________________
Yes! "wish-fulfilment dreams" we spin to cheat
our timid hearts, and ugly Fact defeat!
Guinevere is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2004, 03:55 PM   #13
Boromir88
Laconic Loreman
 
Boromir88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 7,518
Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.
Send a message via AIM to Boromir88 Send a message via MSN to Boromir88
1420! Another clue...

Also other proof is found in the palantir, when Pippin sees the Dark lord in the Palantir. We know this has to be evidence because Sauron can't "alter" the Palantir, I mean what the Palantir show's is reality, he can't change it. If I lost you, because sometimes I don't know how to word things, here's an example...lol.

Ok, Sauron can't make the palantir "lie." For example, say Sauron has 10,000 orcs, in the palantir you'll see that 10,000 orcs, he can't make the palantir lie and show you 40,000 orcs. Hopefully, I've made it a little clearer.

Last edited by Boromir88; 09-08-2004 at 04:38 PM.
Boromir88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2004, 01:42 PM   #14
Son of Númenor
A Shade of Westernesse
 
Son of Númenor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: The last wave over Atalantë
Posts: 515
Son of Númenor has just left Hobbiton.
While we're at it...

Legolas provided this quote from the Letters in Sauron - Physical Form In the War of the Ring or Not?:
Quote:
In his actual presence none but very few of equal stature could have hoped to withhold it from him. Of 'mortals' no one, not even Aragorn. In the contest with the Palantír Aragorn was the rightful owner. Also the contest took place at a distance, and in a tale which allows the incarnation of great spirits in a physical and destructible form their power must be far greater when actually physically present. Sauron should be thought of as very terrible. The form that he took was that of a man of more than human stature, but not gigantic. In his earlier incarnation he was able to veil his power (as Gandalf did) and could appear as a commanding figure of great strength of body and supremely royal demeanour and countenance (Letters, #246).
Son of Númenor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:24 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.