return of the king outrage

when i heard that the Return of the king would not feature the scouring of the shire i was outraged. I mean how will they kill off Saruman,show Sam's wedding and manage to send Frodo to the Grey havens without the Scouring of the shire. What do you think?

[balrogman]

welcome to the downs, but dude thats reeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaallly old news

[HCIsland]

Let's see ...<P>Saruman will be killed at Orthanc, likely early in the film.<P>I don't see any reason why they need to show Sam's wedding. Establishing a break in time and that he is now married and with a kid will take seconds.<P>Why does is the Scouring of the Shire necessary too get Frodo to Grey Havens?<P>What do I think? I think we can discuss the inevitable changes whenever a book is being translated to film without screaming words like "outrage".<P>H.C.<p>[ September 03, 2003: Message edited by: HCIsland ]

[The Only Real Estel]

Although you're entitled to be outraged if you want, I must say that I've gotten over the intial shock. It's workable to not include it, & , although he is leaving out quite a bit there, I think it will fit in better than most of the changes that he has made so far. Although it would've been fun to see the hobbits hunt some ruffians . One more thing: PJ has really played up the innosence of the hobbits in these movies (especially in FotR of course, where you see a lot of the Shire early on), so having the hobbits shooting ruffians may not have fitted into his plans. Although I serisouly doubt that's anywhere <I>close</I> to the main reasons he deleted the Scouring, it might have been one of the minor ones.

[Lord of Angmar]

Welcome to the Downs, Bombur. Post on old threads. There are far too many duplicates.<P>The Scouring of the Shire is a great part of the books, certainly one of my favorites, but it would not work in a movie. See my post's on one of the other Scouring threads for elaboration.

[Lush]

I'M OUTRAGED TOO! LET'S GO START A RIOT AND OVERTURN S.U.V.'S OR SOMETHING!!!!<P><BR> <P>That's just what happens whenever movie rights get sold, dude.

[samrohan]

SO the scouring of the Shire is axed, what about the return through Rivendell when they meet up with Bilbo?<BR>Though it might be old news, it isn't to me. When and how did you get to know this?<p>[ September 04, 2003: Message edited by: samrohan ]

[Morgul Queen]

Sam's wedding will be in the movie, a friend of mine was an extra in that scene! *sigh* PJ has well and truly mucked up now

[The Only Real Estel]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>but dude thats reeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaallly old news<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yes, but this thread wasn't started to announce the fact that the scouring was cut, but rather dissapointment at it being cut. Therefore what you just said is not relavent.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Though it might be old news, it isn't to me. When and how did you get to know this?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I know I got it off onering.net, through an interview with PJ. We've figured out since then that it was never filmed, so it has no chance of makeing it to the silverscreen (obviously).

[Beanamir of Gondor]

Am also upset about no Sam&Rosie and no death of Saruman, but anybody else about ready to die waiting for extended edition of TTT? Holy shiznik, like four new scenes with not only Faramir but BOROMIR TOO!!!<P>Squeeeee!<P>And also, am totally excited by prospect of Troy with evil Orlando, hot Sean, and hot Brad. Sigh. Sean not die as Odysseus, me guesseth.<P>'They will look for his coming from the White Towers... but he will not return.'<BR>[little tear]<P>Hi Elanor!

[Silmiel of Imladris]

Here is my theory on how Saurman dies: Grima throws the Palantir out the window and instead of falling to the ground it hits Saurman in the head. Dear Eru I hope it doesn't happen that way.<p>[ September 04, 2003: Message edited by: Silmiel of Imladris ]

[The Only Real Estel]

Silmiel: Wormtounge cuts his throat & throws him off of Orthanc, Saruman then (presuming this part makes the cut, which it might not) gets his fall broken by falling on one of the spikes of a nearby spiked wheel.<p>[ September 04, 2003: Message edited by: The Only Real Estel ]

[Horse-Maiden of the Shire]

And then Grima is killed in turn by a well-placed arrow from Legolas.

[The Only Real Estel]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>And then Grima is killed in turn by a well-placed arrow from Legolas.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Actually I'd rather that it was a well-placed arrow. I don't take much to PJ's idea of having the arrow sail over Wormy's head, then have Wormtounge laugh at Legolas, then have the arrow crash through Grima's skull. It just sounds corny to me (as I've said before).

[Knight of Gondor]

I've heard these same rumors, and seen some pictures to back them up, like Saruman impaled (egh) on a spike, and also one of Grima on the floor of Orthanc looking incredibly mad. <P>It's also an option that Saruman tries to grab the palantir that is somehow lost of the balcony of Orthanc, because how else would Sauron come to think Pippin has the Ring, unless they include the scene where Pippin looks in the stone?<P>By the way, I'm temporarily back after about 9 months of being away...HI! <p>[ September 06, 2003: Message edited by: Knight of Gondor ]

[Brinniel]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> I've heard these same rumors, and seen some pictures to back them up, like Saruman impaled (egh) on a spike, and also one of Grima on the floor of Orthanc looking incredibly mad. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Yes, I've seen that picture of Saruman one too many times. I don't think I've seen the picture of Wormtongue yet, though. Where did you see that?<P>Welcome back, Knight of Gondor. I've been wondering where you've been.

[HCIsland]

I believe this is what Knight of Gondor is refering to.<P><A HREF="http://www.warofthering.net/photos/rotkwormtongue/imagepages/image1.shtml" TARGET=_blank>Wormtongue at Orthanc</A><P>This pick, more than any other, convinces me that Saruman dies at Orthanc.<P>H.C.

[Elentári]

Now that does look interesting...although I was convinced anyway, having seen him impaled on that spiked wheel. Ahh yes, dear old Wormy having an arrow sail past is head etc etc...where did that topic go? It sounds corny on paper, but maybe it'll look good. I don't know...

[Kalimac]

I've seen that spiked-wheel picture as well, though I do remember reading somewhere that they had filmed a couple of different possible ways for Saruman to die and that there are some pictures floating around out there which contain scenes that were never intended to be in the movies, or which were vetoed later on. So just because it was filmed doesn't mean it's going to be in there. Personally, I hope it isn't - after all, isn't Saruman supposed to turn into smoke and vaporize after he dies? Having die like any ordinary mortal wouldn't be ... well, *right*.<P>That being said, I don't really have any problem with the Scouring being cut. It works wonderfully in the book, but in a movie there are only so many high points in the struggle against evil before people start feeling like they've been pulled up and down too many times. If I can be heretical and mention the movie "Speed" - First Act, the elevator - very scary. Second and Third Acts - the bus - really, really scary. Fourth Act - the subway bomb. At that point it was starting to get less scary and more repetitive as in "All right, how many more forms of transportation can this guy co-opt?" In the ROTK movie, after the Act 1 of Shelob and the Acts 2 and 3 of Mount Doom and the Pelennor Fields, the Scouring would start dragging things pretty badly. <P>As for Saruman's fate - well, there's no reason Wormtongue can't kill him in Orthanc and have him dissolve there. We're probably being set up for something like that in TTT when there's that shot of the tears on Wormtongue's face as he looks at the Orc army.

[Ainaserkewen]

I for one wish that they were doing this scene. That was one of my favorite parts of the book. Just because when the travellers get back, theres hell to pay, and they really demonstrate their maturity and newfound confidence, I mean, they turn into super hobbits! It's the same reason I love the chapter(the name escapes me now) where the Ents invade Isenguard and rip it apart, it's like "Yahh! One for the good guys, Hah!" The whole "Sam's wedding" thing can be avoided, I don't want to see how someone else depicts a hobbit wedding, although I can't wait to see Elanor, I bet she'll be adorable.

[Knight of Gondor]

[quoteWe're probably being set up for something like that in TTT when there's that shot of the tears on Wormtongue's face as he looks at the Orc army.[/quote]<P>I thought the tears were supposed to mean he is amazed and almost moved by how certain victory is! Almost like a perverted reverse of Eowyn's tears of joy at Theoden's healing - "Oh how sweet, we're gonna slaughter 'em."