Aint no stinkin Scourging! - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

08-04-2003, 07:40 PM

I have been reading that the Scourging of the Shire gets only a voice-over in ROTK. If this is so, I will be very upset. I understand that everyscene cannot be included, but PJ said that only things that furthered the plot made it into the movie. I can only hope that the extended DVD of ROTK gets this scene, which to me, is of vital importance.Anyone else know for sure what the deal is?

Lush · 08-04-2003, 08:03 PM

Oh dear. Well, nothing can be known for sure unless I go bribe some New Line executive, but the truth is out there, my friend, and this December we will all know for sure.But I think we should go ahead and start a riot and/or kill ourselves just in case.

Meela · 08-05-2003, 06:00 AM

I thought there was no Scouring at all, and the entire sub-plot was being excluded. It would be nice to see it though, even with just a voice-over.

Ophelia · 08-05-2003, 01:48 PM

Well I allready knew that that scene will not be in the film because looky looky how much from TTT they have to show on RotK (like Shelob) and there probobly will be a lot of Aragorn-Arwen scenes (and I'm geting kinda tierd of them already) instead of those Shire scenes . I understand - love - that is beautyful but why to put so many scenes and dialouges in the film that were not even in the book ? Where is the hobbit love ?

Maeglanthirion · 08-05-2003, 01:52 PM

I know! I will be upset if it doesn't even end up in the EE! You always see hobbits as peaceful carefree creatures. I was kind of looking forward to see them with bows and stuff, you know, avenging their torn up Shire. I always thought it was a pretty cool part, with the Battle of Bywater and what-not. I wonder how they are going to make Saruman and Wormtongue die.

Lord of Angmar · 08-05-2003, 03:41 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I know! I will be upset if it doesn't even end up in the EE!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Then, Maeglanthirion, prepare to be upset.The Scouring of the Shire was never filmed by Peter Jackson. The ending will be different with regards to Saruman (though it will probably still be at the hands of Grima Wormtongue that he meets his end). Since the last of the filming with Elijah Wood and all other major characters has officially ended do not expect to see the Scouring of the Shire in the theatrical release or the extended edition. [ August 05, 2003: Message edited by: Lord of Angmar ]

Esgallhugwen · 08-05-2003, 04:01 PM

That sucks I was really looking forward to seeing the Hobbits kick some evil butt!! But oh well, damn Peter you should have known better that that scene was vital, but I agree we should start a riot!! hehehe but still I can't wait to see Shelob, and the mouth of Sauron will be in the movie right?? It better be or i'll be really mad

The Only Real Estel · 08-05-2003, 05:07 PM

Presicely Lord of Angmar, that was what I was going to say. There will never be any Scouring, extended or non. A voice-over I'm not sure about, but since saruman will already be long-since-dead by then, it would largley diminsh the importance of even having a scouring. I thought the word was out quite a while ago that there wouldn't be anything, extended or non. I suppose I coulda been wrong, though. [ August 08, 2003: Message edited by: The Only Real Estel ]

Maeglanthirion · 08-05-2003, 07:58 PM

That really sucks. Who cares if it was a bit longer of a movie? Even then, he could have put it in the EE. Was it money or time or what? Oh well.

The Only Real Estel · 08-06-2003, 01:54 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>That really sucks. Who cares if it was a bit longer of a movie? Even then, he could have put it in the EE. Was it money or time or what? Oh well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Time. Directors don't have a whole lot to worry about in the money area. He left Shelob & the Wizard Confrontation out of TTT, therefore he needed to find an avenue. I guess he figured the scouring would take up enough time to do it properly that it'd be a good thing to cut. Oh well, I can get over it fairly easily, as long as he doesn' truin another character.

Daisy Brambleburr · 08-08-2003, 12:54 PM

Maeglanthirion, they didn't include the Scouring because of the running time. Plus it wasn't really that necessary to the plot, so they can stand to leave it out as the film will still work without it.I wasn't such a great fan of the Scouring myself. Sometimes it felt like it was just tacked on the end as an afterthought. But then again, some parts of it were pretty good (the hobbits breaking the Rules was quite amusing, amongst other things). So maybe i'm being a bit harsh. Some people are totally put out that it's not included, but I don't think it's so bad. Think about it positivley, there's now much more time for Pippin and the Palantir, Eowyn and Faramir and the showdown with Shelob!

The Only Real Estel · 08-08-2003, 12:56 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Sometimes it felt like it was just tacked on the end as an afterthought.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Exactly what I sometimes feel myself, Daisy.[ August 08, 2003: Message edited by: The Only Real Estel ]

08-08-2003, 10:39 PM

So the anti-climactical, unnessecary ending to the books won't be in the movies? Damn.

Lord of Angmar · 08-08-2003, 11:11 PM

I'm sensing a bit of anti-Scouring of the Shire sentiment in here. Need I remind you that this is the real ending to the Lord of the Rings trilogy? Tolkien himself said that this series is about hobbits, and the simplicity and freedom they represent. The Scouring of the Shire is about the hobbits learning from their experiences in the world and protecting the place they love using the skill and wisdom they had acquired. While it may not be vital to the plot, I felt that it was an excellent summation of the book's theme.Having said that, I do not think it would be a good summation for the movies. The books were more simple and naive, dealing with everything from a hobbit's point of view and focusing mainly on the development of the foursome of Little People. The way the movies have been going, the theme has been twisted and changed, so that the hobbits seem to be but passengers on the ride. The Scouring of the Shire wouldn't make sense as an ending in the movies because they are focused much more on Aragorn and his own journey.[ August 09, 2003: Message edited by: Lord of Angmar ]

Corwyn Celesil · 08-08-2003, 11:38 PM

Oughten't the movie follow the intent of the author of the books? The Scourging was an important part of RoTK to Tolkien, its logical end, and with as jolly good a job as Peter Jackson has done so far, I should think he'd be able to hold to the original intent of the books, their meaning to the author, and so on and so forth. It boggles the mind that he could leave out the Scourging!

Lhunardawen · 08-09-2003, 05:22 AM

No!! This can't be!! I wanted to see Pippin say that amazing line about him being the King's Messenger..oh, you get me. I just loved that line!!! Anyway, I think the reason they weren't able to include that was because they failed to include Shelob's Lair and beyond, as well as the Voice of Saruman and beyond. I'm just wondering how they will do the movie. So they won't include the Grey Havens? How would they end the movie?Oh, I hate this...

Lord of Angmar · 08-09-2003, 08:28 AM

The movie will end at the Grey Havens, it has already been disclosed. Thank goodness, I would be quite upset if it did not. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>with as jolly good a job as Peter Jackson has done so far, I should think he'd be able to hold to the original intent of the books <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Already, I believe, he has veered away from the original intent of the books. In the movies, Aragorn is obviously the main character, and the hobbits take a more passive role. In the books, Tolkien did not even know Aragorn was going to be a character until he was halfway done with the Fellowship. And Strider was originally to be a hobbit named Trotter! Although Aragorn was developed well in the books, he was never made into the main figure, and everything was still told from the hobbits' point of view.

The Only Real Estel · 08-09-2003, 09:38 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I'm sensing a bit of anti-Scouring of the Shire sentiment in here. Need I remind you that this is the real ending to the Lord of the Rings trilogy?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> No you needent Lord of Angmar. I don't mind the Scouring, but as you also said, it woudn't fit all that well in the movies, although that's not to say that PJ coulda put it in anyway... . I simply said that it seemed to me that it was just kinda tacked on as an after-thought. I'm not trying to suggest that we should go back & re-write the books to end differently. Lhunardawen: I also like that quote...

Cleansed Curunir · 08-12-2003, 12:49 PM

I've heard it wasn't to be included, but we can only hope about the extended DVD.I think it's important too since it shows the Hobbits weren't as isolated as they think.It starts in the Shire and ends in the Shire.

The Only Real Estel · 08-12-2003, 12:56 PM

Sorry Cleansed Curunir, but if you'd read some of the above posts, you'll probably gather that the Scouring wasn't even filmed, therefore, we actually can't hope for the Estended Version. As I said before, I thought that was old news, but oh well.

Marroc Underhill · 08-13-2003, 04:53 AM

Well, he coulda made RotK like "Titanic" (Except GOOD!). He coulda put it in like a little seen, you know at the end, showing all these little Hobbits shooting bows and Grima stabb Saruman or somthing! (Actually that part jumped out at me in the book). Stupid one PJ, you dumb, mentally retarded Dwarf, that doesn't take in enough air.

08-04-2003, 07:40 PM	#1
Swordsmith Guest Posts: n/a	Aint no stinkin Scourging! I have been reading that the Scourging of the Shire gets only a voice-over in ROTK. If this is so, I will be very upset. I understand that everyscene cannot be included, but PJ said that only things that furthered the plot made it into the movie. I can only hope that the extended DVD of ROTK gets this scene, which to me, is of vital importance.<P>Anyone else know for sure what the deal is?

08-04-2003, 08:03 PM	#2
Lush Fair and Cold Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: the big onion Posts: 1,770	Oh dear. Well, nothing can be known for sure unless I go bribe some New Line executive, but the truth is out there, my friend, and this December we will all know for sure.<P>But I think we should go ahead and start a riot and/or kill ourselves just in case. <P> __________________ ~The beginning is the word and the end is silence. And in between are all the stories. This is one of mine~

08-05-2003, 06:00 AM	#3
Meela Denethor's True Love Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Mirkwood. With Thranduil... swoon Posts: 2,049	I thought there was no Scouring at all, and the entire sub-plot was being excluded. It would be nice to see it though, even with just a voice-over. __________________ 'The Hobbit' 1st impressions: 1. Thorin is hot... Oh god, I fancy a dwarf. 2. Thranduil is hotter. 3. Is that... Figwit! 4. Does Elijah Wood never age? 2nd: It's all about Fili & Kili, really. 3rd: BARD! OMG, Bard. Last edited by Meela; 11-27-2004 at 07:20 AM.

08-05-2003, 01:48 PM	#4
Ophelia Wight Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: somewhere between the sacred , silence and sweet . Posts: 169	Well I allready knew that that scene will not be in the film because looky looky how much from TTT they have to show on RotK (like Shelob) and there probobly will be a lot of Aragorn-Arwen scenes (and I'm geting kinda tierd of them already) instead of those Shire scenes . I understand - love - that is beautyful but why to put so many scenes and dialouges in the film that were not even in the book ? Where is the hobbit love ? __________________ I didn't lose my mind . It was mine to give away .

08-05-2003, 01:52 PM	#5
Maeglanthirion Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Atlanta Posts: 47	I know! I will be upset if it doesn't even end up in the EE! You always see hobbits as peaceful carefree creatures. I was kind of looking forward to see them with bows and stuff, you know, avenging their torn up Shire. I always thought it was a pretty cool part, with the Battle of Bywater and what-not. I wonder how they are going to make Saruman and Wormtongue die. __________________ "I see in your eyes, the same fear that would take the heart of me. A day may come, when the courage of men fails, and we break all bonds of fellowship, but it is not this day. This day, we fight!..."

08-05-2003, 03:41 PM	#6
Lord of Angmar Tyrannus Incorporalis Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: the North Posts: 833	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I know! I will be upset if it doesn't even end up in the EE!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Then, Maeglanthirion, prepare to be upset.<P>The Scouring of the Shire was never filmed by Peter Jackson. The ending will be different with regards to Saruman (though it will probably still be at the hands of Grima Wormtongue that he meets his end). Since the last of the filming with Elijah Wood and all other major characters has officially ended do not expect to see the Scouring of the Shire in the theatrical release or the extended edition. <p>[ August 05, 2003: Message edited by: Lord of Angmar ] __________________ ...where the instrument of intelligence is added to brute power and evil will, mankind is powerless in its own defence.

08-05-2003, 04:01 PM	#7
Esgallhugwen Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Where the Moon cries against the snow Posts: 526	That sucks I was really looking forward to seeing the Hobbits kick some evil butt!! But oh well, damn Peter you should have known better that that scene was vital, but I agree we should start a riot!! hehehe but still I can't wait to see Shelob, and the mouth of Sauron will be in the movie right?? It better be or i'll be really mad __________________ "...for the sin of the idolater is not that he worships stone, but that he worships one stone over others. -8:9:4 The Witness of Fane"

08-05-2003, 05:07 PM	#8
The Only Real Estel Raffish Rapscallion Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Far from the 'Downs, it seems :-( Posts: 2,835	Presicely Lord of Angmar, that was what I was going to say. There will never be any Scouring, extended or non. A voice-over I'm not sure about, but since saruman will already be long-since-dead by then, it would largley diminsh the importance of even having a scouring. I thought the word was out quite a while ago that there wouldn't be anything, extended or non. I suppose I coulda been wrong, though. <p>[ August 08, 2003: Message edited by: The Only Real Estel ]

08-05-2003, 07:58 PM	#9
Maeglanthirion Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Atlanta Posts: 47	That really sucks. Who cares if it was a bit longer of a movie? Even then, he could have put it in the EE. Was it money or time or what? Oh well. __________________ "I see in your eyes, the same fear that would take the heart of me. A day may come, when the courage of men fails, and we break all bonds of fellowship, but it is not this day. This day, we fight!..."

08-06-2003, 01:54 PM	#10
The Only Real Estel Raffish Rapscallion Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Far from the 'Downs, it seems :-( Posts: 2,835	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>That really sucks. Who cares if it was a bit longer of a movie? Even then, he could have put it in the EE. Was it money or time or what? Oh well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Time. Directors don't have a whole lot to worry about in the money area. He left Shelob & the Wizard Confrontation out of TTT, therefore he needed to find an avenue. I guess he figured the scouring would take up enough time to do it properly that it'd be a good thing to cut. Oh well, I can get over it fairly easily, as long as he doesn' truin another character.

08-08-2003, 12:54 PM	#11
Daisy Brambleburr Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 334	Maeglanthirion, they didn't include the Scouring because of the running time. Plus it wasn't really that necessary to the plot, so they can stand to leave it out as the film will still work without it.<P>I wasn't such a great fan of the Scouring myself. Sometimes it felt like it was just tacked on the end as an afterthought. But then again, some parts of it were pretty good (the hobbits breaking the Rules was quite amusing, amongst other things). So maybe i'm being a bit harsh.<P> Some people are totally put out that it's not included, but I don't think it's so bad. Think about it positivley, there's now much more time for Pippin and the Palantir, Eowyn and Faramir and the showdown with Shelob! __________________ 'What news from the South, O sighing wind, do you bring to me at eve? Where now is Boromir the Fair? He tarries and I grieve.'

08-08-2003, 12:56 PM	#12
The Only Real Estel Raffish Rapscallion Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Far from the 'Downs, it seems :-( Posts: 2,835	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Sometimes it felt like it was just tacked on the end as an afterthought.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Exactly what I sometimes feel myself, Daisy.<p>[ August 08, 2003: Message edited by: The Only Real Estel ]

08-08-2003, 10:39 PM	#13
GrimaWormtounge Guest Posts: n/a	So the anti-climactical, unnessecary ending to the books won't be in the movies? Damn.

08-08-2003, 11:11 PM	#14
Lord of Angmar Tyrannus Incorporalis Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: the North Posts: 833	I'm sensing a bit of anti-Scouring of the Shire sentiment in here. Need I remind you that this is the <I>real</I> ending to the Lord of the Rings trilogy? Tolkien himself said that this series is about hobbits, and the simplicity and freedom they represent. The Scouring of the Shire is about the hobbits learning from their experiences in the world and protecting the place they love using the skill and wisdom they had acquired. While it may not be vital to the plot, I felt that it was an excellent summation of the book's theme.<P>Having said that, I do not think it would be a good summation for the movies. The books were more simple and naive, dealing with everything from a hobbit's point of view and focusing mainly on the development of the foursome of Little People. The way the movies have been going, the theme has been twisted and changed, so that the hobbits seem to be but passengers on the ride. The Scouring of the Shire wouldn't make sense as an ending in the movies because they are focused much more on Aragorn and his own journey.<p>[ August 09, 2003: Message edited by: Lord of Angmar ] __________________ ...where the instrument of intelligence is added to brute power and evil will, mankind is powerless in its own defence.

08-08-2003, 11:38 PM	#15
Corwyn Celesil Haunting Spirit Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: The House of the Fountain, Gondolin Posts: 57	Oughten't the movie follow the intent of the author of the books? The Scourging was an important part of RoTK to Tolkien, its logical end, and with as jolly good a job as Peter Jackson has done so far, I should think he'd be able to hold to the original intent of the books, their meaning to the author, and so on and so forth. It boggles the mind that he could leave out the Scourging! __________________ Then came there from the south of the city the people of the Fountain, and Ecthelion was their lord, and silver and diamonds were their delight; and swords very long and bright and pale did they wield . . .

08-09-2003, 05:22 AM	#16
Lhunardawen Hauntress of the Havens Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: IN it, but not OF it Posts: 2,538	No!! This can't be!! I wanted to see Pippin say that amazing line about him being the King's Messenger..oh, you get me. I just loved that line!!! <P>Anyway, I think the reason they weren't able to include that was because they failed to include Shelob's Lair and beyond, as well as the Voice of Saruman and beyond. <P>I'm just wondering how they will do the movie. So they won't include the Grey Havens? How would they end the movie?<P>Oh, I hate this...

08-09-2003, 08:28 AM	#17
Lord of Angmar Tyrannus Incorporalis Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: the North Posts: 833	The movie will end at the Grey Havens, it has already been disclosed. Thank goodness, I would be quite upset if it did not.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>with as jolly good a job as Peter Jackson has done so far, I should think he'd be able to hold to the original intent of the books <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Already, I believe, he has veered away from the original intent of the books. In the movies, Aragorn is obviously the main character, and the hobbits take a more passive role. In the books, Tolkien did not even know Aragorn was going to be a character until he was halfway done with the Fellowship. And Strider was originally to be a hobbit named Trotter! Although Aragorn was developed well in the books, he was never made into the main figure, and everything was still told from the hobbits' point of view. __________________ ...where the instrument of intelligence is added to brute power and evil will, mankind is powerless in its own defence.

08-09-2003, 09:38 AM	#18
The Only Real Estel Raffish Rapscallion Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Far from the 'Downs, it seems :-( Posts: 2,835	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I'm sensing a bit of anti-Scouring of the Shire sentiment in here. Need I remind you that this is the real ending to the Lord of the Rings trilogy?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> No you needent Lord of Angmar. I don't mind the Scouring, but as you also said, it woudn't fit all that well in the movies, although that's not to say that PJ coulda put it in anyway... . I simply said that it seemed to me that it was just kinda tacked on as an after-thought. I'm not trying to suggest that we should go back & re-write the books to end differently. Lhunardawen: I also like that quote...

08-12-2003, 12:49 PM	#19
Cleansed Curunir Newly Deceased Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: purified Isengard Posts: 10	I've heard it wasn't to be included, but we can only hope about the extended DVD.<P>I think it's important too since it shows the Hobbits weren't as isolated as they think.<P>It starts in the Shire and ends in the Shire.

08-12-2003, 12:56 PM	#20
The Only Real Estel Raffish Rapscallion Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Far from the 'Downs, it seems :-( Posts: 2,835	Sorry Cleansed Curunir, but if you'd read some of the above posts, you'll probably gather that the Scouring wasn't even filmed, therefore, we actually can't hope for the Estended Version. As I said before, I thought that was old news, but oh well.

08-13-2003, 04:53 AM	#21
Marroc Underhill Haunting Spirit Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: In The Deep Places Of The World Posts: 61	Well, he coulda made RotK like "Titanic" (Except GOOD!). He coulda put it in like a little seen, you know at the end, showing all these little Hobbits shooting bows and Grima stabb Saruman or somthing! (Actually that part jumped out at me in the book). Stupid one PJ, you dumb, mentally retarded Dwarf, that doesn't take in enough air. __________________ Hail to the Lords of Angmar, for we are the true power!