Crap burrahobbit doesn't like... - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

burrahobbit · 04-23-2002, 08:19 PM

There are two things about The Fellowship of the Ring that I am not particularly fond of. The first(second) thing is on the Redhorn Pass. It shows Saruman doing magic to cause a storm, when it ought to be the mountain itself causing the storm. The second(first) and more troubling is during the discussion between Arwen and Aragorn in Rivendell in Elvish. The subtitles say at one point that Arwen says something along the lines of "Long years has it been since I saw you last," but I was paying attention to the words being said aloud, and one of them jumped out at me: yén. You may or may not be aware of what exactly a yén is. A yén is an elvish period of time. Most of the time it is translated as "years", or "long years" as above. But that isn't exactly what it means. A yén is 144 years of the Sun. At the time Arwen said the above Aragorn was about 90, he hadn't even lived to see one yén![ April 23, 2002: Message edited by: burrahobbit ][ April 23, 2002: Message edited by: burrahobbit ]

Arwen Imladris · 04-24-2002, 02:49 PM

If it is usually trandslated as year or long years, why are you worried about it?Question: What is the correct elvish translation for year?

burrahobbit · 04-24-2002, 05:15 PM

Because it actually means 144 years, and Aragorn wasn't that old yet.

VanimaEdhel · 04-24-2002, 05:20 PM

About the "years" part: maybe the Elves had no name for the Human year (I heard that word too and this is what I decided to assume), they just used their word for "year". You must remember that, although they were fighting together against Morgoth in the Sil and Sauron in LotR, the Humans and the Elves were not all cuddly, lovey-dovey (except for Beren and Luthien, Aragorn and Arwen, etc.) and close. Maybe they did not form a word for a Human year, so they just used their term for their year to compensate for the lack of a 365 day year term.

The Half-Hobbit · 04-24-2002, 09:18 PM

As for the Redhorn pass, my understanding of the book was that the Fellowship did not know whether it was Saruman, or the mountain itself, or just unfortunate wheather that was to blame. In the movie they just decided to get rid of the uncertainty....understandable, a lot of "maybe"'s in a movie get annoying.

Mhoram · 04-24-2002, 09:46 PM

One thing that bugged me was them taking two or three minutes to show Saruman breeding Orcs, as if that was needed whatsoever. Time that could have been spent elsewhere.

burrahobbit · 04-25-2002, 04:43 PM

VanimaEdhel, elves had two names for a solar (human) year: coranar, which is "sun-round", and loa, which is "growth". The loa (as elves prefered biology to astronomy) was further divided into six seasons: spring, summer, autumn, fading, winter, and stirring.

04-25-2002, 05:25 PM

It was Sauron who supposedly controlled the weather at Caradhras, not Saruman (at least in the book).

Orodhromeus · 04-26-2002, 03:00 PM

There was no indication against the theory that it was Caradhras itself that refused to let the Fellowship pass. Saruman had probably nothing to do with it, and Sauron even less.

04-23-2002, 08:19 PM	#1
burrahobbit Hidden Spirit Join Date: May 2000 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,424	Crap burrahobbit doesn't like... There are two things about The Fellowship of the Ring that I am not particularly fond of. The first(second) thing is on the Redhorn Pass. It shows Saruman doing magic to cause a storm, when it ought to be the mountain itself causing the storm. <P>The second(first) and more troubling is during the discussion between Arwen and Aragorn in Rivendell in Elvish. The subtitles say at one point that Arwen says something along the lines of "Long years has it been since I saw you last," but I was paying attention to the words being said aloud, and one of them jumped out at me: yén. You may or may not be aware of what exactly a yén is. A yén is an elvish period of time. Most of the time it is translated as "years", or "long years" as above. But that isn't exactly what it means. A yén is 144 years of the Sun. At the time Arwen said the above Aragorn was about 90, he hadn't even lived to see one yén!<P>[ April 23, 2002: Message edited by: burrahobbit ]<p>[ April 23, 2002: Message edited by: burrahobbit ] __________________ What's a burrahobbit got to do with my pocket, anyways?

04-24-2002, 02:49 PM	#2
Arwen Imladris Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In a box with a fox Posts: 1,347	If it is usually trandslated as year or long years, why are you worried about it?<P>Question: What is the correct elvish translation for year? __________________ "Wake up! Wake up! Wake up, sleepies, we must go, yes, we must go at once."

04-24-2002, 05:15 PM	#3
burrahobbit Hidden Spirit Join Date: May 2000 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,424	Because it actually means 144 years, and Aragorn wasn't that old yet. __________________ What's a burrahobbit got to do with my pocket, anyways?

04-24-2002, 05:20 PM	#4
VanimaEdhel Etheral Enchantress Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Wellesley College! Posts: 1,461	About the "years" part: maybe the Elves had no name for the Human year (I heard that word too and this is what I decided to assume), they just used their word for "year". You must remember that, although they were fighting together against Morgoth in the Sil and Sauron in LotR, the Humans and the Elves were not all cuddly, lovey-dovey (except for Beren and Luthien, Aragorn and Arwen, etc.) and close. Maybe they did not form a word for a Human year, so they just used their term for <I>their</I> year to compensate for the lack of a 365 day year term. __________________ "I think we dream so we don't have to be apart so long. If we're in each others dreams, we can be together all the time." - Hobbes of Calvin and Hobbes

04-24-2002, 09:18 PM	#5
The Half-Hobbit Haunting Spirit Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 51	As for the Redhorn pass, my understanding of the book was that the Fellowship did not know whether it was Saruman, or the mountain itself, or just unfortunate wheather that was to blame. In the movie they just decided to get rid of the uncertainty....understandable, a lot of "maybe"'s in a movie get annoying. __________________ I'm your only friend. I'm not your only friend, But I'm a little glowing friend, But really I'm not actually your friend, But I am. -They Might Be Giants

04-24-2002, 09:46 PM	#6
Mhoram Dead and Loving It Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: The land of fast cars and loud guitars. Posts: 361	One thing that bugged me was them taking two or three minutes to show Saruman breeding Orcs, as if that was needed whatsoever. Time that could have been spent elsewhere.

04-25-2002, 04:43 PM	#7
burrahobbit Hidden Spirit Join Date: May 2000 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,424	VanimaEdhel, elves had two names for a solar (human) year: coranar, which is "sun-round", and loa, which is "growth". The loa (as elves prefered biology to astronomy) was further divided into six seasons: spring, summer, autumn, fading, winter, and stirring. __________________ What's a burrahobbit got to do with my pocket, anyways?

04-25-2002, 05:25 PM	#8
White Rider Guest Posts: n/a	It was Sauron who supposedly controlled the weather at Caradhras, not Saruman (at least in the book).

04-26-2002, 03:00 PM	#9
Orodhromeus Wight Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Greece Posts: 106	There was no indication against the theory that it was Caradhras itself that refused to let the Fellowship pass. Saruman had probably nothing to do with it, and Sauron even less.