Where have the rings gone? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

arelendil · 12-29-2002, 06:10 AM

Okay first I find it really strange that you can see Nenya on Galadriel's hand but never see Vilya or Narya on Elrond's or Gandalf's. Then of cause what happened to Galadriel and Elrond's wedding ring. They're both married so what happened to the rings! They should both have simple golden band rings on the left hand as is said in HoME ten. Why show the rings of power which can be hidden and not the normal wedding rings?

doug*platypus · 12-30-2002, 09:06 PM

I think the simple answer is that LOTR (the Alan Lee-illustrated centenary version, appendices included) is really the only book that was consulted for the movie, although to be fair it was consulted heavily. I for one didn't know about the wedding rings - thanks for bringing it up! Vilya and Narya are never shown in the LOTR until the end, so I think PJ was correct in not showing them.

Iargwath · 12-31-2002, 02:10 AM

The rings of power were hidden from all sight during the quest of the ring. Only when the One Ring is destroyed the elven rings are to be visible. In the film, Nenya is visible to Frodo only, since he bore the One Ring (Note: Sauron only needed the One Ring in order to see the Three Rings). Futhermore in Return of the King: The Grey Havens, it clearly states that Gandalf wore his ring openly: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>As he turned and came towards them Frodo saw that Gandalf now wore the ring openly on his hand the Third Ring, Narya the Great, and the stone upon it was red as fire <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Another quote about the other two rings, Vilya and Nenya are also stated in Return of the King: The Grey Havens <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Elrond wore a mantle of grey and a star upon his forehead, and a silver harp was in hand, and upon his finger was a ring of gold with a great blue stone, Vilya, mightiest of the Three. But Galadriel sat upon a white palfrey and was robed all in glimmering white, like clouds about the moon; for she herself seemed to shine with a soft light. On her finger was Nenya, the ring wrought of mithril, that bore a single white stone flickering like a frosty star. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>So voluntarily, Peter Jackson will indeed leave the Three elven rings until Return of the King, since they are visible only then throughout the trilogy. Of the wedding rings i do not know, so you raise a valid point unless somebody else with more knowledge can explain it.

arelendil · 01-02-2003, 01:18 PM

Elves took tradition very seriously, living for thousands of years one would think they had too. they never removed their wedding ring. In HoME X there is a huge essay on traditions amoung the elves. It says that engagement they gave each other silver band rings. Then at the wedding these were swapped back and treasured by the other. In replacement they got gold band rings. In which case elves that are married need silver rings on a chain and a gold ring on the left hand. But none of these are visible in the movie!

Iargwath · 01-03-2003, 02:05 AM

Wow that is very interesting. I never knew that. What is the book called (that contained this information)?

arelendil · 01-03-2003, 01:18 PM

History of middle earth ten - Morgoth's ring! It has a really interesting essay called traditions and customs amoung the eldar or something like that. Its my favourite HoME!!

dunedain_aragorn · 01-03-2003, 03:13 PM

Elrond married Celebrain! Arwen is Elronds daughter, and Galadriel is her grandmother! Plus, Galadriel is married to Celebrain, and Gandalf doesnt even have a ring, he is a wizard, not an elf!

eleanor_niphredil · 01-03-2003, 03:36 PM

Gandalf doe to have a ring! he has a ring of power!Not oly is there no wedding rings, but what happened to Celebrain? Why do we never hear of her?

Elanor · 01-03-2003, 03:45 PM

I don't think that arelendil was suggesting that Elrond and Galadriel were married to each other , just that they were married. That is interesting about the wedding rings though. I haven't read any of HoME X, I may have to get that one next.Celebrian was injured by orcs (while travelling through the Misty Mountains?) and left Middle Earth so that she could be healed in the Undying Lands. As far as I can remember, it happened well before the events of LotR.

Iargwath · 01-04-2003, 07:52 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>and Gandalf doesnt even have a ring, he is a wizard, not an elf!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Gandalf does have an elven ring of power. Even though he is a wizard, he still bore the ring of fire Narya (one of the three elven rings). And i'll have to check out that HoMe book arelendil, sounds very interesting

dunedain_aragorn · 01-04-2003, 02:59 PM

Whoa, My bad, thanks for correcting me guys!

Morgul Queen · 02-20-2003, 09:05 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> galadriel is married to Celebrain <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ahhhh, don't you mean Celeborn

12-29-2002, 06:10 AM	#1
arelendil Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Eryn Lasgalen Posts: 202	Where have the rings gone? Okay first I find it really strange that you can see Nenya on Galadriel's hand but never see Vilya or Narya on Elrond's or Gandalf's. Then of cause what happened to Galadriel and Elrond's wedding ring. They're both married so what happened to the rings! They should both have simple golden band rings on the left hand as is said in HoME ten. Why show the rings of power which can be hidden and not the normal wedding rings? __________________ Nai Vardo eleni ilye lumenn' enomentielvo siluvar!

12-30-2002, 09:06 PM	#2
doug*platypus Delver in the Deep Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Aotearoa Posts: 960	I think the simple answer is that LOTR (the Alan Lee-illustrated centenary version, appendices included) is really the only book that was consulted for the movie, although to be fair it was consulted heavily. I for one didn't know about the wedding rings - thanks for bringing it up! Vilya and Narya are never shown in the LOTR until the end, so I think PJ was correct in not showing them. __________________ But Gwindor answered: 'The doom lies in yourself, not in your name'.

12-31-2002, 02:10 AM	#3
Iargwath Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 236	The rings of power were hidden from all sight during the quest of the ring. Only when the One Ring is destroyed the elven rings are to be visible. <BR>In the film, Nenya is visible to Frodo only, since he bore the One Ring (Note: Sauron only needed the One Ring in order to see the Three Rings). Futhermore in Return of the King: The Grey Havens, it clearly states that Gandalf wore his ring openly:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>As he turned and came towards them Frodo saw that Gandalf now wore the ring openly on his hand the Third Ring, Narya the Great, and the stone upon it was red as fire <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Another quote about the other two rings, Vilya and Nenya are also stated in Return of the King: The Grey Havens<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Elrond wore a mantle of grey and a star upon his forehead, and a silver harp was in hand, and upon his finger was a ring of gold with a great blue stone, Vilya, mightiest of the Three. But Galadriel sat upon a white palfrey and was robed all in glimmering white, like clouds about the moon; for she herself seemed to shine with a soft light. On her finger was Nenya, the ring wrought of mithril, that bore a single white stone flickering like a frosty star. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>So voluntarily, Peter Jackson will indeed leave the Three elven rings until Return of the King, since they are visible only then throughout the trilogy. Of the wedding rings i do not know, so you raise a valid point unless somebody else with more knowledge can explain it. __________________ 'I waited patiently for the Lord; and He inclined to me, and heard my cry'-Psalm 40 My M-e Forum

01-02-2003, 01:18 PM	#4
arelendil Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Eryn Lasgalen Posts: 202	Elves took tradition very seriously, living for thousands of years one would think they had too. they never removed their wedding ring. In HoME X there is a huge essay on traditions amoung the elves. It says that engagement they gave each other silver band rings. Then at the wedding these were swapped back and treasured by the other. In replacement they got gold band rings. In which case elves that are married need silver rings on a chain and a gold ring on the left hand. But none of these are visible in the movie! __________________ Nai Vardo eleni ilye lumenn' enomentielvo siluvar!

01-03-2003, 02:05 AM	#5
Iargwath Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 236	Wow that is very interesting. I never knew that. What is the book called (that contained this information)? __________________ 'I waited patiently for the Lord; and He inclined to me, and heard my cry'-Psalm 40 My M-e Forum

01-03-2003, 01:18 PM	#6
arelendil Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Eryn Lasgalen Posts: 202	History of middle earth ten - Morgoth's ring!<BR>It has a really interesting essay called traditions and customs amoung the eldar or something like that. Its my favourite HoME!! __________________ Nai Vardo eleni ilye lumenn' enomentielvo siluvar!

01-03-2003, 03:13 PM	#7
dunedain_aragorn Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: a Mcdonald's Happy Meal Posts: 47	Elrond married Celebrain! Arwen is Elronds daughter, and Galadriel is her grandmother! Plus, Galadriel is married to Celebrain, and Gandalf doesnt even have a ring, he is a wizard, not an elf! __________________ "I must take leave, I have not slept since Dunnharrow, and I am weary."said Aragorn. Merry seized his hand and kissed it."I am frightfully sorry, we have been a nuisance to you since Bree." Aragorn laughed and left them. "Was there ever any like him?" said Pippin,"Except for Gandalf of course. I believe they must be related."

01-03-2003, 03:36 PM	#8
eleanor_niphredil Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: england Posts: 805	Gandalf doe to have a ring! he has a ring of power!<P>Not oly is there no wedding rings, but what happened to Celebrain? Why do we never hear of her? __________________ Here I am, brain the size of a planet, and they ask me to spend my time on this forum. And by the way, for any of you turning into a penguin, stop it. ~* I am Pippin took in the Female Fellowship*~

01-03-2003, 03:45 PM	#9
Elanor Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: my own corner of the Shire Posts: 316	I don't think that arelendil was suggesting that Elrond and Galadriel were married to <B>each other</B> , just that they were married. That is interesting about the wedding rings though. I haven't read any of HoME X, I may have to get that one next.<P>Celebrian was injured by orcs (while travelling through the Misty Mountains?) and left Middle Earth so that she could be healed in the Undying Lands. As far as I can remember, it happened well before the events of LotR. __________________ "When I read about the evils of drinking, I gave up reading." Henny Youngman (1906 - )

01-04-2003, 07:52 AM	#10
Iargwath Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 236	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>and Gandalf doesnt even have a ring, he is a wizard, not an elf!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Gandalf does have an elven ring of power. Even though he is a wizard, he still bore the ring of fire Narya (one of the three elven rings).<BR>And i'll have to check out that HoMe book arelendil, sounds very interesting __________________ 'I waited patiently for the Lord; and He inclined to me, and heard my cry'-Psalm 40 My M-e Forum

01-04-2003, 02:59 PM	#11
dunedain_aragorn Animated Skeleton Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: a Mcdonald's Happy Meal Posts: 47	Whoa, My bad, thanks for correcting me guys! __________________ "I must take leave, I have not slept since Dunnharrow, and I am weary."said Aragorn. Merry seized his hand and kissed it."I am frightfully sorry, we have been a nuisance to you since Bree." Aragorn laughed and left them. "Was there ever any like him?" said Pippin,"Except for Gandalf of course. I believe they must be related."

02-20-2003, 09:05 PM	#12
Morgul Queen Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dontgonearthe Castle Posts: 414	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> galadriel is married to Celebrain <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Ahhhh, don't you mean Celeborn __________________ Athrabeth is still doing the wave for Boromir the Disco-King Oh...and call me Morgy!