Was Old Man Willow an Ent ? Huorn? and... - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

**lindil** · 09-19-2002, 07:32 AM

Was Old Man Willow an Ent ? Huorn? and how about that walking tree up on the moors in NorthFarthing?

sorry if this topic has been done already [admins feel free to smite if so]

I am reminded of Elrond saying that in the Elder days the Old forest stretched clear to Dunland [ a woodland region due east of Fangorn w/ only the ends of the Misty Mntns dividing them. Plus we know from the Silmarillion that Ents inhabited some region in or near Ossiriand so a late 1st age/ early 2nd age migration of Ents must have taken place and seemingly some [or something possessing very similar qualities] called a halt in Eriador.

[ September 19, 2002: Message edited by: lindil ]

littlemanpoet · 09-19-2002, 07:43 AM

On one hand I don't like "tying down" all of the beings and subcreations in LotR to such categorizations. Perhaps JRRT did not mean it to be so; yet, if one considers the nature of "huorn", Old Man Willow seems to fit it.

My hesitation arises from a sense (a kenning?) that everything near the Shire, such as the Old Forest and Tom Bombadil, have a strong flavor of "Fae" about them (this is also true of The Hobbit all the way to Laketown), whereas once you get into the great big world of Middle Earth, that Fae touch seems to give way to a more immense, grandiose Quenyan feel. I don't know if I'm finding the right words.

I wonder if anyone else senses this difference? I suppose I really ought to have started a new thread, but you got me thinking....

Melephelwen · 09-19-2002, 08:01 AM

I too think that Old Man Willow is/was a Huorn. (Huorn are the more-treelike-not-any-longer-ents-creatures, if I remember correct?)
And littlemanpoet, I at least understood what you meant (I think).
I also "sence" a sort of difference between the Shire and the rest of the world. It's like the Shire is reminding of an old fairytale (not any specific). It's more 'magic' when it's around there.
The "rest of the world" is more likely to be true, if you understand what I mean.
I don't think I put this out very good, but my English isn't fluent enough to do it better. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Cazoz · 09-19-2002, 09:02 AM

In a silly way, I always pictured Old Man Willow as one of those evil apples trees in the Wizard of Oz. But then when I got to TTT, I thought of the Ents as those, only nicer.

A Huorn would be more rational though.

Frodo Baggins · 09-19-2002, 07:24 PM

Well, since Treebeard said that the Entwives would love the Shire. I think the "moving tree" Sam's cousin saw in the North Farthing was an Entwife.

[ September 19, 2002: Message edited by: Frodo Baggins ]

Samwise · 09-19-2002, 07:38 PM

I believe so, too, sir--regardless of what Ted may have said.

Frodo Baggins · 09-21-2002, 07:42 AM

Godd four you Sam!!!!!! How many times have I told you, never listen to Ted Sandman, He dosen't half the time know what he's talking about.

09-19-2002, 07:32 AM	#1
lindil Seeker of the Straight Path Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: a hidden fastness in Big Valley nor cal Posts: 1,680	Was Old Man Willow an Ent ? Huorn? and... Was Old Man Willow an Ent ? Huorn? and how about that walking tree up on the moors in NorthFarthing? sorry if this topic has been done already [admins feel free to smite if so] I am reminded of Elrond saying that in the Elder days the Old forest stretched clear to Dunland [ a woodland region due east of Fangorn w/ only the ends of the Misty Mntns dividing them. Plus we know from the Silmarillion that Ents inhabited some region in or near Ossiriand so a late 1st age/ early 2nd age migration of Ents must have taken place and seemingly some [or something possessing very similar qualities] called a halt in Eriador. [ September 19, 2002: Message edited by: lindil ] __________________ The dwindling Men of the West would often sit up late into the night exchanging lore & wisdom such as they still possessed that they should not fall back into the mean estate of those who never knew or indeed rebelled against the Light.

09-19-2002, 08:01 AM	#3
Melephelwen Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: May 2002 Location: the Middle of Nowhere Posts: 291	I too think that Old Man Willow is/was a Huorn. (Huorn are the more-treelike-not-any-longer-ents-creatures, if I remember correct?) And littlemanpoet, I at least understood what you meant (I think). I also "sence" a sort of difference between the Shire and the rest of the world. It's like the Shire is reminding of an old fairytale (not any specific). It's more 'magic' when it's around there. The "rest of the world" is more likely to be true, if you understand what I mean. I don't think I put this out very good, but my English isn't fluent enough to do it better. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] __________________ We're all following a strange melody We're all summoned by a tune We're following the piper And we dance beneath the moon

09-19-2002, 07:24 PM	#5
Frodo Baggins Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Bag-End, Under-Hill, Hobbiton-across-the Water Posts: 606	Well, since Treebeard said that the Entwives would love the Shire. I think the "moving tree" Sam's cousin saw in the North Farthing was an Entwife. [ September 19, 2002: Message edited by: Frodo Baggins ] __________________ "I'm your huckleberry....that's just my game."

09-19-2002, 07:38 PM	#6
Samwise Faithful Spirit Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: #3 Bagshot Row, Petaluma, Ca Posts: 2,299	I believe so, too, sir--regardless of what Ted may have said. __________________ Giving thanks unto the Father...In whom we have redemption through His blood, even the forgiveness of sins.~Colossians1:12a,14 * * * * * * * I am Samwise son of Hamfast, if by hoe or trowel I can get these weeds out of your garden, I will.You have my shears!;)

09-21-2002, 07:42 AM	#7
Frodo Baggins Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Bag-End, Under-Hill, Hobbiton-across-the Water Posts: 606	Godd four you Sam!!!!!! How many times have I told you, never listen to Ted Sandman, He dosen't half the time know what he's talking about. __________________ "I'm your huckleberry....that's just my game."

09-19-2002, 07:43 AM	#2
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	On one hand I don't like "tying down" all of the beings and subcreations in LotR to such categorizations. Perhaps JRRT did not mean it to be so; yet, if one considers the nature of "huorn", Old Man Willow seems to fit it. My hesitation arises from a sense (a kenning?) that everything near the Shire, such as the Old Forest and Tom Bombadil, have a strong flavor of "Fae" about them (this is also true of The Hobbit all the way to Laketown), whereas once you get into the great big world of Middle Earth, that Fae touch seems to give way to a more immense, grandiose Quenyan feel. I don't know if I'm finding the right words. I wonder if anyone else senses this difference? I suppose I really ought to have started a new thread, but you got me thinking....

09-19-2002, 09:02 AM	#4
Cazoz Haunting Spirit Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London, UK Posts: 71	In a silly way, I always pictured Old Man Willow as one of those evil apples trees in the Wizard of Oz. But then when I got to TTT, I thought of the Ents as those, only nicer. A Huorn would be more rational though.