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#1 |
Pile O'Bones
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lothlorien
Posts: 12
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In the Silmarillion, (which I havn't realy read yet), it says Glorfindel is killed by a Balrog at Gondolin. I though Glorfidel was in the FOTR? Were their two different people named Glorfindel? Also, where is Gondolin exactly..
If the Glorfindel in FOTR was a different person than the Glorfindel that was killed by the Balrog, what ever happens to him? I can't remember the LOTR saying anything about him except he rescued Frodo at the ford.
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#2 |
Eldar Spirit of Truth
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Land of the FREE, Home of the BRAVE
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According to Christopher Tolkien in The Return of the Shadow (HoMe) It is the same Glorfindel. Gondolin was in the hidden valley of Tumladen, in Beleriand which was destroyed and sank beneath the sea in the beginning of the Second Age.
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#3 |
Wight
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So... What happened to him? Did he some back like Gandalf or something?
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#4 |
Late Istar
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,224
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Glorfindel of Gondolin is indeed the same as Glorfindel of Rivendell. As discussed in HoMe X, Elves can be reincarnated by the Valar. In Glorfindel's case (moving to HoMe XII), he was reincarnated in Valinor and then sent back to Middle-earth, possibly at the same time as the Istari.
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#5 |
Pile O'Bones
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lothlorien
Posts: 12
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Was Beleriand in Numenore or somewhere North of the Grey Mts. in Middle Earth?
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#6 |
Regal Dwarven Shade
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
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Beleriand was west of the Blue Mountains. It was submerged at the breaking of Thangorodrim. The Grey Mountains were actually some of the remains of the Iron Mountains that Thangorodrim was attached to.
Numenor was right in the middle of the Sundering Sea between Middle Earth and Valinor. It was a little bit closer to Valinor so that the Numenoreans could see the tops of some of the towers of the Elves in Valinor, or something like that.
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#7 | |
Eldar Spirit of Truth
Join Date: Oct 2001
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*~*Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.*~* |
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#8 | |
Eldar Spirit of Truth
Join Date: Oct 2001
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*~*Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.*~* |
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#9 | |
Late Istar
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,224
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#10 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Gondolin
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Yes, in Last Writings Tolkien says that Glorfindel's return very probably took place during the second age before the shadow fell on Numenor. It is said that he might have come to Middle Earth to aid Gil-Galad in the battles that occured following Sauron's forging of the One Ring. While Tolkien doesn't rule out the possibility of Glorfindel returning after the Change of the World, he deems it very improbable, saying that Manwë would have need special permission from Eru to allow it to happen.
-Voronwë
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#11 |
Animated Skeleton
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 33
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Both Glorfindel and the Balrog fell to thier deaths, but it protected the retreaty people of Gondolin.
Almost all the elves were reicarnated by the Valar, in the Sil it talks of how some must wait longer than others, namely Feanor and his 7 sons. Some, like Fingolfin didnt wait very long at all. Glorfindel was obviously not tired of Middle Earth yet, so he returned.
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#12 | |
Eldar Spirit of Truth
Join Date: Oct 2001
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*~*Call me a relic, call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned , say I'm over the hill. That old whine ain't got no soul. I'll stick to Old Toby and a Hobbit hole.*~* |
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#13 | |
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And where's the part on Fingolfin's return? He's my all time fav character. Thks for d assist! |
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#14 |
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Despite his short apperance in FOTR; I liked Glorfindel and wanted to find out more about who he is. It's preety likely that he just came back to ME, but Tolkien never mentions why or how which is what makes Glorfindel such a highly discussed topic.
[ February 14, 2002: Message edited by: Ellesime ] |
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#15 |
Haunting Spirit
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lothlórien
Posts: 82
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Glorfindel is quite the enigmatic character. There are many theories around him--most like to believe that he did come back (this is what i believe) but if you want to read this, it may help clarify a few things...
Glorfindel article I asked the same question in books II. It's called Glorfindel; shadow in the background. *shrugs* You might want to read it because there are some interesting things there... I hope I didn't confuse you... ~~Daegwenn
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"And still of a winter’s night, they say, when the wind is in the trees, When the moon is a ghostly galleon tossed upon cloudy seas, When the road is a ribbon of moonlight over the purple moor, A highwayman comes riding— Riding—Riding— A highwayman comes riding, up to the old inn-door. Over the cobbles he clatters and clangs in the dark inn-yard. And he taps with his whip on the shutters, but all is locked and barred. He whistles a tune to the window, and who should be waiting there But the landlord’s black-eyed daughter, Bess, the landlord’s daughter, Plaiting a dark red love-knot into her long black hair" Highwayman Alfred Noyes |
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#16 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: 315, CNY Boys and girls.
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Glorfindel was related to king Turgon. He was of the house of the Golden hair (or something similar) Notably because he was Noldorin but had golden hair. He was a great warrior, and wise. After he came back from death, he went with Elrond to Rivendell at one point (Elrond may have been the most closely related to him). He must have been strong because when Earnur was humiliated by the Witch King in the second age, and Glorfindel arrived, the Witch King fled. Also he must have been wise, because he prophecized that no mortal man would kill the Witch King. I would wonder if he was related to Galadriel moreso than Elrond? It never mentioned direct relation to anyone in any book. He probably had a sword similar to Glamdring or Orcrist. He may have been friends with Ecthelion, etc... These from being from Gondolin. There you go, some regular information.
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#17 |
Animated Skeleton
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 33
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Its been months since I last read the Sil, but I distinctly remember reading thatFingolfin was reincarnated quickly. Yes I know that Maglor did not directly die, but ill bet he got tired of wandering by the sea and eventually died, him being the most temperate son of Feanor.
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#18 |
Haunting Spirit
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lothlórien
Posts: 82
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*scratches head looking very, very confused* Well, what I don't get is, J.R.R. Tolkien made Golden hair a rare thing amongst elves, but Thranduil has golden hair. So does Galadriel and Glorfindel...so does that make them related in some way?
~~Daegwenn
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"And still of a winter’s night, they say, when the wind is in the trees, When the moon is a ghostly galleon tossed upon cloudy seas, When the road is a ribbon of moonlight over the purple moor, A highwayman comes riding— Riding—Riding— A highwayman comes riding, up to the old inn-door. Over the cobbles he clatters and clangs in the dark inn-yard. And he taps with his whip on the shutters, but all is locked and barred. He whistles a tune to the window, and who should be waiting there But the landlord’s black-eyed daughter, Bess, the landlord’s daughter, Plaiting a dark red love-knot into her long black hair" Highwayman Alfred Noyes |
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#19 |
Animated Skeleton
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: western Arda
Posts: 41
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Golden hair is rare among the Noldor (one of the three kindreds of the High Elves or Eldar); it's the usual hair color of the Vanyar (the smallest kindred of the Eldar), and apparently also occurs with some frequency among the Teleri and their cousins the Sindar. Thrainduil is of the Sindar, although most of his people are Silvan elves.
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#20 |
Haunting Spirit
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Valinor
Posts: 55
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Glorfinel is a fascinating character! His short presence in FotR is powerful and awe-inspiring! I loved the FotR movie, but I am soooooo, soooooooo bummed out that he was not in it!
Long live Glorfindel! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]
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Lord of the seas and one of the greatest of the Valar; in the dark days of the First Age, he kept watch on Elves and Men while the others of his order remained in Valinor. He is famed for bringing Tuor to Gondolin, and so ultimately bringing about the downfall of Morgoth in the War of Wrath. |
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#21 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Gondolin
Posts: 413
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I'm pretty certain that there is no mention of Fingolfin's reincarnation in the Silmarillion. However, there is a reference to the reincarnation of Finrod Felagund.
-Voronwë
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#22 |
A Northern Soul
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Valinor
Posts: 1,847
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Someone stated correctly - light hair was a trait of the Vanyar. This trait was introduced into the Noldorin tree when Indis (a Vanyarin) became Finwë's second wife. Indis bore Finarfin and Fingolfin (Míriel had previously given birth to Fëanor), thus in their lines, we see the occasional light-haired elf [i.e. Galadriel (in Fingolfin's), Gil-galad (from Finarfin's)].
[ February 24, 2002: Message edited by: Legalos ]
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