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Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page |
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#1 |
Dread Horseman
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Behind you!
Posts: 2,743
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Feedback and Suggestion Box
Greetings, Chapter-by-Chapter readers.
Since we're in this thing for the long haul, and now that we've all had a chance to test-drive the project with the Foreword thread, I thought I'd establish a place for feedback and suggestions. Any suggestions on how to improve the read-through or the discussion structure we have set up are welcome (though of course we reserve all rights as to which ones will actually be implemented). Things you might comment on are the pacing of the read-through, ways to focus or enrich the discussion, or ways to make this thing as friendly as possible to your fellow members. |
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#2 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Where you want me to be
Posts: 1,036
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Some chapters in Lotr are longer than others, so I think it would be a good idea to break them up into smaller sections to make it easier for everyone to follow. Also, there hasn't been much posting by a wide variety of members- only a few people have contributed so far. I think posts should be more open and accessible to everyone in the Barrow-Downs, not just a few more 'learned' people.
That's my two cents on what's looking to be a promising new forum!
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Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta. |
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#3 | |
Illusionary Holbytla
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 7,547
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#4 | |
La Belle Dame sans Merci
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Firefoot's got it in one:
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peace
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#5 |
Spectre of Decay
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I'd like to see a wider range of people too. All too often the presence of lengthly posts in academic language seems to deter others from sharing their thoughts, but that is not the intention of the members who write those posts. I don't have the answers, but I think it would deter certain members from the discussion if they were required somehow to tailor their posts to suit the needs of others.
Perhaps a more determined promotion of the idea that anyone with an insight to share should consider posting in the discussions would be more helpful. The 'learned' members are always eager to hear a fresh opinion, particularly from new members; and nobody who has participated so far is the sort of person to dismiss someone's views because they aren't written up like a university paper. I agree that the foreword isn't the most interesting part of the book for a lot of readers. I'm sure that the Prologue and A Long-Expected Party will draw a lot more people into the discussion who are more interested in Hobbits than allegory versus applicability. In fact, the lighter tone of those sections may well be just what the doctor ordered (and that doctor is not necessarily a PhD).
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Man kenuva métim' andúne? |
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#6 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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Some members might find it uncomfortable to post in such a thread that has had posts that are “like a university paper”. They could feel that there is nothing for them to contribute, as others have said. Or possibly find that whatever they say might make others 'judge' them as a member (considering, “many of the posts have been made by some of the 'more-learned' BDers, many of whom frequently post in the Books section”), if what they say is not as ‘high standard’ as everything else. It could simply be that this is not the most interesting section of the book for them. Yes, I hope others will post more in the next few sections and chapters.
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-Ever wonder whats beyond those trees? -More trees. 'Poor ye. Ye're tied to someone who's been photographed trying to shave their hand... My condolences.' |
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#7 | |
Cryptic Aura
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 5,992
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Like Squatter, I too wouldl like to see more people post in the discussion. I was pleased, however, to see such people as Orofaniel, Durelin, Firefoot, Saraphim, Arry, Fingolfin II, Kransha, and tar-ancalime post.
Yet, also like Squatter, I don't have the answer to Fingolfin II's statement. Quote:
Do you mean we limit the discussion solely to LOTR and not bring in any other of Tolkien's writings or his Letters, since many might not have read the Letters or The Silm? (When I first arrived on the Downs, I had read some of Tolkien's essays and minor works, TH and LOTR, but not The Silm and was daunted by how others would off-handedly refer to passages and elements from the Legendarium.) Or would you prefer not to see outside critics and scholars quoted with their ideas about Tolkien? (I am thinking here of such things as davem's quote from the Proceedings of the Tolkien Society.) Perhaps we need to be more rigorous in focussing the discussion solely on the chapter in question? Are there differences of style, as Squatter and Alatariel Telemnar have suggested, which you think would make the discussion more inviting? Perhaps when posters such as Fordim Hedgethistle (or myself on the Canonicity thread) use words such as readerly, we need to provide an explanation of the word or idea? Maybe we are using concepts about books which are unfamiliar and some posters would like us to explain them better? Or is there something about this Chapter by Chapter forum which is different from other Books threads? Or is this rather the kind of difference which exists between Books and, say, Novices and Newcomers? I don't think anyone who posted wanted to deter others from posting--certainly there is nothing here like the curt, short, sharp style the guys used when I came to BD. Others besides myself addressed posts to people who, for instance, did not post on the Canonicity thread, such as Orofaniel and Durelin (I hope I'm right about this--relying on my faulty memory!). I enjoyed Arry's post about old typewriters and ten-fingured so much that it inspired me to think about Tolkien's self-deprecatory wit. I was very pleased when tar-ancalime took a point about my post and expanded it to a defense of the work of art as art to speak for itself without outside explication.--something I had in fact been planning to do myself in a subsequent post! I still owe replies to Oro and Durelin (RL is placing a heavy limit on my time here these days) but in my delay I find that Son of Númenor has, quite better than I think I could have, provided an explanation of how real life events could be seen to have had a hand in the writing of LOTR without necessarily providing a one-to-one literal correspondence. In short, I think there has been a fair bit of cooperative discussion on the Foreword thread so far. Fingolfin, I don't want to cut you off from answering, but these ideas have been running in head for some time. Please bear with me while I ponder some other ideas about internet communities. What possibly is happening is, of course, common to all internet communities which grow and develop with 'new blood'. Some of us have been here for four years, some two years, others a little over or under a year. That creates some difficulties, for the "old timers" have memories of discussions which inform their ideas, memories which the 'newly arrived' don't share. One other unique aspect of the Downs is the age range of people here. We have teenagers to, well, not quite senior citizens, but people in their forties and even *gasp* fifties. This is I think an admirable effect of Tolkien's writing, that he can appeal to such an age range. But it can provide some difficulties when we 'speak' to each other. Another aspect of internet communities is the sometimes rapid turnover of people. Some stay; others go, for a variety of reasons. I know that some of us, Child and myself particularly and I think Estelyn also and I am sure others, go to great effort to welcome 'newbies' and to encourage them to post. I have spent much delightful time corresponding via PM with posters. And many of them are now gone, at least from the site and some even from all email access. It is hard to be constantly making new acqaintances and then losing them. This is not the 'fault' of anyone, but perhaps it limits the responses of some of the 'old timers' who want to wait to see if the 'newbies' will in fact stay. And some of us just have our own 'hobby horses' to ride as we challenge each other back and forth about our ideas. (What? Moi ride my own hobby horse?) ![]() Posting on discussion boards takes courage, because we see our ideas 'out there' and have little idea initially what might happen to them. Perhaps if we took more courage to contact posters when we didn't understand something, either via PM or even on a post, we might be able to create a 'common ground of understanding' so that, without necessarily demanding that we all think and write alike, we can feel comfortable listening to each other. Fingolfin II, I guess I got a little carried away here with ideas. Please feel entirely free to tell me I have either answered my own questions or missed your point or the boat . (Note, I got told I used too many smilies, so I have removed them. Now I rely on words alone to suggest my gentle touch of humour, at myself, I point out.)
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I’ll sing his roots off. I’ll sing a wind up and blow leaf and branch away. Last edited by Bêthberry; 06-12-2004 at 10:34 AM. |
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#8 |
Gibbering Gibbet
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Beyond cloud nine
Posts: 1,844
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I think that much of the discussion's nature in the foreword thread is due to the nature of the foreword -- the misgivings of some here, myself included, that this chapter-by-chapter subforum will become dominated by a few "learned" people (read, perhaps, windbags such as myself) will probably be allayed when we get into the discussion of the story itself.
Those of us who are or who become more regular posters might be able to help this along by attempting to have our first posts for each chapter move toward asking questions and dangling provocative ideas rather than making set arguments. I find that's always the most useful way for me to proceed: I have learned a lot from reading other people's responses to my queries/ramblings/ponderings. I shall also attempt to expunge from my posts all words derived from critical theory! ![]() EDIT -- as a point of interest, the Foreword thread has had over 1200 views on only 75 posts: so I assume that there are a lot of people following the discussion who have yet to contribute. If we undertake to make the discussion more clearly focused on the story (beginning with the Prologue) that will perhaps draw some of them in(?). |
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#9 | ||||||
Beloved Shadow
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I have not read the foreword discussion but I plan on getting into this chapter by chapter thing relatively soon. In the meanwhile, I'm finding this suggestion box thread rather interesting.
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I haven't read the thread in question, but I can certainly recall viewing other threads that contained lengthy, academic posts that seemed to suck the oxygen right out of the room. The posts were full of words but there was very little meaning per word. This is what happens when a poster has a way to express himself that would use about one tenth the space but elects to take the long road. Quote:
For instance, let's say someone starts a new thread and asks "Why did Feanor want to chase Morgoth so bad?" I would prefer to see someone post something like this- So, did you miss the parts where it said- 1) Feanor loved his dad 2)Morgoth killed his dad 3)Feanor loved his jewels 4)Morgoth stole his jewels I'd rather see that than some super long post dripping with psychology terms that ends up saying no more than the previous post. The only way I'd want a long post is if it says a lot more. You know, begins to ponder why Feanor felt this way about this, and what he might've been thinking at this time, and what he might've said to so and so at this other time. But all too often it's just smart sounding posts taking up way too much space. I love the curt, short, sharp style. But of course this discussion isn't going to mean anything once we get past the foreword because I agree with these posts- Quote:
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the phantom has posted.
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#10 | ||
Deadnight Chanter
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![]() Not to stray off to personal self-analysis - to the benefit of the discussion to come, I remember in the past when it was done in the chat room, the preliminaries were made to find out how well (and in what way) the text itself was understood. Sharku was asking questions as to how well do we know meanings of rare words. Only after 15 minutes of such a warm-up the discussion proper took off. I can not tell the means of doing it on the board (as opposed to chatroom), but I liked idea at its time, maybe recalling it here may give someone an inspiration to come up with something ![]() well... edit: cross posted with the phantom here The retelling of the plot is not a solution - it will make the initial posts a bit of a bore for those who do their homework well, and those who are lazy won't read it anyway But that kind of quiz may work, you know. But only if combined with something more serious. You'd be drawing newbies in, but scaring old philosophy masticators away, for Quote:
![]() So, the solution probably will be something in between - starting with simple quiz, and than let everybody say it in a way they like. After all, you are bored by some post, you skip it and go on.
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Egroeg Ihkhsal - Would you believe in the love at first sight? - Yes I'm certain that it happens all the time! Last edited by HerenIstarion; 06-12-2004 at 11:47 AM. |
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#11 |
Illustrious Ulair
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties
Posts: 4,240
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I can only say that I was slightly disappointed that we started with the Forword, as I knew it could only lead to analysis of Tolkien the man & his motives. I went too far in such analysis, & possibly deterred some others from posting - if so I'm sorry.
I can see valid reasons for sticking to LotR, or at least to LotR, Hobbit - possibly with relevant references to the Sil, leaving aside Letters, Home, UT, Trying as far as possible to approach LotR as if its all we have. The only danger is the thread decending into 'I think Aragorn is really cool' or I really liked it when the Ringwraiths attacked the Hobbits under Weathertop', etc. As long as it doesn't go that way I think it will be a very interesting experience. |
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#12 | |
Gibbering Gibbet
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Beyond cloud nine
Posts: 1,844
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Davem, you said:
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Everyone's opinion springs from a response to something in the text, and every opinion is extremely useful to everyone else's understanding. This is not just a pose I adopt for the sake of discussion on the BD, it's a truth that I live by in both my personal and professional life! |
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#13 | |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Where you want me to be
Posts: 1,036
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I think The Phantom is right when he/she says:
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![]() In answer to your comment on the age gap between some Barrow-Downs users I totally agree. I'm only fifteen, whereas others are much older and some are even younger. This does contribute to potential misunderstandings between people who have been on for a longer time, and those who have not. However, I also believe that while more 'experienced' posters should aim to try and make their post so everyone can reply (I realise that this is not always possible, especially in debates about HoME and The Letters), the onis should also be on new posters to contribute to the discussion themselves. Hope that all makes sense. EDIT: What I should have said is that the discussions should be 'more open and accessible' to everyone.
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Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta. Last edited by Fingolfin II; 06-12-2004 at 09:03 PM. |
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#14 | ||
Estelo dagnir, Melo ring
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,063
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For my part, I think this 'Chapter-By-Chapter' discussion will get many new posters into the in-depth discussions, and hopefully help make them a permenant browser and poster of the Books forum. I know that this is what is has done for me, I hope. I truly have missed out for quite some time... -Durelin |
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#15 |
Haunting Spirit
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: At The Golden Perch enjoying the best pint in the East Farthing!
Posts: 68
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As a new comer to LotR and to this site, I would like to comment as to why I wouldn't feel comfortable posting to this forum. It's not intentional of course but I'm very intimidated by most of you because most of you have read the books over and over again while the newbies have read them at least once. I myself am now reading LotR for the second time. All of that knowledge can be quite intimidating.
The only reason I checked out this forum was because I finally got the guts to do it. I wanted to see what you talked about to see if I could join in on the conversation. There are quite a lot of you that speak very eloquently and that can be intimidating also. For me personally I have always been intimidated by someone who speaks so eloquently because it makes me feel so common. These are just my feelings on the matter and I could be totally wrong about the whole thing. From what I've read you folks were hinting about it so I thought I would take the initiative and just say it point blank. Hopefully I have not offended anyone because that was not my intent.
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YOU shall not pass!! Even the smallest person can change the course of the future... |
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#16 | |
A Shade of Westernesse
Join Date: May 2004
Location: The last wave over Atalantë
Posts: 515
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Alchisiel
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This endeavour seems simple to me: read the chapters, share what you think, and discuss your thoughts to gain a better understanding of your personal experience with The Lord of the Rings. ![]()
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"This miserable drizzling afternoon I have been reading up old military lecture-notes again:- and getting bored with them after an hour and a half. I have done some touches to my nonsense fairy language - to its improvement." |
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#17 | |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Where you want me to be
Posts: 1,036
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Great advice, Son of Númenor.
Alchisiel, the people who write 'eloquently' with proper grammar and spelling do so to make it easier and more enjoyable for others to read. However, I can understand that the 'deep' discussions of those who have read the books several times can seem a bit daunting and discourage newbies from contributing, especially if they think their comments and opinions don't 'match up' or aren't good enough when compared to the posts of the more experienced BD-ers. That shouldn't be the case though; as Son of Númenor said, it doesn't matter how small or insignificant you think your post will be- just post it, get involved in the discussion and try and learn from other posters. I'm no expert, but I try my best to add to a discussion and sometimes the points I raise are discussed even though I think that they are not well made. This adds to my confidence so I am able to make better and more worthwhile contributions in the future (better contributions does not necessarily mean longer posts). I think this will also work for you and any other shy Barrow-Downers. Quote:
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Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta. Last edited by Fingolfin II; 06-12-2004 at 11:20 PM. |
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#18 | |
Estelo dagnir, Melo ring
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,063
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![]() Alchisiel - Look! You've already written a three paragraph post, and on the suggestions thread! I think you'll do fine. ![]() |
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#19 | |
Gibbering Gibbet
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Beyond cloud nine
Posts: 1,844
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Son of Numenor wrote
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#20 | |
Mighty Mouse of Mordor
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First of all I would just say that the Chapter to Chapter forum is looking....awesome. =D I'm very positive towards the idea, and I plan on spending some time there when it starts for full.
I've noticed a lot of questions regarding whether the more "experienced" posters should make their posts easier to understand so that everyone can reply afterwards. Fingolfin wrote: Quote:
![]() The main reason I don't usually post on the big discussions is that I'm too late to discover them! I start reading them when there are two pages and so on. The difficulty for me is simply to keep track with the posters. ![]() I really hope that the Chapters by Chapters discussions will go slower, although I doubt it. ![]() Cheers, Oro
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I lost my old sig...somehow....*screams and shouts* ..............What is this?- Now isn't this fun? >_< .....and yes, the jumping mouse is my new avatar. ^_^ |
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#21 | |
Banshee of Camelot
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 5,830
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I agree very much with what Orofaniel wrote! I read much, much more than I post myself.
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Also I'm a bit in awe of all those erudite and eloquent Downers as well ![]() I think this "chapter by chapter"reading is a good opportunity for me to reread the books once more from beginning to end and not merely in random bits like in the past year.
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Yes! "wish-fulfilment dreams" we spin to cheat our timid hearts, and ugly Fact defeat! |
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#22 |
Dread Horseman
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Behind you!
Posts: 2,743
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There's a lot of great advice here.
I certainly am aware of how difficult it is for a new person to carve out a niche on an established board. Getting a curt, dismissive reply can be discouraging, but having your post be completely overlooked and ignored can be just about as dispiriting. Here's a couple of tips on ways for less established members to successfully join a discussion:
These same two tips can be used by more experienced and established members to help others out.
Read, share, discuss. It's that simple. |
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#23 |
Gibbering Gibbet
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Beyond cloud nine
Posts: 1,844
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I do realise that this is probably a 'nothing' post, soon to be deleted by a mod if not by the BW himself, but. . .
I just had a peek at the Who's Online (I admit: I am a stalker -- bad Fordim!) and saw that at the moment there are no fewer than six people viewing the 12 hour old Prologue Thread. I think that this bodes well for getting people involved! |
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#24 |
Cryptic Aura
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 5,992
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About the attractiveness of short posts, the phantom, I concur. There was a reason why Diamond18 called this place the burra-Downs.
And about the number of times that the more senior (older?) (arthritic?) members of the Downs have read the books: not all of us have read them annually over decades. I first read LOTR as a furtive, 'guilty pleasure' read for fun to balance my 'required' reading for my studies. Then later as I was slogging my way through translating the Old English works I came to know Tolkien's academic stuff and learnt how much of his writing gives new breath and life to the old language and culture. Four years ago, I reread The Hobbit as preparation for escorting a school class to a live theatre production of The Hobbit (brilliant performance from the actor/gymnast who played Gollem!). Three years ago, at the bedside of an ill relative undergoing painful and extensive medical tests, I reread LOTR and became aware for the first time of how prevalent are the themes of loss and death. Thus, this Chapter by Chapter reading will be only my third reading. I post in perpetual fear that the "annual readers" will always find some obscure line that will undo me. ![]() ![]()
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I’ll sing his roots off. I’ll sing a wind up and blow leaf and branch away. |
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#25 |
Maiden of Tears
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I'm sure more people will begin posting as we go into the actual chapters. I only lately saw that this was happening, and have spent the evening reading the entire thread on the Prologue (not an easy task...) after a long and regretted departure from the forum. (I will try and stay back here, this time!)
As for the discussion being more 'accessible', I really think that depends on the individual reader. While perhaps some members could use less shockingly big words ![]() ![]() Just give it a little bit more time, and some more people will drop by to see what's going on.
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'It must often be so, Sam, when things are in danger: someone has to give them up, lose them, so that others may keep them' ~Frodo "Life is hard. After all, it kills you." - Katharine Hepburn |
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#26 | |
La Belle Dame sans Merci
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Actually, to be more serious about the big word issue... I don't know if this holds true for anybody else, but when I'm speaking or writing, I use whatever word comes to mind, and it rarely occurs to me that somebody may not know what it means. I got accused a couple of weeks ago in class of "giving a definition that needs a definition." I believe I was asked to define 'ubiquitous' and I said 'omnipresent.' It didn't occur to me until I got yelled at by my friends that the teacher was the only person who knew what I meant. So although we can *try* to ease up on the university lingo, a lot of our Big Word Posters may not even realize that they're doing it.
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peace
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#27 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Where you want me to be
Posts: 1,036
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Dictionary.com- the great online dictionary ;-)
I don't see that using big words is really much of a problem. It's one thing to use a seemingly large word to better describe something, but it's another thing to be verbose and use 'university language' for the sake of using it. I agree with *Varda* that if people don't know the meaning of a word they should take two seconds to look it up in the dictionary.
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Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta. |
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#28 |
Guest
Posts: n/a
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Feanor of the Peredhi
Very interesting, however, it is the writers job to make themselves understood not the readers job to do so. Big words do not for intelligence make. Some of the most profound statements in human history are said in very few words and are totally understandable to those of higher and lesser intelligence than the writer ![]() |
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#29 |
Blithe Spirit
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,779
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Hmmm.....but what would Tolkien do?
Should his editor have told him "hey JRR, you can't come out with all this 'begone foul dwimmerlaik' stuff because it's alienating and elitist and in fifty years time a bunch of college kids won't know what the hell you're talking about. What's wrong with simple English - 'beat it you creepy monster'." This is a forum devoted to the works of a professor of philology. Philology is the study of words but it literally means 'love of language.' If you come across a word you don't understand, in a book or on this forum or anywhere else, do Tolkien the honour of looking it up in a dictionary. Ok you won't find dwimmerlaik in most dictionaries, I admit, ![]() |
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#30 |
Banshee of Camelot
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 5,830
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I agree, Lalaith!
Btw, in the new German translation Wolfgang Krege actually [I]did[B] modernize Tolkien's language! *shudders* (If anymone is interested in details about that, see my old thread Tolkien Translations )
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Yes! "wish-fulfilment dreams" we spin to cheat our timid hearts, and ugly Fact defeat! Last edited by Guinevere; 06-21-2004 at 07:57 AM. Reason: I wanted to add a link to an old thread |
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#31 | |
Corpus Cacophonous
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: A green and pleasant land
Posts: 8,390
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I've been rather "out-of-the-loop" in the last two weeks, but I'm back now and hoping to resume participation once I have done my "homework" and caught up on all the posts.
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As for the style of posts, I think that everyone should post in the style with which they feel comfortable (txtspk excepted ![]() ![]() ![]()
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Do you mind? I'm busy doing the fishstick. It's a very delicate state of mind! |
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#32 |
Spirit of the Lonely Star
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 5,133
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Slightly off topic but pertinent to future discussion.....
Yes, I thought this would be an incentive to read the whole thing methodically which, to tell the truth, I have not done in years and years. RS and the others came out sosme fifteen to seventeen years ago, and that's the only time I sat down to read them through cover-to-cover! I do pick up the volumes quite frequently to look something up, but that is different than a concentrated reading. This seems like a good time to do that. Mark 12_30 - As I read the varying drafts of the chapters, I am planning to be on the lookout for certain things. One of these is the question we raised in a much earlier thread: whether the later revisions were the point that Tolkien added the "Christian and Catholic" elements we talk so much about. I'll be looking for hints of providence and the specific references that Tolkien discussed in his letters like lembas, Galadriel's characterization, etc. to see when these first came in. Of course, Tolkien is the one who said in his Letters that the "Christian and Catholic" elements were added in the later revisions. But sometimes what we remember and what we've actually done is different, even for Tolkien who was certainly trying to tell the truth. We shall see...
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Multitasking women are never too busy to vote. Last edited by Child of the 7th Age; 06-23-2004 at 07:47 AM. |
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#33 |
Stormdancer of Doom
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Bingo, Odo, and.... [i]Marmaduke[/i]???
Child and Esty :
Would it be polite to open a thread(s) as needed for the HoLotR discussions? I'm a bit concerned that bringing Marmaduke, Odo and Bingo into the regular discussions could confuse some of the participants or discourage them, and get the discussions off track. That would hardly encourage broad participation in the LotR threads. And I'd like to be free to get as in-depth as we'd like regarding Bingo, Trotter, et al. Since the participants will be fewer, we can do threads by groups of chapters, or by books, or what not. We could even put them in Books. What think ye? --mark12_30
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...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve. |
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#34 |
Deadnight Chanter
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Bingo is already there, I believe (or, even, I know), for I put him in myself
![]() Well, I suppose it is all right to bring those gentlemen in as long as poster provides satisfactory explanation who they are (and, of course, who they become, if they did, that is)
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Egroeg Ihkhsal - Would you believe in the love at first sight? - Yes I'm certain that it happens all the time! |
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#35 |
Stormdancer of Doom
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H-I-- I think your brief reference was fine; you were clear on who you were referring to and why, and the quick reference you made was not off-topic to Fordim's original intent in any way.
However, knowing Child (and me) we will be diving deeper than that, and it doesn't seem fair to burden Fordim's discussion with the detail I anticipate. Child has *already* played Trotter, and we are both certified (certifiable?) Frodophiles; Child states she will be looking for Catholic & Christan references; I will also be looking quite hard at Dreams and Visions (especially Frodo's-- er, sorry, Bingo's)... I'm uncertain what level of fanaticism Esty will bring to the mix. But it doesn't seem quite fair to put it on Fordim's thread. If needed, we can certainly post links back and forth... Perhaps we should agree to, so that any who are interested may pursue. Nevertheless, I think discussing HoLotR won't take NEARLY as many threads as The Big Discussion will. **second thought** I suppose, if new threads were frowned upon, we could sort of "cordon off" our HoLotR discussions on the main thread with asterisks or titles or something. "Those not interested in Bingo may skip this section." But then our discussions will be fragmented and harder to follow. ...Child? Esty?
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...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve. |
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#36 |
Gibbering Gibbet
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Beyond cloud nine
Posts: 1,844
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For what it's worth I see no problem with bringing in material from HoME here -- that material is all relevant and interesting and illuminating of the text insofar as it is all really just drafts of the final product and not separate works of their own.
Last edited by Fordim Hedgethistle; 06-24-2004 at 08:19 AM. |
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#37 |
Night In Wight Satin
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 4,043
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I think we need to keep HoME stuff out of the Chapter-by-chapter discussions. The idea was to discuss the Lord of the Rings and not the entire span of JRRT's writings, right?
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The Barrow-Wight |
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#38 |
Dread Horseman
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Behind you!
Posts: 2,743
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Although I'll probably be too busy to follow along in HoME, I think such discussion could have great general appeal and I'd hate to see it carried off into separate threads.
I think that as long as members who introduce HoME material are careful to annotate such contributions (and, I guess I should add, are careful not to let it dominate and overpower the "straight" discussion), I think we'll be fine. EDIT: Whoops -- cross-posting with BW. Well, this is the Feedback and Suggestion Box. What do others think? Is there general interest? If not, how can we accomodate the few who are interested? I don't think cluttering up this Chapter-by-Chapter section with "alternate draft" threads is the answer. |
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#39 |
Gibbering Gibbet
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Beyond cloud nine
Posts: 1,844
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In thinking further about having HoME in the discussion -- I have never read these volumes
![]() So long as those who want to refer to those works do so as they have been already, I think that material can only add to the discussion. |
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#40 | |
Night In Wight Satin
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 4,043
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Quote:
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