Password

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

Well, the theme is Middle-earth couples: Finduilas of Dol Amroth and Denethor II, Faramir Took and Goldilocks Gamgee, Elanor Gamgee and Fastred of Greenholm. That leaves Arwen and Thorongil (Toil, including h as your aspirant and an anagram of most of Grond

[Pervinca Took]

That's better.

Of course, I could have chosen Samwise and Rose instead of making Faramir Took and Goldilocks walk backwards, but that would have been boring. And it's also more fun to put that couple instead of the more obvious Faramir and Eowyn.

Thanks to Morsul the Dark, whose theme of namesake pairs led to my idea of couples as a theme.

Finduilas: She’s a good catch, you hear, but it sounds like a twisted deal.
Arwen: Orome loses an article, but two directions lead to her.
Skcolidlog: Blue Peter dog, we hear, is very clever. She runs backwards and secures the room!
Thorongil: See him labour and aspirate with four-fifths of a battering ram, however badly.
Rimaraf: Perturbed, the blessed Welsh virgin joins the air force, running back to find him.
Elanor: She wraps knowledge (albeit twisted) around a volatile metal.
Denethor: Foxy place of note; sounds like he needs to defrost, though.

THEME: COUPLES

And over to Nerwen.

[Mithalwen]

Nerwen?

[Pervinca Took]

I was about to say the same thing.

NEEERRRRRRRR - WEEEEEEEEEEN!!!!

[Nerwen]

Okay, okay! I'll think of something!

[Nerwen]

Here you go!

1. Slender cave amphibian is disturbed to become pallid plant.
2. Agitated ballroom dance loses element for fateful landing place.
3. Reassemble and decorate cable-car to arrive at sacred mountain.
4. Loan cover for muddled tall chap.
5. Princess to wed metaphysical poet's island?
6. Spanish gold encountered in king's tower.
7. From eternal city, all roads lead confused grandmother to haven.

[Pervinca Took]

4. Might TUOR in a jumbled state be the initials of a kind of loan cover somewhere? I believe Tuor was the tallest bloke ever, although not sure if that was amongst men only, or men *and* elves.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took

4. Might TUOR in a jumbled state be the initials of a kind of loan cover somewhere? I believe Tuor was the tallest bloke ever, although not sure if that was amongst men only, or men *and* elves.

No, you're looking for someone who lived much later.

[Pervinca Took]

PPI is a kind of loan cover, but I have a feeling the answer ain't Pippi Longstocking either.

[Pervinca Took]

I think 2 might be UMBAR from Rumba, except I can't see how it loses an element.

The tall guy could be ELENDIL (lid = cover) but can't get the 'loan' bit to work.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took

The tall guy could be ELENDIL (lid = cover) but can't get the 'loan' bit to work.

LEND + LIE maybe?

[Pervinca Took]

I did think of LEND, but lie is not cover, where lid is.

[Nerwen]

No, it is Elendil- I made a mistake with the letters from doing this in a hurry!

And #2 is indeed Umbar: rhumba - H (for hydrogen). I didn't know you could write it without an H in English.

1. Slender cave amphibian is disturbed to become pallid plant.
UMBAR Agitated ballroom dance loses element for fateful landing place.
3. Reassemble and decorate cable-car to arrive at sacred mountain.
ELENDIL Loan cover for muddled tall chap.
5. Princess to wed metaphysical poet's island?
6. Spanish gold encountered in king's tower.
7. From eternal city, all roads lead confused grandmother to haven.

[Galadriel55]

7. Romenna was a city, possibly a haven. Rome + Nan.

[Nerwen]

That's it!

1. Slender cave amphibian is disturbed to become pallid plant.
UMBAR Agitated ballroom dance loses element for fateful landing place.
3. Reassemble and decorate cable-car to arrive at sacred mountain.
ELENDIL Loan cover for muddled tall chap.
5. Princess to wed metaphysical poet's island?
6. Spanish gold encountered in king's tower.
RÓMENNA From eternal city, all roads lead confused grandmother to haven.

[Pervinca Took]

Is the password (and maybe also the theme) NUMENOR?

I have been looking for towers with ORO (Spanish gold) in them). I believe there is one called OROMET (to cover encountered as well as gold).

I am not very good at zoology - I was trying to turn salamander into various blooms without success. But if Numenor is right, 1 I guess has to be NIPHREDIL.

P.S. Well done, G55! I was trying to do something with lots of directions (for East Road, North Road, etc) followed by confused nan, and didn't get very far.

[Pervinca Took]

Could the metaphysical poet's island simply be 'no man' - from Donne's 'No man is an island?' The only N candidates I can think of for princesses are Nerdanel and Nimrodel - neither married a *man* - but Nimrodel ended up not marrying at all.

I did try with island as the straight clue, but none seem to begin with an N.

[Nerwen]

NUMENOR it is!

As regards your other guesses- the princess in question is Ancalimë, who said her preferred husband would be "Úner" = "Noman".

OROMET was a tower built by Tar-Minastir.

NIPHREDIL is not correct- there are plants other than flowers...


N Slender cave amphibian is disturbed to become pallid plant.
UMBAR Agitated ballroom dance loses element for fateful landing place.
M Reassemble and decorate cable-car to arrive at sacred mountain.
ELENDIL Loan cover for muddled tall chap.
NOMAN Princess to wed metaphysical poet's island?
OROMET Spanish gold encountered in king's tower.
RÓMENNA From eternal city, all roads lead confused grandmother to haven.

[Pervinca Took]

Ah! I did think of Ancalime, because I am reading Unfinished Tales at the moment, and read Aldarion and Erendis last weekend. I particularly remember her saying her preferred husband would be 'No man.' I just thought I had to give the name of a princess beginning with N.

[Pervinca Took]

If you 'thin' salamander by removing an A and the R, and disturb it, then (provided you add another E and another S) you can get NESSAMELDA, a Numenorean plant.

[Galadriel55]

I'm gonna say Meneltarma based on the straight clue.

[Pervinca Took]

I've been trying to scramble synonyms of cable-car to get Meneltarma, too.

[Nerwen]

MENELTARMA is correct- do you want me to explain the clue, or would you prefer to guess?



NESSAMELDA is ingenious, but not the right answer. The clue refers to a rather obscure animal.

[Pervinca Took]

Speaking for myself, I would love to see an explanation of the clue.

[Pervinca Took]

I think the only options left for the plant are NELDOR (elvish for 'beech') and NIMLOTH.

I don't know of, nor can I find, any amphibians that either could be scrambled from. But I will guess NIMLOTH because it was white (pallid) and it grew on Numenor (Numenor being both theme and password).

[Nerwen]

NIMLOTH Slender cave amphibian is disturbed to become pallid plant.
UMBAR Agitated ballroom dance loses element for fateful landing place.
MENELTARMA Reassemble and decorate cable-car to arrive at sacred mountain.
ELENDIL Loan cover for muddled tall chap.
NOMAN Princess to wed metaphysical poet's island?
OROMET Spanish gold encountered in king's tower.
RÓMENNA From eternal city, all roads lead confused grandmother to haven.

It is indeed NIMLOTH- anagram of "thin olm". An olm is a rare cave-dwelling salamander found in Eastern Europe.

I'll wait to see if G55 wants me to explain MENELTARMA.

[Pervinca Took]

OK ... I guess I can go ahead and post the next password, though? Maybe you could PM me the explanation?

P.S. GREAT password!

[Galadriel55]

Oh yes please, explain away! I have absolutely no clue how it works, I was just going by the straight part.

[Pervinca Took]

Look forward with G55 to the demystifying of Meneltarma!

Meanwhile, the next password (I've been scribbling away and now have a few passwords up my sleeve!) ...

1. Lady born where three ways meet, however tortuously.
2. She certainly troubled Cupid’s counterpart!
3. Wells girl found a way to reveal her.
4. Secluded lady? Ancient letter reveals her.
5. Eva’s epesse? For her, the simile has not grown stale.
6. Sounds like a utopic time for her.
7. Noble lady runs back for Ol’ Blue Eyes.

[Nerwen]

Okay then- MENELTARMA = ENAMEL TRAM.

[Nerwen]

#7 is ARTANIS. (Sinatra backwards).

[Nerwen]

And could #2 be ROSE? (Anagram of "Eros").

[Pervinca Took]

It's 'Sinatra' ('Artanis' backwards), but you can have it.

'Rose' is correct, too, and for the reason you state.

'Enamel tram' is a WICKED synonym!

1. Lady born where three ways meet, however tortuously.
Rose: She certainly troubled Cupid’s counterpart!
3. Wells girl found a way, through confusion, to reveal her.
4. Secluded lady? Ancient letter reveals her.
5. Eva’s epesse? For her, the simile has not grown stale.
6. Sounds like a utopic time for her.
Sinatra (Artanis): Noble lady runs back for Ol’ Blue Eyes.

[Pervinca Took]

Nerwen probably guessed the two easiest ones, but I don't think the rest are *all* that hard.

Maybe give me your thoughts so far, and then I'll give hints?

[Galadriel55]

For 6 I have been unsuccessfully trying to come up with synonyms for either utopic as in future or utopic as in very good.


Also, was it just me or was the Downs inaccessible in the last couple days?

[Pervinca Took]

It was, yes.

Try finding a word meaning 'utopic time' rather than utopic. It's a word you'll be more used to in its related adjectival form.

Or maybe have a guess at the password?

[Galadriel55]

Hmm, Idril as in idyll?

And the only thing I can see in the password is Artanis, because it's flashing the right letters at me from the bottom clue . I'll work on that.

[Pervinca Took]

Indeed!

1. Lady born where three ways meet, however tortuously.
Rose: She certainly troubled Cupid’s counterpart!
3. Wells girl found a way, through confusion, to reveal her.
4. Secluded lady? Ancient letter reveals her.
5. Eva’s epesse? For her, the simile has not grown stale.
Idril: Sounds like a utopic time for her.
Sinatra (Artanis): Noble lady runs back for Ol’ Blue Eyes.

[Huinesoron]

Well, I can't make head nor tail of the clues themselves (though the 'ancient letter' keeps pointing me at Miriel Th/Serinde for #4, and she could definitely be described as 'secluded'), but with three datapoints, I'm sure it's possible to deduce the password.

There are two words that come to mind as fitting the -R---IS pattern, both names: Artanis and Erendis. However, neither of them seem to fit as a linking theme. It's possible that Erendis could be the password, making a hidden eighth name in the set; I've not been around long enough to know if that would be valid under the rules.

But assuming for a moment that neither Erendis nor Miriel are relevant, what can the three names we do have tell us? Rose Cotton-Gamgee, Artanis, and Idril Celebrindal are all:

• Women (obviously)
• Wives (also obviously)
• Connected to a journey over the Sea (Rose's husband went, the other two made their own - Artanis twice!)
• Known by an epesse - Rosie, Galadriel, and Idril, which isn't her original Quenya name. (Clue #5 could point to this.)
• Resident in isolationist enclaves. I know, that describes half of Middle-earth, but the Shire, Lorien, and Gondolin make a good showing. (Clue #4's 'secluded' could point to this.)
• Related to a resident or guest in Imladris (ie, Sam, Celebrian, and Elrond himself).
• People whose status is in doubt in the evolving Legendarium. Not Rosie Cotton this time, but Meril-i-Turinqi, the Lady of Tol Eressëa, whose name indeed translates to Rose. Does she still exist? How did Artanis reach Middle-earth? Is Idril in Valinor with Tuor, or sleeping in the Tower of Pearl?

... it turns out three datapoints isn't enough to narrow things down in a hyper-connected setting like Middle-earth. Darn.

That '-IS' in the password really bothers me. It's just not a common word-ender in English, so my mind keeps parsing it as Elvish, which almost certainly means a name... but whose (or where's)? Other than Rivendell, there's no-one/where obviously linking Rosie to the other two - the hazard of being a Hobbit, I suppose.

... yeah, I was hoping something would have sprung out at me by this point, but no such luck. Maybe some of my ramblings will help someone else out.

hS

EDIT: They are also, weirdly enough, all credited with seeing the future: obviously Galadriel's mirror and Idril's foresight, but also Rosie's words to Sam: "They said you were dead; but I’ve been expecting you since the Spring." The Spring in question, of course, was when the Ring was destroyed; if not actual foresight, we can at least credit Rosie with an uncanny awareness of distant events... (No, probably not, but you never know!)

[Pervinca Took]

The password is indeed ERENDIS. It couldn't be Artanis, because that is the answer to the final clue, and I don't tend to use an answer twice in one puzzle.

It's only relatively recently that we've had themes every time as well as passwords.

Mine does have a theme too. But it isn't one that you have yet suggested (ingenious though many of your suggestions are!)

Miriel is not the answer to number 4. You might want to consider that the 'straight' part of the clue is not always at the beginning.

Don't forget that the theme may not be spelt out, as with Nerwen's 'Numenor' one. It may be 'silent,' but with all the answers - INCLUDING the password - fitting it.

E: Lady born where three ways meet, however tortuously.
Rose: She certainly troubled Cupid’s counterpart!
E: Wells girl found a way, through confusion, to reveal her.
N: Secluded lady? Ancient letter reveals her.
D: Eva’s epesse? For her, the simile has not grown stale.
Idril: Sounds like a utopic time for her.
Sinatra (Artanis): Noble lady runs back for Ol’ Blue Eyes.

...

As a hint, the theme is proving difficult because of the *order* in which the clues have so far been guessed.