Abduction in Edoras Discussion Thread

[Celuien]

Save will be filled tomorrow. Garstan is quite likely to have noticed Osfrid while he was at the hall. While his interaction with Lèoðern was apparently innocent enough, she and Garmund have certainly reported that they had the conversation, chatty children that they are. That description is now going to put a new spin on his interpretation of the questioning.

[Taralphiel]

I've added a save in too, so I don't get too far behind :P

I ask again, what would be the best time of day? If no-one can answer, I'll put it as afternoon, to take into account the time since Osfrid and Muriel left.

- Tara

[Celuien]

Save filled. I've assumed that Osfrid and Muriel left, but if they should still be at the hall, I'll gladly edit.

And, sorry to be a pain, but Alcarillo, could I request one change to Lèoðern's dialogue?

"Yeah! I went there. The fair was fun."

to
"Yes! I went there. The fair was fun."

[Firefoot]

Concerning Osfrid's and Muriel's whereabouts: Being that they said they were moving right on, they must not be at the Mead Hall; however, they aren't back at Sorn's house, either - that leaves a two Day gap for them... Alcarillo, did you say something about them being able to enjoy the fair as well while they were there? Because that would account for it. There are, after all, other inns beside the Mead Hall that they could have stayed at.

I ask again, what would be the best time of day? If no-one can answer, I'll put it as afternoon, to take into account the time since Osfrid and Muriel left.

Tara, we've taken a time jump of two days, making this the third day since Osfrid and Muriel left. It's in the morning.

[Taralphiel]

Thank you very much for that, Fire! Playing catch-up tends to get a little confusing.

I'll play with my post a little more and put it up.

Also, I thought I'd try to let you know how busy I'll be this week. It's Sunday for me now, and I'll probably be unable to post until Wednesday (workplace exams till then *dies*). So if someone notices Sorn, that's when I'll have time to get back to you

- Tara

[Alcarillo]

Originally Posted by Celuien

And, sorry to be a pain, but Alcarillo, could I request one change to Lèoðern's dialogue?

I've already sent a PM to pio containing the edited post, with both lmp's and your edits. Lmp could've edited the post directly, actually. My post was attatched to one of his in the RPG thread.

I'm a little confused myself about Osfrid's and Muriel's location. Let's see...

Day 1 - O&M arrive, spy, stay night at Mead Hall.
Day 2 - O&M go to the horse fair, begin trip back to Sorn's house.
Day 3 - O&M travel, travel, travel. Should be back at Sorn's house by this day.
Day 4 - Today in the game.

But...if they had spent another night in Edoras (between Days 2 and 3) and spent some time at the fair on Day 3, starting the trip back to Sorn a bit late, they would arrive at Sorn's house on Day 4 instead.

So, I officially agree with Firefoot that Osfrid and Muriel will arrive today, having spent an extra night in Edoras.

[piosenniel]

Alcarillo's edited post is on board.

~*~ Pio

[littlemanpoet]

Here is the latest follow-up on the "Bertwald & Hilda" sub-plot. Please let Foley and me know what you think.

Eodwine reached the gate of Edoras and found Deren with the other guards.

"Greetings, Deren! I hope your thankless chore at the gate has paid you in some bit of news. What know you of this Bertwald and Hilda?" Eodwine smirked. "The wife seems to have mistaken your King's Markings for robbers' crests, if you can believe it! Do you remember the pair?"

"I remember the pair," Deren replied, walking forward. He placed his hand on the horse's shoulder and looked up at Eodwine. "They came through not long ago, just after dark. Said they were on their way to see the woman's dying mother and had to stop here on their way. Why do you ask? Has something come up?"

Eodwine wondered at that: the woman had spoken nothing of a dying mother. Had the man? Eodwien could not remember that he had. It was suspicious. Then again, anything and everything seemed suspicious these days. Eodwine scowled, not liking that he was suspicious first.

"They have come to the Mead Hall seeking shelter for the night. What think you of the pair? Tell me all your mind about them."

“Well, I do not rightly know, sir,” Deren replied. He knit his eyebrows together, wondering if something had happened and asking himself all the while why the Eorl had come all this way to question him on the matter. “This job has made me question everybody, for real and in my mind. I did wonder that they came so late, but I do not suppose we can really hold that against them too much. He spoke strangely, sir, to tell you the truth. All day we had people coming through here and they did not know why they were stopped by guards and most of them didn’t say much. They just answered the questions straight and went on. He. . .well, he talked, but without making his point quite clear. But maybe it was only my imagination.”

Deren scratched his head. He was talking in circles and that certainly would not help in the matter. “I would just keep an eye on him, my lord,” he finished. “If he fails to leave tomorrow morning early, then there would be real cause to worry. He told me that they were only stopping for the night, and when I asked him if he’d be leaving tomorrow morning, he said ‘I imagine so!’ and I let him pass."

"My thanks, Deren. I will watch these two and see if they leave early tomorrow. If we could spare men, maybe we should have them followed. I will give the matter thought. Good night to you!"

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Firefoot's post


Upon his return to the Mead Hall, Eodwine went directly to Haleth and asked him to his own rooms for a talk in private. Once there, Eodwine went straight to the point.

"I know not if you heard Bertwald's own words as to the greeting he and his wife were given at the Gate. I spoke to Deren who was the very guard this Hilda claims to have mistreated her; or I should say, this Bertwald claims that Deren was, shall we say, overzealous. Deren told me that it seemed this Bertwald talked more than need be. That suggests to me that he may be crafting a bed of lies, as they say. I admit that I have no other call to think ill of the man, but these are bad times. So I would ask of you that the couple be watched. Maybe they will lead us to the fiend who has taken Linduial."

Haleth hesitated. Where did one draw the moral line? "In normal times, such would not even be thought on," he answered slowly. "As like as not it is simply an innocent couple staying here the night. Would not watching them be near the same as questioning those nobles on our list simply because they meet our guidelines?" But then what had been the point of guards at the gates of Edoras if Haleth was not going to take their word when someone seemed suspicious? "I would be loath to have them followed in the case that they are innocent people. But if they do not leave the Mead Hall in the morning, then yes, have them watched. If they leave, let them go."

Eodwine was unsure of Haleth's thought, but Haleth was the ruler in this matter. He nodded, "Aye, that is well."

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EDIT

So, lmp I'm supposing you can move Firefott's post to wherever it needs to be moved? (See her post #294 on this thread)

~*~ Pio, helpful, but confused

[Celuien]

Very nice twist.

I'll edit my filled in save later so that Garstan's comments to Torim still make sense, given that he would probably know about what was going on.

Are they still being followed in the current day? Knowing where they're headed could be useful information now that the clear connection to Sorn is in place.

[Firefoot]

Save filled.

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Celuien

Very nice twist.

I'll edit my filled in save later so that Garstan's comments to Torim still make sense, given that he would probably know about what was going on.

Are they still being followed in the current day? Knowing where they're headed could be useful information now that the clear connection to Sorn is in place.

Well, that's a problem. I intend to write a follow-up post in which Eodwine recommends to Haleth that Bertwald and Hilda be watched and followed. In fact, Firefoot, what say you and I PM-build that post? And we can see where it leads? It's going to be perhaps tricky to keep this lead from developing into too much by Day 4 when Torim finally comes forward, but we'll do what we can to not mess with that, right Firefoot?

[Firefoot]

Sounds good to me.

I'm slowly realizing the implications of this though... they're followed, then they don't leave the city like they say... perhaps they somehow manage to lose those following them - do they assume they've left the city? And then they're able to actually leave because out-bound traffic wasn't being so well monitored? Hm...

Or what if Haleth decides not to have them trailed? I'm not sure about reasoning here, but talk about a mistake...

[littlemanpoet]

Haleth saying "no" would be the simplest way to take care of it. I would be fine with that. However, such a decision will no doubt have implications down the road. .... which could be fun. I'll PM you and that'll give you a chance to have Haleth respond as you see fit.

[Firefoot]

Alrighty, this needs to be placed after Folwren's and LMP's post above...

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Firefoot's post


Upon his return to the Mead Hall, Eodwine went directly to Haleth and asked him to his own rooms for a talk in private. Once there, Eodwine went straight to the point.

"I know not if you heard Bertwald's own words as to the greeting he and his wife were given at the Gate. I spoke to Deren who was the very guard this Hilda claims to have mistreated her; or I should say, this Bertwald claims that Deren was, shall we say, overzealous. Deren told me that it seemed this Bertwald talked more than need be. That suggests to me that he may be crafting a bed of lies, as they say. I admit that I have no other call to think ill of the man, but these are bad times. So I would ask of you that the couple be watched. Maybe they will lead us to the fiend who has taken Linduial."

Haleth hesitated. Where did one draw the moral line? "In normal times, such would not even be thought on," he answered slowly. "As like as not it is simply an innocent couple staying here the night. Would not watching them be near the same as questioning those nobles on our list simply because they meet our guidelines?" But then what had been the point of guards at the gates of Edoras if Haleth was not going to take their word when someone seemed suspicious? "I would be loath to have them followed in the case that they are innocent people. But if they do not leave the Mead Hall in the morning, then yes, have them watched. If they leave, let them go."

Eodwine was unsure of Haleth's thought, but Haleth was the ruler in this matter. He nodded, "Aye, that is well."


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EDIT


Hmmm . . . I'm not sure who you're asking to do what or where . . .

So - I did move this post up into lmp's post space above (#288), and then he can put it wherever it's supposed to be.

~*~ Pio, the confused

[littlemanpoet]

I've added the most recent additions to that lengthening post on the main thread. I hope it fits okay with what's needed. Please let me know if it needs anything changed.

[JennyHallu]

Firefoot: I'm editting my last post to change Lin's target with the plate. I reread what I had and decided Lin's irritation demanded a much more direct means of taking out her frustration.

[Firefoot]

I love it.

[Celuien]

Post edited to account for Haleth and Eodwine's planning. Let me know if there's anything that needs changing.

[JennyHallu]

Uh-oh...


I think Lin's food source just went on a vision quest.


I'll update with Torim sometime today, sorry for the delay.

[Anguirel]

And his writer went on holiday...

[JennyHallu]

Happy holiday...

Don't break anything, and don't eat bugs. When shall you be back?

[Anguirel]

In Quite A Long Time. I'd say early September is a goodish estimate.

[Taralphiel]

Happy holiday, Ang!

I've also put a save in.

I'm going to really try to make Sorn...well...unhinged here. I have a feeling all I've done till now was make him evilly self-absorbed, and that's not all THAT terrible (rather irritating, tough! XD). Please tell me if I'm stepping on people's toes, and I'll change my post.

I get the feeling Sorn's demise is coming soon, so hopefully this'll show how much he deserves it

Speaking of which, I haven't thought much of how his story will 'end', nor of how any of the others will fare. Does anyone have any thoughts?

- Tara

[Firefoot]

Speaking of which, I haven't thought much of how his story will 'end', nor of how any of the others will fare. Does anyone have any thoughts?

We kill Linduial, most of the rescue party dies, Scyld kills Sorn, and Scyld becomes supreme ruler of Middle-earth...

What? It could work... maybe... not...

On a more serious note, I really am not sure where Scyld will end up - unusual for me, as I usually have some idea of where my characters are going. Worst case scenario, he ends up fleeing the law, vanishing into the wilds of ME, best (?) case, Jenny (I just called you Linduial... ) has even proposed that he may end up swearing fealty to Linduial. Not sure.

Haleth, I have already pretty much decided is going to die unless there is some reason for it to happen otherwise.

Bigger picture - rescue party shows up at Sorn's estate - I assume they do some questioning... or maybe just arrest him right off from Torim's testimony... fight (?), Linduial rescued - Scyld helps? goes to redeem her things - and meets Sorn... fight between these two? And eventually some sort of trial, I would imagine. At least, that's more or less how I see it playing out, with lots of ?'s. Is this about what the rest of you have had in mind?

Tara, I eagerly await your post.

[littlemanpoet]

Seems to me we're 4 plot days into a three week plot span, and in 2 days (tops) we're likely to be at Sorn's place. How quick or long does the rescue take? Does Sorn flee with Linduial and henchmen to some place where he gets surrounded and there's a besiegement? Or is something else planned? We can't, I suppose, just have Sorn defeated and Linduial saved right away; it doesn't seem to fit in with what we've been writing at the Mead Hall thread. I was thinking that Sorn ought not to die, but he's not my character....

[Celuien]

I like the idea of Sorn's moving into hiding. We've moved toward finding our culprit awfully quickly.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

You could always run into conveniently un-travel-in-able weather, or trip over a kid in the road...

Or you could have one of the horses in your group trip over a woodchuck hole, lame himself, and kill his rider and then have to spend a bit of time... I dunno... bringing him back to Edoras rather than lugging around a dead body?

Then again, something like that would probably mean that only one or two of you would be sent back, not particularly slowing the others down.

*ponders*

What if Sorn were to hear that the Queen had sent a group of rescuers out rather than somebody with a nice fat ransom and feigns a letter from her calling them back due to something important ("The package that you were sent to pick up has been delivered safely." or some such) and sends a message-rider out for them? The rider could disappear once they reached Edoras and the mistake could take a lovely amount of time to sort out...

Say they're riding for a day when they get the message calling them back; that's a day's ride back. Then sorting out the confusion. Then the ride back to Sorn's during which he will have moved Lin?

It's a rough sketch, but it could give you time while adding a nice bit of conflict... Everybody likes a nice bit of conflict...

[Taralphiel]

I can't speak for those in the investigating party, but would it be plausible for Sorn to throw them off the scent?

With Gurth in his current state, I could have Sorn act as the heart-broken brother/father/uncle searching for his family member. The noise in the carriage would be explained to transporting the poor person to his estate.

This would require Anguriel's permission, which is sadly unavailable. But it's a start to some sort of plan.

Does this make sense?

As for Sorn living...I'm not sure of that myself.

- Tara

[littlemanpoet]

Is there some way to revise what has happened already? Such as, could Torim come later? Perhaps a whole week later?

I do like the idea of Sorn throwing the rescuing party off the scent, but it would have to be pretty convincing what with Torim's testimony.

I still think it would be good to have Sorn go into hiding and/or besiegement. The fake letter could be part of his attempt to buy time to go hide.

Bad weather is another option, but again, it would have to be pretty bad.

[Folwren]

Oh, I've just glanced over some of the posts about all this planning and I wanted to put in a word that I would love to see either Sorn killed by one of his own men or brought to trial and executed in Edoras for whatever charges would be brought against him for this crime. It would be terrible if he escaped!

To stretch the time out. . .well, is it absolutely necessary? I can't see leaving Lin there for two or three weeks. That seems like a long time. And how long did Sorn say he would let her live before the ransom was paid?

But, actually, that fake letter sounds like a fun twist, and it would give him a chance to escape to some hiding place, in which case, they would once again be delayed in finding him. Think, though, everybody - at that point, now that he knows they don't intend to pay ransom - what is keeping him from just killing her or doing something bad? Will he send another letter saying - 'I've heard about your rescue party. If you don't change your mind and get the ransom to me, you and especially the Lady Linduial will be sorry.'

Anyway, those are just my two cents worth of thoughts.

-- Folwren

[Taralphiel]

I would love to see either Sorn killed by one of his own men or brought to trial and executed in Edoras for whatever charges would be brought against him for this crime. It would be terrible if he escaped!

I prefer the former very much. If Sorn were imprisoned, he would...do something drastic, if you follow me.

Sorn being betrayed by one of his men (one or two stand out in particular *wink*) seems very fitting.

My post will be up soon.

- Tara

[JennyHallu]

Sorry-just catching up on my reading. Our power was out both Saturday and Sunday so...no internet.

[JennyHallu]

Caught up...

I don't think I could make Torim wait any longer. As long as I wait with Torim, there is almost nothing to do for half the party.

I also don't think that hiding behind the story of Gurth being the person in the wagon would work, as Torim saw Lin being pulled out of the wagon.

But I like the idea of Sorn catching wind of the discovery, for whatever reason, and running. Whether to a place where there might be a seige, or instigating a cross-country chase, that could both prolong a story line I perhaps over-estimated, and add an element of adventure that is taking a long time in developing.

The question, of course, is why does he not murder Lin as soon as he realizes no ransom is forthcoming?

Well, I think current events have shown that terrorists do not necessarily kill their captives when it becomes apparent their demands will not be met. Often they do, but that young American journalist was released and reunited with her family.

I think Lin's saving grace might actually be that Sorn is insane: he cannot be expected to act logically.

[Taralphiel]

Unfortunately, while running seems to be what is favoured, I really can't imagine Sorn doing that. He'd sooner end Lin's life on principle...and possibly even his own. Like you say, Jenny, he's insane

So, what other options do we have? I'm mulling over it, but any suggestions are very much appreciated.

- Tara

[JennyHallu]

What if he had some sort of hidey-hole planned from the beginning? Just throwing things out there...I'm a little lost as for ideas.

[littlemanpoet]

Or if the Sorn plot winds down before three weeks are up, could Scyld sort of take Linduial into his own hands and try for the ransom Sorn wanted?

[Folwren]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Or if the Sorn plot winds down before three weeks are up, could Scyld sort of take Linduial into his own hands and try for the ransom Sorn wanted?

Oh, poor Skyld!! I would feel SO sorry for him if he did that!

-- Folwren

[Firefoot]

I don't think Scyld would. He's pretty much figured out by now (even if he won't admit it) that his best bet is going to be to throw his lot in with Linduial. He's also smart enough to know that if ransom money hasn't come yet, it won't. He and Linduial had worked that out (if rather uncoopertively ) in the first days.

I'm playing over scenarios in my mind, and nothing's fitting. I don't even know where Scyld would go with Lindiual if he did run away with her (say, because Sorn wants to kill her after hearing of the rescue party - except I think Scyld would be more likely to just kill Sorn than run away); he doesn't have a home somewhere, he can't go to Edoras and or Dol Amroth and Minas Tirith wouldn't be too hot of an idea either. He's not exactly the sort to go hiking up into the mountains. Bree? That seems about as likely a destination as any, I suppose.

But I really don't know what would happen if Sorn were to end up dead before the rescue party got there. That would be a really weird position for Scyld - what's he supposed to do with Linduial? Just letting her go won't seem just right, but he's not going to run off with her either. And when the rescue party gets there - "oh yeah, she's down in the cellar, let me get her for you"? I don't know. This would be rather anticlimactic however you look at it - Scyld isn't so dumb to fight a whole rescue party, and he wouldn't have any good reason to hold Linduial against them.

I don't know. Unless some of this sparks an idea?

[JennyHallu]

FACTS:

1. There is no reason to continue to delay the rescue attempt. They know it's Sorn.
2. Sorn is loopy. Criminally insane. Has evil monologues.
3. No one trusts Sorn, even his own men.
4. We seem to be completely forgetting Osfrid and Muriel. Alcarillo, where do you stand with those characters, and what do you have planned for them?
5. Scyld trusts no one, including Linduial. He is aware his best chance is with her, but does not trust her offer.

[Folwren]

Firefoot - why can't Skyld go to Edoras? It would do him tons of good to just go and own up. They might even have mercy on him if he delivers Lin.