Riddles in the Downs - Page 72 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

Yeah, but he didn't hate her.

I know, that's why I said it was "neither here nor there".

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 08:27 AM

None of the solutions I can come up with fit all of the lines, though I am curious to see who this is. (For instance, Gollum wasn't slain, Feanor didn't have mixed blood etc.)

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 08:47 AM

You'll just have to keep looking, won't you?

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 09:01 AM

Yeah, but that'd take forever.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 09:13 AM

So this character hated someone, someone else attempted to kill them, they were saved by the person they hated from the person who tried to kill them, and then they were slain by someone who was loyal.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 09:14 AM

Why does this still give me CoH vibe.....?

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 09:22 AM

Maybe Frodo? Briefly, he relied on Gollum and pushed Sam away, and as Lobelia pointed out, he's half-Baggins, half-Brandybuck.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 09:40 AM

Except that he wasn't slain.....

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 09:41 AM

Anyone else willing to take a shot at this?

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 09:50 AM

Quote:

So this character hated someone, someone else attempted to kill them, they were saved by the person they hated from the person who tried to kill them, and then they were slain by someone who was loyal.

Pretty much, except that there are subtler ways of "undoing" someone...

Quote:

Why does this still give me CoH vibe.....?

Well, probably because it resembles various things from CoH- but they didn't all apply to the same person. (So no, not that.)

Hints:

Line 1 is completely accurate, but also not, I think, something people particularly associate with this character. It serves mainly to rule out candidates, as you've found.

You might want to look at your question, "Who would be saved by someone they hated?" another way round.

The last bit is important, though again it's something you might well have forgotten. In-story, however, the incident was considered worth writing a line or two of verse about- I've basically paraphrased this, in fact.

Finally, I assure you the speaker is a major character and not Bilbo's fourth cousin's mother-in-law or anything like that.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 09:58 AM

So the question is 'who would hate someone they've saved', right?

And 'undoing someone' could also mean steering them the wrong path/corrupting them.

Maybe Gwindor 'I rue the day I stole you from Orcs' son of Guilin?

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 10:03 AM

Where does it say this person hated the speaker?

But yes to your second observation.

Not Gwindor, though.

Re-posting for a new page:

Blood of two peoples made me.
He I trusted tried to undo me.
He that I hated saved me.
He that was loyal slew me.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Where does it say this person hated the speaker?

Re-posting for a new page:

Blood of two peoples made me.
He I trusted tried to undo me.
He that I hated saved me.
He that was loyal slew me.

There

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

He that I hated saved me.

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 10:06 AM

"I hated him" != "He hated me".

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 10:10 AM

So the speaker hated by someone that didn't hate them, and yet none of my guesses are correct?

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 10:12 AM

Oh, I see. Answer incoming, I hope.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 10:14 AM

Gender confirmed. Time to end this.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 10:17 AM

Theoden.

Blood of two peoples made me - Blood of Rohan and Lossarnach
He I trusted tried to undo me. - Grima
He that I hated saved me. - Gandalf
He that was loyal slew me. - Snowmane

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 11:02 AM

Am I right?

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 11:17 AM

The King of the Golden Hall it is! Well done!

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 11:19 AM

Sorry for keeping you in suspense- I had to attend to some things.

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 11:38 AM

Let me change it up a little.

You want to escape from us, but beware
Of things that came to light
Of us who caught you unaware
We won't let you run into the night

Nerwen · 06-12-2019, 08:51 PM

Thinking aloud. First and second lines seem pretty general... but the middle ones are interesting. Who was "caught unaware"? Does it mean "ambushed"? While sleeping?

Urwen · 06-12-2019, 11:03 PM

No. I am merely being sneaky.

Pervinca Took · 06-13-2019, 01:21 AM

Shelob's eyes?

Urwen · 06-13-2019, 03:00 AM

Nope, why would I make a riddle about that?

It describes one of my favorite moments.

Nerwen · 06-13-2019, 04:09 AM

Is it Túrin's Orc captors? "Things that came to light" might be a reference to the flash of lightning that revealed Beleg's dead face to him.

Pervinca Took · 06-13-2019, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

Nope, why would I make a riddle about that?

It describes one of my favorite moments.

Well, why would anyone make a riddle about anything?

Urwen · 06-13-2019, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Is it Túrin's Orc captors? "Things that came to light" might be a reference to the flash of lightning that revealed Beleg's dead face to him.

And how and when did they catch him unaware? He was quite aware of them the whole time.

Nerwen · 06-13-2019, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

And how and when did they catch him unaware? He was quite aware of them the whole time.

Quote:

“Thus was Bar-en-Danwedh betrayed, for the Orcs came upon it by night at unawares, guided by Mîm.”

That's what I thought you might mean- but apparently not.

Think... think... who else is Urwen obsessed with...?

Urwen · 06-13-2019, 01:17 PM

Except they did let him 'run into the night'.

And you do have the complete list of my favorites, thanks to one of my passwords.

Nerwen · 06-14-2019, 08:45 AM

Faramir to Gollum, then?

Urwen · 06-14-2019, 09:46 AM

No.

Hint: Think about the riddle. Think about ALL of the meanings each of the lines can have.

Urwen · 06-15-2019, 07:59 AM

One more hint: This riddle more or less paraphrases the events that occurred in a very specific chapter of a very specific book of a very specific trilogy.

Pervinca Took · 06-15-2019, 09:34 AM

A Conspiracy Unmasked?

Urwen · 06-15-2019, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took

A Conspiracy Unmasked?

Now you just need to say the answer.

Pervinca Took · 06-15-2019, 11:58 AM

I thought I had ....

Urwen · 06-15-2019, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took

I thought I had ....

Well, yeah, technically......

Urwen · 06-15-2019, 12:08 PM

You know what? Have at it. You let me make it by your goodwill, so I'll do the same.

Pervinca Took · 06-16-2019, 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

Let me change it up a little.

You want to escape from us, but beware
Of things that came to light
Of us who caught you unaware
We won't let you run into the night

Escape from us - from Merry and Pippin (and Fatty) - to face the dangers alone and not risk their lives.

Things that came to light - Merry once saw Bilbo use the Ring. Could refer to other things too, though, like the things Sam has reported.

Caught you unaware - Muttering 'Shall I ever look down that valley again' and things like that. Plus Frodo was taken unaware in that they already knew he wasn't just settling down at Crickhollow.

We won't let you run into the night - Night as a metaphor for danger; run as a metaphor for facing it recklessly and alone.

Is that better?

I had thought it obvious once solved, but actually, you're right. It's only fair, after all, to explain how the parts of a riddle work when someone has gone to the effort of making one.

Furthermore, it was probably only obvious to me because Frodo is my favourite character, (in literature, not just in Tolkien), so I know the parts of the book with him in extremely well. Which begs the question: why did I think of Shelob's eyes first? Well, that's another part of Frodo's story, so I guess that's why.

The last line doesn't work as well for that solution, though. Shelob *wants* him to run into the night. (The metaphor here would be her larder).

Which reminds me ... why has no-one made me a Frodo password like your Maeglin and Huey's Telperien?

06-12-2019, 08:27 AM	#2842
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	None of the solutions I can come up with fit all of the lines, though I am curious to see who this is. (For instance, Gollum wasn't slain, Feanor didn't have mixed blood etc.) __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 08:47 AM	#2843
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	You'll just have to keep looking, won't you? __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-12-2019, 09:01 AM	#2844
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Yeah, but that'd take forever. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 09:13 AM	#2845
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	So this character hated someone, someone else attempted to kill them, they were saved by the person they hated from the person who tried to kill them, and then they were slain by someone who was loyal. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 09:14 AM	#2846
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Why does this still give me CoH vibe.....? __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 09:22 AM	#2847
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Maybe Frodo? Briefly, he relied on Gollum and pushed Sam away, and as Lobelia pointed out, he's half-Baggins, half-Brandybuck. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. Last edited by Urwen; 06-12-2019 at 09:40 AM.

06-12-2019, 09:40 AM	#2848
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Except that he wasn't slain..... __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 09:41 AM	#2849
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Anyone else willing to take a shot at this? __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 09:58 AM	#2851
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	So the question is 'who would hate someone they've saved', right? And 'undoing someone' could also mean steering them the wrong path/corrupting them. Maybe Gwindor 'I rue the day I stole you from Orcs' son of Guilin? __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 10:03 AM	#2852
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Where does it say this person hated the speaker? But yes to your second observation. Not Gwindor, though. Re-posting for a new page: Blood of two peoples made me. He I trusted tried to undo me. He that I hated saved me. He that was loyal slew me. __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-12-2019, 10:06 AM	#2854
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	"I hated him" != "He hated me". __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-12-2019, 10:10 AM	#2855
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	So the speaker hated by someone that didn't hate them, and yet none of my guesses are correct? __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 10:12 AM	#2856
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Oh, I see. Answer incoming, I hope. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 10:14 AM	#2857
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Gender confirmed. Time to end this. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 10:17 AM	#2858
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Theoden. Blood of two peoples made me - Blood of Rohan and Lossarnach He I trusted tried to undo me. - Grima He that I hated saved me. - Gandalf He that was loyal slew me. - Snowmane __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 11:02 AM	#2859
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Am I right? __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 11:17 AM	#2860
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	The King of the Golden Hall it is! Well done! __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-12-2019, 11:19 AM	#2861
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Sorry for keeping you in suspense- I had to attend to some things. __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-12-2019, 11:38 AM	#2862
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Well then Let me change it up a little. You want to escape from us, but beware Of things that came to light Of us who caught you unaware We won't let you run into the night __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-12-2019, 08:51 PM	#2863
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Thinking aloud. First and second lines seem pretty general... but the middle ones are interesting. Who was "caught unaware"? Does it mean "ambushed"? While sleeping? __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-12-2019, 11:03 PM	#2864
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	No. I am merely being sneaky. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-13-2019, 01:21 AM	#2865
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	Shelob's eyes? __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

06-13-2019, 03:00 AM	#2866
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Nope, why would I make a riddle about that? It describes one of my favorite moments. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-13-2019, 04:09 AM	#2867
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Is it Túrin's Orc captors? "Things that came to light" might be a reference to the flash of lightning that revealed Beleg's dead face to him. __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-13-2019, 01:17 PM	#2871
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	Except they did let him 'run into the night'. And you do have the complete list of my favorites, thanks to one of my passwords. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-14-2019, 08:45 AM	#2872
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Faramir to Gollum, then? __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.

06-14-2019, 09:46 AM	#2873
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	No. Hint: Think about the riddle. Think about ALL of the meanings each of the lines can have. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-15-2019, 07:59 AM	#2874
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	One more hint: This riddle more or less paraphrases the events that occurred in a very specific chapter of a very specific book of a very specific trilogy. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

06-15-2019, 09:34 AM	#2875
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	A Conspiracy Unmasked? __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

06-15-2019, 11:58 AM	#2877
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	I thought I had .... __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

06-15-2019, 12:08 PM	#2879
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,388	You know what? Have at it. You let me make it by your goodwill, so I'll do the same. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.