WWLXII: Dead Men Do Tell Tales

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Rikae

It doesn''t seem likely an assassin would just drop out, though, so - wasted vote.

Yes. I think Brinn hadn't noticed you had retracted already...

Well, you others need to see we don't lynch Mira toDay as she will be dead anyway.

[Inziladun]

Well Me Hearties, I've finished me work n' now've had some time t' read over n' make some notes n' offer some thoughts.
I'm not wild abou' votin' Shasta. I've not seen wha' others are on abou' w' his jokin' aroun' n' sayin' double lychin' Greenie oughta be discussed, then defendin' hisself when called on it. Maybe a cobbler, mind, bu' I'm thinkin' too obvious t' be a baddie. He be votin' for Rikae, but maybe just out a' revenge.

Gwath's vote do be a throwaway, n' I think he's one t' watch, but I'm not certain if he ought t' walk th' plank t'day.

Kath be makin' a good list, and makin' some sense ('n not just cos I'm in her good books just now ) Th' Annu vote looks t' be solid.

Rikae indeed seemed t' be pushin' agin' Shasta mighty hard, 'n like I said I thought it w'out merit. Has calmed a bit since (only after some folks reacted to it?), bu' I'm still not easy abou' her.

Eomer really be worryin'. He voted Mira twice w' no real reason either time, 'n has mostly seemed t' be layin' low.

Annu is a bit puzzlin'. I know how newbies be c'n give th' wrong impressions while bein' innocent (from personal experience), but seems t' latch onta th' Shasta cause right quick.

Izzy be anoth'r puzzle. Not sure wha' t' think.

Wilwa be votin' Ëonwë. Not really explained, n' seemed a bit forced.

Back 'n a bit fer th' vote.

[Nerwen]

I be back, shipmates. I'll be speakin' to ye again when I ha' had time to pick up th' talk o' th' day.

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

But you are during the Night if she does not get lynched? Or not?

That's an issue I'm currently debating. I've always hated modfiring as its unfair to all the other players and I really hate to be so quick to modfire someone considering the circumstances why she cannot play (as I know how much it sucks to have computer issues), especially if she manages to regain computer access before the end of toMorrow (though unfortunately Nienna made it sound like that wasn't likely). She won't be modfired at the end of the Day, but at the end of the Night at the earliest. I might be willing her one more Day tops, and if she doesn't show up and vote after then, I'd definitely modfire her immediately following...though I haven't decided yet.

[Boromir88]

Well, you others need to see we don't lynch Mira toDay as she will be dead anyway.~Nogrod

I'm afraid it's not so clear cut sir. You be right, we are automatically losing Mira, and if we lynch someone different, that would really essentially like having a double lynch, a double lynch that could turn out disastrous.

Plus, Izzy showed, up but I would still like to know that she's here, because if she doesn't vote she be gone too.

[Rikae]

I wonder if th' whole 'isterical womin thing - th' "intense" n' "over-the-top" tone folks seem t' read into me posts would 'ave been there if I''d orig'nally signed up t' th' 'downs pretendin' I was a fella. Just sayin'.

Because I really don't enjoy being accused of a tone I'm not using. That's all.

[Boromir88]

My last post crossed with Brinn...apparently it's not a done deal then?

In that case it might be even more beneficial to make Mira go ghostly. I mean we won't know her role, but if she's having computer issues, she won't be posting as a ghost anyway, we won't have to worry about her role anymore (even if it only is for an extra day), and we would spare our Cap'n from having to mod-fire someone.

[Inziladun]

I be seein' no reason t' waste a lynch on Mira. Tis pointless. It do appear th'a she be gone, either fer good or at least fer a day or two. Either way, we c'n afford t' wait n' see on her.

x'd with Boro 'n Rikae

[Nogrod]

Okay. I saw this one when trying to leave the thread...

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Still it might be a good option to stay with Mira...based on the request to be mod-fired, it's likely she's innocent who's run into computer issues (although she could very well be a mutineer). We're apparently going to lose her anyway (and I'm assuming we'd get her role too...?), if we vote to lynch someone else, we run the risk of lynching an innocent (but of course concede the chance of getting a baddie), plus losing Mira. At this point, it might be good to keep the deaths down, and let the mutineers make their selection at night, which would presumably, with a successful kill, give us another innocent.

We run a risk of lynching an innocent everytime we lynch someone Boro! You should know that. But lynching is the only way to get rid of the baddies. So you say we lynch a possible innocent who - even if a mutineer - would die anyway? Huh-huh.

And hoping for a succesfull kill? They'll have enough of them during this game. And they will make their selections. Okay, you talk of the ratio between the lynched and the night- killed, right. Sadly of those lynched/killed we have no guarantee how much will they take part in the game after they're dead so I'm not too sure that idea is as good as you make it look like.

And the mutineer selections are always selections between non-mutineers while our lynches always have the mutineers at the stake as well!

And where did you get that assumption that Mira's role would be for some reason revealed if she was modfired? It would be against the mod-goddesses principal that deaths will not be revealed.

Originally Posted by Boro

The good news is, whether Nogrod is lynched or not, we won't know his role, but he will be a ghost and can still participate if he so chooses, and that can tell us more about him.

So let's lynch Nogrod? See what I said about the mutineers wishing to do at the previous page: some should be lynched to keep people insecure about their status? Didn't you Boro just say you'd like to let the mutineers do the choices, why you'd wish otherwise with me?

Originally Posted by Boro

Does any of that make sense?

Yes and no. If you're a mutineer or a cobbler that makes perfect sense and becoming quite daring... timing and all. If you're not you're loosing your grip .

But let's discuss that later (dead or alive). Now to bed at last.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Rikae

I wonder if th' whole 'isterical womin thing - th' "intense" n' "over-the-top" tone folks seem t' read into me posts would 'ave been there if I''d orig'nally signed up t' th' 'downs pretendin' I was a fella. Just sayin'.

Because I really don't enjoy being accused of a tone I'm not using. That's all.

Tha's not wh' I was sayin'. I jus' thought y' blew up a small thing into a big 'un.

[Rikae]

At th' risk o' somebody thinkin' I'm gettin' uppity fer havin' an opinion:

I seen this here problem on another ship once: one pirate was goin' overboard, an' th' mutineers were th' ones arguin' that we should lynch somebody else, too. I tried t' convince th' crew that we'd give ourselves one more day by lynchin' th' doomed one - one more day for findin' th' mutineers.

So, although I complained 'bout wastin' my vote, maybe it ain't wasted after all. Ef we have two deaths t'day (or t'night) that's a day we lose, an' later on we'll know more an' choose better (even statistically). So mebbe we'd best lynch Mira after all.

Yes, Nog, we'll only win this by lynchin', but only by lynchin' th' right people. Now it's still very much a shot in th' dark, but later, th' odds and our knowledge will be better - usin' the lnch on Mira t'day saves us an extra day at t' end o' th' game, when we can make our lynch count.

[Boromir88]

So let's lynch Nogrod? See what I said about the mutineers wishing to do at the previous page: some should be lynched to keep people insecure about their status? Didn't you Boro just say you'd like to let the mutineers do the choices, why you'd wish otherwise with me?~Nogrod

If you're a mutineer yes...

I'm not sure what your point is, I'm considering the options...

Should it be Mira, to avoid losing 2-people?

Should it be Nogrod, who I have only a gut feeling is a mutineer based on behavior and the end of Day 1 voting.

Should it be Rikae, who I have a theory is a co-conspirator, based on all the mixed and twisted words?

Should it be Shasta whose vote I took as a challenge?

Why are you acting like I'm speaking in absolutes with regards to you?

Edit: crossed with Rikae...exactly! (and I'm sure this is going to be taken as we're working together, but who cares? I don't, sorry.)

[Gwathagor]

I be takin' a second shot at that thar Shasta-Rikae-Annu-Kath tussle (was thar anyone else involved that I be missin'?). It's the sort of spot I'd be expectin' to find a mutineer.

As far as I be able to navigate it, Rikae's initial challenge to Shasta's "pros and cons of lynching LG" post be seemin' pretty rational and tame, especially when it be comparrrred to Shasta's initial defense, which be strikin' my flint as awrful abrupt - particularly if you be considerin' that Shasta proceeds to get into it with Rikae, while if anyone had twisted Shasta's words, it was Annu. Annu probably be lookin' the worst of the gang of 'em - s/he latches onto Rikae's post like a crab onto a fish and then be takin' it a league or two farther, and then goin' on to vote Shasta in his/her second post. Now that looks suspicious, if you be askin' this honest seaman's opinion - a far sight more suspicious 'n Shasta, Rikae, or Kath. Kath doesn't do much - she just be mentionin' that Rikae's twistin' Shasta's words, which I be disagreein' with, although I think I be seein' how it could seem that way. I do think she is attributin' motives, at least at first, and reading into Shasta's remarks - but she takes a less negative stance toward our first mate later on, which, to my spyglass, makes her looks awrful reasonable. Based on the exchange, I be thinkin' that Shasta's an innocent experiencin' a case o' righteous indignation (rare enough in these parts), that Rikae's a shrewd innocent, and that Annu's either a lazy son of gun or a black-hearted, opportunistic, privateerin' mutineer. Kath could be goin' either way, hard to tell from her brief involvement. Regardin' Annu, I'm leanin' towards guilty. Sure, Annu admits that his/her reasons are weak, but I be thinkin' they're weaker than s/he be admittin'.

[Gwathagor]

Originally Posted by Rikae

I wonder if th' whole 'isterical womin thing - th' "intense" n' "over-the-top" tone folks seem t' read into me posts would 'ave been there if I''d orig'nally signed up t' th' 'downs pretendin' I was a fella. Just sayin'.

Because I really don't enjoy being accused of a tone I'm not using. That's all.

For all it be worth, I don't think your tone's been particularly intense or anythin'. I warn't meanin' to sound like I was sayin' so. Sorry!

[Macalaure]

Almost known innocent:
Nerwen

Fairly good feeling:
Rikae
Boro

Not sure, but tend to trust:
Sally
Kath
Mith

Simply no idea:
Wilwa
Mirandir
Isabellkya
Eonwe

A bit doubtful about:
Inziladun (can't put my finger on it, but some vague bad feeling)
Shasta (might be conspirator)
Annu (see Inzy)
Gwath (can't put him anywhere, which makes me nervous in his case)
Nogrod (can't shake it off)

Suspicious:
Eomer (more confused about him than really suspicious, but I have no one better...)

++Eomer

I admit, though, that voting with Nogrod gives me a bit of a toothache...

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by Boromir

In that case it might be even more beneficial to make Mira go ghostly. I mean we won't know her role, but if she's having computer issues, she won't be posting as a ghost anyway, we won't have to worry about her role anymore (even if it only is for an extra day), and we would spare our Cap'n from having to mod-fire someone.

Yeah, I don't think I'd reveal her role anyway since that would defeat my purpose of the game. All players have to be killed twice to have their role revealed, regardless of cause of death. Though thinking about it, mod-fire isn't quite as bad as it usually is since Mira could still participate if she ever returns, so I'm not completely cutting her out of the game. Though like any other mod-fire, it still does affect the innocent: baddie ratio.

Anyway, as of this moment Mira is still in the game. Once deadline hits, I'll give a final decision about mod-firing her.

[Gwathagor]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Suspicious:
Eomer (more confused about him than really suspicious, but I have no one better...)

++Eomer

I admit, though, that voting with Nogrod gives me a bit of a toothache...

Care to explain? Where be all this suspicion of Eomer spewin' from? I've been feelin' stupid not knowin' why Eomer is supposed to be suspicious. What has he done, even?

[Boromir88]

++Mira

I'm being ultra conservative on this ship, so sue me...voting for someone who's very doubtful to return, we avoid essentially what would be a double lynching if we chose someone else, which means we get an extra day. Also we won't have to spend another day thinking about should we lynch Mira, or let her go, also who's to say she's not a mutineer?

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

Care to explain? Where be all this suspicion of Eomer spewin' from? I've been feelin' stupid not knowin' why Eomer is supposed to be suspicious. What has he done, even?

I'm not easy abou' him because 'o his two Mira votes w/ no explanation.

[Rikae]

Thanks, Gwath.

An' ever'body give some thought t' votin' Mira, like I said. An' Mac, I'd like t' know why ye be votin' fer Eomer, too.

[Gwathagor]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

++Mira

I'm being ultra conservative on this ship, so sue me...voting for someone who's very doubtful to return, we avoid essentially what would be a double lynching if we chose someone else, which means we get an extra day. Also we won't have to spend another day thinking about should we lynch Mira, or let her go, also who's to say she's not a mutineer?

Well now, Boro matey.

I was thinkin' on votin' for Annu, but now you've made realize that lynchin' Mira would buy us another day, at any rate. And there is always the off-chance that she could be a mutineer or a co-conspirator.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

Care to explain? Where be all this suspicion of Eomer spewin' from? I've been feelin' stupid not knowin' why Eomer is supposed to be suspicious. What has he done, even?

He pops in, votes for Mira two days in a row and goes, I can see the suspicious reasons.

But, for me, I interpret it as Eomer being a bored ordinary. Usually with any type of special role (good or evil) Eomer is in the thick of the action...he's always confusing of course, and you always wonder what he's up to, but he's always right there, if you know what I mean.

[Isabellkya]

Are you trying to find out how many people can be gotten rid of in one day Boro? *insert one eyebrow raise*

I've no intention of making a record stat anytime soon.


Why do you think those two are baddies Shasta?


Rikae, I think if you'd signed up as a guy - it would be called "dueling".


Voting alongside one of your suspects Mac?

I think Eomer has only posted song-like posts.


X'd since #258.
Edit2. Took out a rogue i.

[Boromir88]

I was thinkin' on votin' for Annu, but now you've made realize that lynchin' Mira would buy us another day, at any rate. And there is always the off-chance that she could be a mutineer or a co-conspirator.~Gwath

Hmm...I'm actually going to go and look at Annu, I admit to just scanning his posts so far and didn't realize he was also involved in the 'word twisting' earlier...

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Thanks, Gwath.

An' ever'body give some thought t' votin' Mira, like I said. An' Mac, I'd like t' know why ye be votin' fer Eomer, too.

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

Well now, Boro matey.

I was thinkin' on votin' for Annu, but now you've made realize that lynchin' Mira would buy us another day, at any rate. And there is always the off-chance that she could be a mutineer or a co-conspirator.

Sorry fer bein' a poor addled pilot, but I jus' don't see th' point 'a goin' fer Mira. What's she done, anyway? Buys us another day? 'N meanwhile th' baddies get another un' of us toNight.

[Inziladun]

Vote must be now.

++ Annu

[Isabellkya]

Nerwen -> Zil
Mith -> Nog
Annu -> Shasta
Rikae -> Shasta 2
Kath -> Annu
Eomer -> Mira
Shata -> Rikae
Wilwa -> Eonwe
Rikae -- Shasta
-> Mira 2
Nog -> Eomer
Mac -> Eomer 2
Boro -> Mira 3
Zil -> Annu 2


Mira 3. Annu, Eomer, Shasta 2. Zil, Rikae, Nog 1.

[Gwathagor]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Sorry fer bein' a poor addled pilot, but I jus' don't see th' point 'a goin' fer Mira. What's she done, anyway? Buys us another day? 'N meanwhile th' baddies get another un' of us toNight.

Seriously, matey, what be the odds that we're gonna get us a mutineer today? If Mira's going to be modfired anyway, then why risk lynchin' two innocents by votin' for Eomer or Annu or whoever? (Though I be ponderin' votin' for the latter meself.) That's the point.

[Isabellkya]

Right now I'm debating between Sally, Nog, and Mac.

Sally - For her voting of Shasta yesterDay after saying it wouldn't be a good idea.

Nog - Because it isn't his usual self. When ever I see him as his usual self, he is on the innocent side. So mostly feeling of his behaviour thus far.

Mac - Because his voting is... a bit whack, and looks like bandwagon votes. Voting alongside a seemginly top suspect of yours, even though it gives you a toothache?


X'd with Gwath.

[Macalaure]

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.

I voted for Eomer because, looking at his two vote-posts, I have a hard time imagining him innocent. I do think he's more likely a conspirator than a mutineer, but if I have a choice between lynching a conspirator and shooting into the dark, I do the former.

Originally Posted by Boro

But, for me, I interpret it as Eomer being a bored ordinary.

I've heard that kind of reasoning before. Being an ordo isn't always fun. But if one is bored, then one can simply stir up the pot (I, for example, enjoy acting somewhat suspicious when ordinary and bored). Just making less than a handful of posts in two days means either that the person is up to no good or that the person has maybe played a game too much. No offense to anybody, seriously, but if you're not motivated to play if you're an ordo, then you shouldn't play - because chances are you will be one (about 55%, to be more precise ).

[Boromir88]

Are you trying to find out how many people can be gotten rid of in one day Boro? *insert one eyebrow raise*~Izzy

hehe, just wonderin' if you would be joining us on the ship this stormy evening. (well it's been storm out on my part of the ship!)

Sorry fer bein' a poor addled pilot, but I jus' don't see th' point 'a goin' fer Mira. What's she done, anyway? Buys us another day? 'N meanwhile th' baddies get another un' of us toNight.~Inziladun

I don't know if you have been on a boat where double-lynches were allowed during the day. It's where two people can get lynched if they are tied in votes, and those mostly turn out bad, because wolves happen to love double lynches, they take out two people in one day, thus shortening the total days they need for victory.

Since we are already pretty much guaranteed to lose Mira, whether it be tonight, or tomorrow, if we chose someone else, that would virtually be like a double-lynching...am I wrong? Mira hasn't done anything wrong, her computer is just evil, but that doesn't change the fact that she can't be here and could be killed off anyway. And whether we decide to lynch Mira or someone else, the wolves will get a kill choice...which means we risk losing 3 people in one day, not good.

Maybe Mira is a wolf...maybe we chose someone else and he/she is a wolf. Who knows? But I would rather keep the death numbers down at this point, so we don't have a double-lynching (by double-lynching I mean losing Mira to mod-fire and lynching whoever else is decided) and thus getting an extra day.

[Gwathagor]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.

Aye, aye, that's true, thar be no denin' it. I reckon you be feelin' pretty confident about your vote, then?

[Boromir88]

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.~Mira

Why so sure about Mira's role? She could be a mutineer just as like as she could be innocent. Just because someone's computer crashed doesn't mean she is all of a suddenly innocent.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by wilwarin538

So I am inclined to believe Greenie, and therefore trust Nerwen (though she could still be a cobbler right?). But it could help us to kill her a second time cause then we'd either see she is the spy and have a known innocent in Nerwen, or see that she is a cobbler and get rid of a baddie who's oppinion can't sway us negatively any longer. But it may also be a good idea to keep that as an option for when we're more desperate for information.

Aye, I'd be leavin' it fer later, lass. Be different if she ha' an aggressor for us.

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

You speak for the rest of the crew now, do you? If I "slipped up" by asking a question, then please, by all means lynch me for showing curiosity.

No one's asked me, but I'll avoid Rikae and her attempt to distract me and say it anyway; while I don't at all advocate mass double-lynching, I think in this case, with Greenie claiming to be our Spy, it could be a good idea. If she is the Spy, she can't help us with her role any more, and either way we get information on Nerwen.

Shark Tooth be still a'carryin' on wi' his pecul'ar lay o' double-killin' th' powder-monkey. He be gettin' main agitated too.

So be th' Cabin Boy:

Originally Posted by Rikae

I wonder if th' whole 'isterical womin thing - th' "intense" n' "over-the-top" tone folks seem t' read into me posts would 'ave been there if I''d orig'nally signed up t' th' 'downs pretendin' I was a fella. Just sayin'.

Ease off a point! Who be accusin' of ye?

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Arrrr, ye be close to a known innocent at this point, so, if ye say so, I will let him be for now, although he literally begs for me vote.

Nay, ye'd best be makin' up yer own mind. I ha' no special knowledge o' yon gunner's role, remember. I were but sayin' that his confusion 'bout yer "confessin'" seemed to ha' nowt in't to me.

EDIT:X'd wi' a host.

[Gwathagor]

Well, I be votin' now. I'm awrful suspicious of Annu, but I'm gonna put it off until tomorrer, so:

++Mira

[Isabellkya]

++ Mac

I've got to vote now.
He feels the foulest of the three, for previously stated reasons.

X'd with Gwath.

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Boro

Why so sure about Mira's role?

I'm not. As you can see from my list up there, I don't know about her at all. But she will most probably be modfired, so she will be dead anyway. Why waste the lynch opportunity?

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

I happen to be with Nogrod about Mira. We can only lynch mutineers if we try to. Lynching Mira will cost us one opportunity to do that.

Mac, you should know better. We'd still have the opportunity, and when we could better use it (sorry, too tired for attempting pirate speak).

If we lose 2 people today (or 3 today/tonight) instead of 1 (or 2), if we're lucky, we're getting rid of an aggressor, but if we're not - we're losing two innocents. We're already probably losing one (because an aggressor would be less likely to quit).

If we lose 2 innocents in a day, that's one less day until the aggressors can win - and our odds of lynching one of them get better later in the game. Think about it - it just doesn't make sense to have 2 deaths on Day 2, when we're basically clueless, and lose the possibility of a day n that we might need.

[Boromir88]

I'm not. As you can see from my list up there, I don't know about her at all. But she will most probably be modfired, so she will be dead anyway. Why waste the lynch opportunity?~Mac

We're technically not wasting one though, we are just delaying the oppurtunity for a day. We're really just looking at the same thing from two different ways...either we take the oppurtunity today, lynch someone else and lose Mira (that amounts to a doube lynching) as well as all likely hood losing someone else at night from the wolf kill. Or we pass the oppurtunity, but gain it back by avoding losing 2 people in one day, and thus gain the oppurtunity back.

[Macalaure]

Nerwen -> Inzy
Mith -> Nogrod
Annu -> Shasta
Rikae -> Shasta (2)
Kath -> Annu
Eomer -> Mira
Shasta -> Rikae
Wilwa -> Eonwe
Rikae -- Shasta (1) -> Mira (2)
Nogrod -> Eomer
Mac -> Eomer (2)
Boro -> Mira (3)
Inzy -> Annu (2)
Gwath -> Mira (4)
Izzy -> Mac

Mira 4, Eomer, Annu 2, plenty o' 1's.