Two truths and a lie...

[Corsair_Caruso]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Oh wow, lucky guess! Well, here's a fairly easy one:

1) When looking in the mirror of Galadriel, Frodo saw only one sunset.
2) Pippin saw only one scene in the Palantir before Sauron's "voice" came.
3) Four Rangers of Ithilien came simultaneously to Frodo and Sam when they were found by the smoke of their fire and taken to stay with Faramir.

EDIT: PS: Caruso, are you familiar with The Silmarillion and Children of Hurin? I was gonna post a question about the First Age, but I realized that not everybody has read these books, and I wanted it to be fair.

I've read The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings, The Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, The Children of Hurin, Morgoth's Ring, The Peoples of Middle-earth, and The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Corsair_Caruso

I've read The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings, The Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, The Children of Hurin, Morgoth's Ring, The Peoples of Middle-earth, and The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien.

Oh wow! That's more canon than I've read! Well, expect something First Age next time I post.

[Corsair_Caruso]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Oh wow! That's more canon than I've read! Well, expect something First Age next time I post.

I'll take a crack at your question later today. And First Age questions sound great!

[Tar-Verimuchli]

I'll give this a go. Frodo sees more than one sunset in the mirror.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Tar-Verimuchli

I'll give this a go. Frodo sees more than one sunset in the mirror.

That is correct! Frodo sees the sun set several times - two or three, maybe even four, I can't remember exactly, but definitely not one. Well done!

[Tar-Verimuchli]

Cool. Silmarillion questions then.
1. Only 12 men of the House of Beor remain in Dorthonion before Sauron has all but Beren killed.
2. Glaurung's siblings fight in the fall of Gondolin.
3. Turin and Brandir are related as they share 2 great grandparents.

[Orphalesion]

Originally Posted by Tar-Verimuchli

Cool. Silmarillion questions then.
1. Only 12 men of the House of Beor remain in Dorthonion before Sauron has all but Beren killed.
2. Glaurung's siblings fight in the fall of Gondolin.
3. Turin and Brandir are related as they share 2 great grandparents.

Number 2 is a lie, there were dragons in Gondolin, but Glaurung is never mentioned to have had siblings, he is called (probably metaphorically) the father of Dragons.

(Turin and Brandir share 2 great grandparents, Halmir and his wife)

[Tar-Jêx]

Originally Posted by Tar-Verimuchli

Cool. Silmarillion questions then.
1. Only 12 men of the House of Beor remain in Dorthonion before Sauron has all but Beren killed.
2. Glaurung's siblings fight in the fall of Gondolin.
3. Turin and Brandir are related as they share 2 great grandparents.

The 2nd and 3rd statements were probably a bit too obvious, making it easy to determine the lie.

I'm not particularly good at wording questions to make them confusing and vague, but I'd like some more questions related to Turin.

[Orphalesion]

Originally Posted by Tar-Jêx

The 2nd and 3rd statements were probably a bit too obvious, making it easy to determine the lie.

I'm not particularly good at wording questions to make them confusing and vague, but I'd like some more questions related to Turin.

So was I right?

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Orphalesion

So was I right?

Well, Tar-Verimuchli didn't confirm the answer, but it doesn't look like he's gonna come back to do so anytime soon. Feel free to take the turn.

[Orphalesion]

Alright

1) The Easterlings of Hithlum called the Elves "White-fiends".
2) According to Hobbit folktales Trolls originated in the Ironwood in the east.
3) According to Rohrrim folktales Halflings have voices like birds.

[Tar-Jêx]

Originally Posted by Orphalesion

Alright

1) The Easterlings of Hithlum called the Elves "White-fiends".
2) According to Hobbit folktales Trolls originated in the Ironwood in the east.
3) According to Rohrrim folktales Halflings have voices like birds.

I'm quite sure the Easterlings of Hithlum did address the elves as 'white-fiends' as they did not trust them, and thought they were too pale to have done anything of use.

I think I remember the Rohirrim stating that the Halflings have voices like birds, but I can't be as certain as the first one.

While Trolls did come from Eastern lands, I do not believe that it was specified as to where exactly they originated. This makes the second option suspect. In my reading, I have not come across any reference to Trolls in the Ironwood. Trolls came from Mordor, and dark lands, but moved West to Eriador some time during the Second Age, perhaps earlier. Native trolls are a very uncommon thing to find in Eriador. I'm calling this the lie.

[Tar-Verimuchli]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Well, Tar-Verimuchli didn't confirm the answer, but it doesn't look like he's gonna come back to do so anytime soon. Feel free to take the turn.

Sorry, didn't notice the replies. Tar Jex is right, there are 13 men of the house of Beor left in Dorthonion not 12. The Silmarillion states that dragons of the brood of Glaurung are part of the army that sacks Gondolin and Brandir and Turin are both great grandsons of Hador of the third house and Halmir of the second.

[Orphalesion]

Originally Posted by Tar-Jêx

I'm quite sure the Easterlings of Hithlum did address the elves as 'white-fiends' as they did not trust them, and thought they were too pale to have done anything of use.

I think I remember the Rohirrim stating that the Halflings have voices like birds, but I can't be as certain as the first one.

While Trolls did come from Eastern lands, I do not believe that it was specified as to where exactly they originated. This makes the second option suspect. In my reading, I have not come across any reference to Trolls in the Ironwood. Trolls came from Mordor, and dark lands, but moved West to Eriador some time during the Second Age, perhaps earlier. Native trolls are a very uncommon thing to find in Eriador. I'm calling this the lie.

You are right. I was hoping that the Edda talking about the Trolls living in the Ironwood in the east of Midgard would confuse people.

The Easterlings calling the E;ves withe-fiends is from the Tale of the Children of Hurin, Eomer says that all the Rohirrim know of Hobbits is that they live far away and have voices like birds.

Your turn.

[Tar-Jêx]

1. By the time Bilbo has found the ring, Saruman had already betrayed the White Council
2. In Riddles in the Dark, Bilbo tells 5 riddles
3. Both of Mîm's sons died at Amon Rûdh

[Andsigil]

Originally Posted by Tar-Jêx

1. By the time Bilbo has found the ring, Saruman had already betrayed the White Council
2. In Riddles in the Dark, Bilbo tells 5 riddles
3. Both of Mîm's sons died at Amon Rûdh

1) I believe is true, as Saruman had already betrayed them in his heart, if not overtly.

2) is true, if you count, "What do I have in my pocket?" as a riddle. Gollum did (but wanted 3 guesses... and actually took 4).

3) I think is the lie. I remember one son died at Amon Rûdh, but wasn't the other MIA?

[Tar-Jêx]

Originally Posted by Andsigil

1) I believe is true, as Saruman had already betrayed them in his heart, if not overtly.

2) is true, if you count, "What do I have in my pocket?" as a riddle. Gollum did (but wanted 3 guesses... and actually took 4).

3) I think is the lie. I remember one son died at Amon Rûdh, but wasn't the other MIA?

Incorrect. Khîm was wounded by Turin's men, but succumbed to his wounds in Amon Rûdh. At least, that was one version of the story. There have been quite a few iterations of the story, but I believe in the most recently published edition, Khîm died at his home.

[Tar-Verimuchli]

Originally Posted by Tar-Jêx

Incorrect. Khîm was wounded by Turin's men, but succumbed to his wounds in Amon Rûdh. At least, that was one version of the story. There have been quite a few iterations of the story, but I believe in the most recently published edition, Khîm died at his home.

His other son, Ibun, doesn't die in Amon Rudh (or, at least, is not stated to have died there), he's captured by orcs but not mentioned after although later Mim says to Hurin that he is the last of his people.

[Tar-Jêx]

Originally Posted by Tar-Verimuchli

His other son, Ibun, doesn't die in Amon Rudh (or, at least, is not stated to have died there), he's captured by orcs but not mentioned after although later Mim says to Hurin that he is the last of his people.

Ibun died in the Sack of Amon Rudh, leading the reader to believe that he was killed their. His fate was vague, and it's probably different through all of the versions.

Bilbo and Gollum were both in internal agreement that his fifth questions was not a riddle, even though they went along with it and treated it like one.

[Tar-Verimuchli]

Originally Posted by Tar-Jêx

Ibun died in the Sack of Amon Rudh, leading the reader to believe that he was killed their. His fate was vague, and it's probably different through all of the versions.

The Silmarillion just says that Ibun and Mim are captured by orcs while looking for roots away from Amon Rudh then doesn't mention Ibun again apart from Mim's statement to Hurin when they meet in Nargothrond that he is the last of his people. In The Children of Hurin, Mim and Ibun deliberately betray the outlaws to the orcs who insist on holding Ibun hostage and are said to have no intention of keeping their side of the bargain. Mim then tries to kill Beleg at Amon Rudh but Ibun is not mentioned. The Unfinished Tales skips the events at Amon Rudh. It's reasonable to conclude from the Silmarillion and the Children of Hurin that the orcs hold Ibun hostage away from Amon Rudh to make sure that Mim keeps to his side of the bargain then kill him after the sack.

[Tar-Jêx]

Originally Posted by Tar-Verimuchli

The Silmarillion just says that Ibun and Mim are captured by orcs while looking for roots away from Amon Rudh then doesn't mention Ibun again apart from Mim's statement to Hurin when they meet in Nargothrond that he is the last of his people. In The Children of Hurin, Mim and Ibun deliberately betray the outlaws to the orcs who insist on holding Ibun hostage and are said to have no intention of keeping their side of the bargain. Mim then tries to kill Beleg at Amon Rudh but Ibun is not mentioned. The Unfinished Tales skips the events at Amon Rudh. It's reasonable to conclude from the Silmarillion and the Children of Hurin that the orcs hold Ibun hostage away from Amon Rudh to make sure that Mim keeps to his side of the bargain then kill him after the sack.

I see, however, that doesn't change that he died during the Sack of Amon Rudh, just not directly at Amon Rudh. If I worded the questions so that it asked whether both sons had died surrounding the events of the Sack of Amon Rudh, it would be a lot clearer, however, would make it too obvious.

Either way, the intended lie was that Bilbo told 5 riddles, as "What is in my pocket...?" is not a proper riddle.

[Tar-Verimuchli]

As the last lie and truths has been answered by person who wrote it, here's one on Children of Hurin.

1. In his later writings, Tolkien considered making Sador one of the druedain.
2. Turin's sword, Anglachel, forged by Eol from a meteorite, is given to him by Thingol.
3. Turin's sister, Urwen, died before his other sister, Nienor was born.

[Tar-Jêx]

Originally Posted by Tar-Verimuchli

As the last lie and truths has been answered by person who wrote it, here's one on Children of Hurin.

1. In his later writings, Tolkien considered making Sador one of the druedain.
2. Turin's sword, Anglachel, forged by Eol from a meteorite, is given to him by Thingol.
3. Turin's sister, Urwen, died before his other sister, Nienor was born.

The second one is a lie. Anglachel was given to Beleg Cuthalion by King Thingol, but in a tragic turn of events, Turin slew Beleg with his own sword, thus leading him to keep it, until it was reforged in Nargothrond as Gurthang.

I would say that Anglachel wasn't Turin's sword, but Beleg's. Turin merely kept it, and used it, but it became his own when it became Gurthang.

[Tar-Verimuchli]

Correct. That was quick!

[Corsair_Caruso]

I think I'm becoming a regular necromancer for this thread

1. No King of Númenórean descent after the foundation of Arnor and Gondor ever took the name Elendil.

2. The Steward Cirion's son, Hallas, came up with the name the Kingdom of Rohan, when it was given to Eorl and the Eotheod.

3. The term for "Regent" in Quenya, referring to a royal descendent exercising the King's authority on his behalf, is given as "Karma-Kundo" meaning "seat-guardian," and can more generally be translated as "Guardian of the Throne."