The Ambassador's Son Discussion Thread

[maikafanawen]

Oooh --- very interesting Earendil.

So this means that Adeline will have had to go back to her house that night. At the discussion I want them to come up with a plan. It will pretty much be vague, simple, a bit typical. They will need to get more information on Doran's strategy. Devon knows where his house is (Adeline will be sneaking in there instead of his ship--makes more sense yes?) So Adeline will offer to go (All right Brinniel?) and they'll send her. They decide on this, only resolving to meet again when Adeline has accomplished her goal and go from there. How about during the day when Doran is at the embassy? Then they can meet later that same night at the stables? Perhaps Telson has a room at an inn somewhere? So, when the four Umbar-Gondorians and Telson finish their wee talk, they will all retire and Devon will escort Miss Adeline back to her house. Then he'll go home and get ready for whatever he can do to help the next day.

The night after their talk, Adeline will find the bodies. She can go on her errand in the morning then. No one will see her or suspect her ever being in Doran's house.

I guess we can go from there. Brinniel: You are still with us? The things of importance Adeline will need to acquire is a sketch of Doran's map of The Bay. Maybe she'll come across a letter to him from a captain waiting for him there? On it he will mention the 10 ships including The Rapscallion that are ready for his employment. No description of the ships will be given though. I want us to be v surprised when we see them. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] If you think of anything else that might help them but not too much we could add 'em.

Earendil: Mind sharing your new 'plan' with me please? [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

If no one else (Aman, Nuranar, Arvedui, or Brinniel) is going to post for our discussion by tonight I'll move it on.

-Maikafanawen

[Earendil Halfelven]

I have a question: How come Adeline is able to sneak into Doran's house, find all the info she needs, and escapes unnoticed? Right after talking to the ambassador, Doran headed home and he's stayed there, mostly in his office talking to Acacia, so it looks pretty impossible for Adeline to get in and not get caught. Doran knows that Devon and his gang are up to something so he would logically up the security at his house to prevent such an excursion. And, its only logical that sometimes, Devon's plans should fail because not everything works out, especially when one is working against an evil mastermind, like Doran. Is something bad going to happen to Devon and his friends because so far, all the kidnaps attempts against them have failed but their plan of Adeline sneaking into Doran's house is supposed to go off flawlessly?

[Himaran]

Earendil:

"Have you heard about Jythralo and the guards?"

It should be "Jurex and the guards," correct? It was a little confusing to read at first - but great post!!

[Nuranar]

I've just carried through the discussion in a somewhat lengthy post. I tried to include everyone in it, writing their characters in an appropriate manner. Please let me know if there's anything you want changed.

And if the plan itself isn't what you have in mind, Maika or anyone else, just say so. I had to come up with reasons why these four guys would let the girl do the dirty work. It weren't easy! [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img]

Thoughts?

[Earendil Halfelven]

[img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] woops!
Its fixed.

I don't want to seem like a party pooper but part of the plan that I've pm'd Arien and Himaran about is that Acacia is still having Devon and his friends followed. Telson is still free of that, for now. But with Devon and the others being followed, the corsairs are going to know when Adeline breaks into the mansion and she will get caught. If you guys are willing in letting her get caught then go right ahead!-I won't stop ya. Its not like she is going to get killed or anything-even though that would be pleasant [img]smilies/evil.gif[/img] But I'm just letting you guys know the situation and that if she goes in there, she will get caught.

Himaran and Maika check your pm's

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 11:10 PM December 12, 2003: Message edited by: Earendil Halfelven ]</font>

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 11:19 PM December 12, 2003: Message edited by: Earendil Halfelven ]

[Nuranar]

I know, I figured on that. I'm thinking of an earlier post concerning the subject of follwoing, actually. *mysterious smile*

But seriously, we're still in charge of these characters. It's still entirely possible that Adeline's shadow can either lose her in a mob (truly accidental) or be lost by her (way to go Adeline!).

I think she does need to get in and back with some information, though. At least, that's what I understand from Maika (see above). Any ideas, Madame Game Owner?

[maikafanawen]

the owners have had a row [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

MUST READ Slight change in plans (with everyone's consent that is)

great post Nuranar (i read it quickly since it's late). now we can wrap that up, and take it to bed. later, we'll get a shock. adeline will never really get to go snooping. ehem, see below!

how's this?

we're going to stuff all the politcalness of this blasted rpg ;-) and get right to the stuff that makes an rpg good. doran will kidnap devon, calnan, callath and adeline. (not telson.) He will bring them to his house and sit them down (forcefully) in his office where he will tell thim this:

"you are in my house. i have complete power. here is my proposition by teh standards of the fairness of the pirate code:" (if you want i can explain that) "I will give you a week to come up with as many captains, crews, ships etc. as you can. with you will be one of my men. at teh end of the week if you have come up with a minimum of 1 ship, 1 captain. and at least 30 crew members i will meet you on the ocean to decide the fate of umbar. my man will tell me if you have met these requirements. if not, i will let you be and umbar will be mine in all fairness and you will ahve nothing to say against me."

Devon and friends will tell Telson what happened. they have no choice but to fight for Umbar. they get avershire, a good ship and some crew members and prepare to face Doran's armada of 10, seemingly invincible ships. they will go from there. they will barely survive, obtaining 1 of doran's ships as their own and using it against the others. since avershire is a very crazy but skilled captain (thank god) he will save their butts. in the end, however, avershire's ship will sink and they will be stranded on an island where they will ahve to hide from Doran. 1 of Avershire's crew will have left on a jolly boat for gondor, telling the people what is going on and begging that they send the gondorian fleet. Avershire and crew pluse devon etc. have to depend on this. in the end, the fleet arrives, doran & crew is arrested. doran will be freed though leaving room for a sequel if it possesses us to do such a crazy thing. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]


if there are any doubts of the realisticalness of this idea i recommend that you stuff them too. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] we are going to embark on a perilous, unreal journey. if you are suckling the idea that the good guys always win clear and easy, be prepared for a shock. Avershire and Devon will get their buttocks whipped v nicely by "Mad" Doran. it will be fun you will enjoy this. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] lol i'm kidding of course no one's forcing you [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] but this is what we think will make the rpg more enjoyable. i don't like doing too much thinking for fun and 'pointy end of sword into enemy' sounds pretty nice right now? [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

it's tres late and i completely just whipped this up. i will get on tomorrow and explain it further if need be. but for now we'll keep the allies thinking of the original plan and earendil will have doran get devon etc. soon at his will. well any comments/questions? good! then let's go. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

-Cap'n Maikafanawen, Yo ho, a pirate's life for me...

PS I also wanted to appologize for my horendous grammar and bluntness. when i good idea hits, i need to type fast. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] okay, clarity will come with the dawn! 'night

[Brinniel]

Hmm. Wow. That was a sudden change. I have to say I do like the idea of getting on with the RPG. I like action and I think your idea sounds good, though I do see a problem.

As exciting as all that is, I just don't see Adeline's personality working for it. I don't think she'd be much help in finding a crew and then fight, especially since she hates ships. Actually, I was thinking that we should still have her kidnapped, but instead do it on the current night. I mean, there are enough reasons for the corsairs to kidnap her; not only is she a friend of Devon, but she is also Captain Montrés's daughter. That way, the action can start immediately, and when Doran sits Devon, Callath, and Calnan down, they can also discuss the fate of Adeline. This way we could forcibly get Adeline onto a ship and into the action, and perhaps have some interesting interactions with her and the corsairs. Meanwhile, Devon and friends would have more than one reason why they must fight Doran.

Does that make any sense? (It's 3:30am here, so... [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img] )

If you don't like this idea, that's fine. It just happened to be a thought that suddenly popped into my head...

[Himaran]

Maika - I like your idea. Adeline can be kidnapped first, followed by Devon and his other kiddie friends. Then, Jythralo will have REAL bartering power - the life of their friend.

Here is my proposition - an agreement with Brinniel You mentioned that Adeline might attempt to sneak into Jythralo's house and find evidence? Why bother kidnapping her? The corsairs can capture her in the attempt.

Himaran

Himaran

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 11:09 AM December 14, 2003: Message edited by: Himaran ]

[Nuranar]

Hey, I'm all for the action here! You're right, Maika, this is supposed to be fun. So whatever you decide is cool with me. I've actually been uneasy with Adeline being the one out of all these guys to get stuck with the most dangerous (and fun) part. Dang the plotlines! Full speed ahead!

Just one proviso, Earendil: Calnan may not be a General Blood 'n' Thunder, but he's no wuss, either - Doran's people aren't going to take him easily. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] Consider yourself warned! [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

[Arvedui III]

Herm, that's different, but I'm all for unrealistic action and naval battles and stuff. [img]smilies/evil.gif[/img] Heck, if Adeline still gets kidnapped, it could add a whole winner's prize to the deal. Don't think Telson will have a problem with the changes either. On with the game! [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

[Nuranar]

Aman, your PM's are full. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

[maikafanawen]

I'm not understanding what Himaran and Brinniel, you two are saying exactly but I think I get some of it. So how's this: I don't want anything else ot happen right this minute (With exception of GaladrielOTO getting Hessa up) unless its Doran getting the four people into his house for his game plan. But I have a solution typer thing that I think is what Himaran meant...

How about Doran keeps Adeline with him while Devon & the rest look for what they need. That way they can't escape to Gondor and it will give them more of a reason to meet Doran's challenge. Adeline will be much like a hostage that way.

Does that take care of it Brin? Hope so... This game MUST go on NOW. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

I'm working out how we'll do the ships. Instead of guns we'll have catapults and instead of flint-locks, bows & arrows. The swords'll be the same though: standard cut-thrust or cutlasses. I'll be back with information on the ships. I'm looking at a [naval] sloop for Avershire's first ship until he gets one of Doran's. And maybe brigantines for Doran? I don't remember how many crew members we're given for those ... I'm thinking about loosing the archers though. If we dedicate the archer places to catapults, it'll be more like a real sea battle. I like it.

QUESTIONS? COMMENTS? SUGGESTIONS?

-Maikafanawen

[Himaran]

Aharr! Time for some seafairing fun! Blood an' thunder t'all yee Gondor Scum!

So, Adeline is captured and held prisoner UNTIL Devon and his pals can round up a ship or two. Correct?

[Amanaduial the archer]

Nuranar: Cleared. Thanks for letting me know [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

[maikafanawen]

Himaran: That will be what Doran tells them (right Earendil?). But he may keep her afterwards? Or he will give her back? We can decide when the time comes.

Arvedui, or Brinniel: You two would be ideal posters to move us out of the meeting and to bed. Telson could return to an inn, Callath to the stables, Calnan to wherever he stays, Adeline to her house (don't forget to find the dead guy) and Devon'll stay at the embassy. Then Doran will get us all! [img]smilies/evil.gif[/img]

-Maikafanawen

[maikafanawen]

Earendil's going to get up a post tomorrow where Doran kidnaps Devon, Calnan, Callath, and Adeline all at once and brings them to his townhouse to tell him the game plan.

Let me remind you that Doran, Jurex, and Acacia shouldn't be evil. They're just the bad-guys. But not EVIL, entirely.

-Maikafanawen

[Earendil Halfelven]

Ok, post is up. I left a few days time in between the threat against Adeline and the kidnapping in case you wanted to post something before that.

[maikafanawen]

HAHA! YES EARENDIL!! That is awesome. Do you want us to post about our character's waking in Doran's TOWNHOUSE ( [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]) or what? Whatever we do do you want to post the part about the demands? I could if you didn't want to but you get first pickin's [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

Yeah, that's the only other thing:

into Doran's mansion

It's a townhouse buddy. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] Coastal city=townhouses. But don't worry it's a pretty posh house. Most of Doran's things would have been confiscated after he was apprehended as a corsair. Yeah.

But awesome post. We are so ready to get going. I'm about to take care of RL right now so I'll post tomorrow. No school for the next 2 weeks. I will be going out of town the 26th-3rd but I am counting on computer access. I am so ready for this!!! Pirates rule. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] Yeah....

GaladrielOTO: Please check your PMs and just post whatever you want because Hessa technically shoudl be in Doran's employment when he talks to Devon etc. because he is smart and probably wouldn't hire well nevermind it woudl jsut be better if she was. Oh well. Just hurry please.

-Maikafanawen

[Earendil Halfelven]

Yeah, y'all can post about your character's reactions and stuff. I figure that would be good but it doesn't matter to me who posts about the demands and stuff. But do I get to keep somebody just to "motivate" the others to do my evil bidding? [img]smilies/evil.gif[/img]

GaladrielOTO check your pm's

Arien & Himaran I don't think that the change in plot changes the plans of you two attacking and stuff. You guys could lead the battle on land while I take care of the sea. Sound good?

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 12:30 AM December 21, 2003: Message edited by: Earendil Halfelven ]

[Amanaduial the archer]

Apologies for my absence - I've been in Northern Ireland at very short notice and wasn't able to get onto the internet before I went.

[Himaran]

Maika: Possibly - it depends on what Earendil wants to do.

Earendil: So, Jurex and Acacia stay at Umbar, while he sails into battle, correct? If so, we will seek a larger prize: The Embassy itself!

I will pm Arien about it.

Himaran

[Himaran]

Earendil and Maika:

I posted: Jurex helped to kidnap Adeline, but did not know of Jythralo's full plan. In my post, Acacia enlightend him to the greater scheme.

ARIEN: Can you "inspire" the mob to become an organized fighting force in Umbar, lead by Jurex? As soon as you do, I can begin the BLOODY REVOLT!!!!

yeah.... its about time.

Himaran

[maikafanawen]

But do I get to keep somebody just to "motivate" the others to do my evil bidding?

I'm afraid I don't understand that one...

Maika: Possibly - it depends on what Earendil wants to do.

Hmm, I'm not figuring this one out either (?) ...

Hey, Earendil, actually Jurex and Acacia are going to have to come out to the ocean with Doran. I don't want to have two plots going on land & sea. Just the waters. Besides, Acacia is your first mate, remember? Yeah, Acacia and Jurex will have to come with Doran.

Where is Arien by the way? Did she mention an absence?

Anyway, my post is up. Let's go!

-Maikafanawen


Just a Reminder:

Let me remind you that Doran, Jurex, and Acacia shouldn't be evil. They're just the bad-guys. But not EVIL, entirely.

[Himaran]

Maika: If Acacia and Jurex are going with Jythralo, then my recent post (following Earendil's idea) should be removed, correct?

Himaran

[Arien]

First off Maika: Sorry for the absence. I didn’t actually go anywhere, but sorry about the lack of posting.

Ok then, I just posted. If I understand rightly everyone is still on land. Devon & Co. have been kidnapped by Jythralo. Acacia and Jurex are still going to organise the militia attacks on certain compounds in the city, when they have done this they will join Jythralo and go to sea. Is that right?

If it is Himaran, you don’t need to remove your most recent post. You just need to change it slightly. We could complete these assaults in one night. Nice and swift, they won’t know what hit them especially with three organised attacks at the same time in different parts of the city. And then we leave for the sea.

I don’t know if this is what Earendil meant, but this would incorporate the attacks without leaving Acacia and Jurex on land. Sound good or not?

[maikafanawen]

Sure, Arien, that'll be good. Makes sense to me anyways. We'll see what Earendil thinks of it too.

Earendil: Check your PMs please. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] OH, and I just figured out what you meant by what I didn't understand above. Yeah, you get to keep Adeline. And you'll probably have her throughout the whole seabattle too. We'll see.

-Maikafanawen

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 1:50 PM December 23, 2003: Message edited by: maikafanawen ]

[Himaran]

I posted: The army is raised and Jurex has the orders from Acacia.

Arien: Can you post about getting the much needed Embassy key from the same councillor?
And, if so, should you recieve some help from Jurex?

[maikafanawen]

The Embassy key? Hmm, why don't you just force your way in. Getting the key would be near to imposssible (I'm still unsure about the other keys but oh well). They're corsairs--they can force their way in and it'll be okay.

-Maikafanawen

[Arien]

Embassy Key? I didn't know that they were going lead an assult on the actual Embassy. I thought it was just a Councillor's estate and two officer barraks...

But yeah, it will be hard for Acacia to get the Embassy Keys. It would be better just to force your way in. Or you could get in by stealth...

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 7:16 AM December 24, 2003: Message edited by: Arien ]

[piosenniel]

The BW has done something different with the "edited by" note at the end of posts. As you can see, if you go back and look at one of your recently edited posts, it is an html command.

If you decide to re-edit something you've already edited - please scroll to the bottom of the post box and delete the html string. It makes the game a cleaner read.

Thanks!

~*~ Pio

Otherwise - it looks like this:

&lt;font size=1 color=339966&gt;[ 3:04 PM December 24, 2003: Message edited by: piosenniel ]&lt;/font&gt;

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 4:58 PM December 25, 2003: Message edited by: piosenniel ]

[maikafanawen]

I'm not sure about the assault on the embassy. Let's just go with Arien's plan of the Councilman's estate and the two barracks okay?

I'm going to get Avershire's post up when I get to Washington. Then we've GOT to get to the ocean battles. I think we're supposed to have just a month left and I'd like to at least be close to finishing up by then.

-Maikafanawen

[Himaran]

Sounds good; after the barrack attacks, Jurex will turn on Councillor B...something's home, and.... to what end?

- The counciller is murdered

- The counciller is kidnapped

- The entire household is held hostage

- The counciller's documents, money, etc. are taken and he is left unharmed

- The counciller and his family are left unharmed, but everyone else (aids, guards) are brutally murdered

Which would you prefer, Maika, Earendil?

Himaran

[Earendil Halfelven]

I'd say kill all of the men but leave the women and children unharmed. If thats too bloody, then just take the councilor hostage and keep him as a POW.

[Nuranar]

I've posted, pretty much just elaborating on the tail end of yours, Maika. I'm not sure how you want to run your captain to earth, so I left that open. And as always, if anyone wants me to change anything, just let me know.

A word of explanation for the future: It has proved unexpectedly difficult to even get to a computer, now that I'm at home. And once I figure out what post I can do, it's hard to find time to write it and get back on to post it with any degree of timeliness. So your patience, I pray of you, and my assurance that I'm still with you! [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

Carry on!

[maikafanawen]

I hope I'm not too late to express my opinion on your plan Himaran. I'd say that if they fight back aggressively kill them but not brutally. Do not kill the women, children, or the Councilman though. You may keep him as a POW if you so wish. And take the money, silver and jewels the raiders might find as well. That is what I think sounds reasonable.

Now I'm going to read the most recent posts. I'm out of town you see and I had to fight my way onto the computer. I am not brave enough yet to even consider trying my hand at dueling for the phone! (I hope the one of you whom it concerns can interpret that hint, [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] lol!) Ah, the cleverness of me.

[EDIT]: Ah yes, very nice post Nuranar. And I can sympathize with computer unavailability at the moment [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]. Anyways, I am working on Avershire right this moment and will do my best to get it up asap! That is all.


-Maikafanawen

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 4:31 PM December 28, 2003: Message edited by: maikafanawen ]

[maikafanawen]

Here is Avershire's Main Character Bio:

Name: Captain Kent Avershire

Age: 45

Gender: Male

Race: Gondorian, from Dol Amroth (of Corsair lineage)

Weapons: He has a 28 ½ in. cutlass with a steel basket handle to use like an iron fist in sea-board combat. He carries a boot dagger too.

Appearance: Kent has dark blue eyes, thick, shoulder length, dark brown hair and tan, leathery skin. He is 6’4” at approximately 210 lbs. His handsome features are very pronounced and he has that rugged manly facade about him. He wears the tough clothes of a sailor: a white, billowy shirt; dark red, knee-length breeches; a wide leather belt; black, calf-high fold-over boots; and because of his former status, an old-fashioned styled cuffed and collared chocolate colored corduroy captain’s coat with delicate gold and black trimming.

Personality/Strengths/Weaknesses: He is a very brilliant man with cunning ideas and a bewildering intellect (bordering insanity). Avershire knows things about the sea one would never find in books. His agile frame and incredible strength is valued in every mariner. The purposelessness of his current situation is very depressing for him and he is quick to anger at anyone to poke fun at him (this might be a problem when Devon comes to ask for his help). When he returns to the sea alongside an aged but loyal crew, we find that five years of drinking and dormancy have added an insane twist to his ingenious plots.

History: Kent grew up the son of a pirate--no kidding. He was a cabin boy on his father’s ship and learned the ways of the sea at a very young age. However, unhappy with his life of rampage and destruction, he fled to Dol Amroth and later offered his service to the king after the War of the Ring. For twenty years of captaincy, Kent would hunt the pirates whose ships hadn’t been taken by Lord Aragorn after the Paths of the Dead. His ships would escort merchants traveling up and down the coasts and send search and rescue parties out for missing vessels. All this stopped five years ago when a jealous rival uncovered his pirate lineage and he was dismissed from the navy. He now takes up residence in Gondor’s new Umbar where he sits in his townhouse by his self mostly, just reading and drinking in his pub of choice: the Beast’s Lair. Deep in the back of his mind still dwells the nagging thoughts of sea faring adventure and the life he led five years ago. He hasn’t forgotten a thing and yearns to be able to captain a crew just once more...

And here's Meri, an important secondary character:

Name: Meri Loliway

Age: 37

Gender: Female

Race: Gondorian from Dol Amroth, (moved to Umbar with Avershire)

Weapons: Bandoleer set of twelve black throwing knives, and a 28 in. cut and thrust that hangs from her left hip.

Appearance: A resplendent wavy mass of hair darker than sin tumbling waist length. A shapely figure; tall, and on the slender side. She has impressive sea-blue eyes with a burst of hazel in the right making her eyes look almost like two different colors. Her facial features: strikingly handsome with a nearly strait, small nose, bold cheekbones, and full, dusty rose-pink lips. She could not be called beautiful in the strictest sense of the word, but her features do have an awe-inspiring effect that make her look imperious as well as exceptionally attractive. Her skin tans easily, and blemishes caused sometimes by the sun are not uncommon. She usually wears tight leggings, a white, billowy sleeved cotton shirt, and a low cut, rust-colored jerkin that closes up the front in gold clasps.

Personality: Meri is tough but not overbearing. She is very quick to earn people's respect and she treats others with a good deal of courtesy. She is very dedicated to Avershire and does all she can for him. She is quiet though and a great singer and dancer (mostly for Avershire‘s eyes only though).

History: She was born the daughter of a merchant sailor in Dol Amroth--the youngest of three children. She had one older brother named Dirk, and an olders sister named Lotte. Her family is still alive but living in fine style in Dol Amroth. They offer her haven if she should ever need it, but she chose to sail with Avershire instead. Her family secretly disapproves of Kent and Meri’s relationship but they love her anyways and are kind to him.

She has only ever sailed under/with Avershire and is an able first mate to him agile aloft, and imperious on deck. Thanks to her steadfastness he experienced very fair sailing for fifteen of his twenty years abroad.

She moved with him to Umbar five years ago.

Avershire's first post is up and Devon's is in progress. More later though, I'm going iceskating now!

-Maikafanawen

[Himaran]

Ok - the barracks fell easily and Jurex is turning on the councillers home next

Arien - post about Acacia giving Jurex the following orders:

- Attack counciller Br-somthing's home during the night

- Take the counciller and his staff captive, sparing women, children, and his servants.

- Kill all guards

- Take any and all plunder for yourselves.


Sound good?

Meanwhile, I have a few problems to sort out with the garison...
Himaran

[Arien]

Ok I've given the orders to Jurex.

One question, is Jurex still recruting Hessa?

[Earendil Halfelven]

IMPORTANT!!!!
HIMARAN and ACACIA read this before posting about the attack!

Ok, we have a plan to get Hessa into this game. GaladrielOTO and Himarancontact Arien about the plan. Sorry that this took so long but I couldn't think of a good way to get Hessa into this without having to change a lot of whats already happened. But now I got it!

Arien check your pm

<font size=1 color=339966>[ 11:24 PM December 29, 2003: Message edited by: Earendil Halfelven ]