Tol-in-Guarhoth CIX - Ten Year Anniversary Game: Dead Thread

[Nogrod]

You dead person: do not post into this thread.

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

They see we have posted now - and then we stopped.

I don't see they could interpret it we have it so clear no one bothers to even joke a bit. I mean it's most of the Day and it is going to be tight there and they know it. Why would the game continue unless there were things to settle?

I totally disagree with you. The days are often quieter anyway.

Us getting quiet at #1588 might be a coincidence.

Us talking but the post count staying at #1588 is not a coincidence.

I think we should definitely keep it as an option.

**

edit: post #1,5something added.

Dead person, don't post in this thread.

[Nogrod]

You the most honourable dead person: do not post into this thread.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

ALMOST THERE...

[Aganzir]

YOU, DEAD PERSON. If you post in this thread, please delete one of your earlier posts, or edit two posts into one so we can keep the post count at 1,589 (shows as 1,588 under Replies).

[Nogrod]

You dead person!

Yes you,

exactly you who are reading this.


Please read this before you post anything!


We have a plan were trying to accomplish here. As we have no way to indicate the Living that they should lynch Boro (newcomer: we know McCaber was the last wolf) we try to do it by stopping our posting to 1588 replies.

So don't post anything on this thread for now!


This post is post number 1589 [EDIT: No, Because of Aganzir this is actually the post 1588 - but Aganzir's post is now 1589] – and if you check the ”Active Topics” or ”Middle-Earth Mirth” you can see the thread has 1588 replies. Hope you follow...


1588 replies.
Boromir88.


We'll stay silent until the last hours of the Day so that the Living might get the clue: nothing happens in the Dead thread for over half of the Day and the count stands at 1588.

The living might catch it or then they don't. Or some rebellious wolves might not wish to play along just in principle even if Boro is their enemy and the killer of their packmates. But we'll nevertheless wish to give this crazy plan a chance and to give this anniversary game the ending it deserves.


So do not post anything in this thread unless the Living have caught the message, or there is something like 5 to 7 hours of the Day left.

If you feel a need to say something, follow Agan's instructions of deleting one of your earlier posts to keep the post count intact.


Hold your horses!

PS. Read at least this page and the one before to understand how we came about this...

PS2 Let's keep the silence at least for this evening with the Americans - like 10 hours at least. Of course if the living start to think we think it's over, well of course we abandon the tactics (although I can't see why would they think that). I'm just afraid everyone doesn't remember to quote the plan-post and then some people get energized with a discussion and the plan is lost when someone comes into the middle of a discussion and hasn't seen this plan as it has gone up in the thread...

PS3. Although - a couple of posts - rarely made and including this basic message post might be good indeed during the Day if someone notices the discrepancy between the number of replies (1588) and the name of the last poster.

[Aganzir]

I feel a need to say something.

If you think silence is not strong enough a clue and the living will catch our meaning better if the thread keeps updating but the post count doesn't, feel free to ignore what Nog said about posting nothing all day. I know I will.

However, do quote this post so that it's accessible to everyone entering the thread, and please remember to delete an old post (and edit its contents into another post).

Originally Posted by Nogrod

You dead person!

Yes you,

exactly you who are reading this.


Please read this before you post anything!


We have a plan were trying to accomplish here. As we have no way to indicate the Living that they should lynch Boro (newcomer: we know McCaber was the last wolf) we try to do it by stopping our posting to 1588 replies.

So don't post anything on this thread for now!


This post is post number 1589 [EDIT: No, Because of Aganzir this is actually the post 1588 - but Aganzir's post is now 1589] – and if you check the ”Active Topics” or ”Middle-Earth Mirth” you can see the thread has 1588 replies. Hope you follow...


1588 replies.
Boromir88.


We'll stay silent until the last hours of the Day so that the Living might get the clue: nothing happens in the Dead thread for over half of the Day and the count stands at 1588.

The living might catch it or then they don't. Or some rebellious wolves might not wish to play along just in principle even if Boro is their enemy and the killer of their packmates. But we'll nevertheless wish to give this crazy plan a chance and to give this anniversary game the ending it deserves.


So do not post anything in this thread unless the Living have caught the message, or there is something like 5 to 7 hours of the Day left.

If you feel a need to say something, follow Agan's instructions of deleting one of your earlier posts to keep the post count intact.


Hold your horses!

PS. Read at least this page and the one before to understand how we came about this...

PS2 Let's keep the silence at least for this evening with the Americans - like 10 hours at least. Of course if the living start to think we think it's over, well of course we abandon the tactics (although I can't see why would they think that). I'm just afraid everyone doesn't remember to quote the plan-post and then some people get energized with a discussion and the plan is lost when someone comes into the middle of a discussion and hasn't seen this plan as it has gone up in the thread...

PS3. Although - a couple of posts - rarely made and including this basic message post might be good indeed during the Day if someone notices the discrepancy between the number of replies (1588) and the name of the last poster.

Also, here, have a Tweedlefang and a Tweedlegrip.


**
Added:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

All I know is I think this is a conspiracy and set up to get me lynched by the last wolf

Yeah, suuuuure.

[mormegil]

Better that Boro win than the helpless welps who would listen when I said to lynch him. He is playing brilliantly and if I can help I will. I thought post deletion was against the rules.

[mormegil]

Love the graphic Agan!

[mormegil]

Oops, is this a triple post? Go predators.

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

You dead person: do not post into this thread.

Just saw this. ..good thing I'm a dead wolf.

[mormegil]

I've been gone with my family all day and just saw that Boro killed Mith...an odd choice, why not a known innocent?

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

You dead person!

Yes you,

exactly you who are reading this.


Please read this before you post anything!


We have a plan were trying to accomplish here. As we have no way to indicate the Living that they should lynch Boro (newcomer: we know McCaber was the last wolf) we try to do it by stopping our posting to 1588 replies.

So don't post anything on this thread for now!


This post is post number 1589 [EDIT: No, Because of Aganzir this is actually the post 1588 - but Aganzir's post is now 1589] – and if you check the ”Active Topics” or ”Middle-Earth Mirth” you can see the thread has 1588 replies. Hope you follow...


1588 replies.
Boromir88.


We'll stay silent until the last hours of the Day so that the Living might get the clue: nothing happens in the Dead thread for over half of the Day and the count stands at 1588.

The living might catch it or then they don't. Or some rebellious wolves might not wish to play along just in principle even if Boro is their enemy and the killer of their packmates. But we'll nevertheless wish to give this crazy plan a chance and to give this anniversary game the ending it deserves.


So do not post anything in this thread unless the Living have caught the message, or there is something like 5 to 7 hours of the Day left.

If you feel a need to say something, follow Agan's instructions of deleting one of your earlier posts to keep the post count intact.


Hold your horses!

PS. Read at least this page and the one before to understand how we came about this...

PS2 Let's keep the silence at least for this evening with the Americans - like 10 hours at least. Of course if the living start to think we think it's over, well of course we abandon the tactics (although I can't see why would they think that). I'm just afraid everyone doesn't remember to quote the plan-post and then some people get energized with a discussion and the plan is lost when someone comes into the middle of a discussion and hasn't seen this plan as it has gone up in the thread...

PS3. Although - a couple of posts - rarely made and including this basic message post might be good indeed during the Day if someone notices the discrepancy between the number of replies (1588) and the name of the last poster.

This wolf goes along with the plan. I can vouch for Lottie, too, but haven't heard from Form yet.

Let's hope anybody will notice that our post count doesn't change even though we're posting. I know I wouldn't. I would have prefered complete silence.

I am offended at having to delete one of my exceedingly substantial posts. Ah, the things I do for revenge.

This below used to be post #1481. A grave loss for wolfkind.

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Kill him. Kiiiiiiiiiilllll hiiiimmmmm!

Originally Posted by Agan

Here's a gif of Macalaure posting in this thread:

Do you liken me to a troll?

I can't take my eyes off that gif. Did anyone notice how Merry and Pippin, who, from their point of view, should see the troll coming, don't react at all? Couldn't they have warned Frodo?


edit: crossed with morm

[the phantom]

Shasta just voted Boro!

*crosses fingers*

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

You dead person!

Yes you,

exactly you who are reading this.


Please read this before you post anything!


We have a plan were trying to accomplish here. As we have no way to indicate the Living that they should lynch Boro (newcomer: we know McCaber was the last wolf) we try to do it by stopping our posting to 1588 replies.

So don't post anything on this thread for now!


This post is post number 1589 [EDIT: No, Because of Aganzir this is actually the post 1588 - but Aganzir's post is now 1589] – and if you check the ”Active Topics” or ”Middle-Earth Mirth” you can see the thread has 1588 replies. Hope you follow...


1588 replies.
Boromir88.


We'll stay silent until the last hours of the Day so that the Living might get the clue: nothing happens in the Dead thread for over half of the Day and the count stands at 1588.

The living might catch it or then they don't. Or some rebellious wolves might not wish to play along just in principle even if Boro is their enemy and the killer of their packmates. But we'll nevertheless wish to give this crazy plan a chance and to give this anniversary game the ending it deserves.


So do not post anything in this thread unless the Living have caught the message, or there is something like 5 to 7 hours of the Day left.

If you feel a need to say something, follow Agan's instructions of deleting one of your earlier posts to keep the post count intact.


Hold your horses!

PS. Read at least this page and the one before to understand how we came about this...

PS2 Let's keep the silence at least for this evening with the Americans - like 10 hours at least. Of course if the living start to think we think it's over, well of course we abandon the tactics (although I can't see why would they think that). I'm just afraid everyone doesn't remember to quote the plan-post and then some people get energized with a discussion and the plan is lost when someone comes into the middle of a discussion and hasn't seen this plan as it has gone up in the thread...

PS3. Although - a couple of posts - rarely made and including this basic message post might be good indeed during the Day if someone notices the discrepancy between the number of replies (1588) and the name of the last poster.

Morm, you already lost, and you're trying to ruin something this cool?

Anyway, one more vote for Boro and we have him!

[mormegil]

Yes, call me a poor loser

[mormegil]

Seriously though, isn't deleting posts against the rules? Kuru?

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by mormegil

3. Editing a post for reasons other than grammar or crossposting is prohibited. Once a post is submitted, the content within it must not be changed.

Sorry to be a wet blanket but it is clearly against the rules to edit or delete the posts.

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Morm, you already lost, and you're trying to ruin something this cool?

My primary goal wad to rid the village of all of you with my pack, those plans were foiled. I would like to see Boro win as a cunning predator. He bested me during the game and by so doing earned my wolf is respect.

Go Boro! I'm trying

[mormegil]

To put it mildly, I'm very disappointed at the rate at which posts are being deleted. This is akin to cheating and goes against the sportsmanship of the game. I can see the deleted posts.

I admit the idea was clever but I have my strategy to not help the villagers. I wish you would abide by the rules of the game.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

You dead person!

Yes you,

exactly you who are reading this.


Please read this before you post anything!


We have a plan were trying to accomplish here. As we have no way to indicate the Living that they should lynch Boro (newcomer: we know McCaber was the last wolf) we try to do it by stopping our posting to 1588 replies.

So don't post anything on this thread for now!


This post is post number 1589 [EDIT: No, Because of Aganzir this is actually the post 1588 - but Aganzir's post is now 1589] – and if you check the ”Active Topics” or ”Middle-Earth Mirth” you can see the thread has 1588 replies. Hope you follow...


1588 replies.
Boromir88.


We'll stay silent until the last hours of the Day so that the Living might get the clue: nothing happens in the Dead thread for over half of the Day and the count stands at 1588.

The living might catch it or then they don't. Or some rebellious wolves might not wish to play along just in principle even if Boro is their enemy and the killer of their packmates. But we'll nevertheless wish to give this crazy plan a chance and to give this anniversary game the ending it deserves.


So do not post anything in this thread unless the Living have caught the message, or there is something like 5 to 7 hours of the Day left.

If you feel a need to say something, follow Agan's instructions of deleting one of your earlier posts to keep the post count intact.


Hold your horses!

PS. Read at least this page and the one before to understand how we came about this...

PS2 Let's keep the silence at least for this evening with the Americans - like 10 hours at least. Of course if the living start to think we think it's over, well of course we abandon the tactics (although I can't see why would they think that). I'm just afraid everyone doesn't remember to quote the plan-post and then some people get energized with a discussion and the plan is lost when someone comes into the middle of a discussion and hasn't seen this plan as it has gone up in the thread...

PS3. Although - a couple of posts - rarely made and including this basic message post might be good indeed during the Day if someone notices the discrepancy between the number of replies (1588) and the name of the last poster.

Morm, of course you can "see the deleted posts", they haven't been deleted, only consolidated into other posts with a note of where they originally were.
I was one of the people who called for rules against editing/deleting, and we all understood the purpose was to avoid deception about what was posted and when.
No one is engaging in such deception now.
I actually think your attempt to call what's being done now, cheating, is unsportsmanlike.

Originally Posted by Rikae

And, once again, being "helpful" by suggesting multiple plans... and known innocents are doing it, too.

Get your act together, living people!

Edit: X'd with Nog

And here is what I originally accidentally posted here:
EDIT: My post following this one:

Originally Posted by Rikae

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nogrod
How many "secure" voters do we have there at the DL against wolves aka. is there a good argument for early-sleepers not to vote at all if there seems to be happening nothing in the Living thread in say 1-1½ hours the most?

You have phantom and Firefoot... and me. I solemnly swearto vote in the interests of the village.

(Or is that only believable when wolves say it?)

EDIT - Stop it, phantom! By the time we got to 1688 they'd think we were proceeding as normal

[the phantom]

Ah well, I cave. Though I do feel a "spirit of the law" case could be made, i.e. all rules have a specific reasoning behind them- in Werewolf the changing of posts isn't allowed because we base our accusations/defenses on the words of others etc. etc. that is the reason for the rule, and the reason is what matters, not the rule itself.

But today, when everyone on the thread knows we are making posts just for the sake of deleting them, and everyone knows every role, obviously there can be no arguments/accusations made based on such editing practices. In short, the law lacks its supporting reason in this case, therefore in this case no such law applies.

But if you insist and you feel your allegiances are with Boro, all you have to do is keep spamming even if we did keep deleting and that will just get tiresome (and call down wrath from above). I think perhaps we should just run this thing up near 1688 and leave it sit there (without editing), as Morm has to go to sleep at some point.

[the phantom]

Wow, that last Boro post almost seemed suicidal, heh. I would've thought he would've tried harder to frame the remaining Wolf, saying that Kath must've killed Mith to frame Boro. But then maybe part of his role is he wants to die (i.e. doesn't want to kill everyone). We'll see.

[the phantom]

Of course it's too large a risk to take, but it would be nice if the Living could promise not to lynch Boro if he'd promise to stop his murderous ways, and then sit on their votes and Boro sit on his Night kill. Making peace for the first time in Werewolf. Surely that could count as victory!

[McCaber]

Well, if the voting's started over there I might as well start the voting in here.

++Shasta

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Of course it's too large a risk to take, but it would be nice if the Living could promise not to lynch Boro if he'd promise to stop his murderous ways, and then sit on their votes and Boro sit on his Night kill. Making peace for the first time in Werewolf. Surely that could count as victory!

I was rather disappointed to see him effectively roll over after he did so well and fought so hard.

[mormegil]

++Boromir

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Ah well, I cave. Though I do feel a "spirit of the law" case could be made, i.e. all rules have a specific reasoning behind them- in Werewolf the changing of posts isn't allowed because we base our accusations/defenses on the words of others etc. etc. that is the reason for the rule, and the reason is what matters, not the rule itself.

But today, when everyone on the thread knows we are making posts just for the sake of deleting them, and everyone knows every role, obviously there can be no arguments/accusations made based on such editing practices. In short, the law lacks its supporting reason in this case, therefore in this case no such law applies.

But if you insist and you feel your allegiances are with Boro, all you have to do is keep spamming even if we did keep deleting and that will just get tiresome (and call down wrath from above). I think perhaps we should just run this thing up near 1688 and leave it sit there (without editing), as Morm has to go to sleep at some point.

But it was being manipulated to give those who don't know all the roles information. Isn't that a reason?

[the phantom]

Fact is perhaps he played slightly too well. If he'd killed one less Wolf he'd be in position to lynch the Wolf today then take the game during the Night. That just shows- you don't want to be too good. You just need to be exactly good enough.

[McCaber]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Fact is perhaps he played slightly too well. If he'd killed one less Wolf he'd be in position to lynch the Wolf today then take the game during the Night. That just shows- you don't want to be too good. You just need to be exactly good enough.

He is, however, exactly where I wanted to be toDay. So that means I need to kill him out of spite.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Morm

But it was being manipulated to give those who don't know all the roles information. Isn't that a reason?

Well, seeing as those on the receiving end have zero access to any of the edited information in question, it could be argued that its a moot point.

Unless you are arguing that the editing of the post-count itself qualifies, but obviously when those rules were written none of us dreamed that the post count itself qualified as a means of communication.

Hmmm... Either way this is a brand new case. There's never been anything like this...

I can totally see what you're saying. Those that have access to the text are gaining nothing therefore editing rules don't apply, EXCEPT for the fact that the editing is meant only to change the reply number which everyone has access to, which may lead to an exchange of information via editing. Yes, in that case the rule applies. That's where you are coming from- I get it.

But at the same time, unique situation due to a unique game- spamming is obviously out of bounds and yet within Fea's Republic game it was encouraged (the Filibuster) as a creative gameplay technique. Similarly in this game, modeled after Mac and Rikae's game, the Mod is interested in seeing if the Dead can find unique ways to communicate with the Living (i.e. voting methods, same-player spamming, Europe players going quiet to signal hurry up, etc.) thus the editing may fall under the umbrella of game-specific technique. But perhaps the umbrella has been stretched too far...

Ah, but that's getting too technical and I'm content with your ruling- it has legs under it as the Reply count could signal information. That was the intent, certainly. We should just try for the next 88 per usual posting rules.

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by McCaber

He is, however, exactly where I wanted to be toDay. So that means I need to kill him out of spite.

You played well McCaber. I'm interested to learn what specifics Boro knew. The whole Lalaith kill still bothers me. It was too big a shot in the dark to be coincidence to me.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Morm

The whole Lalaith kill still bothers me. It was too big a shot in the dark to be coincidence to me.

That bothered me too, because at the time I didn't see why she would be ruled out by a Werebear type as the Seer, and yet in his reasoning for killing her he said she definitely didn't look Gifted. I'll have to dig it up after the game, but at that stage in the game she was a possible Gifted. At the time I was content to think, "Perhaps he isn't afraid of taking a shot because his ability only works on Wolves," but if he is a true WereBear then he obviously didn't care if he killed Gifteds (and why would she have been an obvious Wolf?).

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Well, seeing as those on the receiving end have zero access to any of the edited information in question, it could be argued that its a moot point.

Unless you are arguing that the editing of the post-count itself qualifies, but obviously when those rules were written none of us dreamed that the post count itself qualified as a means of communication.

Hmmm... Either way this is a brand new case. There's never been anything like this...

I can totally see what you're saying. Those that have access to the text are gaining nothing therefore editing rules don't apply, EXCEPT for the fact that the editing is meant only to change the reply number which everyone has access to, which may lead to an exchange of information via editing. Yes, in that case the rule applies. That's where you are coming from- I get it.

But at the same time, unique situation due to a unique game- spamming is obviously out of bounds and yet within Fea's Republic game it was encouraged (the Filibuster) as a creative gameplay technique. Similarly in this game, modeled after Mac and Rikae's game, the Mod is interested in seeing if the Dead can find unique ways to communicate with the Living (i.e. voting methods, same-player spamming, Europe players going quiet to signal hurry up, etc.) thus the editing may fall under the umbrella of game-specific technique. But perhaps the umbrella has been stretched too far...

Ah, but that's getting too technical and I'm content with your ruling- it has legs under it as the Reply count could signal information. That was the intent, certainly. We should just try for the next 88 per usual posting rules.

I get what you are saying and I'm wearing two hats here...one as a player (wants Boro to win) the other as forum moderator (wants rules to be followed). Yes you have my reasoning.

The player in me will keep spamming too. The moderator would defer to Kuru for his thoughts on the matter if this is okay in his game given the general rules. With that said I've been out of touch with WW for some time now and some conventions may have changed.

[Rikae]

Ok, I give up too, since everyone else (including Mac) has decided to do as morm says.

However, I do think it's not only acceptable to use this strategy, but, as I said, offensive and un-sportsmanlike to intimidate us into abandoning it with bad-faith accusations of rule breaking.

This was a fun game, but that turned it sour for me.

Oh well, I guess all we can do is:
++Shasta

and hope for the best.

EDIT: X'd with morm

[Nerwen]

++Shasta

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by Rikae

However, I do think it's not only acceptable to use this strategy, but, as I said, offensive and un-sportsmanlike to intimidate us into abandoning it with bad-faith accusations of rule breaking.

This was a fun game, but that turned it sour for me.

Rikae, no offense was meant and I apologize if I came across wrong. I did not intend to be intimidating, I was trying to sort out what it all meant and looking at it from the moderator perspective I had some questions I wanted to bring forward as from my perspective what was occurring was indeed breaking the rules.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by the phantom

That bothered me too, because at the time I didn't see why she would be ruled out by a Werebear type as the Seer, and yet in his reasoning for killing her he said she definitely didn't look Gifted. I'll have to dig it up after the game, but at that stage in the game she was a possible Gifted. At the time I was content to think, "Perhaps he isn't afraid of taking a shot because his ability only works on Wolves," but if he is a true WereBear then he obviously didn't care if he killed Gifteds (and why would she have been an obvious Wolf?).

Well, I had a pretty strong hunch she was a wolf, and nearly dreamed her the night she was killed- so it may have been only a lucky guess.

Still, multiply that by three and it's awfully good lucky guessing...
maybe as I suggested he could originally only kill wolves, but can now kill anyone.

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Well, I had a pretty strong hunch she was a wolf, and nearly dreamed her the night she was killed- so it may have been only a lucky guess.

Still, multiply that by three and it's awfully good lucky guessing...
maybe as I suggested he could originally only kill wolves, but can now kill anyone.

I wondered that too. I also was thinking he may have some sort of seer component to his role. That would be powerful indeed.

[the phantom]

By the way, I very much enjoyed the Cage and Power Rangers, etc. We're going to have to reread this a couple months from now just so we can get the laughs all over again.