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#1161 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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#1162 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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And this document was written by Sam?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1163 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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Er. Hmm.
Okay, apparently the answer is no; it (in its final form) postdates him. (And no, I don't mean 'by several thousand years because it was written by Tolkien' ![]() The answer is in two parts: "They all appear in _____, and have ______." hS |
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#1164 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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I wonder if this is something to do with founding a new surname, or bringing people into the world who do. (Fairbairn, Gardner). But I can't make it work. The same would be true of the Gaffer and Tolman Cotton.
Ah ... missed the clue. They all appear in the Appendix of Family Trees and ... They all marry a descendant of someone? Someone high up the Gamwich tree? ... No. Faramir Took does that as well.
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." Last edited by Pervinca Took; 06-13-2019 at 06:47 AM. |
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#1165 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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So what is the difference between these three and Faramir Took?
hS |
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#1166 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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I don't know. I think only the 10 day rule can save us on this one.
Goodchild was a surname JRRT considered for Sam. Did he consider Brown and Fairbairn as surnames for different or more important characters as well?
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." Last edited by Pervinca Took; 06-13-2019 at 10:23 AM. |
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#1167 | ||
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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Quote:
Quote:
hS |
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#1168 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
Posts: 5,035
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That's the thing ... I'd guess something like the King's letter to Samwise, but it's after Bell's time. Lily is probably still alive ... but if they're mentioned there in a 'son of' and 'daughter of' capacity for Sam and Rose, it would be unusual to either not name the other parent or to name the mothers instead of the fathers. Also, why would the King mention Fastred when I believe Elanor is still a child, although not a young one?
Was I right about the 'they are in' being a family tree/trees?
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." |
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#1169 | |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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Quote:
![]() Well, all 3 appear on the Longfather Tree of Master Samwise. Is that the document? I wish I could say they're the only 3 spouses mentioned, but 6 marriages are indicated on that document. ... whoops ... there are 7! Hob and Rowan. Rowan must have been a girl, then, unless the Shire was more forward-thinking than we thought.
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." Last edited by Pervinca Took; 06-14-2019 at 03:09 AM. |
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#1170 | |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
Posts: 5,035
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Quote:
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." |
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#1171 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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How about this?
They all appear in the Longfather Tree of Master Samwise AND They all three have a unique surname. 1. Bell is the only 'real' Goodchild ever mentioned (Christopher wouldn't let his dad make Sam a Goodchild ... so that was never *really* a character). 2. Lily Brown is the only Brown ever mentioned. 3. Fastred is the only 'of Greenholm' (is that a surname, like the Dutch ''Van" or the French "De?"), because his children and wife, and he himself, (supposedly upon his marriage), took the name of Fairbairn.
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." Last edited by Pervinca Took; 06-14-2019 at 03:38 AM. |
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#1172 | |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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Quote:
The Longfather Tree is the document I was looking for. I was phrasing the other part as 'they are the only person from their [birth] family ever named', but it comes to the same thing. Well done to both of you - Urwen got tantalisingly close - and over to Pervinca. hS |
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#1173 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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OK. I am using the answers and password from my last password puzzle, for which I am not willing to give away the theme until at least a couple of people have had a go at guessing.
With one caveat, which I will defend, I believe these are the only known characters to whom this applies. It's something that I would say is rarer in Tolkien's works than it is in 'real life.' There could have been many other cases, but if there were, Tolkien did not report them. Aragorn Luthien Idril Niniel Finwe Turin EDIT: If, once the theme is guessed, anyone can cite any further examples, I will add them with my apologies.
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." Last edited by Pervinca Took; 06-14-2019 at 04:32 AM. |
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#1174 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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Is it some kind of physical characteristic?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1175 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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Yes, they all had a sixth finger, like Anne Boleyn.
![]() Only kidding. No.
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." |
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#1176 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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I am drawing a blank here. :|
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1177 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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They all had magical powahs?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1178 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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Well ....
When you thought the password was couples, you were wrong, but you were closer, thematically, than the above two answers are.
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." |
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#1179 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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People who married golden-haired people?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1180 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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That is wrong for at least 3 of them.
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#1181 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
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Hmm.
It can't be to do with their children: Turin and Nienor never had any. It can't be their parents, because Finwe never had any (named). It can't be anything to do with their deaths, because Idril never did. Is it something to do with them all having two suitors (of varying degrees)? Aragorn has Arwen and Eowyn, Luthien had Daeron and Beren, Idril had Tuor and some elf who just doesn't get mentioned enough for me to remember his name ( ![]() But those last two kind of break it: while the other four had one they rejected and one they married, Finwe was married to both of them, and Turin didn't know both at the same time. If it is this, is your caveat Tar-Miriel? (Or Tar-Ancalime, who was a total fairytale princess when it comes to rejecting suitors.) hS |
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#1182 | |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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Quote:
How could you do this to me? ![]()
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1183 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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Also, new password is up.
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1184 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
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Huinesoron has the answer, more or less.
They were all loved (romantically) by two people, not just one. Not that common a thing in Tolkien. Only one of his characters even remarries, as far as I am aware. CAVEATS: I am not counting Finduilas. *She* loved Gwindor, then Turin, but I believe Turin only felt brotherly affection for *her*. (Don't shudder at this. He was blameless when it came to Niniel, unless you count not accepting 'No' the first time and ignoring Brandir's advice (IIRC)). I include Idril, because my gut feeling is that Maeglin did love her. I have a friend whose parents were first cousins. I'm not saying it's a good idea for such a thing to happen often. It isn't. But I am not grossed out by the idea of it happening occasionally. I exclude Eowyn, because I would definitely *not* dignify Grima's urges with the name of love. Ditto others who lusted after Luthien. Only 2 are presented as loving her. Are there any I have missed? I thought at first I was going to have to use Edith as an answer to have enough for a password (she had got engaged to another man by the time Tolkien was 21, but broke it off when Tolkien got back in touch with her and declared his feelings unchanged). EDIT: Do I have to include Ancalime? Was she *loved* by two or more men?
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." Last edited by Pervinca Took; 06-14-2019 at 05:13 AM. |
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#1185 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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Would you like to try the password now, Pervinca?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1186 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
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Also, which two people loved Turin?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1187 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
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Niniel and Finduilas.
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"Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." |
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#1188 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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In response to Huinesoron: Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin Maeglin
Is that enough for you, or do you need more? ![]()
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1189 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials
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And it's Huinesoron's turn again, of course. Forgot to say it.
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#1190 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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Give us a puzzle, Huinesoron.
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1191 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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Okay, let's try this one:
-Indis -Ancalime -Vorondil There may be other examples, but I can't come up with any right now. hS |
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#1192 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
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Is it something to do with spouses again? Because Vorondil had none.
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1193 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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#1194 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
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They all held a position which didn't exist beforehand?
They all had royal blood?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1195 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
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#1196 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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Can't think of anything else.
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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#1197 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
Posts: 5,379
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Oh wait. They all had a relative named Maeglin, did they not?
![]() Or maybe they all wore wool hats and spoke in southern Irish accents?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. Last edited by Urwen; 06-14-2019 at 07:27 AM. |
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#1198 |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The north-west of the Old World, east of the Sea
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#1199 | |
Overshadowed Eagle
Join Date: Nov 2017
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Quote:
-For Indis, this was Finwe's fault. -For Ancalime, it was Tar-Aldarion's. -For Vorondil, it was Earnil's. Of the guesses so far, Urwen's 'position which didn't exist beforehand' comes closest. hS |
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#1200 |
Spirit of Nen Lalaith
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Meneltarma
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They were both forced to act as regents in the absence of true ruler?
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Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia. |
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