Cryptic Clues - Page 28 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Ivriniel · 07-09-2015, 04:45 AM

I took twilight to mean 'twilight of Turumbar's people in the devastation of FA', as that part of the clue that was 'the real bit'.

Pervinca Took · 07-09-2015, 04:57 AM

Cryptic clues can sometimes work more like riddle clues, but usually they are more likely to be made up of anagrams and synonyms, etc of the words in the clue (with the straight part of the clue often being exactly what it seems to be).

Ivriniel · 07-09-2015, 04:58 AM

I'm learning. So, will look forwards to seeing what the answer is and reverse engineer

Pervinca Took · 07-09-2015, 06:26 AM

Why not have another go and learn on the job, so to speak?

Start with 'twilight.' What might you do with that, according to the conventions of cryptic clues?

Ivriniel · 07-09-2015, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took

He mingles twilight with doom, initially.

hahaha I have a mindsight headache hahaha

okay - I'll try. I'll think out loud for you to explain why the headache hahahah

'hmm, is 'mingles' one of their 'special' words, not like 'annexe' - which I thought, meant 'join this bit with that bit' and it sort of 'did' in that the creature thing 'ET' WAS joined to the suffix - but they meant 'by territory' not by 'special word'.

Hmmm, now - what about 'mingles'. It could then, 'pet word to join' or it could be 'one of those elfy metaphor things, you know, like 'mingled light of the two trees' and - really - mingles is really one those 'middle earthy words' used everywhere. You know, like 'numenoreans mingling with lesser men' and 'teleri mingling with sindarins in beleriand' and then - the mingling of elf and man!

Ah, is this then a 'half-elfy' thing. Um - could be. So, now I want to say

Undomiel. She was that twilight, or even star thing, 'mingling' of night and light and of blood. A double match!!! hahahaha

Hmm, but Umbar really meant 'doom', but then again Undomiel did have 'the doom of Mortal men.

I'm sure my reasoning is all wrong.

Undomiel! hahahah

Ivriniel · 07-09-2015, 06:55 AM

Or wait

Undome means twighlight, and Umbar means doom in Elvish.

Quote:

He mingles twilight with doom, initially

He mingles 'undome' with 'umbar', initially.

Mingles (anagram?)......"He" why HE? What on earth of an anagram can I possibly get out of either (twilight) or Undome. And then 'with' doom. Is the anagram on just 'undome' or on 'undome' AND 'umbar' or on the non-elfy words?

EDIT:

Seriously, I haven't stopped laughing for 15 minutes..........It can't possibly be Undomiel hahahaha she doesn't anagram out of the clue.

Mithalwen · 07-09-2015, 08:22 AM

He, I think, merely indicates that the answer is a male character. You are right about mingles suggesting an anagram. Initially suggests well just the initial of doom is needed too - but whether it is D or of a synonym or a translation I don't know..

Pervinca Took · 07-09-2015, 10:54 AM

'Mingles' might indeed mean 'mixes,' or becomes an anagram of itself.

But you might have to do something with the word first. It might not be a translation of it that you need, but a synonym. (I suppose a translation is a kind of synonym, in a way, but not the kind that you need here).

Galadriel55 · 07-09-2015, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ivriniel

Undome means twighlight, and Umbar means doom in Elvish.

Isn't it Ambar? As in TurAMBAR, aka Master of Fate. Or Amarth, as in the Gondorian name for Mount Doom (Amon Amarth).

But anyways, Pervinca said it's not a translation. I was trying to work in some anagram of gloom or dusk, with the former being more promising, but the closest I got to matching the clue was getting Olog-hai, which is pretty obviously not the answer. I can't make Gollum fit either. But maybe this will help one of you guys.

Pervinca Took · 07-10-2015, 04:17 PM

Galadriel, you're very close with your anagram ideas.

Sorry not to have replied sooner. I tried to get into the thread this morning, but couldn't. My laptop seems to have a problem getting into threads at times.

Galadriel55 · 07-10-2015, 09:02 PM

Ok, I keep trying different combinations without anywhere. I'm desperate enough to search up the different letter combinations on Encyclopedia of Arda to get something that fits. But in the meantime, to throw out another half-answer out there, is there a singular form for GOLODHRIM? I feel that it wouldn't have the M, though, so probably not it either.

Ivriniel · 07-10-2015, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Ok,...GOLODHRIM? ....

I've gottit! HAHAHA DUSKodhrim.....hahahaha

Arwen Duskomiel, or Arwen Gloomomiel (she was a bit that way inclined in the movies, anyway hahaha) (crying from laughter)

(seriously, 'just in case' I looked up "Olog-dhrim" - a elf/orc realm somewhere, I heard).

Mithalwen · 07-11-2015, 03:06 AM

Maglor is very nearly an anagram of gloam, an archaic, poetic word for twighlight. He certainly was doomed but I can't explain the R..

Pervinca Took · 07-11-2015, 04:55 AM

Mith, you are very, very, very close. Correct synonym, wrong character.

Mithalwen · 07-11-2015, 09:15 AM

I am not sure as not exactly a character but Wormtongue is Grima son of Galmod which is an anagram of gloam and the initial d of doom.

Pervinca Took · 07-11-2015, 12:49 PM

Correct. Galmod, father of Grima who became 'a witless worm,' so to speak.

Over to you.

07-09-2015, 04:57 AM	#1082
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	Cryptic clues can sometimes work more like riddle clues, but usually they are more likely to be made up of anagrams and synonyms, etc of the words in the clue (with the straight part of the clue often being exactly what it seems to be). __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

07-09-2015, 06:26 AM	#1084
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	Why not have another go and learn on the job, so to speak? Start with 'twilight.' What might you do with that, according to the conventions of cryptic clues? __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

07-09-2015, 08:22 AM	#1087
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,455	He, I think, merely indicates that the answer is a male character. You are right about mingles suggesting an anagram. Initially suggests well just the initial of doom is needed too - but whether it is D or of a synonym or a translation I don't know.. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

07-09-2015, 10:54 AM	#1088
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	'Mingles' might indeed mean 'mixes,' or becomes an anagram of itself. But you might have to do something with the word first. It might not be a translation of it that you need, but a synonym. (I suppose a translation is a kind of synonym, in a way, but not the kind that you need here). __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

07-10-2015, 04:17 PM	#1090
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	Galadriel, you're very close with your anagram ideas. Sorry not to have replied sooner. I tried to get into the thread this morning, but couldn't. My laptop seems to have a problem getting into threads at times. __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

07-09-2015, 04:45 AM	#1081
Ivriniel Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 430	I took twilight to mean 'twilight of Turumbar's people in the devastation of FA', as that part of the clue that was 'the real bit'.

07-09-2015, 04:58 AM	#1083
Ivriniel Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 430	I'm learning. So, will look forwards to seeing what the answer is and reverse engineer

07-10-2015, 09:02 PM	#1091
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,376	Ok, I keep trying different combinations without anywhere. I'm desperate enough to search up the different letter combinations on Encyclopedia of Arda to get something that fits. But in the meantime, to throw out another half-answer out there, is there a singular form for GOLODHRIM? I feel that it wouldn't have the M, though, so probably not it either. __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

07-11-2015, 03:06 AM	#1093
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,455	Maglor is very nearly an anagram of gloam, an archaic, poetic word for twighlight. He certainly was doomed but I can't explain the R.. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

07-11-2015, 04:55 AM	#1094
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	Mith, you are very, very, very close. Correct synonym, wrong character. __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

07-11-2015, 09:15 AM	#1095
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,455	I am not sure as not exactly a character but Wormtongue is Grima son of Galmod which is an anagram of gloam and the initial d of doom. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

07-11-2015, 12:49 PM	#1096
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	Correct. Galmod, father of Grima who became 'a witless worm,' so to speak. Over to you. __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always." Last edited by Pervinca Took; 07-12-2015 at 04:59 PM. Reason: To put the answer in bold