Lord of the Rings: Both sides of the argument - Page 2 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Eurytus · 12-09-2003, 03:50 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> it is obvious that he bases his opinions solely on the movies and not the books. What a complete and total retard. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> He may have views that I totally disagree with (for example holding up Star Wars as some paragon of excellence) but you can't exactly call him a retard because he based his opinion solely on the movies.He was reviewing the movie. What was he meant to do? The quality or otherwise of the book should not be a consideration when reviewing a movie.

Lord of Angmar · 12-09-2003, 05:07 PM

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, Arathor. It is up to us to ignore the opinions of the ignorant (which would make us, by definition, ignorant as well, but I digress). There is no need to verbally assault the writer simply because he is not as infatuated with the books and movies as some of us.This thread seems to be quite a bickering-ground. I have to agree with Esty on this one: Let's just wait until the movie comes out and judge for ourselves. Oscar Shmoscar. Why does Return of the King need an Oscar? To be added to the ranks of such greats as Chicago (sorry for the sarcasm, I'm not a fan of musicals... much less a fan of musicals featuring Richard Gere), Rocky and Dances With Wolves (really, can anyone take Costner seriously?). Well, that's my rather cynical two cents. Cheers, Angmar

**lindil** · 12-10-2003, 02:54 PM

"My thanks to you and your associate for sharing that with us, even if I did find the information it imparts dreadfully depressing."Your welcome Squatter, I am afraid I am of a similar mind to yourself...ArathorofBarahir: first off it is a 'she' and I find your manner of expressing disagreement deplorable. Please seriously consider rephrasing your remarks. I was about to send my friend the links to the threads wherein I included her link, but I would be ashamed to do so now.Saying that someone was 'trying hard to not like the movie because it differs from the books' is understandable critique [if erroneus imo] but to call them a 'complete and total retard' [or some such] I take as not only far out of line, but also pointed at me, because I had exactly the same sorts of responses myself when watching TTT . I posted as much on the Downs also, as did many others. So are all people here who critique PJ for his 'adaptations' to be labeled complete and total retards by you everytime we post on this subject? Anyway, I would strongly suggest that you post your reaction just as you would if the critic [jennifer I believe] was a board member. 'Nough said I hope...and I hope I have cause to be able to edit most of this post soon myself.[ 7:13 PM December 10, 2003: Message edited by: lindil ]

doug*platypus · 12-14-2003, 03:36 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> plot holes you could ride a mumak through <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>LOL!! Great call on the disappearance of any kind of reasonable flow from the TTT movie. Thanks for the link, Lindil, although I have to admit that I didn't read it through. I want to be forewarned about any nassty surprises, but I also don't want a blow-by-blow account of the entire ROTK movie.It was great to hear from this reviewer, however, and from a lot of people here on the Downs. Most people I know (with the exception of one or two, and soon a few more that have nearly finished reading the books) are just gobsmacked by the movies. They can't know like most of us do how great the potential was for some incredible movies instead of some very good ones. For Tolkien fans, the PJ versions have been a mixed blessing at best. Honestly? I hope he and Fran Walsh stay well away from The Hobbit and most especially The Silmarillion.

doug*platypus · 12-16-2003, 09:54 PM

Well, it's now three days after my last post, and yes I have succumbed. Three more days was all it took for complete spoilage in my case. And boy! am I glad I spoiled!!Some of the changes that Jennifer points out in her review are just atrocious! I think that it will largely be more of the same from ROTK. Changes that don't make sense (Sam actually leaves for home, a walk of some thousand miles?!), nauseating dialogue, dumbed-down characters and incredible special effects. I am disappointed about Valinor not being in there. I thought that this was one of the places where a movie could have really outdone or added to the book. But maybe it is after all best left up to the imagination. It will be nice, though to have everything wrapped up, and to see our beloved Shire again. The Grey Havens sounds like a beautiful scene, and I suppose that's what matters most as it is the last impression we will be left with. Apart from Annie Lennox!

Eurytus · 12-17-2003, 03:13 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Some of the changes that Jennifer points out in her review are just atrocious! I think that it will largely be more of the same from ROTK. Changes that don't make sense (Sam actually leaves for home, a walk of some thousand miles?!), nauseating dialogue, dumbed-down characters and incredible special effects. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Then a very easy solution would be to simply not go and see it and spare yourself the pain of watching such an atrocious piece of work.

12-09-2003, 03:50 PM	#41
Eurytus Wight Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: England Posts: 179	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> it is obvious that he bases his opinions solely on the movies and not the books. What a complete and total retard. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>He may have views that I totally disagree with (for example holding up Star Wars as some paragon of excellence) but you can't exactly call him a retard because he based his opinion solely on the movies.<P>He was reviewing the movie. What was he meant to do? The quality or otherwise of the book should not be a consideration when reviewing a movie. __________________ "This is the most blatant case of false advertising since my suit against the movie The Neverending Story!" Lionel Hutz

12-09-2003, 05:07 PM	#42
Lord of Angmar Tyrannus Incorporalis Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: the North Posts: 833	Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, Arathor. It is up to us to ignore the opinions of the ignorant (which would make us, by definition, ignorant as well, but I digress). There is no need to verbally assault the writer simply because he is not as infatuated with the books and movies as some of us.<P>This thread seems to be quite a bickering-ground. I have to agree with Esty on this one: Let's just wait until the movie comes out and judge for ourselves. Oscar Shmoscar. Why does <I>Return of the King</I> need an Oscar? To be added to the ranks of such greats as <I>Chicago</I> (sorry for the sarcasm, I'm not a fan of musicals... much less a fan of musicals featuring Richard Gere), <I>Rocky</I> and <I>Dances With Wolves</I> (really, can anyone take Costner seriously?). Well, that's my rather cynical two cents. <P>Cheers,<BR>Angmar __________________ ...where the instrument of intelligence is added to brute power and evil will, mankind is powerless in its own defence.

12-10-2003, 02:54 PM	#43
lindil Seeker of the Straight Path Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: a hidden fastness in Big Valley nor cal Posts: 1,680	"My thanks to you and your associate for sharing that with us, even if I did find the information it imparts dreadfully depressing."<P>Your welcome Squatter, I am afraid I am of a similar mind to yourself...<P>ArathorofBarahir: first off it is a 'she' and I find your manner of expressing disagreement deplorable. Please seriously consider rephrasing your remarks. <P>I was about to send my friend the links to the threads wherein I included her link, but I would be ashamed to do so now.<P>Saying that someone was 'trying hard to not like the movie because it differs from the books' is understandable critique [if erroneus imo] but to call them a 'complete and total retard' [or some such] I take as not only far out of line, but also pointed at me, because I had exactly the same sorts of responses myself when watching TTT . I posted as much on the Downs also, as did many others.<P> So are all people here who critique PJ for his 'adaptations' to be labeled complete and total retards by you everytime we post on this subject? <P>Anyway, I would strongly suggest that you post your reaction just as you would if the critic [jennifer I believe] was a board member. 'Nough said I hope...and I hope I have cause to be able to edit most of this post soon myself.<p>[ 7:13 PM December 10, 2003: Message edited by: lindil ] __________________ The dwindling Men of the West would often sit up late into the night exchanging lore & wisdom such as they still possessed that they should not fall back into the mean estate of those who never knew or indeed rebelled against the Light.

12-14-2003, 03:36 PM	#44
doug*platypus Delver in the Deep Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Aotearoa Posts: 960	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> plot holes you could ride a mumak through <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>LOL!! Great call on the disappearance of any kind of reasonable flow from the TTT movie. Thanks for the link, Lindil, although I have to admit that I didn't read it through. I want to be forewarned about any nassty surprises, but I also don't want a blow-by-blow account of the entire ROTK movie.<P>It was great to hear from this reviewer, however, and from a lot of people here on the Downs. Most people I know (with the exception of one or two, and soon a few more that have nearly finished reading the books) are just gobsmacked by the movies. They can't know like most of us do how great the potential was for some incredible movies instead of some very good ones. For Tolkien fans, the PJ versions have been a mixed blessing at best. Honestly? I hope he and Fran Walsh stay well away from The Hobbit and <B>most especially</B> The Silmarillion. __________________ But Gwindor answered: 'The doom lies in yourself, not in your name'.

12-16-2003, 09:54 PM	#45
doug*platypus Delver in the Deep Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Aotearoa Posts: 960	Well, it's now three days after my last post, and yes I have succumbed. Three more days was all it took for complete spoilage in my case. And boy! am I glad I spoiled!!<P>Some of the changes that Jennifer points out in her review are just atrocious! I think that it will largely be more of the same from ROTK. Changes that don't make sense (Sam actually leaves for home, a walk of some thousand miles?!), nauseating dialogue, dumbed-down characters and incredible special effects. <P>I am disappointed about Valinor not being in there. I thought that this was one of the places where a movie could have really outdone or added to the book. But maybe it is after all best left up to the imagination. It will be nice, though to have everything wrapped up, and to see our beloved Shire again. The Grey Havens sounds like a beautiful scene, and I suppose that's what matters most as it is the last impression we will be left with. Apart from Annie Lennox! __________________ But Gwindor answered: 'The doom lies in yourself, not in your name'.

12-17-2003, 03:13 AM	#46
Eurytus Wight Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: England Posts: 179	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Some of the changes that Jennifer points out in her review are just atrocious! I think that it will largely be more of the same from ROTK. Changes that don't make sense (Sam actually leaves for home, a walk of some thousand miles?!), nauseating dialogue, dumbed-down characters and incredible special effects. <P> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Then a very easy solution would be to simply not go and see it and spare yourself the pain of watching such an atrocious piece of work. __________________ "This is the most blatant case of false advertising since my suit against the movie The Neverending Story!" Lionel Hutz