Tapestry of Dreams, Part 2 Discussion - Page 18 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Feanor of the Peredhil · 03-31-2008, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Certainly. But that means that I'll have to bug you in a few years and ask if you want to write it.

I'll leave you a trail of breadcrumbs to follow. I'm leaving the forum, not the people. I like y'all way too much just to go.

mark12_30 · 03-31-2008, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. Tharonwë. I'm leaning toward no redemption. I can see him having a Saruman-like death.

Hmm, from your latest post methinks you have sniffed something out that I meant to stay hid. Perhaps 'twill be even better with Tharonwe woven in to the finale.

littlemanpoet · 04-01-2008, 08:55 AM

Fea, my thoughts exactly.

Helen: huh?!? Something I sniffed out? What, that Amroth and Nimrodel are united in the Halls of Mandos? Well son of a gun! Or is that wrong? Do tell!!!

mark12_30 · 04-02-2008, 07:57 PM

Well, yeah, what you said. The thing is, Nimrodel is too broken to take ship alone. Amroth can't take her, because he can't "take" Mellondu. Erebemlin could escort her there I suppose but his heart is in Middle-earth now, with Marigold. Anyway, she's too messed up. Mithrellas could take her but Mithrellas has Roy Edwards, on the other hand, to deal with. Or something.

Nimrodel needs a new start; a rebirth. That she can have, if she dies; her rebirth (reincarnation, via new parents, and a new family, elvish style) will be a healing experience for her. And Amroth will then be free to do the same. THey will have a lovely future, all healed up and young again.

THe trick is getting Nimrodel to finally die and go to Mandos. (Amroth is still there, really, having drownded quite thoroughly.) And since elves can only either be killed, or die of a broken heart, well, we have some options for getting Nimrodel to join him. I had planned on the broken-heart bit. But we can discuss it.

littlemanpoet · 04-03-2008, 08:50 AM

Hmmm... so that means Tharonwë is not thinking clearly, or he would know that sending Nimrodel to Mandos is merely sending her to Amroth. Would Tharonwe be that foolish? Is evil that blind? I suppose so, once bitterness and hatred take over that completely. I guess it works, rather neatly. Feels like almost too neatly.

So does Tharonwe try to kill Mellondu himself? That was his original intention.

mark12_30 · 04-03-2008, 05:49 PM

Hmmm, you're right, it is a little TOO neat. Besides, he wants her for himself. It seems more likely that he would try to kill Mellondu to get her for himself.

Maybe he just unintentionally pushes her heart to the snapping point, with some thoughtless cruelty aimed at some one else..

Perhaps by trying to kill Mellondu.

I should say, that Amroth knows that Nimrodel will have to die in order for them to be together.

littlemanpoet · 04-06-2008, 05:38 PM

I'm glad I left Nimrodel to you. I had not imagined her aged. I had imagined Tharonwe rushing to her to take her in his hands and threaten to end her life. He will of course be completely disgusted by the change in her, and overcome with revulsion, who knows what he wll do? I will think on it.

mark12_30 · 04-06-2008, 06:01 PM

I think there's plenty of options...

Brainstorms over dishwashing to follow, in no particular order.

Edit: I had posted them but removed them to PM just on thhe off chance that maybe SOMEBODY is reading this. Or might. (Anybody out there?)

littlemanpoet · 04-08-2008, 08:35 AM

If Fea cannot write for Indil and April 10 comes and goes, I will take her over, more's the pity.

Feanor of the Peredhil · 04-08-2008, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

If Fea cannot write for Indil and April 10 comes and goes, I will take her over, more's the pity.

I'm in the middle of my finals week, having a nasty allergic reaction to B&G puttering with gardens (either that or I caught my roomie's cold). I'm taking a five minute break from a final paper on Conrad's Heart of Darkness (due in the morning), then I need to study for a sit-down lit test I have tomorrow morning (passage identification: title, author, literary/cultural significance; terminology identification as well), and I have a painting due tonight I haven't started, and a final drawing due 'before I leave' which is Thursday.

I should be able to fit one more post in before I'm off the charts (Thursday afternoon), particularly if I know what you have in mind, but I won't be able to do it until after 11am tomorrow.

I wish I could stick around, but if ever there was a writer I trust with my RP characters, it's you, Elempi.

littlemanpoet · 04-08-2008, 03:58 PM

Thanks for your trust, Fea. I will do my best to honor it. Take care of yourself. I imagine I've put your creative abilities in a bit of a pickle, asking you to think Angela in Indil's brain. I'll help if you want. Let me know.

Feanor of the Peredhil · 04-08-2008, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Thanks for your trust, Fea. I will do my best to honor it. Take care of yourself. I imagine I've put your creative abilities in a bit of a pickle, asking you to think Angela in Indil's brain. I'll help if you want. Let me know.

Help is always appreciated. If you want to co-post, I can check my PMs pretty obsessive compulsively. I have the time for snippets, especially with help. It's only troublesome trying to organize my mind into a solid post entirely of my own doing.

And I don't really know if drinking a caramel frappucchino is taking care of myself, but it definitely makes me feel better.

As does the fact that tonight I bought an anthology of southern vampire stories. Yay for folklore on sale at Barnes and Noble. I'm just not allowed to read it until AFTER finals are done.

littlemanpoet · 04-09-2008, 03:56 AM

Ok, I've started a PM post to Fea.

Feanor of the Peredhil · 04-10-2008, 11:38 AM

It's time for me to go, and it's a pity I didn't get to finish before the time came.

You guys can find me at http://aliquisa.livejournal.com, and I lurk on Facebook and Myspace (you can track me through other 'Downers). I'll be findable.

I'm sorry I couldn't stay longer, and I just wanted to let you all know, I loved working with you.

-Fea/Laura

mark12_30 · 04-10-2008, 05:11 PM

All the best, Fea, and God's blessing on you. We will miss you. Enjoy your new road.

littlemanpoet · 04-10-2008, 07:36 PM

Fea-Laura, I will miss your creative touch here. I will with sadness but no regret take over Angela/Indil; no regret because you have done so well and I have much resource to draw from. Thanks so much for your willingness with the character. You will not be forgotten, and I will keep you in my sights down the road. Take care. Who knows what the future may bring?

-Paul/Elempi

Well, Helen, it's pretty much just you and me from here on out, there not being much I can see for Bergil to do except willingly give Indil into Raefindan's and Mithrellas' care during the denouement.

So I don't really have that strict a deadline now. None of my rpgs have wrapped up yet, and I don't see the necessity of this being the first one to finish. Not that I want it to drag on, but it can take the time it needs.

The way I see it, there is a post coming from me yet that involves Indil/Angela, Roy/Raefindan, and Mithrellas; while they are preoccupied with their triangular drama they will be somewhat oblivious to the troubles Tharonwe imposes upon Nimrodel and Amroth. I can write two posts in that regard, one from the perspective of Roy, and the other from Tharonwe. The one from Tharonwe will require more thought as I'm not sure just what he hopes to achieve if not killing Nimrodel and himself. He's not such a fool that he won't eventually see that by killing Nimrodel he sends her into a future with Amroth, so I'm not sure what he'll try to do next. Probably try to kill Mellondu outright.

What direction do you expect to take in your next posts?

mark12_30 · 04-11-2008, 07:59 PM

Simply put: currently Amroth is standing on the shores of sanity, calling to Nimrodel. SHe's not responding. He will draw back, gather strength, and follow her into her madness, in order to meet her in the depths of it and finally bring her back.

I envision it to be a kind of retracing of her steps-- whether in reverse chronological order or in normal chronological order I hadn't decided: but since they've all been dreaming about bits and peices of her life til now, it will pull all the tapestry threads tighter, and perhaps form the whole picture and make everyone's part in it clear. I hope.

It would have been so much easier to have each character's writer taking part. I miss everyone keenly now. But there it is. I could wish for a dream-summary but I do not have the time this month to reread the whole RPG, so I will have to just do the best I can.
\
Mithrellas should be a large part of the warp and woof. BUt I am not sure how to approach that. A constant stream of self-sacrifice has been coming from her, for a thousand years. That should be huge. SHould be huge. Should be. How do we make it enough? Amroth's debt to Mithrellas-- well, I don't know. Perhaps it might cross his mind that if only she had been alone she might have gone on to Mandos a long time ago, and met him there. But then, he's too noble to let that stew for long; he'd set it aside. I hope. RIght?

mark12_30 · 04-11-2008, 08:04 PM

Should I wait for the post from you and Fea?

littlemanpoet · 04-12-2008, 12:57 PM

Our PM post never got started, so it's up to you and me. I'll write as the inspiration comes. You do the same. We'll see how it threads together. Since there's only two of us (for all practical purposes) we can edit in whatever we want wherever we want.

As far as researching dreams, perhaps an advanced Search on dreams might be doable with a very tight "from-to" set. That way we may be able to access what we need without having to search the entire haystack.

Regarding Mithrellas, I recently learned something important about the nature of self-sacrifice. It goes like this: Jesus was able to face his passion & crucifixion on 2 bases: (1) his love for us, and (2) they joy that awaited him. Remember, he gave up all the glory of his deity when he came, so he faced it as a human without sin. Similarly, Aragorn was able to live a long life of self-sacrifice for love of Gondor, Hobbits, Arwen, Gandalf, and many others; and for the joy that awaited him once all was achieved.

So we have precedent from two good sources for Mithrellas. If she is nothing else, she is strong. She has been able to keep her hope alive throughout a millenium of her Lady's despair, and she has been able to keep her mind safe from the wiles of Tharonwe; not only the wiles, but he didn't even know she existed! That is strong! And noble! And pure. Holy, even. You do see where I'm going with this?

mark12_30 · 04-12-2008, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

So we have precedent from two good sources for Mithrellas. If she is nothing else, she is strong. She has been able to keep her hope alive throughout a millenium of her Lady's despair, and she has been able to keep her mind safe from the wiles of Tharonwe; not only the wiles, but he didn't even know she existed! That is strong! And noble! And pure. Holy, even. You do see where I'm going with this?

Not yet, but I think that wherever you are going, I think I like it a lot.

littlemanpoet · 04-18-2008, 07:41 AM

Should I post next for Tharonwe and/or Raefindan and/or Indil?

How do you see what's next?

mark12_30 · 04-21-2008, 06:18 PM

Yup.

I see Amroth and Erebemlin essentially coming up for air, recognising that they weren't getting very far, deciding to "go in after her" (I need an elvish way to say that) and follow Nimrodel into the grim darkness, like Aragorn did with Eowyn and Faramir. Only, with Nimrodel having been there a long time, it will be a long slow journey.

It can progress through all those dreams. I think that's the best roadmap for us to take. All the tentacles, drownings, ash, despair, accusations, railing against the Valar... etc. Amroth nowhere to be found in all of it. Avarien's departure; Gwyllion's gruesome departure. All of that should weave in.

littlemanpoet · 04-21-2008, 06:37 PM

I'm feeling at sea and rather intimidated. Maybe it's I'm tired and am not quite ready for such a load of research into past posts. Yike. I'm not even sure what Tharonwe would even want to try to do. See, he's disgusted by Nimrodel's agedness, for he himself has not aged, as such. So his love (greed/lust, whatever) has been swallowed up by disgust and hatred. So now he actually hates both Amroth and Nimrodel, and does not want her for himself after all, but just wants to defeat them both, precisely because all he has attempted in all of this has turned to ashes, though caused by his own deeds. That doesn't matter to him. But how on earth can he defeat them both? Not by killing them. The only way he can think of (I can think of) is to doom Amroth to a forever searching for Nimrodel in the depths of wherever she is - some kind of limbo. Tharonwe has developed his osanwe with the addition of hypnosis now, and that should be a powerful tool.... somehow. But that's the best I can do, for him. Raefindan is by contrast easy. He will simply attempt to defeat whatever Tharonwe tries to do.

Thoughts?

mark12_30 · 04-21-2008, 07:04 PM

Hey, I'm good at angst and the brink of despair. Bring it on.

Raefindan-- he will fight it, being a good sort, but surely-- if Amroth and Erebemlin are following her (porposefully) into the heart of all her darkness, Raefindan can't-- nor would he-- fend everything off that Tharonwe tries to throw at them.

There's couselling like that; bringing the victim into the heart of their darkness-- mentally returning to the crime scene at the time of the crime-- and THEN looking for Jesus in the midst of it, and sensing the freedom he brings. But the mental return to the crime scene is never easy. There's plenty of darkness there.

Tharonwe (here) can play thepart of the accuser very easily. If Amroth gets immersed in NImrodel's despair, and Nimrodel stays stuck in it, then they both lose. He doesn't have to kill them; their madness will be even better. And if even Erebemlin gets lost in the dark?

They will be walking back through all of Nimrodel's anguish. They will not find Amroth in any of it, not until they get back to the root of it (although echoes of the root's accusations will be howling all the time, she can't be free from it til she gets to the root itself.

Raefindan can't hope to solve any of it for Nimrodel; she has to hear the truth herself, back at the root of her lies. But he can provide some light-rays for Amroth and Erebemlin.

We can do this one dream at a time. THe first scene they recollect, and travel through, could be her travel into the vale they are in now, with its ghosts. There was also ice there, until recently. And it was full of Tharonwe's lies. We could start there.... ice. Hmm, which post was that...

mark12_30 · 04-21-2008, 07:32 PM

OK< I did some skimming. Mostly, lately, thedreams have been about Roy and indil. SO mightn't it be appropriate if the first working backward part --- or maybe even the intro to it-- was more about Mithrellas, Imrazor, INdil, Roy, Angela?

It would set the stage as to why Indil (Angela) was the answer to Avarien's searching. (Which I admit I'm currently a bit fuzzy on, but it's working/worked.) Amroth and Erebemlin can rest up, a little, & Ravion, Mellonin, and Nethwador too, while part of the indil story is told.

Maybe it begins with Tharonwe's resentment, and his need to remain important/ influential desite his sudden loss of interest in Nimrodel? Maybe it's time to flesh out the dark elf and explain his twistedness to the audience?

littlemanpoet · 04-22-2008, 03:54 AM

Can we handle these posts via PM? I think I can do better in a collaboration by interacting with what you write, instead of posting separately. I'm busy all day today, but tomorrow looks better. But PM me as soon as you like if this sounds good to you.

littlemanpoet · 04-23-2008, 08:58 AM

How about if we built these posts via email? I'll get started unless you beat me to it.

mark12_30 · 04-24-2008, 07:02 PM

WHile in theory I would be delighted, however, I will be away from my daytime email for the next month.

I have been working like a doggie, offsite, all week. It will continue til the end of May/ beginning of June.

Hopefully May will be slightlyless consuming than End-Of-April is. Consolation: it's really fun. Translation: email me at cox, til June.

mark12_30 · 04-28-2008, 08:09 PM

Ah, lmp, it's good! Can't reply tonight, but will ponder this.

mark12_30 · 05-14-2008, 02:29 PM

lmp-- I'm theoretically up for writing, just kind of bowled over with life right now. It would be good therapy. Maybe one of these days at 2 am when I can't sleep for worrying about work.

littlemanpoet · 05-14-2008, 08:23 PM

We're so close to the end, and my other rpgs will not be done any time soon. So we can take the time this needs to take. Hope you like what I've been up to with Tharonwe lately....

mark12_30 · 05-15-2008, 04:56 AM

Yes, brilliant. Which is good, because it (you) is/are holding my interest even if I'm not responding...

I'm eye-deep in research, at work, and it's a hug3e struggle. All my energy is going into that.

littlemanpoet · 05-22-2008, 03:54 AM

Wow, Helen! That was some post! Not sure how to follow that up unless from Tharonwe's point of view.

littlemanpoet · 05-24-2008, 05:44 AM

Fascinating posts, Helen.

Tharonwe will bide his time as described in my last post.

Do you need help with what the others can do to help? Or do you have a sense for it?

mark12_30 · 05-24-2008, 11:15 AM

Dive in! I don't have much of a sense for the team-mates at all. Nethwador's awkward but heartfelt attempts are about all i have clear vision for. GUess I should review back a bit on the discussion thread...

littlemanpoet · 05-24-2008, 02:20 PM

littlemanpoet · 05-24-2008, 03:41 PM

mark12_30 · 05-25-2008, 04:23 AM

AWESOME!! Thanks thanks thanks.

I don't think I used the word 'dream' very often, but I know many did....

Remember the songfests during the early days? I don't think we need to review and include e v e r y t h i n g. But there were some Moments in there.

littlemanpoet · 05-25-2008, 06:08 AM

Okay, I think it would be fun to do this for the songs too. I'm going to tabulate the links according to who dreamt and who sang, so you'll want to keep an eye on those two posts plus the new ones with song links.

mark12_30 · 05-27-2008, 05:40 AM

Pardon me while I take a moment to publicly hope Alak will return. Helloooo, Alak?

lmp, those linked lists (HEE HEE HEE programmers joke) are great. I have poked at a few links and will try to do more shortly.

04-02-2008, 07:57 PM	#684
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Well, yeah, what you said. The thing is, Nimrodel is too broken to take ship alone. Amroth can't take her, because he can't "take" Mellondu. Erebemlin could escort her there I suppose but his heart is in Middle-earth now, with Marigold. Anyway, she's too messed up. Mithrellas could take her but Mithrellas has Roy Edwards, on the other hand, to deal with. Or something. Nimrodel needs a new start; a rebirth. That she can have, if she dies; her rebirth (reincarnation, via new parents, and a new family, elvish style) will be a healing experience for her. And Amroth will then be free to do the same. THey will have a lovely future, all healed up and young again. THe trick is getting Nimrodel to finally die and go to Mandos. (Amroth is still there, really, having drownded quite thoroughly.) And since elves can only either be killed, or die of a broken heart, well, we have some options for getting Nimrodel to join him. I had planned on the broken-heart bit. But we can discuss it. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve. Last edited by mark12_30; 04-02-2008 at 08:01 PM. Reason: seplling

04-03-2008, 05:49 PM	#686
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Hmmm, you're right, it is a little TOO neat. Besides, he wants her for himself. It seems more likely that he would try to kill Mellondu to get her for himself. Maybe he just unintentionally pushes her heart to the snapping point, with some thoughtless cruelty aimed at some one else.. Perhaps by trying to kill Mellondu. I should say, that Amroth knows that Nimrodel will have to die in order for them to be together. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-06-2008, 06:01 PM	#688
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	I think there's plenty of options... Brainstorms over dishwashing to follow, in no particular order. Edit: I had posted them but removed them to PM just on thhe off chance that maybe SOMEBODY is reading this. Or might. (Anybody out there?) __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve. Last edited by mark12_30; 04-06-2008 at 07:22 PM.

04-10-2008, 11:38 AM	#694
Feanor of the Peredhil La Belle Dame sans Merci Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: perpetual uncertainty Posts: 5,517	Breadcrumbs It's time for me to go, and it's a pity I didn't get to finish before the time came. You guys can find me at http://aliquisa.livejournal.com, and I lurk on Facebook and Myspace (you can track me through other 'Downers). I'll be findable. I'm sorry I couldn't stay longer, and I just wanted to let you all know, I loved working with you. -Fea/Laura __________________ peace

04-10-2008, 05:11 PM	#695
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	All the best, Fea, and God's blessing on you. We will miss you. Enjoy your new road. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-01-2008, 08:55 AM	#683
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Fea, my thoughts exactly. Helen: huh?!? Something I sniffed out? What, that Amroth and Nimrodel are united in the Halls of Mandos? Well son of a gun! Or is that wrong? Do tell!!!

04-03-2008, 08:50 AM	#685
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Hmmm... so that means Tharonwë is not thinking clearly, or he would know that sending Nimrodel to Mandos is merely sending her to Amroth. Would Tharonwe be that foolish? Is evil that blind? I suppose so, once bitterness and hatred take over that completely. I guess it works, rather neatly. Feels like almost too neatly. So does Tharonwe try to kill Mellondu himself? That was his original intention.

04-06-2008, 05:38 PM	#687
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	I'm glad I left Nimrodel to you. I had not imagined her aged. I had imagined Tharonwe rushing to her to take her in his hands and threaten to end her life. He will of course be completely disgusted by the change in her, and overcome with revulsion, who knows what he wll do? I will think on it.

04-08-2008, 08:35 AM	#689
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	If Fea cannot write for Indil and April 10 comes and goes, I will take her over, more's the pity.

04-08-2008, 03:58 PM	#691
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Thanks for your trust, Fea. I will do my best to honor it. Take care of yourself. I imagine I've put your creative abilities in a bit of a pickle, asking you to think Angela in Indil's brain. I'll help if you want. Let me know.

04-09-2008, 03:56 AM	#693
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Ok, I've started a PM post to Fea.

04-10-2008, 07:36 PM	#696
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Fea-Laura, I will miss your creative touch here. I will with sadness but no regret take over Angela/Indil; no regret because you have done so well and I have much resource to draw from. Thanks so much for your willingness with the character. You will not be forgotten, and I will keep you in my sights down the road. Take care. Who knows what the future may bring? -Paul/Elempi Well, Helen, it's pretty much just you and me from here on out, there not being much I can see for Bergil to do except willingly give Indil into Raefindan's and Mithrellas' care during the denouement. So I don't really have that strict a deadline now. None of my rpgs have wrapped up yet, and I don't see the necessity of this being the first one to finish. Not that I want it to drag on, but it can take the time it needs. The way I see it, there is a post coming from me yet that involves Indil/Angela, Roy/Raefindan, and Mithrellas; while they are preoccupied with their triangular drama they will be somewhat oblivious to the troubles Tharonwe imposes upon Nimrodel and Amroth. I can write two posts in that regard, one from the perspective of Roy, and the other from Tharonwe. The one from Tharonwe will require more thought as I'm not sure just what he hopes to achieve if not killing Nimrodel and himself. He's not such a fool that he won't eventually see that by killing Nimrodel he sends her into a future with Amroth, so I'm not sure what he'll try to do next. Probably try to kill Mellondu outright. What direction do you expect to take in your next posts? Last edited by littlemanpoet; 04-10-2008 at 07:45 PM.

04-11-2008, 07:59 PM	#697
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Simply put: currently Amroth is standing on the shores of sanity, calling to Nimrodel. SHe's not responding. He will draw back, gather strength, and follow her into her madness, in order to meet her in the depths of it and finally bring her back. I envision it to be a kind of retracing of her steps-- whether in reverse chronological order or in normal chronological order I hadn't decided: but since they've all been dreaming about bits and peices of her life til now, it will pull all the tapestry threads tighter, and perhaps form the whole picture and make everyone's part in it clear. I hope. It would have been so much easier to have each character's writer taking part. I miss everyone keenly now. But there it is. I could wish for a dream-summary but I do not have the time this month to reread the whole RPG, so I will have to just do the best I can. \ Mithrellas should be a large part of the warp and woof. BUt I am not sure how to approach that. A constant stream of self-sacrifice has been coming from her, for a thousand years. That should be huge. SHould be huge. Should be. How do we make it enough? Amroth's debt to Mithrellas-- well, I don't know. Perhaps it might cross his mind that if only she had been alone she might have gone on to Mandos a long time ago, and met him there. But then, he's too noble to let that stew for long; he'd set it aside. I hope. RIght? __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-11-2008, 08:04 PM	#698
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Should I wait for the post from you and Fea? __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-12-2008, 12:57 PM	#699
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Our PM post never got started, so it's up to you and me. I'll write as the inspiration comes. You do the same. We'll see how it threads together. Since there's only two of us (for all practical purposes) we can edit in whatever we want wherever we want. As far as researching dreams, perhaps an advanced Search on dreams might be doable with a very tight "from-to" set. That way we may be able to access what we need without having to search the entire haystack. Regarding Mithrellas, I recently learned something important about the nature of self-sacrifice. It goes like this: Jesus was able to face his passion & crucifixion on 2 bases: (1) his love for us, and (2) they joy that awaited him. Remember, he gave up all the glory of his deity when he came, so he faced it as a human without sin. Similarly, Aragorn was able to live a long life of self-sacrifice for love of Gondor, Hobbits, Arwen, Gandalf, and many others; and for the joy that awaited him once all was achieved. So we have precedent from two good sources for Mithrellas. If she is nothing else, she is strong. She has been able to keep her hope alive throughout a millenium of her Lady's despair, and she has been able to keep her mind safe from the wiles of Tharonwe; not only the wiles, but he didn't even know she existed! That is strong! And noble! And pure. Holy, even. You do see where I'm going with this?

04-18-2008, 07:41 AM	#701
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Should I post next for Tharonwe and/or Raefindan and/or Indil? How do you see what's next?

04-21-2008, 06:18 PM	#702
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Yup. I see Amroth and Erebemlin essentially coming up for air, recognising that they weren't getting very far, deciding to "go in after her" (I need an elvish way to say that) and follow Nimrodel into the grim darkness, like Aragorn did with Eowyn and Faramir. Only, with Nimrodel having been there a long time, it will be a long slow journey. It can progress through all those dreams. I think that's the best roadmap for us to take. All the tentacles, drownings, ash, despair, accusations, railing against the Valar... etc. Amroth nowhere to be found in all of it. Avarien's departure; Gwyllion's gruesome departure. All of that should weave in. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-21-2008, 06:37 PM	#703
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	I'm feeling at sea and rather intimidated. Maybe it's I'm tired and am not quite ready for such a load of research into past posts. Yike. I'm not even sure what Tharonwe would even want to try to do. See, he's disgusted by Nimrodel's agedness, for he himself has not aged, as such. So his love (greed/lust, whatever) has been swallowed up by disgust and hatred. So now he actually hates both Amroth and Nimrodel, and does not want her for himself after all, but just wants to defeat them both, precisely because all he has attempted in all of this has turned to ashes, though caused by his own deeds. That doesn't matter to him. But how on earth can he defeat them both? Not by killing them. The only way he can think of (I can think of) is to doom Amroth to a forever searching for Nimrodel in the depths of wherever she is - some kind of limbo. Tharonwe has developed his osanwe with the addition of hypnosis now, and that should be a powerful tool.... somehow. But that's the best I can do, for him. Raefindan is by contrast easy. He will simply attempt to defeat whatever Tharonwe tries to do. Thoughts?

04-21-2008, 07:04 PM	#704
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Hey, I'm good at angst and the brink of despair. Bring it on. Raefindan-- he will fight it, being a good sort, but surely-- if Amroth and Erebemlin are following her (porposefully) into the heart of all her darkness, Raefindan can't-- nor would he-- fend everything off that Tharonwe tries to throw at them. There's couselling like that; bringing the victim into the heart of their darkness-- mentally returning to the crime scene at the time of the crime-- and THEN looking for Jesus in the midst of it, and sensing the freedom he brings. But the mental return to the crime scene is never easy. There's plenty of darkness there. Tharonwe (here) can play thepart of the accuser very easily. If Amroth gets immersed in NImrodel's despair, and Nimrodel stays stuck in it, then they both lose. He doesn't have to kill them; their madness will be even better. And if even Erebemlin gets lost in the dark? They will be walking back through all of Nimrodel's anguish. They will not find Amroth in any of it, not until they get back to the root of it (although echoes of the root's accusations will be howling all the time, she can't be free from it til she gets to the root itself. Raefindan can't hope to solve any of it for Nimrodel; she has to hear the truth herself, back at the root of her lies. But he can provide some light-rays for Amroth and Erebemlin. We can do this one dream at a time. THe first scene they recollect, and travel through, could be her travel into the vale they are in now, with its ghosts. There was also ice there, until recently. And it was full of Tharonwe's lies. We could start there.... ice. Hmm, which post was that... __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-21-2008, 07:32 PM	#705
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	OK< I did some skimming. Mostly, lately, thedreams have been about Roy and indil. SO mightn't it be appropriate if the first working backward part --- or maybe even the intro to it-- was more about Mithrellas, Imrazor, INdil, Roy, Angela? It would set the stage as to why Indil (Angela) was the answer to Avarien's searching. (Which I admit I'm currently a bit fuzzy on, but it's working/worked.) Amroth and Erebemlin can rest up, a little, & Ravion, Mellonin, and Nethwador too, while part of the indil story is told. Maybe it begins with Tharonwe's resentment, and his need to remain important/ influential desite his sudden loss of interest in Nimrodel? Maybe it's time to flesh out the dark elf and explain his twistedness to the audience? __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-22-2008, 03:54 AM	#706
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Can we handle these posts via PM? I think I can do better in a collaboration by interacting with what you write, instead of posting separately. I'm busy all day today, but tomorrow looks better. But PM me as soon as you like if this sounds good to you.

04-23-2008, 08:58 AM	#707
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	How about if we built these posts via email? I'll get started unless you beat me to it.

04-24-2008, 07:02 PM	#708
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	WHile in theory I would be delighted, however, I will be away from my daytime email for the next month. I have been working like a doggie, offsite, all week. It will continue til the end of May/ beginning of June. Hopefully May will be slightlyless consuming than End-Of-April is. Consolation: it's really fun. Translation: email me at cox, til June. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

04-28-2008, 08:09 PM	#709
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Ah, lmp, it's good! Can't reply tonight, but will ponder this. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

05-14-2008, 02:29 PM	#710
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	lmp-- I'm theoretically up for writing, just kind of bowled over with life right now. It would be good therapy. Maybe one of these days at 2 am when I can't sleep for worrying about work. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

05-14-2008, 08:23 PM	#711
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	We're so close to the end, and my other rpgs will not be done any time soon. So we can take the time this needs to take. Hope you like what I've been up to with Tharonwe lately....

05-15-2008, 04:56 AM	#712
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Yes, brilliant. Which is good, because it (you) is/are holding my interest even if I'm not responding... I'm eye-deep in research, at work, and it's a hug3e struggle. All my energy is going into that. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

05-22-2008, 03:54 AM	#713
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Wow, Helen! That was some post! Not sure how to follow that up unless from Tharonwe's point of view.

05-24-2008, 05:44 AM	#714
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Fascinating posts, Helen. Tharonwe will bide his time as described in my last post. Do you need help with what the others can do to help? Or do you have a sense for it?

05-24-2008, 11:15 AM	#715
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Dive in! I don't have much of a sense for the team-mates at all. Nethwador's awkward but heartfelt attempts are about all i have clear vision for. GUess I should review back a bit on the discussion thread... __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.

05-24-2008, 02:20 PM	#716
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	As time permits, I'll do an advanced search on the word 'dream', trying a limit to our rpg threads. I'll let you know how that works. The following are all the dream posts I could find in Tapestry 2. http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=153 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=151 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=150 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=149 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=124 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=122 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=105 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=101 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...9&postcount=59 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...1&postcount=18 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...3&postcount=11 Last edited by littlemanpoet; 05-24-2008 at 03:08 PM.

05-24-2008, 03:41 PM	#717
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Tapestry 1 dreams, part 1 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=696 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=693 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=689 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=679 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=605 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=603 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=602 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=596 - this one is Marigold talking to Erebemlin about his own fate, so ought to come back into play toward the end. http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=594 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=590 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=558 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=535 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=532 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=527 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=522 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=518 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=508 http://www.forum.barrowdowns.com/sho...&postcount=494 That covers pages 14 to the end of Tapestry 1. More later. This takes time. I haven't read all of them, nor tried to process the ones I've read; but this gives us a handy tool to find them at need. Maybe I'll find time to name the dreamer. Last edited by littlemanpoet; 05-27-2008 at 09:14 AM.

05-25-2008, 04:23 AM	#718
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	AWESOME!! Thanks thanks thanks. I don't think I used the word 'dream' very often, but I know many did.... Remember the songfests during the early days? I don't think we need to review and include e v e r y t h i n g. But there were some Moments in there. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve. Last edited by mark12_30; 05-25-2008 at 04:45 AM.

05-25-2008, 06:08 AM	#719
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Okay, I think it would be fun to do this for the songs too. I'm going to tabulate the links according to who dreamt and who sang, so you'll want to keep an eye on those two posts plus the new ones with song links.

05-27-2008, 05:40 AM	#720
mark12_30 Stormdancer of Doom Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars Posts: 4,349	Pardon me while I take a moment to publicly hope Alak will return. Helloooo, Alak? lmp, those linked lists (HEE HEE HEE programmers joke) are great. I have poked at a few links and will try to do more shortly. __________________ ...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve. Last edited by mark12_30; 05-27-2008 at 05:44 AM.