T-I-G LXVII: The Rangers of the North - The Fell Winter - Page 16 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:26 PM

Alright, a general point:

If Sally and Lottie are the two rangers and both have confessed their roles to Nienna, then I do believe they're innocent, and our wolves are Kath, Gwath and Nerwen.

If the role Sally and Lottie "have in common" according to Nienna is ordo, and Nienna is the gifted Sally hints at being in the lot, then they're just having a show around and at least some of them are guilty.

And if I understand the rules correctly, Nienna isn't forbidden to tell me now on the thread what Sally and Loslote claim to be. Or is she? She should have a complete freedom to claim what others have said in PMs as long as she's not quoting.

edit: xed with Nienna

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:27 PM

Nienna, I'm thinking. (Mostly about Kath's part in this.)

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:30 PM

It doesn't completely add up in my head. We should have a dead ranger by now if we are talking about the same thing. Or then someone is working really hard to stay in some other people's good books.

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:31 PM

Well at least I'm currently thinking Nerwen would be the safest lynch because more or less in every scenario I can come up with she's a wolf.

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lommy

Well at least I'm currently thinking Nerwen would be the safest lynch because more or less in every scenario I can come up with she's a wolf.

I'm starting to think I agree with you on this one.

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lommy

We should have a dead ranger by now if we are talking about the same thing.

How do you figure?

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:38 PM

Now ignoring all that has been said lately for a moment and making a conclusion just based on my research:

Gwath - has been quiet, my gut-feeling of him is good but there's no evidence one way or another
Kath - has been quiet and non-committal, little evidence for guilt or innocnce and very little connections with others
Loslote - has done fishy stuff
Nerwen - a tad unlikely fellows with Gwath
Nienna - would be a really bold wolf (joining a bandwagon against a fellow and killing a person who suspects her on Night2)
Sally - would be a really bold wolf (joining a bandwagon against a fellow and killing a person who suspects her on Night2

edit: xed with Nienna x2

satansaloser2005 · 09-28-2009, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

When we lynch an innocent toDay, you mean...

Anyway thanks for the clarifications.

A bit overconfident aren't you?

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nienna

How do you figure?

You, Sally, Loslote and Kath have seemingly been discussing rangers. You can't all be innocent because there are only three innocents besides me. If a wolf knows the identity of a ranger, it would be probable the ranger is dead. Unless the wolf was trying to look innocent, or the wolf wasn't involved in the ranger discussion, or there was no ranger discussion at all.

Anyway, my current list looks like this -
innocent: Lommy, Nienna and Sally
two wolves and one innocent: Loslote, Gwath and Kath
wolf: Nerwen

PS. Nienna and Sally, if you are wolves, you actually deserve to win.

edit: xed with Sally - well I was quite certain you'd lynch me because 4/6 fellow villagers had expressed suspicion in me, but now it looks a bit better (possibly also because I'm less confused now)

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 12:47 PM

Sally: What are you thinking?

Lommy: Kath, Sally, and Lottie all know at least one Ranger

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nienna

Lommy: Kath, Sally, and Lottie all know at least one Ranger

So either there is a wolf among you four that is sort of bluffing the others, or then you people are not being honest with me (which means there is a wolvish ploy involved).

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 12:54 PM

Kath would only be one that is a possible wolf.

Loslote · 09-28-2009, 12:55 PM

I'm on for very little time.

Nerwen is one of my top suspicions. Lommy, I haven't stopped suspecting you, but you could be ordo. Gwath could also be a wolf. Kath I don't think is a wolf, but I could very easily be wrong.

I agree that we should lynch Nerwen toDay. I think we can probably hope to get a wolf in her.

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nienna

Kath would only be one that is a possible wolf.

Then she is one.

... I know you can't take my word for it, but at least you've clarified it for me.

Or then you're fooling me.

But the options look clearer now.

edit: xed with Loslote - you do understand you have to make the total of three wolves, right?

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 12:56 PM

Ok, I'm back now.

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 12:57 PM

Opinions Gwath?

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 12:57 PM

*is looking forward to seeing Gwath posting*

edit: xed with Nienna, again and notifying - I'll be gone for a while now but I'll be back soon so won't reply anything instantly

Loslote · 09-28-2009, 12:59 PM

The way I see things:

Innocent
Nienna
Sally
Lottie
Possible Wolves
Gwath?
Lommy?
Kath?
Wolf
Nerwen

Nerwen is the one I'd be willing to vote for toDay. Gwath, Lommy, and Kath I don't know for a fact at all, and I'm not going to risk toDay's lynch on a hunch.

edit: xed with Nienna and Lommy

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 01:05 PM

All right. I've got to run. I'll be back in an hour to catch up but then I'm going to need to vote. I anxiously await many many posts from Gwath and Kath.

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nienna

Opinions Gwath?

On what?

Loslote · 09-28-2009, 01:08 PM

I'll not be on again before deadline. So here are my votes:

++ Captain Sally

++ Night Guard Nienna

++ lynch Nerwen

Good luck, all! Don't kill an ordo!

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

On what?

For real? We are essentially calling you a wolf. Ok really leaving now.

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 01:19 PM

I'll tell you right now I'm concerned about the complicity being apparently enjoyed by Sally, Nienna, Loslote, and maybe Lommy, too. The extent to which they all seem to be "in" with each other really makes me uneasy, because it looks so...conspiratorial. I know I'm paranoid (I'm a sucker for Templar conspiracy theories) but I don't like things going on behind the scenes and I don't like it when too many people seem to be of one mind. In my opinion, a healthy village is one with checks and balances where the players disagree, because that's how bad ideas get eliminated. Maybe said players have simply moved beyond that to a point of consensus - but nonetheless, I'm not interested in taking anybody's word for anything; I want to be able to judge a player based on what I've seen and heard.

[Crossed with Loslote and Nienna - oh WOW]

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nienna

For real? We are essentially calling you a wolf. Ok really leaving now.

Sorry, I missed that part.

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 01:20 PM

On anything, Gwathagor.

edit: xed with the man himself

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 01:24 PM

I don't know.

Sally is looking like either very innocent or very evil, as in, diabolical ringleader sort of evil. Not a good time for me to be torn, hmph.

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 01:30 PM

Because it seems like she's certainly got all her ducks in a row (heheh), meaning Loslote and Nienna.

Nogrod · 09-28-2009, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

And if I understand the rules correctly, Nienna isn't forbidden to tell me now on the thread what Sally and Loslote claim to be. Or is she? She should have a complete freedom to claim what others have said in PMs as long as she's not quoting.

There is a simple answer to that question...

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Rules

- No one is allowed to quote anything from possible Nightly PM's. Everyone is allowed to claim whatever they have discussed though. But no quotes!

I think that is one of the oldest WW-rules: no quotes in any case, of any stuff, from outside the game-thread...

It was just that with all this PM'ing going on I thought I needed to remind people of it stating it in the rules.

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 01:59 PM

Gwath, I think Nienna is more of a ringleader.

Anyway, it seems to me that the best course of action for toDay is lynch-vote Nerwen, guard-vote Nienna and captain-vote Sally. I want Nienna and Sally to be protected because they are the most innocent to me, but also the most widely considered innocent and thus the safest wolf targets.

And as for Nerwen, I've said it before, but in more or less any scenario I can think of, she is a wolf. Congrats for fooling me quite well this far, but you can thank Greenie whose judgement on you I trusted, for unknown reasons.

Now the question remains, should I vote that and go to sleep now, or stay here (possibly entertained by msn and art history meanwhile).

Thinlómien · 09-28-2009, 02:23 PM

I'm too tired to think of ww or study.

For good or bad, let it be for toDay:

++lynch Nerwen

++captain Sally

++guard Nienna

I do hope we make a right decision toDay, and if not, well, we suffer the consequences and that's it.

Good night!

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 02:24 PM

I'm back if anyone has any last minute questions/comments before I vote.

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Anyway, it seems to me that the best course of action for toDay is lynch-vote Nerwen, guard-vote Nienna and captain-vote Sally. I want Nienna and Sally to be protected because they are the most innocent to me, but also the most widely considered innocent and thus the safest wolf targets.

Interestingly, I'm uncomfortable with all those options. I can't vote to lynch Nerwen in good conscience because as far as I can tell, she's been fairly helpful, at least early on in the game, and because I have yet to see any actual evidence against her. She could be a wolf, but we'd basically be lynching her on the word of Sally and Nienna - and I should also point out that we're also taking their word that they are innocent. I disagree that they are "the most widely considered innocent" - they've only been proclaimed innocent by the Sally-Nienna-Loslote club. If one just looks at what has actually been said on the thread, all unsubstantiated claims of innocence aside, all that conspiratorial "code-crap" from the beginning of the Day makes either Nienna or Sally look really suspicious to me. It scares me.

Kath · 09-28-2009, 02:30 PM

Hi, hi, hi - sorry for missing so much of the Day (again!). I've spent the whole Day in London with Rune!

I've read through. Now, I'm absolutely happy to believe in Nienna's innocence. I'm not so happy to believe in sally or Lottie's. Lottie's the least simply because I haven't actually had a chance to talk to her at all and because over the Days she is the one out of the two that I have actually found things to worry about.

Nienna, it's clear that you think the two are innocent, and that you can't give explicit reasons why, but it isn't inconceivable that you have the wrong opinion on one of them. Being innocent (in my view) doesn't make your opinions more likely to be right.

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

I'm too tired to think of ww or study.

For good or bad, let it be for toDay:

++lynch Nerwen

++captain Sally

++guard Nienna

I do hope we make a right decision toDay, and if not, well, we suffer the consequences and that's it.

Good night!

You know why they aren't lynching you, Lommy? Because you changed your mind. You'll notice that the moment you began to agree with them, they dropped all suspicion of you. Sally, Loslote, Nienna. All of them.

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 02:31 PM

I'm sorry Gwath if we are being scary. We are actually not a scary bunch.

We were being conspiratorial because we don't want to talk about roles out-right. But I believe its not that difficult to discern.

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

You know why they aren't lynching you, Lommy? Because you changed your mind. You'll notice that the moment you began to agree with them, they dropped all suspicion of you. Sally, Loslote, Nienna. All of them.

She is either being a good innocent or a smart wolf. Either way she has talked herself out of a lynch and if she is an innocent (we should mention that she is the only person--other than Me, Sally, and Lottie--who is proclaiming her innocence) then this is very very good. If she and Nerwen are wolves then we have time to catch her. If Nerwen is the last innocent then she didn't try at all to convince us and gave up on the safety of the village.

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 02:36 PM

Kath!!! I have to vote really super soon. What thinks you about Nerwen?

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kath

Hi, hi, hi - sorry for missing so much of the Day (again!). I've spent the whole Day in London with Rune!

You've got a lot of talking to do.

Nienna · 09-28-2009, 02:40 PM

Ok gotta go sit in class for a really long time. I really hope we are right.

++Nerwen

++Captain Sally

++NG Nienna

Gwathagor · 09-28-2009, 02:43 PM

Look, Nienna. ONE of you is a wolf. In WW, in any ostensible category or group, it's never all innocents or all wolves. There's always one mixed in with the others, which is why I'm hesitant to write you all off. But I know that one of you has to bad. This is why I hesitate to trust any of you, because I'm guessing that you're all being cleverly manipulated.

09-28-2009, 12:26 PM	#601
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	Alright, a general point: If Sally and Lottie are the two rangers and both have confessed their roles to Nienna, then I do believe they're innocent, and our wolves are Kath, Gwath and Nerwen. If the role Sally and Lottie "have in common" according to Nienna is ordo, and Nienna is the gifted Sally hints at being in the lot, then they're just having a show around and at least some of them are guilty. And if I understand the rules correctly, *Nienna* isn't forbidden to tell me now on the thread what Sally and Loslote claim to be. Or is she? She should have a complete freedom to claim what others have said in PMs as long as she's not quoting. edit: xed with Nienna __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 12:27 PM	#602
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	Nienna, I'm thinking. (Mostly about Kath's part in this.) __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 12:30 PM	#603
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	It doesn't completely add up in my head. We should have a dead ranger by now if we are talking about the same thing. Or then someone is working really hard to stay in some other people's good books. __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 12:31 PM	#604
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	Well at least I'm currently thinking Nerwen would be the safest lynch because more or less in every scenario I can come up with she's a wolf. __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 12:38 PM	#607
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	Now ignoring all that has been said lately for a moment and making a conclusion just based on my research: Gwath - has been quiet, my gut-feeling of him is good but there's no evidence one way or another Kath - has been quiet and non-committal, little evidence for guilt or innocnce and very little connections with others Loslote - has done fishy stuff Nerwen - a tad unlikely fellows with Gwath Nienna - would be a really bold wolf (joining a bandwagon against a fellow and killing a person who suspects her on Night2) Sally - would be a really bold wolf (joining a bandwagon against a fellow and killing a person who suspects her on Night2 edit: xed with Nienna x2 __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 12:47 PM	#610
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	Sally: What are you thinking? Lommy: Kath, Sally, and Lottie all know at least one Ranger __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 12:54 PM	#612
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	Kath would only be one that is a possible wolf. __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 12:55 PM	#613
Loslote The Werewolf's Companion Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Moon Posts: 3,021	I'm on for very little time. Nerwen is one of my top suspicions. Lommy, I haven't stopped suspecting you, but you could be ordo. Gwath could also be a wolf. Kath I don't think is a wolf, but I could very easily be wrong. I agree that we should lynch Nerwen toDay. I think we can probably hope to get a wolf in her. __________________ I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night. Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 12:56 PM	#615
Gwathagor Shade with a Blade Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: A Rainy Night In Soho Posts: 2,512	Ok, I'm back now. __________________ Stories and songs.

09-28-2009, 12:57 PM	#616
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	Opinions Gwath? __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 12:57 PM	#617
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	is looking forward to seeing Gwath* posting* edit: xed with Nienna, again and notifying - I'll be gone for a while now but I'll be back soon so won't reply anything instantly __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 12:59 PM	#618
Loslote The Werewolf's Companion Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Moon Posts: 3,021	The way I see things: Innocent Nienna Sally Lottie Possible Wolves Gwath? Lommy? Kath? Wolf Nerwen Nerwen is the one I'd be willing to vote for toDay. Gwath, Lommy, and Kath I don't know for a fact at all, and I'm not going to risk toDay's lynch on a hunch. edit: xed with Nienna and Lommy __________________ I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night. Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 01:05 PM	#619
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	All right. I've got to run. I'll be back in an hour to catch up but then I'm going to need to vote. I anxiously await many many posts from Gwath and Kath. __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 01:08 PM	#621
Loslote The Werewolf's Companion Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Moon Posts: 3,021	I'll not be on again before deadline. So here are my votes: ++ Captain Sally ++ Night Guard Nienna ++ lynch Nerwen Good luck, all! Don't kill an ordo! __________________ I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night. Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 01:19 PM	#623
Gwathagor Shade with a Blade Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: A Rainy Night In Soho Posts: 2,512	I'll tell you right now I'm concerned about the complicity being apparently enjoyed by Sally, Nienna, Loslote, and maybe Lommy, too. The extent to which they all seem to be "in" with each other really makes me uneasy, because it looks so...conspiratorial. I know I'm paranoid (I'm a sucker for Templar conspiracy theories) but I don't like things going on behind the scenes and I don't like it when too many people seem to be of one mind. In my opinion, a healthy village is one with checks and balances where the players disagree, because that's how bad ideas get eliminated. Maybe said players have simply moved beyond that to a point of consensus - but nonetheless, I'm not interested in taking anybody's word for anything; I want to be able to judge a player based on what I've seen and heard. [Crossed with Loslote and Nienna - oh WOW] __________________ Stories and songs.

09-28-2009, 01:20 PM	#625
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	On anything, Gwathagor. edit: xed with the man himself __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 01:24 PM	#626
Gwathagor Shade with a Blade Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: A Rainy Night In Soho Posts: 2,512	I don't know. Sally is looking like either very innocent or very evil, as in, diabolical ringleader sort of evil. Not a good time for me to be torn, hmph. __________________ Stories and songs.

09-28-2009, 01:30 PM	#627
Gwathagor Shade with a Blade Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: A Rainy Night In Soho Posts: 2,512	Because it seems like she's certainly got all her ducks in a row (heheh), meaning Loslote and Nienna. __________________ Stories and songs.

09-28-2009, 01:59 PM	#629
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	Gwath, I think Nienna is more of a ringleader. Anyway, it seems to me that the best course of action for toDay is lynch-vote Nerwen, guard-vote Nienna and captain-vote Sally. I want Nienna and Sally to be protected because they are the most innocent to me, but also the most widely considered innocent and thus the safest wolf targets. And as for Nerwen, I've said it before, but in more or less any scenario I can think of, she is a wolf. Congrats for fooling me quite well this far, but you can thank Greenie whose judgement on you I trusted, for unknown reasons. Now the question remains, should I vote that and go to sleep now, or stay here (possibly entertained by msn and art history meanwhile). __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 02:23 PM	#630
Thinlómien Shady She-Penguin Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: In a far land beyond the Sea Posts: 8,093	I'm too tired to think of ww or study. For good or bad, let it be for toDay: ++lynch Nerwen ++captain Sally ++guard Nienna I do hope we make a right decision toDay, and if not, well, we suffer the consequences and that's it. Good night! __________________ Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris

09-28-2009, 02:24 PM	#631
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	I'm back if anyone has any last minute questions/comments before I vote. __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 02:30 PM	#633
Kath Everlasting Whiteness Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Perusing the laminated book of dreams Posts: 4,533	Hi, hi, hi - sorry for missing so much of the Day (again!). I've spent the whole Day in London with Rune! I've read through. Now, I'm absolutely happy to believe in Nienna's innocence. I'm not so happy to believe in sally or Lottie's. Lottie's the least simply because I haven't actually had a chance to talk to her at all and because over the Days she is the one out of the two that I have actually found things to worry about. Nienna, it's clear that you think the two are innocent, and that you can't give explicit reasons why, but it isn't inconceivable that you have the wrong opinion on one of them. Being innocent (in my view) doesn't make your opinions more likely to be right. __________________ “If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.”

09-28-2009, 02:31 PM	#635
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	I'm sorry Gwath if we are being scary. We are actually not a scary bunch. We were being conspiratorial because we don't want to talk about roles out-right. But I believe its not that difficult to discern. __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 02:36 PM	#637
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	Kath!!! I have to vote really super soon. What thinks you about Nerwen? __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 02:40 PM	#639
Nienna Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: School Posts: 642	Ok gotta go sit in class for a really long time. I really hope we are right. ++Nerwen ++Captain Sally ++NG Nienna __________________ Puddle! Puddle!

09-28-2009, 02:43 PM	#640
Gwathagor Shade with a Blade Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: A Rainy Night In Soho Posts: 2,512	Look, Nienna. ONE of you is a wolf. In WW, in any ostensible category or group, it's never all innocents or all wolves. There's always one mixed in with the others, which is why I'm hesitant to write you all off. But I know that one of you has to bad. This is why I hesitate to trust any of you, because I'm guessing that you're all being cleverly manipulated. __________________ Stories and songs.