Verbal Reasoning! - Page 16 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-06-2007, 07:07 AM

I was thinking what kind of hint should I give. Maybe if you have anyone any specific request of which direction should I aim my hint.

But first, let me emphasise the fact that what I am speaking of can be found really in the book, in the story of Thrór and Nár (at least the part of the riddle that concerns these two).

The best thing I can do is to suggest to try whether you can find parallels between Elrond's life and the story of Thrór and Nár. And if there was ever similar thing that happened to Elrond (not the whole story, but some aspects of it).

Nerwen · 12-06-2007, 09:29 AM

But Elrond had such a long life!

Mind if I ask what age this parellel even took place in?

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-06-2007, 03:35 PM

Well, that would be helping quite a lot...

But okay, I can tell you that it wasn't in Beleriand.

And I am referring to only one single event. In both of the stories: Nár's and Elrond's.

The Might · 12-06-2007, 04:05 PM

I can only think of Celebrian for now, who was tormented by the Orcs.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-06-2007, 04:21 PM

Getting closer. In some things very close. In fact, you are probably the closest you can be. The next guess in the line of going this way should be the correct answer.

The Might · 12-06-2007, 05:20 PM

Hmmm...perhaps Celebrimbor, whos death at the hands of the Orcs Elrond could no prevent?

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-06-2007, 05:36 PM

Yes, Celebrimbor it was. I was referring also to the fact that Thrár's head was chopped off and Nár saw it the same as Sauron's host attacked with Celebrimbor's body instead of a standard...

Please give us another, Mr. Might.

The Might · 12-09-2007, 04:41 AM

Well, I waited for a while to try and find something good...anyway here goes:

Tom Cotton and Rosie Cotton are like

Faramir and ?

Nerwen · 12-09-2007, 05:01 AM

Which Tom Cotton did you have in mind?

The Might · 12-09-2007, 05:02 AM

the young one

Nerwen · 12-09-2007, 05:04 AM

Boromir, then– Tom was Rosie's older brother.

The Might · 12-09-2007, 05:05 AM

Yes, but not what I had in mind...something more special.

Nerwen · 12-09-2007, 05:10 AM

Can you please clarify that, Might?

Is the answer

A) Not Boromir

or

B) Boromir, but for a different reason?

The Might · 12-10-2007, 09:15 AM

A.

Nerwen · 12-10-2007, 06:11 PM

Lothíriel? She married Faramir's wife's brother; Tom married Rosie's husband's sister.

The Might · 12-11-2007, 12:11 PM

Indeed.

You're good, nice to see you so often in the Quiz Room!

Nerwen · 12-12-2007, 07:12 AM

Thanks.

Here's my effort:

Dragon's teeth are to the Dwarves as ________ are to the Sackville-Bagginses.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-12-2007, 09:18 AM

What about spoons? Fram gave the Dwarves this necklace of dragon teeth, and they were quite upset. The same happened with Bilbo's gift to Lobelia.

Nerwen · 12-12-2007, 05:40 PM

You've got it.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-13-2007, 08:19 AM

Gandalf was to Denethor

as

Galadriel was to ________

Nerwen · 12-14-2007, 05:48 AM

How about Saruman? Galadriel supported his rival (Gandalf); Gandalf supported Denethor's rival (Aragorn).

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-14-2007, 06:04 AM

Absolutely precise shot! Very good! Please continue

Nerwen · 12-14-2007, 07:54 PM

Finrod Felagund is to Men as ________ is to the Elves.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-15-2007, 02:42 AM

Hmm, I don't know, someone like... Oromë?

Nerwen · 12-15-2007, 03:13 AM

Yep, your turn.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-15-2007, 04:16 AM

Oh, yeah! Then...

Gollum on Mount Doom is to Sauron

as

Two orcs in the wood are to _______

I hope this is not too vague, but I think with the specifications I provided it is not

McCaber · 12-15-2007, 07:17 PM

Is is Isildur?

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-16-2007, 05:22 AM

These were not two (and in fact, they were not precisely in the wood either)

Nerwen · 12-16-2007, 07:27 AM

A clue, please?

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-16-2007, 07:51 AM

What these two cases have in common is fire.

Nerwen · 12-17-2007, 09:02 PM

Hmmn... my brain isn't working today. 'Nother clue, please.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 12-18-2007, 05:05 AM

Catalyser.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 01-23-2008, 04:04 PM

The fire is the catalyser. It is needed to be there in both cases. I don't want to be too obvious...

Nerwen · 01-23-2008, 08:51 PM

Is it Aghan the Drûg?

Two Orcs set fire to Barach's house in the wood, burning the statue into which Aghan had transferred his power.

Gollum fell into the fires of Mount Doom, destroying the Ring into which Sauron had transferred his power.

In both cases the object's creator was also harmed through a kind of "sympathetic magic".

Legate of Amon Lanc · 01-24-2008, 03:44 AM

Exactly

I know, tricky, but it wasn't that hard, wasn't it?

Please, continue with the thread

Nerwen · 01-24-2008, 06:58 AM

I don't know why it took me so long– except I haven't been around for the last few weeks.

I'll get back to you when I've thought of something.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 02-07-2008, 07:19 AM

Thought of something yet, Nerwen?

Nerwen · 02-07-2008, 07:31 AM

Oh dear, I forgot all about this thread.

Hang in there!

Nerwen · 02-07-2008, 08:41 AM

This is the best I can come up with at the moment. Lame, yes, but it will serve to re-start the thread.

Maeglin is to Gondolin

as

A thrush is to ______

McCaber · 02-07-2008, 09:19 AM

Smaug?

12-06-2007, 07:07 AM	#601
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	I was thinking what kind of hint should I give. Maybe if you have anyone any specific request of which direction should I aim my hint. But first, let me emphasise the fact that what I am speaking of can be found really in the book, in the story of Thrór and Nár (at least the part of the riddle that concerns these two). The best thing I can do is to suggest to try whether you can find parallels between Elrond's life and the story of Thrór and Nár. And if there was ever similar thing that happened to Elrond (not the whole story, but some aspects of it). __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-06-2007, 03:35 PM	#603
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Well, that would be helping quite a lot... But okay, I can tell you that it wasn't in Beleriand. And I am referring to only one single event. In both of the stories: Nár's and Elrond's. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-06-2007, 04:05 PM	#604
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	I can only think of Celebrian for now, who was tormented by the Orcs. __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

12-06-2007, 04:21 PM	#605
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Getting closer. In some things very close. In fact, you are probably the closest you can be. The next guess in the line of going this way should be the correct answer. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-06-2007, 05:20 PM	#606
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	Hmmm...perhaps Celebrimbor, whos death at the hands of the Orcs Elrond could no prevent? __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

12-06-2007, 09:29 AM	#602
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	But Elrond had such a long life! Mind if I ask what age this parellel even took place in?

12-06-2007, 05:36 PM	#607
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Yes, Celebrimbor it was. I was referring also to the fact that Thrár's head was chopped off and Nár saw it the same as Sauron's host attacked with Celebrimbor's body instead of a standard... Please give us another, Mr. Might. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-09-2007, 04:41 AM	#608
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	Well, I waited for a while to try and find something good...anyway here goes: Tom Cotton and Rosie Cotton are like Faramir and ? __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

12-09-2007, 05:01 AM	#609
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Which Tom Cotton did you have in mind?

12-09-2007, 05:02 AM	#610
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	the young one __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

12-09-2007, 05:04 AM	#611
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Boromir, then– Tom was Rosie's older brother.

12-09-2007, 05:05 AM	#612
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	Yes, but not what I had in mind...something more special. __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

12-09-2007, 05:10 AM	#613
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Can you please clarify that, Might? Is the answer A) Not Boromir or B) Boromir, but for a different reason?

12-10-2007, 09:15 AM	#614
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	A. __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

12-10-2007, 06:11 PM	#615
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Lothíriel? She married Faramir's wife's brother; Tom married Rosie's husband's sister.

12-11-2007, 12:11 PM	#616
The Might Guard of the Citadel Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Oxon Posts: 2,205	Indeed. You're good, nice to see you so often in the Quiz Room! __________________ “The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.” Delos B. McKown

12-12-2007, 07:12 AM	#617
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Thanks. Here's my effort: Dragon's teeth are to the Dwarves as ________ are to the Sackville-Bagginses.

12-12-2007, 09:18 AM	#618
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	What about spoons? Fram gave the Dwarves this necklace of dragon teeth, and they were quite upset. The same happened with Bilbo's gift to Lobelia. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-12-2007, 05:40 PM	#619
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	You've got it.

12-13-2007, 08:19 AM	#620
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Gandalf was to Denethor as Galadriel was to ________ __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-14-2007, 05:48 AM	#621
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	How about Saruman? Galadriel supported his rival (Gandalf); Gandalf supported Denethor's rival (Aragorn).

12-14-2007, 06:04 AM	#622
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Absolutely precise shot! Very good! Please continue __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-14-2007, 07:54 PM	#623
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Finrod Felagund is to Men as ________ is to the Elves.

12-15-2007, 02:42 AM	#624
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Hmm, I don't know, someone like... Oromë? __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-15-2007, 03:13 AM	#625
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Yep, your turn.

12-15-2007, 04:16 AM	#626
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Oh, yeah! Then... Gollum on Mount Doom is to Sauron as Two orcs in the wood are to _______ I hope this is not too vague, but I think with the specifications I provided it is not __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-15-2007, 07:17 PM	#627
McCaber Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Skyrim, again. Posts: 820	Is is Isildur? __________________ Werewolves vs. Fishmen. The battle of the century.

12-16-2007, 05:22 AM	#628
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	These were not two (and in fact, they were not precisely in the wood either) __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-16-2007, 07:27 AM	#629
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	A clue, please?

12-16-2007, 07:51 AM	#630
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	What these two cases have in common is fire. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

12-17-2007, 09:02 PM	#631
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Hmmn... my brain isn't working today. 'Nother clue, please.

12-18-2007, 05:05 AM	#632
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Catalyser. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

01-23-2008, 04:04 PM	#633
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	The fire is the catalyser. It is needed to be there in both cases. I don't want to be too obvious... __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

01-23-2008, 08:51 PM	#634
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	I think I have it! Is it Aghan the Drûg? Two Orcs set fire to Barach's house in the wood, burning the statue into which Aghan had transferred his power. Gollum fell into the fires of Mount Doom, destroying the Ring into which Sauron had transferred his power. In both cases the object's creator was also harmed through a kind of "sympathetic magic".

01-24-2008, 03:44 AM	#635
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Exactly I know, tricky, but it wasn't that hard, wasn't it? Please, continue with the thread __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories