WW LX - Mortal Men, doomed to die

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Originally Posted by Wilwa

If he was guilty and Nog revealed that, there would be no reason for him to post, thus being just as useful as if he was modkilled. If he was innocent and Nog revealed that then he could give his oppinion and be far more useful then being modkilled. Therefore, he was only better off being modkilled if he`s guilty. Right? So....I'm leaning guilty.

What I meant was, if I'd just been modkilled, I wouldn't have been around yesterday to muddy things about Sally and I wouldn't have gotten so much wasted innocent attention focused on me instead of the wraiths. That's all.

[Nienna]

Instead of doing my school work I will commence analyzing the unknown villagers. For obvious reasons I am leaving myself for someone else to analyze.

First Lhuna

Day One:

• Nog and Eomer feel innocent, Legate and Shasta worrisome, Sally being creepy, Nilp being bored, Nerwen alright, thinking of voting Sally, Shasta, or Legate (62)
• Votes Legate as having her strongest suspicion (first vote for Legate I believe) (64)

Day Two: Didn't post or vote

Day Three:

• Glad trusted Nog, Sally looking very suspicious (265)
• Says innocent (268)
• Analyzes Eomer voters: (of the unknown people) inclined to suspect Eonwe because of weird list shortly before DL. Of the rest not sure of Nienna or Rune votes Legate (282)

Day Four:

• No real time to post, told Sally she was ingenious to try and take down an innocent with you, thinks there could be a wraith-Eonwe or a wraith-Rune slipping under the radar, sure about Sally being a wraith and votes Sally (373)

Day Five:

• Is sorry about minimal participation toDay, responds to Nog’s comments about having a list including two wraiths…says she just got lucky and they were acting suspicious, thinks is wrong about Shasta from aforementioned list, most suspicious from Sally’s final post is Nienna (398)
• Comes out as Ranger (399)

My thoughts are that she is looking pretty innocent for me. It would have been really risky for Sally to give up another wraith. Then again I thought it was really risky for a wraith to come out as seer. The only other thing that worries me about Lhuna is that Sally said that if we lynch Lhuna she assures us that we will catch a baddie. But this really depends on how we should take Sally's assurances and definitions of 'baddie.'

[Nerwen]

Regarding Sally's "Mwa-ha-ha! Everything is going according to my evil plan!" speech :

Look, it could be a bluff. While I think there may be some general plan behind the wraiths' conduct, I also suspect Sally was largely acting on her own yesterDay. They may have decided during the Night that she would impersonate the Seer, but my guess is that he details were left to her, and that she basically messed them up.

Alternatively, she may have been simply trying to make as much noise and create as much confusion as possible, in order to draw attention away from her fellows... suggesting that at least one of them has a chance of slipping through.

So, who are the last two wraiths? Well, unless they're Shasta and Lhuna, then at least one of them is among the currently "under-the-radar" group of Nienna, Eönwë and Rune.

Originally Posted by wilwarin538

Now cross off the two known innocents, and you get:

Rune
Eonwe

And there are 2 wraiths left......so, uhm. ya. Interesting isn't it?

All I have for now, I know it seems weird, and it could all be part of their plan....but still, the way it adds up, it seems possible.

Okay... I'll second Rune here: it's more likely that Sally would mention one and not the other.

However, we can't dismiss the possibility that she did what you (Wilwarin) suggest just because it's unlikely.

Regarding Lhuna's reveal:

Not sure, but I'm currently more inclined to believe her than not. We'll see. I said yesterDay why the "wraith-on-wraith" theory doesn't really make sense... with the caveat that I can't see any way of getting what Sally did to make complete sense.

EDIT: X'd with Nienna.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Nienna

My thoughts are that she is looking pretty innocent for me. It would have been really risky for Sally to give up another wraith. Then again I thought it was really risky for a wraith to come out as seer. The only other thing that worries me about Lhuna is that Sally said that if we lynch Lhuna she assures us that we will catch a baddie. But this really depends on how we should take Sally's assurances and definitions of 'baddie.'

Look, I think there is a limit to how much we can deduce from what Sally did yesterDay. As I said in my last post, either she was deliberately saying stuff that didn't add up, or she had a plan and it backfired.

Her closing remark about Lhuna could be a bluff... or a double-bluff... or a triple-bluff... no way of telling.

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by Lhuna

I am the Ranger. So please don't lynch me.

Yeah, I guessed you were probably innocent. It just didn't make sense to me that Sally would place two wolves in the spotlight; it seemed more likely she was just trying to get an innocent lynched (maybe they guessed you were the ranger). I don't think it was necessary for you to reveal since I doubt you would've been lynched; at least I wouldn't have voted you. But I can understand your concern and indeed it does narrow down our options.

So our two wolves are either:
Shasta
Nienna
Eonwe
Rune

The good news is that we still have our hunter around; the longer they stay alive, the better chance they'll kill a wolf. If we do lynch an ordo toDay and the hunter happens to be among the unknowns, then they will have no doubt about who the two wolves are by Night. If this situation were to occur, it'd be a good idea for the hunter to reveal toMorrow so that we would know the final two for certain.

Of course, it'd be nicer if we lynched a wolf toDay and we do have a 50% shot. Three out of four of those unknowns have fallen under my radar, so they definitely need looking at. Shasta may look bad after yesterDay, but I don't think he's a wolf. He'd be a lot smoother than that I think were he evil, and not so obvious. Actually Rune concerns me most because he has fallen under my radar, which normally doesn't happen (that, and he never tried to get me lynched in this game ). I've actually never played with an evil Rune, so I really have no clue how he'd behave as a wolf.

Unfortunately, my participation will be minimal again. I'm starting my internship tomorrow which goes like a normal workday, so the late afternoon deadline is a lot worse for me compared to when I was in school. I'm gonna vote tonight since I really can't be late tomorrow and WW tends to delay me. However, I'll try to take a close look at our suspects before I vote since there aren't many of them.

[Nerwen]

We can narrow toDay's lynch down further, I think:

The unknowns.

Lhuna– no. Too much risk she's telling the truth.
Nienna– no. May be a sneaky, low-profile wraith– but for the moment, she hasn't done anything to warrant being lynched. (Again, Sally's parting remarks aren't evidence either way.)

That leaves–

Shasta
Rune
Eönwë

I have to go now, but I'll be back with my thoughts on each of them.

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by Nienna

++ Sally

*sorry dear* *cough cough* "I mean ... GARRRR... Walk the Plank"

Your vote for Nog worries me a bit. It almost seems like a bandwagon vote and those are never good. Nog was being a little zealous but I addressed my issue with that and he doesn't seem suspicious to me.

Would there be a wolf-on-wolf vote on Day 1? Possibly. This was the second vote for Sally, but I don't think there was much risk of her getting lynched.

Legate of Amon Lanc - No Idea - I'm not really really sure whats up with him. I'm not getting any overly good or bad vibes. Voted Izzy Day One. He is being reasonable.

Shastanis Althreduin - No Idea - Voted Nog Day One

Rune Son of Bjarne - No Idea - voted Izzy Day One. I have really no idea... could go either way.

satansaloser2005 - Evil - Voted Nog day One with no real reason and voted I'm getting terrible evil vibes from her. This could be just the way she is playing or that she can't post much but if she is innocent she needs to post something helpful really really soon for me to not vote for her.

Eönwë - No Idea - Voted Izzy at the last minute.

Hmm...still pursuing Sally. Thoughts on the other wolves/unknowns are a bit vague.

++ Sally

Now would a wolf pursue a mate multiple Days? It's happened before, though I think it less likely.

First a question:

Sally are you the seer? If so why would you reveal if Nog was doing so well by himself?

I've read the thread... and think I know all the possibilities but my problem most lies with the fact that Sally never openly stated that she was in fact the seer. She made a seer dream list and said who was guilty and who was innocent so far and she said she has a role but she did not say what that role was. By reading her post it can be inferred that she is the Seer but I would believe her more if she said openly that she is the seer. Does that make sense?

I've been getting evil vibes from Sally for some time now and I've been keeping my eyes on her but a seer reveal now seems like it would be too risky for one of the wolves.

Her statement that Sally never actually revealed is rather odd since I think the implication was pretty obvious. She suspected Sally the first two Days, but slightly backtracks when everyone else starts suspecting her, which concerns me slightly.

[Brinniel]

Very little from him on the first Days aside from banter and a random vote.

Originally Posted by Shasta

Sally is the type of person who would do exactly as she's doing now as a bored Ordo, attempting to protect the person she thought was the Seer. Nogrod, I think you're being overly paranoid.

In any case, whether or not Sally is lying, Lhuna is a wolf. It's clear we need to lynch her today.

This does look pretty bad, but I doubt he'd be so obvious like that.

How many errors do you count in that statement? I count... two.

1. You suspect me. Why? I can't have given you anything to suspect me on - I haven't been able to post. The only reason you say you suspect me is because you don't like that I haven't been able to participate as much as I normally do, Nogrod, admit it.

2. I defend the liar so consistently. ...Wait, consistently? I make one post offering an alternate explanation as to why Sally has been saying what she's been saying - one, mind you, that you seem to have rejected out-of-hand - and not only do you say I'm "defending" her, but that I'm doing it "consistently"? With one post? Rethink that, maybe, and get back to me.

Defensiveness. Could come from either side.

I'll be around to vote tomorrow, but I'm going to sit down and shut up because all that's come of me being active today is I've been A) chastised for not being active during the first few days and B) suspected for being active today and bringing an alternative idea to the table.

Sounds like a frustrated ordo here.

Why would I be desperate to save Sally if she and I were both wraiths, Nerwen? Given that she'll eventually be lynched, that would put a glaring spotlight on me.

Good point, though he could be double bluffing. He acts with obviously wolfish behaviour because others might not expect a wolf to be that obvious. Possible, but less likely I think.

Beloved one, I must confess all manner of ideas have passed through my head. Perhaps Sally is a secret role. Perhaps Sally's attempting to be helpful. Perhaps Lhuna-wraith mis-sent a PM. I really can't fathom her reasoning. I simply wish not to exclude alternative explanations out of hand.

These possible explanations do seem rather absurd.

I hope Nogrod dreamt me. Otherwise I was probably better off not being active and getting modkilled.

A pity post. Could go either way.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

For what it's worth (not much), I think the last wraiths are Nienna and Rune.

Re: the last post Brinn quoted - I wasn't looking for pity. I was being serious, as I explained later.

[Brinniel]

Well, lets see. We have a three way tie. If people are just going to go last minute crazy then I don't know what'll happen. I don't want to kill Nog yet, and I've been killing Sally off too much in the past when she's innocent, so

++Izzy

Perhaps a wolf saving a mate from possible lynching?

Nienna - A pirate eh? You know what we do to pirates...
Kent2010 - He might scam us into joining him
Legate of Amon Lanc - rebels are never good for a stable society. I saw giive 'im the same treatment as pirates"
Nogrod - I don't fancy bein' hit by 'is famous The Cat O' Nine tails
Shastanis Althreduin - Pshhh! King?
wilwarin538 - A magic doer. Evil most likely.
Nerwen - See Shasta
Nilpaurion Felagund - can't be too fussy when lynchin'
Rune Son of Bjarne - See Wilwa. Only he has a more dramatic name.
Lhunardawen - See Legate
Eomer of the Rohirrim - Rohan? I dont like them thar people.
Groin Redbeard - The warlord is quiet. Who know what he plots
satansaloser2005 - Who is she? No fancy title? Why is she here?
Brinniel - See Sally

A lot of people found that post suspicious. I think he was harmlessly trying to be funny, but was unsuccessful due to bad timing. A mistake that could be made from either a wolf or an innocent.

Nienna - Seems like she's trying to help, but maybe a little false. However she may just not be getting any vibes like me, so I'm not ready to incriminate her yet.
Legate of Amon Lanc - Mixed. There are many things he says that seem reasonable and helpful, while some things he says just seem a little sinister, but there's nothing I can pin down.
Shastanis Althreduin - hasn't said much. Not enough for me to say anything on.
Rune Son of Bjarne - I have no idea. He just comes and goes in waves. A very grey area for me.
satansaloser2005 -Seems a little victimised to me. She hasn't really said anything I find suspicious.

Doesn't really tell much.

I don't really like trusting seer reveals too often, so I don't really like the way the village immediately believes him. He could just be a manipulative wolf with a well-though-out case. Werewolf is after all a manipulative game so it's best to be wary.

Nevertheless, I've thought before that something seems a little wrong with Legate this game, and I guess this is our chance to test it (I doubt we could lynch anyone else by now anyway). At least then we will know the identity of at least one wolf (Legate or Nogrod).

And even if Nogrod is a wolf, and the real seer hasn't spoken up yet (and why should they, they're in no danger) then at least the true identity of the seer will be kept hidden and they can continue finding out roles.

This post sounds a bit like a cautious wolf.

++Sally

As much as I'd like things not to be so simple (blindly following the seer), it has to be done.

Again, this post gives a wolfish vibe. Seems like he's begrudgingly voting her...perhaps he's not happy about it because she's his mate.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Brinniel

[Nienna's] statement that Sally never actually revealed is rather odd since I think the implication was pretty obvious. She suspected Sally the first two Days, but slightly backtracks when everyone else starts suspecting her, which concerns me slightly.

Ah, yes. I'd forgotten about that. It could even be read as Nienna trying to suggest a way out to Sally. (Bear in mind, though, that she's a relative newbie.)

EDIT:X'd with Brinn.

[Brinniel]

Nogrod is more agressive than normal and not bringing anything new to the game, but is that a good enough reason to lynch him on day 1? probably not.

Legate seemed resonable, but then there is small inconsistensies. . .

I think I will go for a person I have not been able to read at all, you know people who have posted, but you feel completely indifferent about their posts.

That would make my list look like this:

Kent
Kath
Isabel
Brinn
Lhuna
Wilwa

Of these Isabel seems to be the most careful. . .could be a sign of an evil doer trying not to expose her self. (Or it could just be a day 1 post)

So basicly this vote is 98% random.

++Isabellkya

All players on that list are innocent. Coincidence? Or perhaps the list of a wolf?

I knew I did not have a good case and that more often than not, it is an ordo who is lynched on day 1. . . Why would I go out and try to convince everyone to vote Isabel, when I was not at all sure of her guilt?
I am only obligated to tell why I vote as I do, I don't have to campaign for others to do the same.

A lot of back and forth with Nogrod and defending himself. Could be the response of an innocent or wolf.

++Eönwë

His way of playing so far don't sit right with me. He needs to say more about what he thinks and not just comment on what other people say. The only problem I have with voting this way, is that I have a feeling that this could just be the way Eönwë plays, no matter if he is bad or good.

Eonwe was at risk of getting lynched that Day, though considering he was the first to vote him, they could still be wolves together.

Nogrod is the seer and the wraiths were stupid not to kill him, Sally is Ordo or Wraith.

and

Nogrod is a wraith who sacrificed a mate and Sally is an ordo trying to help the seer.

. . .wait. . .forget it, the only thing I can conclude is that the scenario Sally = Seer, Nogrod = Wraith is not likely.

My problem is that I can easily see Nogrod as a wraith bluffing, but the same goes for Sally.

He's very reasonable in his posts regarding the possible scenarios of yesterDay, but also a bit careful.

[Brinniel]

Meh, they all look like possible wolves to me. But from looking back at their posts, the most suspicious to me is:

++Eonwe

Someone should take a look at the known wolves' posts. I would, but I really need to get to bed, so I'm afraid this is all from me.

[Nienna]

On Eönwë:

Day One:

• Comes ish-late to day one (72)
• Tries to look at things from multiple sides (74)
• 'Ph’ discussion (83)
• Thinks Brinn vote for Sally looks suspicious, more ‘ph’ (88)
• Not sure about Kent (100)
• Votes Izzy at DL because he doesn’t want to kill Nog and he tends to vote Sally a lot and she turns out to be innocent (115)

Day Two:

• Thinks Kath was killed as a no trail kill/typical night one kill (127)
• Something about Eomer and being jumpy, does think Eomer speaks reason (198)
• Backing up what he said about Brinn’s Sally vote to Nog (209)
• Non-serious list 22 minutes before DL (211)
• Responds to Nog some more (213)
• Gives a real list 1 minute before DL: mixed feelings on Legate, Shasta he doesn’t have much to go on, Lhuna under his radar, doesn’t find Sally suspicious (235).
• Votes Eomer to save himself a self-proclaimed innocent at last moment to tie votes (239)

Day Three:

• Doesn’t think that people should blindly follow the seer, is inclined to think Legate guilty anyway, votes Legate (287)

Day Four:

• Would be suspicious of Nog if he wasn’t the seer, think’s Nerwen’s logic is strange on a Sally scenario, gives his own scenario with Nog, Nerwen, and Sally/Shasta as the three wolves (359)
• Has and clears up some confusion based on his thoughts of Sally/seer/wraith scenarios (365)
• Thinking his theory is less and less plausible but that WW is about theories (368)
• Votes Sally (384)

Day Five: Has not yet posted toDay


My thoughts are a bit mixed. I'm glad that he doesn't want us to blindly follow but his suspicions of Nog even though he thinks Nog is the seer are vaguely counterproductive. He has also had some strange and suspicious voting.

[Nienna]

These massive post by post analyzations are taking me forever. I desperately need sleep so I will finish the other two tomorrow but it will be later in the Day.

[Nerwen]

So, leaving aside Nienna, who may be evil but who I can't see getting lynched toDay, we've got Shasta, Rune and Eönwë.

Firstly, I don't see why Shasta is sliding off people's suspicion-lists. Sure, his behaviour is almost too obviously wolfish... but so was Sally's!

However, I talked about Shasta yesterDay, and now I want to say more about the other two.

Basically, yesterDay they both did a "minor-Shasta", in that they came up with implausible theories of Sally's innocence. (Or, in Eönwë's case, a "they're all in it together" scenario.)
Now, Nogrod may think well of Eönwë for refusing to "blindly follow" his lead in lynching Sally... but I beg to differ.

For my part, I can say that I was not simply following Nogrod's lead. Did anyone say, "Yeah, I'll lynch Sally because Nog says so"?

No. Her behaviour was highly suspicious... so much so that the wilful blindness of these three to it looks very bad indeed. (Of course, it has to be innocent in at least one case!)

True, Rune and Eönwë did not go all out defending Sally, but here's what they did say:

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

There is also the possebility that Sally is the seer and deliberatly chose to give wrong information about Nogrod. so that the wraith would think her an ordo. That way she could get 1 wraith lynched (Lhuna) and one more dream before revealing that Nogrod was a baddie.

To be fair, he does conclude that "no possible explanation makes sense"... so he could be trying to feel his way through different possibilities.

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

To me these two scenarios are the most likely:

Nogrod is the seer and the wraiths were stupid not to kill him, Sally is Ordo or Wraith.

and

Nogrod is a wraith who sacrificed a mate and Sally is an ordo trying to help the seer.

. . .wait. . .forget it, the only thing I can conclude is that the scenario Sally = Seer, Nogrod = Wraith is not likely.

My problem is that I can easily see Nogrod as a wraith bluffing, but the same goes for Sally.

Now, by this time it had been pointed out multiple times why Sally's behaviour was extremely unlikely to stem from a desire to help the village. So even if it wasn't self-evident to Rune, he's got no excuse simply to ignore the points already made by others.

Originally Posted by Eönwë

Ok, this just seems a little strange to me... if he wasn't the seer (well, as far as we know), I would definately be going after him. Seems like a slip. Why would he be suspecting Lhuna every now and then? Like he's trying to distance himself from her. Nogrod being the relentless WW player that he is would either mention her as seeming more innocent, or would go after her, at least a little bit (because she wasn't his main target).

He then quotes me out of context in order to criticise my "strange logic", followed by:

Originally Posted by Eönwë

How about a crazy theory:
Nogrod, Nerwen (a "proven" innocent) and Sally/Shasta are all wolves and are just trying to confuse us. Nogrod puts Wilwa in the "proven innocent" category to gain the support of a true innocent (or possibly even a gifted- they're all still alive I believe).

Not very likely, but it's best to think of every option. If it is true, they're amazing.

Firstly, note that the "crazy theories" of these two (unlike Shasta's) seem to be aimed at the one thing that would really help the wraith team: discrediting Nogrod as the Seer and thus also taking away my and Wilwa's credibility as known innocents. (The second worst thing for the evil side, after being dreamed themselves, is to have such a high ratio of known to unknown players around that they'll get caught just by elimination.)

Now, I don't rule out that they may be genuinely worried that there's something strange going on (in fact, judging from the Night kills, there is something strange going on). Again to be fair, the wording of the quote of Nogrod's that Eönwë objects to does look rather wolfish.

That said, it just looks too much like they're throwing out these suggestions just to see if anyone will bite on them.

I'm particularly not rapt in this last bit (from the same post by Eönwë):

Originally Posted by Eönwë

also don't like the fact that everyone seems to be agreeing with everyone, even though the general idea is shifting throughout the Day. Something doesn't seem right there.

Oh really? Just because most people came to the logical and obvious conclusion that whatever Sally was up to, she had to be guilty?

EDIT: X'd with two Niennas.
EDIT2: Clarification.

[Nerwen]

I'll be out for a few hours, but I'll just leave everyone this quote to ponder:

From yesterDay:

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Well. I just thought of something, in any case. I'll throw out on the table that a Sally-Wraith might try to lynch a Lhuna-Ranger during the day, but that's the only explanation I can find for an evil-Sally doing what she did.

Is that in fact why Sally did it, Wraithta Althreduin?

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Talk about bad timing. . . I will have to do alot of writting today and from the looks of it I will also have to defend my self today.

So Lhuna is our Ranger. . .it is a shame that she has revealed her self, a ranger is very nice to have arround in the closing stages. A hunter revealing would have been much nicer, as it is a person the wolves would have to think twice before attacking.

The stage is set and looks like it is going to be a fight between me and Eonwe. Which is odd, because the wraiths have been acting very strange, so I think it is a distinct possebility that Shasta is a wraith that attached him self to Sally. Normally I would guess that the two wraiths left was of the more silent type, but with this bunch anything is possible.

[wilwarin538]

Alright, I'm seeing lots of analysis on the mysterious 5, good good, I'm gonna go back and look at the known baddie posts abit more throughly. Then I shall return...

[Nogrod]

For starters...

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

So Lhuna is our Ranger. . .it is a shame that she has revealed her self, a ranger is very nice to have arround in the closing stages. A hunter revealing would have been much nicer, as it is a person the wolves would have to think twice before attacking.

You're right about it being good to have a ranger in the end as she could really make a difference but no can do.

But the hunter should really think about the following.

The hunter is one from the four last unknowns as my dreams have turned out plain ordos. So the hunter coming forwards now might be pretty nice indeed as it would reduce our chances of lynching an innocent into 1/3 (three unknowns of which two are wolves) and nice lynching list toMorrow and the Day after if we miss!

Also if a wraith tries a fake-revealment we'd have 100% kill as the hunter could take away the faking villain with her and leave the village as our wraith-killing hero!

What do you say hunter? Your pick!


I'l go reading the thread now. Back with hopefully some more ideas after a while.

[wilwarin538]

OK, Sally first, just took some random posts that seemed to have something valuable, most of her others didn`t really say much regarding other players:

Originally Posted by Bad Bad Sally

Eomer's being rather snobbish; I thought that was Nilpie's role.

Kath's being quiet, so is Nienna. No change there. Same for Wilwa.

Cap'n Nog's being a bit of a brute, and I'm not sure I like it. Is he still paranoid from his last voyage or does he have darker motives for being so accusatory?

Rune has picked up on this behavior, and for now I think he'll be allowed to stay, if only because he's very astute and I think he can bring order to this mess.

Nilpie hasn't shown up, but I'm assured he's innocent. He couldn't possibly be otherwise, the sweet thing. Together we'll make this little band of miscreants a bit more ship shape, if you'll excuse the pun. Then again, you'll probably not even get it, so why bother to explain? *sighs, fans herself* I think these proceedings are a bit much for my delicate constitution. Hopefully Nilp will bring me a drink when he returns. He's always so considerate. And did I mention innocent?

Shasta and Nerwen are dirty, thieving pirates. It wouldn't surprise me if they're murderers as well.

Seemed good with Rune, and against Shasta, but that doesn't really mean much, especially cause this is a pretty random Day 1 post.

Originally Posted by Wraith Sally

The weird thing is that although I think Eomer's acting very suspicious, at the moment I don't think he's a wolf. Does that make sense?


I'm still troubled by Noggie, and I've still been getting bad vibes from Lhuna. In my book my beloved Nilpiekins is innocent and I'm sure Brinn is too. Lhuna's crossed over to the dark side, though. I'll look over her posts again, but I think I may be voting her toDay. Maybe....I don't know. I'll have to see.

With Nog though, I think it's just the general mistrust (or rather, hesitation to trust him) that I always have for the poor kid. YesterDay he looked really off the wall and he still does, but I'm a bit doubtful that it's for dark purposes now. I'll have to make my final decision later, but I think I'll leave him alone for the rest of the Day and see how things shape up after the vote toDay.

Again, not much.

Originally Posted by Evil Sally

Okay, so here's what I know.

Brinn: innocent
Nog: innocent
Legate: wolf
Lhuna: wolf



Everything should be in order, and if you have questions feel free to ask. First, an explanation....



I appreciate Noggie's devotion the last Day or so, and imagine my surprise when he posts and says that he's dreamt Legate! However, since I already knew he was innocent and that Legate was in fact a wolf I didn't want to say anything to the contrary. That was of course the reason for my hesitation though, and I'm saying something toDay because:
A: I'm not sure how long the entire fake seer thing (handy though it was) can last
B: since Lhuna's now confirmed as a wolf as well as Legate, I think it's worth the risk
C: hopefully there will be some confusion about who to kill, since it's possible that they may not know who to believe (for example, it's possible that I'm faking instead of Noggie)
D: I'm stressed because of finals and frankly I'd rather like to get the stress of all the secrecy off my system. Besides, if I die I'll have more time for finals. Also, I've been rather skittish (as you all know I am when I have a role) and I'm afraid if I don't say something now you won't believe me later. Besides, at least now I can impart some knowledge to you before I (or Nog, though preferrably neither) go.

Hmmm....yeah, not really much here either I suppose, expect now we know for sure she was definitely trying to get rid of an innocent Lhuna.

Originally Posted by SallyWraith

Oooo, this is working out even better than I planned. Well, sort of....


To my packmates: Stage One is complete. Stage Two and beyond is up to you. You know who to kill and who to save for later, so keep to our plan and all will work out. I'm sorry I couldn't stay longer, but as discussed this was hopefully for the best. Best of luck to you and the village, and may the best side win.


*cackles maniacally and rides off into the sunset*


Oh, and kudos to Nienna for knowing me better than the rest of you. Job well done, darling. I'll ship you some cookies. (Though I wouldn't eat them if I were you.)

To Shasta. Thanks so much for trying to stick up for me, but you know my heart will always belong to my darling Nilp. Besides, I'm too evil for you.

To Lhuna and Brinn. Quoth Mrs. Lovett, "Die! Die! God in Heaven, die!"

To Nog. The same, only with a giggle on the end. I loved flustering you, dear one.



And now, I die. Enjoy being pillaged, village!


~~Sally the Insufferable~~

There`s gotta be something here. I`m still sure that atleast one of the last wraiths is mentioned here, I doubt both and I doubt she`d leave both out.

So...Sally didn`t give us much.

Legate, lots of posts, but here`s two lists he made:

Originally Posted by Wraith of Amon Lanc

Right, I am here, and have read all, it seems most of the people have shown and even contributed, at least to some point. So, here is now a short list of what I think of the situation this far. Already some thoughts are beginning to crystallize (shoton, as people say in my homeland), so I hope by the end of the Day I should have enough to come up with at least partially clear picture.

Kath - so far little input. Kath already makes me feel uncomfortable, as always, and I can't read her. As always.
Nienna - despite the first sort of exchange with Nog, I am inclined now to see her behavior as genuine, and not as a particular intention to fly under the radar. Thus, hope to see her posting more in the future: like I said, this far, the picture seems genuine.
Kent2010 - he did not say practically anything this far. I don't know whether I should take the "let's make a deal" as anything worth considering: actually, I thought that it is a mere in-role talk and thus did not give it any in-game value. Well, though of course, I don't know him, so it may be possible that he would try to win people's favour in this way, "buddying" with them. But anyway, I would need to see more from him to be able to judge anything.
Nogrod - Nogrod is being his normal quiet-people-chasing self, and seemingly something has happened in recent games that made him pursue this habit even more forcefully. Let me say in this place that I agree with him, but this far it seems that hopefully people will post. Nogrod himself does not particularly raise my suspicion: if something happened to him, he's perhaps a bit more of a zealot?
Shastanis Althreduin - posted a bit and even voted, but just a little; so I can only hope that there will be this more participation that he promised in the future.
Isabellkya - stating obvious and dismissing Day 1, well that's quite simple and everybody could do that: I would like to see more.
wilwarin538 - the first impression is somewhat positive, I think she is trying to make some input, I only once again hope that there will be more in the future. It is yet quite some time till the end of Day 1, so let's see...
Nerwen - well hey, I would like some more out-role input...
Nilpaurion Felagund - not have been around yet
Rune Son of Bjarne - he actually reminds me of the typical Rune who weighs arguments of everybody... so he makes me feel him as rather innocent.
Lhunardawen - I guess my dear wife should learn her place, but now I would like to see more than one-(or few-)liner input from her.
Eomer of the Rohirrim - well that is one I cannot quite relate with, okay, he has this "offensive" mask, but overall, I am not quite sure what he's up to. Unclear, I'd say: sort of casting suspicion, or something, or rousing feelings, in a bit unclear way. So is there anything he is okay with, except for hating everybody, or what part of it is actually just roleplaying? Or what part could be casting wraith-y nets with hiding behind roleplaying? (By the way, I think people should slowly quit roleplaying after second, third post they make anyway. Or at least try to not mix the reality with roleplaying to the point that it is unclear.)
Groin Redbeard - not around yet
satansaloser2005 - this far, she's being more or less like her usual self, though it seems to me a bit defensive with her reaction to Brinn's vote, which was, like Brinn said, random. Well, whatever - let's see what comes in the future.
Eönwë - not around yet
Brinniel - all right, seems that she is now mostly busy with RL stuff, so I'm leaving her out for now, hope to see her around more in the future!

Okay, actually, all in all, for Day 1, it is quite good. Might have been worse. I am probably going to leave in a short while, but I will be around perhaps for a minute or two yet. Anyway, I shall be back in the evening (several hours before DL), so then. Hope that by that time, people who haven't posted yet will post, and those who posted will post more so that the picture of the may become clearer to me. So, till later...

Seemed good with Nienna and Rune here...pretty iffy about most though.

Originally Posted by Legate the Wraith

Okay, I'm around just for a little bit, so I'm very very quickly posting a short summary of people as to toDay...

Nienna - is basically not around. Now, I would not like to start about that, but I think people who are silent should try not to be that silent anymore, because otherwise nobody is able to read anything about them.
Kent2010 - I was somewhat unsettled by something in his posts at the beginning of this Day, but otherwise the feeling of him reasonable and trying remains.
Nogrod - still looks quite like a typical Nogrod, and even his recent sort of outburst does not seem any suspicious to me or anything.
Shastanis Althreduin - did he post anything toDay?
wilwarin538 - with the recent posting with Eomer and all I am becoming again a bit more confused, so I don't know. Maybe it would do good to look at her in total... or then maybe who knows, as sometimes she seems to me quite hard to get. "Chaotic."
Nerwen - somewhat hard to say, she gets harder to read when she posts, though basically the feeling I'm getting about her is genuine
Nilpaurion Felagund - not posted much more, hope to see more in the future
Rune Son of Bjarne - looks still more or less the same to me, like a good Rune
Lhunardawen - did not post toDay yet
Eomer of the Rohirrim - okay, I probably really do not get him, but whatever. I could understand if he was trying to lay traps for Wraiths, but the way he posted really does not make much sense to me. He makes me feel uneasy... have to think more. Because really making no sense in some ways... if there was a Cobbler, it would have been easier to say.
Groin Redbeard - did not post AT ALL... I hope he shows up
satansaloser2005 - posts a bit more scarcely, so it's hard to say now. I would certainly like her to post more: otherwise, just sticking with my feelings from yesterDay.
Eönwë - he showed for a bit in the beginning, I think, but did not really say much. Hope he will show up yet too.
Brinniel - also did not quite show up yet toDay either, unless I missed something?

Overall, one thing I don't like is that this far - the really lack of posting from many people, just basically today only some posted - hope the following almost-four hours will make a difference... (well, I can also imagine that when I come back home there will be two more pages ) I will be hopefully back at some two hours before DL for certain, and then keep around...

edit: x-ed with nerwen&sally

Basically he just says that he wants everyone to talk more...

So I have not gotten much from them, except that both seemed good with Rune. Perhaps others can see something I did not.

I have to go to work for a few hours, I`ll be back about 4-5 hours before the deadline.

X`posted with Nog

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

But the hunter should really think about the following.

The hunter is one from the four last unknowns as my dreams have turned out plain ordos. So the hunter coming forwards now might be pretty nice indeed as it would reduce our chances of lynching an innocent into 1/3 (three unknowns of which two are wolves) and nice lynching list toMorrow and the Day after if we miss!

Also if a wraith tries a fake-revealment we'd have 100% kill as the hunter could take away the faking villain with her and leave the village as our wraith-killing hero!

What do you say hunter? Your pick!


I'l go reading the thread now. Back with hopefully some more ideas after a while.

Oooh, good plan. I was gonna say it earlier but I was scared that it would cause a fake reveal. I hadn`t thought of it that far. Makes sense.

I personally think that is a wonderful idea. Either way though, I believe we have this. There are 9 players,including 2 baddies, 3 unknowns and like 5 known innocents. Is it even possible to lose now?

Alright, I'm gone for real now.

[Nogrod]

Good posting toDay, interesting thoughts and some good spotting.

Just a few notions on Sally to begin with - just to ease my mind and have some sense in what hapened yesterDay.

Good point Lhuna in thinking that Sally's mates have been relatively unsuspected as that would make her amok-run more understandable. If she would have succeeded then there would have been a lot ot buzz around Lhuna, Brinn (& possible other innocents she had mentioned) and her on Days to come. But now we have managed to counter it leaving Sally dead, Brinn known innocent and Lhuna a very believable ranger. So that just backfired - if there was a plan after all.

For even if you Brinn are sceptical about it, your mentioning of the possibility that Sally felt uneasy just seems to fill the place of the missing motive for her to go for it with a full risk. Look at how much she has been suspected on earlier Days! She probably really feared she was going to get lynched and thus tried the spectacular way - and if she felt confident with her mates then why not?

Okay. Then to more pressing matters.

[Nerwen]

Okay, now that everyone's posted and there's been no counter-claim, I guess Lhuna is officially a known innocent.

That's a good idea about the Hunter, Nogrod.

And, Hunter– apologies for the following insult to your intelligence:

whatever you decide to do, please make sure your pick is one of the unknowns!

EDIT: X'd with Nogrod.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Okay, now that everyone's posted and there's been no counter-claim, I guess Lhuna is officially a known innocent.

Has Eönwë posted Today, after Lhuna's revealment?

EDIT: Checked it out. Eönwë has not posted toDay. So let's wait for him before declaring the situation. But for now I would still recomend concentrating the search into the four others...

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Has Eönwë posted Today, after Lhuna's revealment?

Ah, now that you mention it, no he hasn't. I thought he had.

[Nogrod]

Sorry Shasta, but I will start with you once more.

There is a lot in your posting that shouts you're an innocent who is just a bit messed up with things (which would be understandable taken your limited participation so far).

Like Brinn said, there are many posts that would be either be too daring or too genuine / frustrating -looking which might point to your innocence.

But there are bad ones as well. Like Nerwen said it's improbable you didn't get the argument quite a many of us tried to bring forwards - namely that if an innocent and bluffing Sally wouldn't have acted in a way of presenting us a "baddie" to lynch when she couldn't have known Lhuna's role (why sacrifice a possible innocent if your sole task is to bluff to save the actual seer?). Just remember that at the same time you said you believed in my seerness. So your thoughts don't make sense while ours do.

No you could argue for a point that I am a false-seer who fools all of you and sarifices his mates. That would be a fair reason to defend Sally's "knowledge". But you never did say that out aloud. On the contrary you said you trusted me and just looked for different explanations. That is a bit weird. Why didn't you take that "obvious step" if you actualy believed Sally?

Also I'm a bit uncomfortable with this one with which you started the whole Day:

Originally Posted by Shasta

I hope Nogrod dreamt me. Otherwise I was probably better off not being active and getting modkilled.

Now if you were an innocent that would be just venting off some frustration - which is totally believable or at least within limits of it. But why start the Day like that as it would be known pretty soon anyway whom I dreamt of?

But if you were a wraith that might be a decent try. Had I not dreamt of you, you might do better looking such frustrated and disappointed to yourself.

Also there is this possibly a minor "slip" (if it is one) that one should never overlook - even if one should not base one's voting solely on these kinds of things. (bolding mine)

Originally Posted by Shasta

you'll still have one day to find the other two ringwraiths

Now I'm not a native-speaker and you should correct me if I'm wrong, but using the word "other" there really looks like a slip! Even if the number (two) is right the term "other" really bothers me there. Even classy hero-wolves (Roa hates me for life for nailing her that way ) have been known to make that kind of slips.

But to refrain a little, I must beg either Nerwen or Shasta to answer to following:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Is that in fact why Sally did it, Wraithta Althreduin?

How do wraiths detect rangers and be such cool with it that they pull out a campaign like Sally did to lynch them?

My problem with lynching you Shasta is that the wolves might be sneakier and better to hide. Both Rune and Nienna have been quite careful - which can be seen from the fact that one can't make points against them as easily as with you (and Eönwë I think stands somewhere between).

If you're an innocent you shouldn't leave us Shasta even if your frustrated. Come forwards and speak your mind, especially about the other unknowns.

[Nogrod]

Blah, have to go now even if I only had time for Shasta. Look at the admin. thread.

If anyone has time, please continue looking at Nienna, Rune and Eönwë as well.

And hunter, please do consider.

Hoping to be back sooner than later...

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Also there is this possibly a minor "slip" (if it is one) that one should never overlook - even if one should not base one's voting solely on these kinds of things. (bolding mine) Now I'm not a native-speaker and you should correct me if I'm wrong, but using the word "other" there really looks like a slip! Even if the number (two) is right the term "other" really bothers me there.

I wouldn't read too much into that, Nogrod. It probably just means "the remaining wolves".

Originally Posted by Nogrod

to refrain a little, I must beg either Nerwen or Shasta to answer to following: How do wraiths detect rangers and be such cool with it that they pull out a campaign like Sally did to lynch them?

No idea, actually– I quoted that precisely because it's such a weird suggestion and seems to come out of nowhere. It made me wonder whether it could have reflected a last minute PM from Sally: "Fine, kill Nilp then... but I've just got this hunch Lhuna's the Ranger... what if I try to get her lynched toMorrow...?" Or something along those lines.

So... I'm still waiting for Shasta's answer.

EDIT:X'd with Nogrod.

[Nienna]

Ok I have weighed the options and I believe that revealing as the Hunter will be only productive for the village.


I am the Hunter.


We now only have three unknowns and two of those are wolves.

I'll continue to look at Rune and Shasta who I have not yet analyzed but I'm not sure how much time I will have because they seem to take me forever.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Ok I am at the internet place now. . .I payed for 1 hour so far, but I will stay for longer if that is needed (although it is expensive).

I will go read through the posts now.

[Lhunardawen]

Whew. Thanks, Nienna.

So we're down to three...

I haven't got much time for anything, so I'll do a quick re-read and then vote.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Hmm I am in kind of a weird situation. . . I am obviously one of the main suspects today, yet I am not faced with serious accusations.

Tell me, is it even possible for us to loose now? How many unknown do we have 3? With 2 wraiths. . .surely we can kill all 3 before the wraiths can kill the rest of the village. Is there any loopholes that I have not spottet?

Since Nienna is the hunter, it leaves me with Eonwe. When I see the way he plays i just keep on thinking "wraith wraith wraith", but as I stated earlier (one of the earlier days) he seems to play in this way all the time.

[Lhunardawen]

If I stick to my theory of sub-radar wraiths, then it's possible that Rune and Eonwe are the final two.

I'm not comfortable with voting for Eonwe without him having posted toDay. Since we're playing a numbers game now, albeit one turned to our favour, I think we should be hearing from all sides. But I do have to vote now and get some sleep. This leaves me with

++RUNE SON OF BJARNE

Compared to Eonwe, he seems to be more careful and guarded. I'm not used to him being like this.

Good night y'all.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Have I played the quiet game?

I know I "fell" under Brinn's radar and that freaking hurt, but other than that. . . (sorry bad joke)

I have been fairly quiet since the seer reveal and that is not something I normally do, but before that I was resonable loud.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

and btw I have half an hour left here at the cafe. . .I really do not want to spend more money here, but it seems that I have to.
(please show up and start posting/voting)

[Nerwen]

I don't like voting someone who hasn't posted, but after another re-read,

++ Eönwë looks the evillest of the lot.

EDIT:X'd with Rune (twice).

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

Since Nienna is the hunter, it leaves me with Eonwe.

And Shasta, remember... surely you haven't forgotten him?

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

And Shasta, remember... surely you haven't forgotten him?

No, but Nienna and Eonwe was the people I thought was our remaining wraiths.

Shasta is complicated. . .

[Nerwen]

Anyway, village, unless something goes very badly wrong, we'll either get a wraith toNight or know the last two toMorrow.

Good night.

X'd with Rune.