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#41 | ||
A Mere Boggart
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: under the bed
Posts: 4,737
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Gordon's alive!
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#42 | ||
Hauntress of the Havens
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: IN it, but not OF it
Posts: 2,538
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But what mostly gave me that idea is the statement she will make three times in the next chapter: He is gone. |
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#43 | |
Illustrious Ulair
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties
Posts: 4,240
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Baldor the Hapless
Lalwende recently came across this reference to Baldor's fate in Tolkien's essay 'The Rivers & Beacon Hills of Gondor'. It was published in Vinyar Tengwar, but I've just found it on-line http://216.239.59.104/search?q=cache...rvo/t/vt42.doc Quote:
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#44 |
A Mere Boggart
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: under the bed
Posts: 4,737
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I liked this (even though it is one of the nastiest, most frightening things I've read by Tolkien). I keep finding these 'hints' about worship of Dark forces in Middle-earth, seemingly most of them are about Men worshipping Sauron. It provides extra depth to the struggle to oust Sauron; it demonstrates yet more how he has managed to corrupt Men to his ways. I wondered if the Men supposedly worshipping in this "evil temple hall" were alive or dead when they did this to Baldor?
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Gordon's alive!
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#45 |
Illustrious Ulair
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties
Posts: 4,240
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Late Addendum
Just been reading some of Kipling's short stories, & came across one called The Lost Legion. This concerns a British Army regiment of Indian troops who join the Indian Mutiny ('betraying' their oath of service) & are killed by Afghan rebels. Many years later a British contingent are sent to capture an Afghan warlord. The contingent is ordered to go in at night & capture the warlord & his men without using violence. They approach the camp, making a deal of noise, but the Afghan guards in the watchtowers fail to raise any alarm, & the British cannot understand why no warning is given to those in the camp. It turned out that the watchers were terrified to raise any alarm because of the ghosts of the slain Indian troops were marching around the watchtowers, hence saving the British troops & allowing them to achieve their mission. Now, one can argue with the 'politics' of the story, but one wonders if Tolkien had read it - we know he had read & enjoyed some of Kipling's other work - like Puck of Pook's Hill. Given Kipling's incredible popularity in Tolkien's youth its entirely possible that this went into the 'leaf mould of the mind'... |
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#46 |
Dead Serious
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As horror stories go, I don't think the unspecified fate of Baldor the hapless can easily be beat. For that matter, the entire journey through the Paths of the Dead, though brief in number of pages, always feels much longer, reading through it over Gimli's shoulder. It's enough in one chapter to make me reject my younger claim of being disappointed that we only get Aragorn's ebcounter with Sauron offscreen, so to speak.
But it *is* a major moment in the War of the Ring, as large as Sauron's encounter with Pippin, larger the Ride of the Rohirrim--at least in Sauron's eyes--larger than the death of the Witch-king. And it is passed over somewhat quickly. This is actually the chronologically earliest chapter in The Return of the King, beginning just after Gandalf dashes with Pippin. It's typical of how Tolkien structures his interweaving plots to go back and restart things from an earlier point and it makes sense to me that Book V opens with a focus on Minas Tirith, which will be the centre of the book's gravity: all action will flow there. I have a tendency to forget that this chapter has the Aragorn/Eowyn dialogues, but they're always a pleasure to rediscover. It's some of Tolkien's most dramatically layered dialogue. Both characters have far more going on behind them than they speak, and hakf the drama comes from knowing those layers and reading them through what isn't said.
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I prefer history, true or feigned.
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#47 | |
Blossom of Dwimordene
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: The realm of forgotten words
Posts: 10,359
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I have to admit it took me many reads to match the identity of the corpse to Eomer's story about Baldor. Tolkien is usually fairly explicit about his hisory, but this little puzzle for the grey cells is a nice solvable mystery touch. Ever since making the connection I kept wondering if Baldor died by that door trying to get in or to get out, and I can think of several arguments for both cases. I suppose that as Aragorn said we'll never know what he sought there.
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You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera |
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