Silmarillion - Chapter 23 - Of Tuor and the Fall of Gondolin

[Estelyn Telcontar]

This chapter introduces a new character (only very briefly mentioned previously) - Tuor. The aspect that fascinates me most is his connection with Ulmo:

...he [Ulmo] had chosen Tuor as the instrument of his designs...

It is very unusual to read of active Valar intervention in the fate of Middle-earth and its inhabitants, as well as of any communication between them.

I can't help but compare the fate of Tuor with that of Túrin - it would seem that Tuor is blessed whereas Túrin was cursed. How much influence did that have, how much was due to his own decisions?

And once again pride is one of the causes of the downfall of an Elven kingdom, in this case, that of Turgon. The warning, "Love not too well the work of thy hands" reminds me of Aragorn's words in LotR: "One who cannot cast away a treasure at need is in fetters."

Betrayal is the other cause of Gondolin's downfall - Maeglin's jealousy drives him to divulge the city's location to Morgoth. He's an interesting character - what do you think of him and the role he played?

The second marriage of Elf and Man takes place here. This is a singular case, because the Human is allowed to partake in the fate of the Eldar, instead of the other way around. Their child will play a very special role in future events. Later, Idril's foresight saves her family and a number of their people from destruction.

A part of this tale is told at greater length in the UT, and I'm sure there is more information in HoMe. I'm away from home, so I can't reference those. Hopefully Aiwendil has notes on those sources to add to the discussion, and others will certainly add what they know. I look forward to reading what you all have to say!

[Aiwendil]

I do indeed have some notes on the sources.

The original tale of 'Tuor and the Exiles of Gondolin' was the very first of the 'Lost Tales' that Tolkien wrote, while he was on sick leave from the army in 1916 or 1917, and is thus, in a sense, the germ of the whole mythology. This original version was, like the rest of the 'Lost Tales', a very full telling of the story, and it is noteworthy that whereas the Silmarillion summarizes the siege and sack of Gondolin in the space of about two paragraphs, the old 'Tale' spends twenty pages or so giving a vivid account of the battle.

When, in the 1920s, Tolkien turned for a while to poetry in developing his legendarium, 'The Fall of Gondolin' was among the tales he began to cast into verse. But, unlike the 'Lay of the Children of Hurin' or the 'Lay of Leithien', the 'Lay of the Fall of Gondolin' did not get very far.

A very short summary of the story appears in the 'Sketch of the Mythology' and, based on this, a slightly fuller summary in the 'Quenta Noldorinwa'. As with 'The Ruin of Doriath', the 'Quenta Noldorinwa' text of 1930 was the last time the story of Tuor was told from beginning to end, and it was upon this text that chapter 23 of the published Silmarillion was based. It's worth noting that associated with the 'Quenta Noldorinwa' text there is a (very beautiful, in my opinion) poem called 'The Horns of Ylmir', which is purportedly a song Tuor sings to his son Earendel telling of his vision of Ylmir (Ulmo). The earliest version of this poem was actually written in 1914 - before the 'Lost Tales' had even been begun - but was later reworked to fit into the story.

Unfortunately, the 'Quenta Silmarillion' and the post-LotR 'Grey Annals' both break of before reaching the story of Tuor. In the post-LotR period, Tolkien did, however, begin to write a new full-length prose version of the story, comparable in scale to the Narn i Chin Hurin. This text, which runs to about thirty-five pages even though it breaks off before Tuor even enters the Hidden City, is given in Unfinished Tales under the title 'Of Tuor and His Coming to Gondolin'.

Additional Readings
HoMe II: Lost Tales version.
HoMe III: Discussion of the abandoned 'Lay' (the text is not given in full)
HoMe IV: 'Sketch' and 'Quenta Noldorinwa' versions; poem 'The Horns of Ylmir'
UT: Beginning of a post-LotR full version

[Aiwendil]

Sorry for the double post, but I just wanted to expand a bit on Estelyn's excellent point:

I can't help but compare the fate of Tuor with that of Túrin - it would seem that Tuor is blessed whereas Túrin was cursed.

Indeed, the stories of Turin and of Tuor mirror each other in many ways, and I think each story provides some insight into the other.

To begin with, Turin and Tuor are of course cousins, each the son of a heroic warrior who fought in the Nirnaeth. Each has had a destiny of some kind prescribed for him by a Vala - by Morgoth in Turin's case and by Ulmo in Tuor's (the interesting questions about fate vs. free will that arise in Turin's saga are applicable also to Tuor's, though less often discussed). Each is, as a child, delivered by his mother into the care of a Grey Elf (Thingol and Annael, respectively). Each wishes to take up arms against the forces of Morgoth; but while Thingol allows Turin to do this, Annael forbids Tuor. Like Turin, Tuor then spends some time as an outlaw. Turin befriends Gwindor, who leads him to the hidden Noldorin kingdom of Nargothrond; likewise, Tuor meets Voronwe who leads him to the hidden kingdom of Gondolin. Notice also that Gwindor meets Turin soon after escaping from Angband, the realm of Morgoth; likewise Voronwe meets Tuor after having been lost for years at sea - in other words, in the realm of Ulmo.

Each of the cousins then becomes a respected leader and counselor to the king in his respective Elvish city. In fact, there is an additional parallel here that did not survive into the published Silmarillion. Turin, of course, counsels Orodreth to abandon his secrecy and go openly to war against Morgoth. In the pre-LotR versions of the story, Tuor (at the command of Ulmo) similarly urges Turgon to go forth to war. Each is opposed in their counsel by another important figure in the city (Gwindor and Maeglin, respectively), who also happens to be a rival of sorts for the affections of the king's daughter. And of course, each of the hidden kingdoms is eventually attacked and destroyed.

One could argue that throughout the story, Tuor makes the right decisions where Turin made the wrong ones. But then, as Esty points out, Tuor was blessed whereas Turin was cursed; after all, neither of them escaped his fate - though, of course, Tuor's fate was happy whereas Turin's was not.

[Galin]

Originally Posted by Estelyn Telcontar

Betrayal is the other cause of Gondolin's downfall - Maeglin's jealousy drives him to divulge the city's location to Morgoth. He's an interesting character - what do you think of him and the role he played?

On this point I think the story was altered by JRRT in that it was the mighty Hurin who unwittingly divulged the location of Gondolin. The story as imagined in the 1930s went:

Húrin element

'...Húrin was released by Morgoth, for Morgoth thought still to use him...' (and after bringing the treasure to Thingol) 'Yet Thingol would not take the hoard, and long he bore with Húrin; but Húrin scorned him, and wandered forth in quest of Morwen his wife, but it is not said that he found her ever upon the earth; and some have said that he cast himself at last into the western sea, and so ended the mightiest of the warriors of mortal Men.' The Quenta

betrayal of Gondolin

'Meglin was no weakling or craven, but the torment wherewith he was threatened cowed his soul, and he purchased his life and feedom by revealing unto Morgoth the place of Gondolin and the ways whereby it might be found and assailed. Great indeed was the joy of Morgoth...' The Quenta

Or, from the Later Annals of Beleriand: (300) 'Húrin brought the gold to Thingol in Doriath, but he departed thence again with bitter words, and of his fate and the fate of Morwen thereafter no sure tiding were ever heard.'

306 'Meglin was taken in the hills, and he betrayed Gondolin to Morgoth.'


Compare to the later material.

Húrin element

'Yet there were ears that heard the words that Húrin spoke, and report of all came soon to the Dark Throne in the north; and Morgoth smiled, for he knew now clearly in what region Turgon dwelt, though because of the eagles no spy of his could yet come within sight of the land behind the Encircling Mountains. This was the first evil that the freedom of Húrin achieved.' The Wanderings of Húrin

betrayal of Gondolin

'Later when captured and Maeglin wished to buy his release with treachery, Morgoth must answer laughing, saying: Stale news will buy nothing. I know this already, I am not so easily blinded! So Maeglin was obliged to offer more -- to undermine resistance in Gondolin.' [a further note of almost exact wording adds] 'and to compass the death of Tuor and Earendil if he could. If he did he would be allowed to retain Idril (said Morgoth).' Note 30 The Wanderings of Húrin


To my mind the story appears to change fairly notably. In the Gondolin section for instance, compare that Morgoth's joy was great at Meglin's news -- with the later reaction that he now laughs at Maeglin, and the reader can easily assume it's because location news is stale news, thanks to Húrin (noting Morgoth smiled upon hearing the news concerning Húrin).


Interestingly, in the early long prose Fall of Gondolin (The Book of Lost Tales) the spies see Gondolin from afar, 'but into the plain they could not win for the vigilance of its guardians and the difficulty of those mountains. Indeed the Gondothlim were mighty archers...'

But Melko would like to know as much as possible about the city he would attack, not simply location. Enter Meglin. Later Melko withdrew his spies: 'for every path and corner of the mountains was now known to him', but Meglin had supplied needed information as well: 'and Meglin told them of all the fashion of that plain and city, of its walls and their height and thickness, and the valour of its gates; of the host of men at arms (...) and the countless hoard of weapons (...) of the engines of war.' And still Meglin said that Morgoth could not avail against Gondolin, and he counselled Melko how to do so.

Granted the spies themselves discovered more about the mountains, but that doesn't appear to be Meglin's doing in any case.

In the end Maeglin was still to betray Gondolin of course, but I think perhaps it was to be more like his role from The Book of Lost Tales, given the introduction of 'the Hurin element'.


Note on the 1977 Silmarillion

It might be added that the published Silmarillion contains a combination of texts, and still includes the early description from the Qenta -- except that Christopher Tolkien added the word 'very' to imply he revealed the 'very' place of Gondolin, or that is, more specific information about Gondolin.

CJRT appears to realize that the reader of The Fall of Gondolin will already naturally think that Húrin has revealed the whereabouts of Gondolin, so if Maeglin is also to do so (if he includes the much earlier Qenta description, as he did), it must be the very location -- and the reader naturally comes to the conclusion that Húrin's part was too general -- a conclusion I agree with, based on an interpretation of the 1977 Silmarillion however.

I have no problem with combining these two descriptions in this way, but I don't think even CJRT would argue that this was necessarily intended by his father.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Aiwendil

To begin with, Turin and Tuor are of course cousins, each the son of a heroic warrior who fought in the Nirnaeth. Each has had a destiny of some kind prescribed for him by a Vala - by Morgoth in Turin's case and by Ulmo in Tuor's (the interesting questions about fate vs. free will that arise in Turin's saga are applicable also to Tuor's, though less often discussed).

I think it is noteworthy that Túrin did have some intervention by the same Vala who "blessed" Tuor.

Ulmo had sent emissaries to Nargothrond, who had given express warnings from him against the manner in which, ordered by Túrin, the Elves there were conducting themselves. Túrin refused to listen, and I see no way in which Morgoth could have prevented him from doing so.

Tuor, on the other hand, sees himself as but a small player in the greater Play. He accepts Ulmo's errand with that in view. One would have to wonder what Túrin might have said in a similar circumstance, confronted by the Lord of Waters, and asked to give up any private ambitions he might have had and go do Ulmo's bidding. Something to the effect of "What have the Valar ever done to help me or me kin? No thanks," maybe.

Originally Posted by Aiwendil

One could argue that throughout the story, Tuor makes the right decisions where Turin made the wrong ones. But then, as Esty points out, Tuor was blessed whereas Turin was cursed; after all, neither of them escaped his fate - though, of course, Tuor's fate was happy whereas Turin's was not.

And the "fate" of both was not etched in stone. Just as Túrin could have at least lessened the impact of the curse by his choices, I feel certain Tuor was also at liberty to escape his "fate". He could have refused Ulmo's errand, "fate" would have found another means of being accomplished, and Tuor's enduring fame would consequently probably not have been present.

[Galadriel55]

The world will come to an end before me and Inzil will stop arguing on this topic, it seems.

Tuor, on the other hand, sees himself as but a small player in the greater Play. He accepts Ulmo's errand with that in view. One would have to wonder what Túrin might have said in a similar circumstance, confronted by the Lord of Waters, and asked to give up any private ambitions he might have had and go do Ulmo's bidding. Something to the effect of "What have the Valar ever done to help me or me kin? No thanks," maybe.

One could equally say that Tuor is a brainless Yes-man, accepting everything that came his way until Maeglin attempted to sieze Idril and Earendil. Ulmo told him to find a city that wasn't found by anybody in hundreds of years, and Tuor says "sure thing! Just cause you're a Vala and can't make mistakes, I'll go I don't know where!" He's darn lucky "fate" brought Voronwe to that place at that time. Then, when Turgon refuses to listen, "sure thing, Turgon, don't listen to Ulmo, he isn't aware of the current situation here inland! You know better!"

You know this isn't the way it was, I know it isn't.

Though his tale is, as was said, a happy one, you could also say that he was partially responsible for the Fall of Gondolin. He also did not heed Ulmo to the full extent. He didn't see to it that the city be abandoned in time. Was it his fault that Turgon was stubborn? No, but he certainly could have nagged him onto it, having a very high position. If Turin was able to bring about a destruction of a kingdom by revealing it, it was in Tuor's hands to prevent a destruction by revealing his respective kingdom. Why was Turin able to do it, and Tuor wasn't? Is it because he didn't have the guts, or perhaps the initiative, or the desire to make things happen in thay Play?

Again, it comes down to this. It'm exaggerating somewhat, but the fact that Turin is an active "player" and Tuor - a passive one, doesn't make one better than the other, or one "right" and the other "wrong".

In modern terms we could call Tuor religious and Turin an atheist. Or, perhaps, Tuor - a believer, and Turin - a realist. Can we fault him for being realistic? You have to look at things from his point of view, not only from up above at the reader's perspective.

Yes, I like Turin better as a character than Tuor. But I'm not putting one as an ideal example in front of the other.

And saying that, I think that Tuor is the closest Tolkien ever came to writing a Mary Sue, or in this case Gary Stu, though that is still very far.

One thing we could say as a definite thing about their opposite fates and personalities is that Tuor was humble and Turin was proud. That is probably what influenced their choices the most. But yet again, this does not make Tuor better than Turi in my eyes. He sure has humility, so much of it that he hardly has any backbone. Turin has too much backbone. They need each other for contrast and compromise. Finis.

~~~

Originally Posted by Esty

Betrayal is the other cause of Gondolin's downfall - Maeglin's jealousy drives him to divulge the city's location to Morgoth. He's an interesting character - what do you think of him and the role he played?

I think he's a true kinsman of Feanor, though distant. He's one of those many characters that are "good", and then suddenly "bad", and most of the time on a "third side". This adds dimention to the world, and makes it more realistic.

Out of all the FA traitors, I think he's the dirtiest and cheapest one. He's comparable with Gorlim, also driven to treachery by love. Gorlim's motivation was longing and dragged-out waiting for some sign, and not knowing what has happened to Eilinel, whereas Maeglin's was drawn-out lust.

From the very beginning he is a bit of a treacherous person. He has no respect for Eol his father, and is indifferent when he is thrown off the cliff. While Eol isn't "right", I still expected some basic son-to-father respect. Maeglin was born with only his personal gain in mind.

In this chapter he once again shows that he only lusts after Idril and is jealous of Tuor, with no care for the other Elves of Gondolin.

[VarTalman]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

I think it is noteworthy that Túrin did have some intervention by the same Vala who "blessed" Tuor.

Ulmo had sent emissaries to Nargothrond, who had given express warnings from him against the manner in which, ordered by Túrin, the Elves there were conducting themselves. Túrin refused to listen, and I see no way in which Morgoth could have prevented him from doing so.

Tuor, on the other hand, sees himself as but a small player in the greater Play. He accepts Ulmo's errand with that in view. One would have to wonder what Túrin might have said in a similar circumstance, confronted by the Lord of Waters, and asked to give up any private ambitions he might have had and go do Ulmo's bidding. Something to the effect of "What have the Valar ever done to help me or me kin? No thanks," maybe.

I say it again... Tuor's assignment closely parallels the journey of Jonah in the Bible.

[Tar-Jêx]

Originally Posted by VarTalman

I say it again... Tuor's assignment closely parallels the journey of Jonah in the Bible.

Considering how many biblical references there are in Lord of the Rings, especially with Gandalf, I don't find this hard to believe.

[Ivriniel]

Originally Posted by Estelyn Telcontar

This chapter introduces a new character (only very briefly mentioned previously) - Tuor. The aspect that fascinates me most is his connection with Ulmo: It is very unusual to read of active Valar intervention in the fate of Middle-earth and its inhabitants, as well as of any communication between them.

I can't help but compare the fate of Tuor with that of Túrin - it would seem that Tuor is blessed whereas Túrin was cursed. How much influence did that have, how much was due to his own decisions?

And once again pride is one of the causes of the downfall of an Elven kingdom, in this case, that of Turgon. The warning, "Love not too well the work of thy hands" reminds me of Aragorn's words in LotR: "One who cannot cast away a treasure at need is in fetters."

Betrayal is the other cause of Gondolin's downfall - Maeglin's jealousy drives him to divulge the city's location to Morgoth. He's an interesting character - what do you think of him and the role he played?

The second marriage of Elf and Man takes place here. This is a singular case, because the Human is allowed to partake in the fate of the Eldar, instead of the other way around. Their child will play a very special role in future events. Later, Idril's foresight saves her family and a number of their people from destruction.

A part of this tale is told at greater length in the UT, and I'm sure there is more information in HoMe. I'm away from home, so I can't reference those. Hopefully Aiwendil has notes on those sources to add to the discussion, and others will certainly add what they know. I look forward to reading what you all have to say!

Maeglin was in many ways a heroic character in terms of strength, given that he witnessed his father, Eol, thrown off the cliffs of the surrounding mountains as response to the death of Aredhel.

Despite that kind of malice (and the Kinslaying estranged the Noldor and the Teleri much more seriously) he was described by Tolkien (or Christopher) as a Elf not lacking strength. And so before Morgoth, it took quite a lot to bend him to Morgoth's will.

It's also a testament to the perversions of Turgon and the Noldor in general, probably affectations of Vanity and Conceit that they could not (read) Maeglin after his confrontation with Morgoth. That blindess seems to imply that Turgon's pride and vanity to rule in separatism had run to Term.