**Spoiler Warning** Rings of Power S2E1 - "Elven Kings Under the Sky"

[Huinesoron]

Yup, we're doing this again. Love it, hate it, refuse to watch it, here's your spoiler thread for The Lord of the Rings: Extracts from Appendix B (Revised and Expanded) - Season 2 ~~~ Episode 1.

Leading with the random thoughts that have stayed with me in the couple of days since I watched the first episode:

- The recap was good for what it was, bringing me back to where the story broke off. I don't think it would work as an intro to the series if someone wanted to start watching with S2.

- HA HA Sauron got murdered by Orcs with his own hand-me-down crown. If you're counting, Mr. The Terrible has now lost his fights with: an orphan who'd lose his own hand if it wasn't screwed on properly; a girl and her dog; a bunch of orcs who just lost the War; an army he didn't even bother to fight; the Sea; an orphan with a busted sword; Finrod's kid sister; and a couple of short fellows with sore feet. (Not all of this can legally be mentioned in the show, of course.)

- I do not like Blood Worm Sauron, but I find him blobbing his way down the mountainside hilarious.

- Elrond ducking behind a bush and pulling a vanishing trick is also hilarious, especially since the editing makes it look like Galadriel reached the guards second later. He must have legged it over to them while she was looking baffled.

- Is this the first time Gil-Galad has been made aware that his aunt (or whatever) is still running around? I half expected a "Didn't I send you to Valinor?".

- Elrond rejecting the Rings is an interesting plot beat, but actually makes sense given the confirmation that Galadriel didn't mention that Halbrand was Sauron. That's a dumb move/bad writing on her part, especially since her justification is that it would be a bit embarassing. It only happened because Celebrimbor needs to not know who his houseguest is/was.

- Waterfall jump! I guess we know where Movie Aragorn gets it from.

- I actually have no idea why Halbrand turned himself in to Adar. His next move is just to head right back to the place he just left. Did he just want to taunt his enemy/target? Or was that wolf his favourite pet that he just really missed? Maybe he just hated Waldreg that much.

- Cirdan is amazing, and properly bearded! He's also the only person in the entire episode (/show) to come up with a simple, enactable plan and just go for it. "Potentially evil rings? Yeah, I've got a mid-ocean rift with their name on it, let me get my boat."

- Why does he stop? The visuals imply that Elrond was 100% correct: looking at the Rings corrupts you into accepting them. But given that it's Cirdan, I think he took that wave as a message from Ulmo, to turn aside from his course and try another. It wouldn't be the first time.

- I feel so bad for those women behind Gil-Galad, the ones who've adopted the Arwen Moping Veils. They clearly want to go to Valinor! They'd love to hop on a boat and head over to the Undying Lands and not have to deal with sweeping up leaves or whatever it is they do in Lindon. And then suddenly it's magic rings and magic trees and I guess we're staying here then.

- That messenger from Gil-Galad to Celebrimbor is so dead. Poor guy should have a red shirt to go with his stolen herald's staff (which is blatantly just Elrond's).

- Very pleased to see the Harfeet again, especially once Poppy returns too. (She has blatantly been following since the moment Nori left, and doesn't have the faintest idea how everyone's doing back home). Fake Gandalf is actually much less interesting now he can talk.

- I like "the song is a map", but wish it had felt less rushed. Were the pillars with ?crystal outcrops? the Light in the Tower, or the Eyes of Pale Fire, or what? I didn't even see the Black Sand For My Bed. We needed a proper flyover here.

- And Celebrimbor lets Halbrand back in. Of course he does - his only evidence against him is that Aunt PTSD said "he's not coming back", because of course Elrond didn't say anything useful before haring off to Lindon like "Halbrand was lying about being the King of the Southlands and is probably a servant of Morgoth, don't trust him even slightly." Nope, the Ring Heist was on, no looking back.

Overall thoughts:

I enjoyed this episode, blob!Sauron aside. I liked the fact that they managed to focus on just the three storylines; in particular, I enjoyed not having to try and identify any Numenoreans or Southlanders for once. The fact that none of the bearers of the Three particularly trust each other (Cirdan tried to destroy the Rings despite knowing Gil-Galad's preference for using them) should make for interesting dynamics. We'll see if episode 2 carries that through.

I won't comment on the trailer that came attached to the end of the episode, because what the even heck.

hS

[Boromir88]

I think the start of Season 2 was much better than Season 1. First 2 episodes, there was a better flow and they seem to be pushing the plot at a better pace. Instead of cramming all the reveals and resolution of Season 1 into the final episode.

Cirdan's hair puts all the other Elves in the show to shame. I enjoyed his introduction to the show, and every time he was on screen. I liked his lines about Rumil and Daeron

I thought Sauron reforming his body was visually cool. Even if the black slime reminded me of what killed Tasha in Star Trek TNG . The CGI, costumes and prosthetics have been on point and improved from Season 1. The Prologue scene, of Adar and the Orcs going Ides of March on Sauron is my favorite scene of the entire series so far. I like that we're going to get to see Sauron portrayed as the master manipulator that he was, and not some super-hulking, mace wielding, smasher of armies from PJ's prologue. That was Sauron's power and Charlie Vickers seems like he's going to be able to step into that role (at least from the first two episodes). Adar was the most compelling character in Season 1. Season 2, up to this point, it's Sauron.

A "cherry picking the good parts" moment, I loved the walking song being turned into the key to show the Harfoots the right path. Also, it sounded to me like the Harfoot actresses dropped their out of place accents.

Overall: I've seen enough from the creators that they have a better understanding on the themes of the story than Peter Jackson did. Season 1, just left me doubting their ability to write and tell a compelling story from all of it. Season 2 is off to a better start than Season 1.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Huey

- I actually have no idea why Halbrand turned himself in to Adar. His next move is just to head right back to the place he just left. Did he just want to taunt his enemy/target? Or was that wolf his favourite pet that he just really missed? Maybe he just hated Waldreg that much.

Going back to this for a moment...I'm pretty sure Halbrand/Sauron got captured to bait Adar into attacking Eregion. By telling Adar that Sauron is helping the Elves, it's going to start the war that's been teased in the Season 2 trailer.

Poor Waldreg. I sort of liked him, but it was cool to tap into one of Sauron's powers/abilities from the 1st age.

[Oddwen]

Ah yes, the origin story of Tar-Raftwurst.


I appreciate the symbolism of Sauron getting his corporeal gluteals handed to him by yet another circular adornment.

Originally Posted by Huin

- I actually have no idea why Halbrand turned himself in to Adar. His next move is just to head right back to the place he just left. Did he just want to taunt his enemy/target? Or was that wolf his favourite pet that he just really missed? Maybe he just hated Waldreg that much.

Solely so Sauron can repeat the "with your head at my feet" line to Adar in the season finale.


I'm sure he wanted to confirm that the guy who stabbed him in the neck was now leading the orc army that he wanted and wanted first-hand information, as well as a way to ensure that Adar didn't just remember him as the preaching blonde fellow that a few orcs could take down, but as someone who could appear to him at any time, in any form, and still manipulate him to do exactly what he wanted.



It's said that servants of the Enemy "look fair but feel foul". What would that look like to another enemy of men & elf? "Look weak but feel strong"?

Originally Posted by Huin

- Cirdan is amazing, and properly bearded! He's also the only person in the entire episode (/show) to come up with a simple, enactable plan and just go for it. "Potentially evil rings? Yeah, I've got a mid-ocean rift with their name on it, let me get my boat."

Yes! He seems so warm. One could imagine him unironically singing "Tra-la-la-lally" and making it work.

[Boromir88]

Rufus Wainwright was a great choice for the Old Tom Bombadil song…



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=L7oaZxdAMzI

[Formendacil]

Well, I've finally watched the first episode of RoP. They've been kicking off these seasons at a bad time of year for me to watch things, but there's also a solid layer of "meh, I'll get to it when I get to it," which is not a good sign. At least last season, I had some urgency to know what insanity they were going to come up with next. I took some notes, but, uh, I was typing one-handed on my phone while holding a baby (do not blame the baby for my lack of RoP-excitement: this is all on Season 1):

Originally Posted by Formendacil typing one-handed on his phone while holding a baby

like the look of earlier Sauron
Adams betrayal not bad
Rebuilding body very creepy
Staring down. Fish
What's with the contrived enmity betwixt Galadri and Elrond?
Golgalad having a daunting elderness to Gaaldreil.is wrong.
They said weeks!!
Far above uournpagrsade,Eornd!
Cast them into the fir, Erind--err, river.
Adar is much darker this season
Who is tThmmT spying on meteor man??
Nori, eating termites is NIT the answer
Deducted saruman vibes
Curdna!
Calling her commandw rnwver feases to amaze me
I a. Listening to it and I already forget this s dialogue.
Poppy shock
Like the personification of the sea
Adar = Maedhros?

Which... I think means something like:

1. I like the look of earlier Sauron. Indeed, this actor gets much closer to my mental picture of Annatar than Halbrand does--or than I expected them to get at all.
2. Adar's betrayal not bad. Granting the utter non-canonicity of Adar (though rooted in a canonical fact), the idea that Sauron might have experienced pushback from the leftover remnants of Morgoth's forces in the 2nd Age is... interesting. It doesn't seem LIKELY to me: we're talking about one of the most powerful Maia who would have had ZERO problem daunting his subjects into submission... but it's interesting, and it's of a piece with the RoP writers having, overall, a strong fascination with what the orks are and what makes them tick.
3. Sauron's rebuilding body is very creepy. I'm not sure if this serves where he's supposed to be in the story well or not: we're being given a Sauron who appears to have some choice in whether he's going to be evil or not in this flashback. Given that we already know what Halbrand ends up choosing, there's not a TON of suspense there, so adding in his literally evil "true nature" of sorts here doesn't quite work for me. But it IS visually striking--if also goofy.
4. Sauron staring down the leviathan is... well, it stuck in my thoughts, but I'm not sure: goofy? Unlikely? Ulmo or "the sea" seems to be a bit of a theme this episode--is this part of it? Is the ship wrecked because Ulmo won't like Sauron cross and recognises him or because Men can't seek Valinor? Sauron's attempt at being a good guy lasted, what--three and a half heartbeats?
5. What's with the enmity betwixt Galadriel and Elrond? No really thoughts here--but after they were shown as friends in Season 1 and we know they're top allies in LotR, I'm not sure that I love this opposition here. I think it wouldn't have made more sense for them to have not known each well, or not been friends, or whatever in Season 1, develop to true opposition here, and leave the mature understanding of each other for the future as something OTHER than a restored friendship... but what do I know?
6. Gil-galad being the daunting elder to Galadriel is wrong. Wherever you place Gil-galad on the Finwëan tree, he should be junior to Galadriel. Galadriel's whole thing in Tolkien's mindset is that she's the one Rebellion Generation Noldo left in Middle-earth after the 1st Age, and they just erase it, and I'm not over it yet.
7. They said weeks! At least we know it actually took weeks rather than hours to forge the Three.
8. Far above your paygrade, Elrond! (Sometimes, there are lines that were CLEARLY reverse-engineered from a modern idiom, and this is one. I can't help but thinking of Tolkien's letter to Hugh Brogan about how Théoden's speech lines up idiomatically with how he THINKS.
9. Cast them into the fire, Elrond--err, river. I fully expected Elrond to chicken out with this Isildur parallel--but he didn't! The writers have made Elrond very much the most principled of all the Eldar, and although the turns of the story make me roll my eyes, I do like that, since I think it would be easy to work backwards from LotR and have a far less respectful impression of the Son of Eärendil.
10. Adar is much darker this season. I don't know if this is the change of actors or a writing emphasis, or both, but he seemed more sad as portrayed last season, more angry this season. Not a complaint so much as an observation.
11. Who is that spying on meteor man?? The designs of the East are very different from the movies: both this masked guy and last season's white sorcerers.
12. Nori, eating termites is NOT the answer!
13. I'm getting Saruman vibes more than Gandalf this season.
14. Círdan! I liked his portrayal, even if I can't say say he matched my preconceived vibes. Unlike Galadriel, he has the right "generation" to him. It's also quite in-character to me that he'd have been off-screen all first season: doing his own thing away from others is right.
15. Galadriel being call commander never ceases to sound wrong to me.
16. I am watching the show right now and I am already forgetting the dialogue.
17. Poppy shock (sarcastic shock at Poppy appearing)
18. I like the suggestion of personification of the sea--especially connected with Círdan. But should we take this as Ossë, Uínen, or Ulmo? And is the sea right?
19. The idea that Adar's torment that led him to become an ork-father is that same as the torment of Maedhros has some interesting implications.

And then for the last 10 minutes or so, I wrote no notes. It is interesting to me that we aren't giving Gil-galad two Rings (in the books, he has both Narya and Vilya, though it's not 100% clear until when). Sauron returning to Eregion really does seem to make his detour to Mordor and Adar really pointless, though I think they're trying to set up the destruction of Eregion at the hands of Sauron's armies later.

I enjoy the acting with Nori and Sarumeteorman, but I can't take it seriously at all: nothing happens (which I seem to remember being a problem last season too) and we don't even have wildly speculative Harfoot culture to explore. The idea that the song is a guide to the desert didn't come across successfully to me at all: more like something out of a Magic Treehouse book than Middle-earth, even if songs as remnants of an earlier time is SUPREMELY Tolkienian.

I'm not rushing to watch episode 2... but I'm not dropping it either, so--success?

[Alassë Estel]

That sums up my thoughts nicely.

And on a side note, I think reviews written with one hand whilst holding a baby are my new favorite kind.

[Oddwen]

Originally Posted by Form

Far above uournpagrsade,Eornd!

Far above Uournpagrsade, Eornd
Where Curdna slinks and Poppy shock
Rebuilding body very creepy
Like the look of earlier Sauron
Who is tThmmT spying on meteor man??
Adams betrayal not bad
Staring down. Fish
And Finrod fell before the throne


Are we using this thread for other episodes or taking them one at a time again?

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by Oddwen

Far above Uournpagrsade, Eornd
Where Curdna slinks and Poppy shock
Rebuilding body very creepy
Like the look of earlier Sauron
Who is tThmmT spying on meteor man??
Adams betrayal not bad
Staring down. Fish
And Finrod fell before the throne


Are we using this thread for other episodes or taking them one at a time again?

Historically (i.e. last time) we put a new thread up for each episode so that sluggards like me could post as they went along without being spoiled.

[Huinesoron]

Originally Posted by Formendacil

Historically (i.e. last time) we put a new thread up for each episode so that sluggards like me could post as they went along without being spoiled.

Yep, this; I've watched 2 and 3 recently so plan to start those if nobody does it first.

hS