Eorling Mead Hall Planning/Discussion Thread

[littlemanpoet]

I was planning to post today, but I want to wait for others to do so first.

The way it looks to me, Rowenna will probably have made her way into the mead hall to observe the goings on regarding Rilef. On her way she will listen for sounds in the cellar, and will be determined to not interfere, and if she can help it, not to let others interfere with Ghem's and the others' plans to escape, so that her checkered time with them does not come to light. So she might attempt to dissuade Stigend should he try to interfere, but in a very subtle way such as redirecting his path away from the cellar, if she can.

Do with that what you like, Noggie. I'll wait for more writers to post.

[Nogrod]

Here's what I've been thinking...

So the outlaws get away and climb the stairs to the kitchen. Wasn't it so?

In that case no one in the hall will have any idea they've escaped. Unless something betrays their escape.

So could it be that someone is there in the kitchen or is just going back there and notices the outlaws there - and screams? Maybe if s/he is there already the outlaws might jump on her/him? Although I'm not sure if a plain scream would provoke the reaction we possibly want so maybe that person should openly call something like "the outlaws" or "they're loose" or whatever.

Now I think Stigend is sitting quite near the stairs (as is implied from my last post) so he would not be in the best position to make a dash for the corridor that leads to the kitchen as there sure would be many people trying to get through that narrow door already. So he would take another route and rush out from the door at the right side of the stove getting to the alder court and trying to reach the kitchen from outside picking whatever utensil he could use as a weapon on his way (surely the normal people sitting in the hall are not armed).

I'd like to think Garstan would come with Stigend. Is that okay for you Celuien?

lmp: I'm not sure how we could fit Rowenna with this scenario but let's come up with something?

What do you think? Other suggestions?

[Lhunardawen]

Ginna says hello, Noggie. I can't bear to miss this, so I stationed her in the kitchen. I hope nobody minds.

Oh, and she's holding a knife. Does she need more drama in her life?

[Nogrod]

Nicely set Lhuna!

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

lmp: I'm not sure how we could fit Rowenna with this scenario but let's come up with something?

What do you think? Other suggestions?

Your plans work for me. What I stated earlier (So she might attempt to dissuade Stigend should he try to interfere, but in a very subtle way such as redirecting his path away from the cellar, if she can) is her ideal situation, how she would prefer things to work out. If they don't, she'll adapt.

[Lhunardawen]

Um, Elempi? Do I have a free rein here or does Ginna have to follow? I don't want to get in the way of any plans, and from the looks of it Ginna has to go, but I'm asking anyway.

[Nogrod]

If Ealasaide posts now we should have a nice little get-together in the kitchen... *hint*

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Lhunardawen

Um, Elempi? Do I have a free rein here or does Ginna have to follow? I don't want to get in the way of any plans, and from the looks of it Ginna has to go, but I'm asking anyway.

Lhuna, do whatever is in your character's personality to do. That's what I'm doing with Rowenna. If 2 of the 3 escaping rogues need to be captured for the storyline to work, then it'll happen, maybe just not the way you or I originally thought it would. This kind of thing happens to writers all the time.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Lhuna, do whatever is in your character's personality to do. That's what I'm doing with Rowenna. If 2 of the 3 escaping rogues need to be captured for the storyline to work, then it'll happen, maybe just not the way you or I originally thought it would.

I do agree... and am eager to see Eala's post sooner that later as the set up is quite interesting right now (with Ginna in the kitchen).


lmp: What do you think about the following matter?

I wrote somewhere in my earlier post here in the planning thread that the "normal people" would not have arms with them in the hall. Is there an armory in the Mead Hall in the first place where people would keep their "serious" weapons?

Thinking of this particular occasion, people who were with the rescue-party have barely had time to turn around in their rooms and would probably not have visited any armoury. So would they have left their weapons beside the main door to begin with - to be recollected later to the possible armoury? It was the practise of the northern and germanic tribes in RL at least to leave the weapons at the door and not to carry them inside - and I would be amazed if lord Eodwine would allow people carrying weapons with them inside the Mead Hall anyway...?

In that case (weapons at the main door) the weapons will be too far for Stigend (and Garstan) and they will have to improvise... and I kind of like the idea. Surely an everyday knife would hang on both of their belts still as they would have left only major weapons to the door - and those working-knives would be at their sides all the time... But what do you think?

And in any case, who are there in the Hall right now waiting for the court to begin who actually bear arms becasue they have an official duty to fex. bring the outlaws to the justice from the cellar?

Has lord Eodwine a sword at hand himself?

[littlemanpoet]

Very interesting thoughts, Noggie. I have never given thought to an armoury or where people leave their weapons. No doubt you are correct as to leaving weapons outside the main hall. My initial thought was that weapons would be hung on the walls of the Great Hall, especially on the (front) wall farthest from the kitchen. Perhaps we could posit an antechamber just inside the doorway that Eodwine and his craftsman have built but we writers hadn't thougt of?

....as shown in the attachment; what do you think?

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

My initial thought was that weapons would be hung on the walls of the Great Hall, especially on the (front) wall farthest from the kitchen. Perhaps we could posit an antechamber just inside the doorway that Eodwine and his craftsman have built but we writers hadn't thougt of?

That woud sound realistic... and the picture you had of it was good as well...

So normally the weapons would be kept in the antechamber but just at this particular moment people would have left their weapons inside the doorway (the main door down there) as they have just rushed in and wished to see their friends or loved ones sooner than later ie. before the court takes place.

Not that this leaving the weapons at the doorstep would help anyone - if not with the possible impressive turns of fate to come?

Lhuna: don't let Ginna to give in to Rowenna too easily! It's better storywise to actually have someone who can actually write in the kitchen... and anyway someone has to make a noise in there for the others to realise in the first place that something is wrong ie. the outlaws have escaped...

[littlemanpoet]

Now now now, Noggie. Do not try to unduly influence someone else's character to get what you want.

Lhuna, be influenced by Rowenna. Her charm and bearing are irresistible.

No, but really, write whatever seems most likely for your character.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Now now now, Noggie. Do not try to unduly influence someone else's character to get what you want.

So how it is in English? In Finnish it's said that a pot scorns a kettle because of it's black side... So aren't you doing the same my friend?

Go on Lhuna and do as you wish, notwithstanding what either of us wishes...

And whether our wishes are of any interest in general to begin with that depends wholly how much weight do you wish to give them... Well, lmp's surely are a bit more important as he's the host of the game but so far when he makes no over-ruling judgements or pre-requirements on issues I think we can do what we like...

And why should you listen to either of us?

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

So how it is in English? In Finnish it's said that a pot scorns a kettle because of it's black side... So aren't you doing the same my friend?

In English we say, "The pot's calling the kettle black." Pretty pedestrian by comparison, I think, but it means the same thing. And yes, of course that's what I was doing.

[Lhunardawen]

Well, thanks for confusing me, you two.

Here's the thing: I placed Ginna in the kitchen in the first place to fulfill Nogrod's wish, although I didn't know it at the time, and there I would want her to stay. I'm also sure she would love to take part in foiling the outlaws's escape. But right now I can't imagine a reason for her to refuse to help Rowenna. So...do I push my privilege as the writer, or respect my character's, well, character?

[Nogrod]

There is a simple answer to that Lhuna. Wait for Ealasaide to post the outlaws in to the kitchen so you don't need to make the decision...

[Lhunardawen]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

There is a simple answer to that Lhuna. Wait for Ealasaide to post the outlaws in to the kitchen so you don't need to make the decision...

I was actually considering that, but didn't think it was an option. Thanks, Nogrod.

Now, Eala, please DON'T wait for me to post.

[littlemanpoet]

Well, if Eala doesn't post soon, then I'll post for Rowenna again, including something about the cat having caught the serving wench's tongue, and then.... we'll see......

[Ealasaide]

EEK! Sorry, gang! I was kept away from the computer by RL complications & work. I'll get caught up on the thread right away and get to work on a post.

I will have the outlaws' next move up there no later than tomorrow! I will do my best to get it done this afternoon.

[Nogrod]

Good to see you back Eala!

*eagerly waiting for your post*

lmp, if you have spare time why not make a general description on the Mead Hall now as the people have gathered around the body of Rilef and wait for the court to begin proceedings?

I mean my characters were not those most near to Rilef and it's lord Eodwine's court anyway. So I am in no position to make that post anyway.

But just to heighten the mood and describing the situation?

[littlemanpoet]

Do a tableau post? Instead of reading this great new LotR movie spoof? Awww.

Oh, okay. I'll give it a whirl. The spoof will be there. (See my siggy while the opportunity lasts)

[Ealasaide]

WHHEEEEEE! My post is up!

[littlemanpoet]

Lefun and Ritun lay on a table between the antechamber and the firepit. Eodwine and his House stood around the body. The Eorl had told the story of the Rilef's death and then asked if anyone else would like to say something. He waited. And waited. Days passed. Meanwhile Rowenna and Ghem had separate adventures. Thornden and Leof somehow were with the group yet available to chat about Thornden's nephew, how Eodwine did not know. But he waited, expecting Garstan to say something, Falco to say something, anybody to say something, but no-one did. They all stood around, waiting for Elempi to lose patience move the plot along.

"Ahem," Eodwine coughed, looking up to the rafters. "Writer mine, this is not ATM. This is not a spoof. These other writers have busy lives and it's not their fault. So just do the post like you know how and move the plot along."

Darn it, said the Writer from above the rafters, But I was having so much fun. Oh, okay.

[littlemanpoet]

Wow! This is going to take some thinking! Great post, Eala.! What would Rowenna do? hmmmm.....

[Nogrod]

Nice post Eala!

But you don't give us others any chance of taking part as no one raises her/his voice to be heard to the hall...

So the people will just sit and wait in the Hall as they have nothing else to do... (and the writers will just sit and wait as well... )

[littlemanpoet]

I s'pose Rowenna could whistle for her dogs if she dares, and get them all in a barking uproar..... Hmmm..... sorry, my dance show is on. See ya tomorrow!

[Ealasaide]

Sorry, Nogrod, but I thought that that part would best be left up to the writers of the two women.

My approach was that it would be foolish of the outlaws to raise their voices in the process of trying to escape. Since I am not terribly familiar with the personalities of the two women, I thought it should be left up to them to decide how to react, whether to call out or what. Once I know what they are going to do, I can create more of a ruckus in the next post.

[Ealasaide]

Lhunardawen - now that Elempi has posted, I am waiting for you to post with Ginna before I come back with the outlaws.

Expect all **heck** to break loose in the kitchen on my next post!!!

[Lhunardawen]

Eala and everyone else, I will, once again, request for your patience. I should have a post up by this weekend (it's Friday VERY early morning for me right now). Heh, this is fun, but tough. What should Ginna do...

"See, you even have a new wench for your pleasure."

Geesh, Elempi, as if the situation's not complicated enough.

[Nogrod]

Thank's for opening the backdoor to me lmp! I do appreciate...

I try to post today.

[Nogrod]

So a hostage situation coming forwards?
*just guessing*

[littlemanpoet]

This is exciting! Eodwine will be in the thick of things now. It will be interesting to see how Rowenna explains herself to Stigend for the words he overheard. Ginna, too, for that matter. I don't expect much difficulty there, however.

[Ealasaide]

Sorry, Lhunardawen, I had intended to wait for you to post, but the thread has moved on. I need to get a post in there for the outlaws. Looking forward to hearing from Ginna when you get the chance!

[Nogrod]

Looking good indeed!

Only please Eala could you consider one minor correction to your post as I don't think the first description one would come up with Stigend is "young man"... Okay he's only thirty and thence quite young at least if the outlaws are clearly older (and in that case it's allright to me surely if the older outlaws think of him as a young man).

In principle I quess Stigend would not have taken the steps forwards because the best position for him surely is standing at the doorway - not to say that he would have given Ghem a chance to sneak behind him and bolt the door... but as it is good for the drama here I'd say let's leave it like it now is. This way we have more options open I think.

Let's see how this plays out...

[Ealasaide]

At the age of 43, I consider any gentleman under the age of 35 as a "young man." But I will make the correction. For future reference, what descriptive would you prefer?

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Ealasaide

At the age of 43, I consider any gentleman under the age of 35 as a "young man."

Soon celebrating my 40th birthday myself I tend to think the same in RL... it just looked to me like you were talking about a twenty-something there. That may be a language-issue as well as in Finnish a "young man" is much more twenty - even younger - than thirty...

Indeed that raised the question of how old people in the Mead Hall are in the first place? I remember that Garstan is 35 (and Modtryth is few years younger than Stigend eg. 27-28) but how about Garwine or Thornden? Lord Eodwine needs to be a mature person I quess as well as Falco, right? How about Ginna or Kara? Or the newcomers?

For future reference, what descriptive would you prefer?

Honestly I have no idea... But now as I think of it I can see one more reason why the "young man" kind of bothered me. For I have myself always thought of Stigend to look a lot older than his age because of the hard wandering life, tough manual labor in construction sites, defending his odd family from peoples scorn and sometimes violence...

But you couldn't naturally know that as I think I haven't talked about that too much after my first postings here. So sorry about the inconvenience.

[Ealasaide]

No inconvenience at all! But thank you for the explanations. I have to confess thinking, my goodness Nogrod is picky! "Young" seemed like such an innocuous adjective. Now that I know your reasons, it is much more understandable. All I had to go on really was the following:

Stigend....age unknown... an Eorling journeyman carpenter, whose wife is Modtryth, and son, Cnebba

Since he seemed to be acting like an impetuous young fellow, charging all alone into a room full of cutthroats, I suppose I did make the assumption that he was not so weathered and experienced as you now point out he is. Apologies!

Perhaps we should have a link somewhere to a more comprehensive set of character portraits so as writers we all have some sort of quick reference that we can go to when dealing with another writer's character. I don't even know what most of the characters here look like aside from male/female and a rough age estimate. It makes for much more colorful writing when we can make use of accurate detail.

As for the ages of my characters:
I see the outlaws as being in their early-to-mid-30's. Ulric may be slightly older (Elempi -- correct me if I am wrong. You were writing Ulric before I got my hooks into him. )
Elián is in his late twenties, probably 27 or 28.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Ealasaide

Since he seemed to be acting like an impetuous young fellow, charging all alone into a room full of cutthroats, I suppose I did make the assumption that he was not so weathered and experienced as you now point out he is. Apologies!

No need for apologies... I tried to wrote it into my post that he was enraged (that's the charging-part) because of how the outlaws actions had affected the children - and yes that's Stigend's soft spot - his child with whom he is overprotective... Modtryth snaps him for it every now and then... But that also can be known only if one is familiar with the earlier phases of the characters...

Perhaps we should have a link somewhere to a more comprehensive set of character portraits so as writers we all have some sort of quick reference that we can go to when dealing with another writer's character.

There indeed is a list of the names of the persons in the Mead Hall and with many their ages and a sentence-worth of description in the post #1 of this thread. But they sure are no descriptions in any thicker meaning of the word.

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Ealasaide

Perhaps we should have a link somewhere to a more comprehensive set of character portraits so as writers we all have some sort of quick reference that we can go to when dealing with another writer's character.

Tell you what: we do have a character list; it would be no problem for me to add anything like age, basic descriptions, and so forth, to what's already there. Just let me know and I'll add it. Some of the characters already do have ages attached to them in that post. See the very first post of this discussion thread for the link.

As for the ages of my characters:
I see the outlaws as being in their early-to-mid-30's. Ulric may be slightly older (Elempi -- correct me if I am wrong.

I'd say you're right about the outlaws.

[Nogrod]

It would be nice to know when Lhuna has time to write. I think she promised this weekend. Here in Finland (+3GMT) it's late Saturday evening - like 10PM - so with Lhuna it's even later. So I gather she will not post in the next few hours...

So maybe I can post something within an hour or two to build up the situation? Let's hope Lhuna gets online after she wakes up on Sunday (it's probably Sunday there already but anyway).

I'll start thinking a post...