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06-18-2004, 10:14 AM | #121 | |
Emperor of the South Pole
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on the other note... the whole 'Annoying Expert' thing is worthy of its own thread. |
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06-19-2004, 06:06 PM | #122 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Talking about Annoying Ammateurs how about Dummies who need to read LOTR for dummies.
There is a girl who claims she is a Ringwraith incarnate!! She is at my school and my other friend was telling me about her. Of course I almost blew up it is the most ridiculuos thing I ever heard! There was also another girl who walked up to my gym teacher (who is a drill seargent and an american football coach) and showed him a map of ME and pointed to Mordor and told him it was Mordor, Well everybody knows where Mordor is and you don't go up to a Gym teacher to tell him the obvious!!!
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06-19-2004, 07:09 PM | #123 | |
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I do confess, I am guilty of falling under the "Annoying Experts" catagory (according to just about everyone I know, anyway...) Abedithon le, ~*~Aranel~*~
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06-20-2004, 12:24 PM | #124 |
Psyche of Prince Immortal
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don't be hasty, not everybody should know everthing about lotr, don't expect that everyone in your school knows where mordor is! heck only like 75% the people in my school (500+ peeps) have seen all the movies! don't judge a book by its cover, even though they act like newbs, don't think that people around them aren't
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06-21-2004, 09:30 PM | #125 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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It is true I guess not everyone knows where Mordor is but the last person you go to tell where Mordor is is your Gym teacher.
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06-22-2004, 03:27 AM | #126 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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Alright, I have to say this. (Here's a fine example of my being an Annoying Expert)
Why, why, oh, why, would they go and make new books?!?!? Alright, so we have a book. A fine book. So fine, in fact, that we're going to make it an epic movie. So now we have a fine movie. Not as good as the book, but fairly good nonetheless. But WAIT! I've got a wonderful idea! We make books from the movies! We just follow the script that was a corruption of the original (read: real) book, which cut out dozens of characters and plots and scenes. So now we have a book that was made from a movie that was made from a book. Will someone explain to me the logic in this?
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06-22-2004, 06:53 AM | #127 | |
Stormdancer of Doom
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I tried to just let everyone have fun. After I had won with Frodo, they kept playing and gave me Galadriel to start over with, and I was on the verge of winning then (they were still filling their first gamepeice) when it was time to go. I tried not to be annoying. (Really, I did, because I wanted them to come back and play again.) But I felt pretty bad all the same. It drives people crazy when I say "We wants it, precious." I really haven't found that many annoying amateurs around. Most of the time I'm just happy when somebody speaks of the movie in a positive way. It's tempting to raise a mug and shout, "AN ALLY! WE WILL FORM A LEAGUE OF FRIENDSHIP THAT WILL LAST DOWN THROUGH THE AGES, AND OUR PEOPLE WILL AID ONE ANOTHER AT NEED! HAIL TOLKIENDOM! "
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06-23-2004, 10:13 AM | #128 | |
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I'm going to have to get LotR Trivial Pursuit (I can't believe I don't have it yet! *sob*) but it will be tricky to get anyone to play it with me. Everyone knows me too well. ^ ^;;; Here's something rather sad to contemplate: I finally talked my 28-year-old cousin into reading LotR (he'd read The Hobbit, but not LotR, though he has seen the movies). But--and this is really quite sad--he gave up before he even got to Chapter 5 of Book 1! He's gone to college; he's had to read all those horrible medical textbooks! How can he not handle LotR? So sad... Abedithon le, ~*~Aranel~*~
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06-23-2004, 10:22 AM | #129 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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I'm a bit of a newbie when it comes to LotR, but I'm always willing to learn from people who genuinely know more than me...
I've read LotR once thouroughly, the hobbit twice, I've started the Silm and I have a book of maps of Middle Earth...I think I also have a book of illustrations from various Tolkein books, but that doesnt really count... There is this one guy at my school who is really annoying...he thinks he knows everything about everything, not just LotR...He once told me that he liked how Tolkein portrayed Sauron as the dark master of Isengard..."Uh...No, Chris...that would either be Saruman, or Mordor...", to which he replied, "What do you mean, Sauron's the master of Isengard"..."Uh, no. Saruman is the master of Isengard, Sauron is the lord of Mordor.", he then shot back, before walking off in a huff "You know I meant Saruman, stop being so bloody pedantic."... This is one of many occasions i've wanted to smack him in the jaw with a lead pipe... Last edited by Hama Of The Riddermark; 06-23-2004 at 10:26 AM. |
06-23-2004, 04:51 PM | #130 | |
Wight
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I hate people who think they know all there is to know! Drives me nuts! I think I'm the only one among my friends who has read the books - some have tried but have never gotten that far. I wish they would but am kinda glad they haven't...it's fun to trick them .
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06-24-2004, 11:47 AM | #131 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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Ugh.
I was watching Return of the King with my mom and she was arguing with me for a full fifteen minutes that "Merry and Pippin go with Frodo on the ship! They do! Don't argue with me, I know they do!" I said, "Mom...I've read the books. They don't go on the ship." "Yes they do!" So we had to make a bet of $20. Needless to say, I won.
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06-24-2004, 01:13 PM | #132 |
Wight
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This Reminds Me of the Old Days...
When I was growing up, I had a Monopoly game. I played it with my family (parents and one brother, younger by two years). I always won. By the time I was in High School, they would not play with me. They absolutely despised the game.
After a while, I couldn't hustle a game from anyone...at all. So leave it to my own children to get old enough to kick my butt at my own best game.... Well, they should be smart, they are my kids, after all!
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06-24-2004, 01:55 PM | #133 |
Etheral Enchantress
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Newbies...
But you know, at the same time, you have to give them a bit of room. I mean some of them are actually pretty young - if not physically, emotionally - and they're still at a stage where reading "The Lord of the Rings" may be a daunting task. People mature at different ages and some people can't help it if they have short to no attention span. My old best friend (we don't speak anymore, but not for this reason) couldn't even get through the first half of The Lord of the Rings: the Fellowship of the Ring.
When I first came on here about two and a half years ago through...well, through until recently, really, I was also one of those people that practically got morally offended if someone saw the movies without reading the books, not to mention came into the Chat and started speaking Grelvish. But you know, recently I've decided that I really shouldn't get upset with them. It may take them time to read it. It may not even really be a maturity issue, they may just be happy with their own knowledge. As much as I hate the fact that this is true, as I like trying to learn as much as I can about everything, ignorance is really bliss for some people. And it's really no reason to waste time getting upset if they get a bit of trivia wrong. So yes, the people who come up to you and say "Tom Bombadil isn't a Lord of the Rings character" are annoying, but is it really worth getting upset about it? I have a friend that actually thinks that it's a serious moral flaw if someone sees the movies without the books, but I don't agree. We can each appreciate things in our own way. Even their not appreciating Tolkien as we think he should be appreciated, at least they're keeping the memory of Tolkien alive, right?
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06-25-2004, 11:38 AM | #134 | ||
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<==The Lofty Tree of Gondor
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Okay, A.A.'s who have only seen the movies are bad. But what about those who have only seen ONE of the movies? Say, their friends dragged them to RotK, but they haven't seen the others, and they still assume they are all-knowing about Middle-earth. Anyone here had to deal with newbies such as this? Abedithon le, ~*~Aranel~*~
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06-25-2004, 02:07 PM | #135 |
Etheral Enchantress
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Newbies...
As I said before, you have to give them time. It's not really something to get personally offended over. There are a lot more serious things you should probably have your mind on - perhaps not even Tolkien-related. I mean yes, having someone claim to know more than you about Middle-Earth when they know about as much as an earthworm does is annoying, but it's really easy to either just ignore them or kindly correct their knowledge with proof. I typically do the latter, pointing to textual support for whatever comment I have made that they refute based on one bit in the movie. It's impossible to contradict that. And if you do find their lack of knowledge as annoying as you seem to, just don't talk Tolkien with them.
And also, if a person's only seen one of the movies, they obviously didn't care for it, or they probably would have seen the others. Usually their comments will probably be derogatory anyway, even if you tied them down and forced them to actually read the books. Not everyone (even if they understand it) likes Tolkien. There are perfectly intelligent individuals - certainly more intelligent than I am - that will admit that Tolkien's style just isn't their cup of tea, so to speak. Whenever someone doesn't like something, it's much easier to find fault in it. Even if it is a good piece of literature (and regardless of content, the movies were well-made), if one doesn't like it, it's difficult to compliment it, even if the good points are staring you right in the face and calling your name.
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06-25-2004, 07:16 PM | #136 | |
Wight
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Grrr....
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Ahhh, the depth and depravity that fills the minds of the, erm..... Well, there isn't really a word in the world that would let me describe how I feel about these people. Not one that I can use, anyway. When TTT came out (I skipped school the day after to see it, naughty me), one of my friends and I went to see it with someone who had never read the books. I spent the whole movie telling her that "No, Frodo doesn't die. If he did, they wouldn't have another movie, then they wouldn't make anymore money off of people like us, would they?" And half of the other people in the theatre were so busy being dumb that I missed half of it listening to them make out and stuff. Frustration, indeed. Then, during our long wait for RotK the third day after it came out, my other friend and I (my, but I have a lot of weird friends) spent the whole time running up and down the line asking people if they'd read the books or not. As it was, only about four answered with a positive "yes". The rest were hopeless....
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06-26-2004, 12:11 PM | #137 |
Psyche of Prince Immortal
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well for drama, we were doing greek tragedy's, and my partners wanted to do return of the king....well only the pathes of the dead part
(i was undead king and Elrond) it go as well as i have planned it, ony i and another one showed effort into it (one didn't show up till we were finished and other one was too stoned too do anything but just read teh script really bad)
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06-26-2004, 02:04 PM | #138 |
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I have to agree. People just want to make themselves look good, and not just when you're talking about LOTR. I know a girl who is constantly talking about LOTR but she's never read the books. My friend and I were talking about Legolas and Haldir and she just butted in and stated that Legolas couldn't have talked to Haldir because they were different races. They're both Sindarin right? If she had read the books she would have known that Haldir recognized Legolas's tounge. It's in the chapter titled "Lothlorien"!
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06-27-2004, 08:42 PM | #139 |
Wight
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I'm at a summer program for 5 weeks this summer and have already professed my love of LOTR. I'm simply waiting to see if any A-As show up and what will happen. Of course I'll be kind to them when i see them and graciously correct them if need be - - - - and then i'll come on here and rant.
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07-02-2004, 01:41 AM | #140 |
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If you can't find a book and it's still published, go to Barnes & Noble and they will order it you you free of charge and you still don't even have to buy it when it arrives if you want a different edition (like if you wanted one not paperback or something).
I'm one of those people who has been into Toklien a relatively short period of time. The day the first DVD came out to be exact. I preordred it, picked it up, and watched it, not expecting much. But I was swept away and wondered how I went to song without it. And I though that Gandalf was dead and it upset me at the time. Ah, ignorance. Now people who know me will tell you it's part of who I am. So much that I feel wrong in myself if I don't have something on me that I'm wearing, be it the Evenstar, Nenya, the Ring itself.... And I'm antsy without a book, or at least the books on DVD if I'm driving, as I did today to go rescue my boyfriend when his car brokw down south of San Francisco. Still, there are Newbies and then there are Dummies. The Newbies are the ones who are new and trying. They don't know a whole lot in any sense and they know that and are find learning. The Dummies are the ones who like to think they know it all, yet think Elves lived in the Shire. No, the insist Elves live in the Shire because Hobbits live in Mordor. And you can show them proof and they insist that the book is wrong. One of my idiot cousins actually did that-insisted the book was wrong and that Elves do, in fact, live in the Shire. *sigh* And she claims to be an expert. And, sadder still, she knows more about the books than any of her friends. When asked who wrote them, she guessed wrong. Then one of my aunts and her brother came to her defense saying that she read the books before me (sadly true, but she obviously didn't retain any information) and, therefore, knows more than I do. Uh-huh, right. Whatever. Who's Shelob? Who's Tom Bombadil? Apparently I made them up, according to them. Yet they claim the idiot is right and that I must have paid to have an altered copy made. Yeah. The one I was using is quarter-bound in leather and expensive as it was, and there's no way I could afford, or want to, have a wrong copy. When I went to the midnight opening of RotK, a girl came dressed in a starlingly beautiful replica of Eowyn's green gown. Someone asked her who she was dressed as and she mentioned, "That blonde Elf chick." I broke in and asked if she meant Galadriel since she didn't wear green, though Eowyn wore a gown nearly identical to what she was wearing. And she said no, the Elf that the main guy liked. Um, Arwen wasn't blonde.... I tried telling her that, and she argued with me because she thought she knew all there was to know about LotR (so much she didn't know the names of Arwen or Aragorn). And probably felt dumb when the movie started and she was proven wrong. How much attention did she pay to the movies before it? Or did she only watch Orli? (I'll admit he's hot as hell, but I paid attention to more than just him!) Yeah, Dummies who don't now character names, even main ones, and who don't know their butts from their elbows and try to act like know-it-alls are just downright irritating. |
07-02-2004, 01:58 AM | #141 | |
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Vanima, I agree that people who've just seen the movies are fine. I started out seeing just one movie, and didn't even know who Frodo was when I did. But those people who've only seen the movies and claim to be experts on all things Tolkien are another story....
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07-08-2004, 04:32 AM | #142 |
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stupid teachers
It's way more annoying when done by those damn teachers who haven't even read the book.
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07-08-2004, 09:02 AM | #143 |
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Oh, that's bad. If a teacher talks about the book and doesn't know what's what, is it any wonder why school kids tend to be so stupid these days? Not to offend the ones here who are among the exceptions! It takes brains to read and understand all the intricacies of Tolkien!
Please tell me you aren't talking about a literature teacher though! That would be inexcusable. |
07-08-2004, 09:43 AM | #144 | |
Wight
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<== Behold the great ball of green orgin!
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Have you guys ever had problems with little children trying to show you up? Some kids know their stuff but some... I was telling someone who Frodo was and explained that he was the ringbearer. This little 10 year old girl goes 'No, Biblo had the ring.' I asked her if she'd read the books or seen the movie and she said no. Needless to say after that... I wasn't too worried. But come on! What are we teaching children nowadays?
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07-09-2004, 10:23 AM | #145 |
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I do have to defend a 10-year-old here. LotR is so involved it is above many 10-year-olds. Not all, but most. The Hobbit is much more in line with with what a child that age could easily read. So she was right as well in a way. While Frodo was the ring BEARER, Biblo did have the ring-for a while anyway. I believe in cutting slack on kids with this.
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07-09-2004, 04:09 PM | #146 | ||
Etheral Enchantress
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Quote:
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"I think we dream so we don't have to be apart so long. If we're in each others dreams, we can be together all the time." - Hobbes of Calvin and Hobbes |
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07-14-2004, 04:47 AM | #147 | |
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ang titser ko
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but my Trigonometry teacher understands me... he is an LOTR geek... he's gay, and loves legolas[ew ew ew ew] |
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07-16-2004, 10:43 PM | #148 | |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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<==The Lofty Tree of Gondor
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Abedithon le, ~*~Aranel~*~
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07-31-2004, 09:28 PM | #149 | ||
Bittersweet Symphony
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But the worst annoying amateur was a Mary-Sue writer on ff.net. She was terrible. She kept saying that she had read the books "like 100 timez" and memorized all of Legolas' lines so she should be entitled to write a fanfiction. She misspelled the name of every canon character (except Sam), and her MS's name was Jyessicah. This is still a running joke among my friends. Just say it... Jyesssssicaaaahhhh.... Someone emailed her a bunch of questions to test and see if she really did read the book, and here's the Q&A: Quote:
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07-31-2004, 09:41 PM | #150 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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I can gladly say I knew most of those answers I did however forget that they met the elves but merry wasn't there so that threw me off and I always forget glorfindels name despite a rather decent chunk of lotr I am definetely an amateur especially compared to most people on thhis site and I am willing to admit it
I hope i may now having admitted my problem go from annoying amateur to irritating amateur and eventually annoying expert
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07-31-2004, 10:52 PM | #151 |
Psyche of Prince Immortal
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funny how this thread sparked two other threads...
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08-01-2004, 08:25 AM | #152 |
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I totally agree, I know quite a bit about lotr and nobody I know really likes it as much as I do. If I talk about lotr and somebody gets something wrong, I tend to scream at them at the top of my voice. Also, none of my friends have even heard of Old man willow or Bill Ferny! some dont even know what Gollum's name was once! I just have to say that even though i dont have many posts (because im a newbie ) I am apalled at the lack of Tolkien knowledge where I live and what's worse is that some of them pretend they know everything and really, they don't. Somebody once asked me "since when was Iluvatar in lotr?"
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08-01-2004, 07:22 PM | #153 |
Bittersweet Symphony
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What was extremely interesting, though, is that LotR fans pop up in odd places: ie, my Music Theory teacher/Marching band conductor, Mr. Giannotti, or fondly, simply G. The band was playing at the graduation ceremony this past June and they were reading an uber-long list of names and we were all insanely bored, G included. Suddenly they read out this one kid's name, and his last name sounded like Smeagol! Suddenly our (meaning me, three of my friends, and G) ears all perked up and G went, "What? Smeagol?" It was exciting... okay, not really. I guess you had to be there
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08-02-2004, 07:21 PM | #154 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Encaitare, where in the name of high school football did you find that Sue writer?! I feel so pointedly annoyed all of a sudden. *gr*
Happily, I knew the answers to the questions you presented, although I almost spaced on Gildor (the fact that you said Frodo, Sam, Pippin, *and* Merry may have thrown me off...). I can't believe how badly she did! She must have read the books with her eyes closed... I may have to borrow that list as my "Offical Amateur Test", just to see if people have actually read the books, or have even the slightest clue as to what they're talking about. Oh, before they got to Bree, the hobbits also ran into the Barrow-wights. ^ ^ Abedithon le, ~ Saphy ~
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08-02-2004, 08:43 PM | #155 |
Bittersweet Symphony
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Please do use it as an Official Amateur Test, and thus we may determine within moments who knows "lotr cannon" and who doesn't. I found her while browsing fanfiction.net, and was immediately so enraged by her lack of skill at anything that I felt compelled to send it to all my friends to bash. A lot of people reported her because of her blatant errors and general lousiness and the admins took it down and I believe suspended her account as well ::cackles with no remorse whatsoever::
I'm sure there are more bad bad bad writers like her but I haven't checked out ff.net recently. And they most certainly did meet the Barrow-wight, although if the creator of the list had presented the fool writer (whose name was, incidentally, iloveleggy -- gee, what does that tell you?) with FOUR non-movie characters (Tom, Golderry, Gildor, and the Wight), I think her brain would have exploded from all the canon. |
08-02-2004, 08:53 PM | #156 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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First off I feel utterly stupid I must have forgotten the entire book between Farmer Maggot and Bree because somehow I placed those events after (Uh-Duh) "smacs self" don't worry such idiocy i try to keep at a minimum I do however have a question what is canon? is it just another word for trivia?
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08-02-2004, 09:03 PM | #157 |
Bittersweet Symphony
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Canon is a term used among fanfiction writers which basically means what really happened in the original story. A fanfiction which follows the original plot line without making big changes is canon; one that deviates from the original is non-canon, or Alternate Universe.
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08-02-2004, 09:07 PM | #158 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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I see thank you very much for that explanation.
I sadly prefer non-canon for bad guys but for good guys i have good canon
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08-02-2004, 09:14 PM | #159 |
Bittersweet Symphony
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Non-canon has its place too... it's what keeps the fanfiction world interesting!
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09-27-2004, 12:40 PM | #160 |
Newly Deceased
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I know earlier that someone mentioned the Trival Pursuit game. I'm trying so hard to get that game. My friends and mother have agreed to play with me if I ever get it. Key word being...IF. I have yet to see it giftwrapped on my birthday or Christmas.
But yeah...my mom knows enough about LOTR to know not bet with me. All my friends do the same. They treat me like an expert, while I'm running around looking up answers to their questions on boards like these! SHH!!! But I do tell them where I get the info from. I won't even pretend to be an expert on LOTR. There's too much to know about it and my poor little human mind can't contain all that glorious information. Not with school going on. My sister (older by 17 months) would be at the level of seeing on movie and NOT liking it. She didn't hate it, she just didn't understand what was going on. So Mom and I had to explain it to her. Then she seemed to get frustrated that I knew more than she did about LOTR. So I pointed out what she did better than me and that made her feel better. But after that, Mom and I didn't drag her to see any more LOTR movies. It was always just us, then family, then I saw it with friends. So for sure there are different levels of understanding out there for people about the books and movies. My friends are "experts" on the movie (somehow they count me in there as well.) They view me and my mom as the "book experts". And then they figure everybody else knows a little bit. They've tried to read the books but didn't like it or just didn't finish, while I've been reading them once a year since the 6th grade (sophomore in college now for a time frame). So it does vary for each person. If it didn't, then this would be a very boring world with no room for discussions and debates about Tolkien's world, cause we'd all understand it. And that would be boring, indeed.
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