Werewolf LIII: The Republic

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Lommy

I'm not sure I want to talk with phantom of all people...

I thought we were friends.

Is it the Penguin thing? Sorry, but I just don't love them the way you do. Surely we can get past this, Lommy.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Well, I don't have a vote, so I'm not sure my opinion matters.

Bad joke.

Originally Posted by tp

I thought we were friends.
Is it the Penguin thing? Sorry, but I just don't love them the way you do. Surely we can get past this, Lommy.

I'm merely suspicious of you and that's why I take everything you say with a heap of salt. And btw, thanks for reminding me - I should really write a letter to the editor to the 'downer...

Okay, so sally and tp both have votes? Hmm... I'm not really too enthusiastic about lynching either of them toDay. But if I'm to introduce a third candidate, it must be someone whose lynch will gain some support...

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

I wouldn't draw hasty conclusions.

Like that you would be dreamed of in the first Days of the game tp... It was just the "yesterGame" Rune was the seer and he picked up the submarines or those who were hard to figure in the "middle" leaving the loudmouths to reveal themselves by actual posting and their action - and why bother as the fearsome enemies of the wolves that the people tend to trust for their stature get killed pretty soon anyway so it's a dream wasted. In the end-game one needs as many living innocents there can be. What's the worth of a known innocent who is killed by the wolves?

I mean I shouldn't be doing this but sorry, you should think of this a second time if you're an innocent. And in the same time I will be at least partly answering your concerns about my points on you yesterday.

So let's take this one fex.:

Originally Posted by tp

Once again, this quote is fairly straightforward. Brin said that Boro and I should never have brought up the ploy. I respond, giving her the reason that we did discuss it- to build further trust. A logical answer to the question, is it not?

That reason you give is plausible indeed. I can think of you two trying to bring forwards trust between yourselves and getting all the more assured about it (although I think Boro has some bad experiences with that from the past... ). That is possible. Sure. And logical.

But. How come you think we others might believe it - or why do you protest if we don't? How about a few bright wolves did the same and said to an innocent you, not part of that plot that is, that you must believe them because "You people wonder why we're trusting each other? Um, maybe because we're doing things to build trust"? You'd be head on with it, wouldn't you? Isn't that a bit circular reasoning to begin with? And why should anyone outside the circle believe what you say? We have only your word that you were "building trust" and not playing a scheme you had planned during the Night!

Do you take someone, anyone, by his word in this game tp? Do you? If I say my case is rational (which it is btw.) and I only think for the good of the village, do you trust that? Just because I say it is logical - and it is. Would you take me to my word if I said I'm annoyed because you don't trust my logical case?

You should know better. And I think you do. Good wolves are perfectly cabable of constructing sensible, rational, logical explanations of the things that have happened. So why do you think we should trust you just because you have a logical explanation to things?

My theory of you and Boro is a logical one as well - and I think fits all the details. So it's true... Surrender guys, you're caught!

But you say it's only one possibility, right? But so is you and Boro just finding each other innocent just one possibility.

You would disagree with my case of you two being wolves - whether it was true or not - with that it was just a possibility and not conclusive evidence or a known truth. Guess what I'm thinking about your story about you and Boro?


But enough of this. As I said, you guys are things for the seer to find out. We should not lynch you anyway.

I will listen to you but do not think I will believe what you say without a pinch of salt. Like Boro said: "I have some ammo loaded" if the seer turns out dead with no conclusive info. I have only scraped the surface now...

But so far I'll call it a truce - which I think it has already been for a while.

[Thinlómien]

Nogrod are you that desperate to get to my "might get lynched by me because of sheer annoyance" list to accompnay tp, Boro, morm and Greenie?

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by tp

Brin makes her statement and gives a paraphrasing, and then I simply point out that there is nothing at all suspicious about the paraphrased statement, for it is the exact statement that could be made were Boro and I innocent. Therefore what point was she trying to make? I was questioning her, and how her statement could possibly mean anything bad about me, or paint me in a negative light, since all that it was was a true statement.

Just to answer this real quick...

When I paraphrase with a quote, the tone doesn't exactly come out in written word. But by using that statement, I was trying to say that I didn't like how you and Boro seemed to be so surprised that the village was turning on you. You both made some pretty bold statements and innocent or not, I don't think you should expect people to instantly trust you just because you claim you've been creating all these ploys to manipulate the wolves. It's the same thing if someone were to claim seership...even if they were the real seer, they can't expect others to instantly believe them until there's some solid evidence to back up their claim. So I don't see any reason why the village shouldn't suspect you guys, just as anyone else could be as easily suspected. Which is why I found your reactions to other people doubting you discomforting and suspicious. Does that make sense?

Anyways, I just recently got back from classes. I'm pretty tired so I don't know if I'll do much posting at this moment, but I promise to contribute more later in the evening....which means also looking at players other than tp and Boro..

EDIT: X-ed with Nogrod and Lommy

[Shastanis Althreduin]

*sigh* Phantom always suspects me when I'm not around to defend myself, have you noticed?

Today was insanely busy for me, and it's not over yet. Ask Sally how much work goes into a tech rehearsal two days before opening night.

I am being quiet today, though, for once. I believe it's called "playing the McCaber".

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Lommy

I should really write a letter to the editor to the 'downer...

I look forward to it.

And I've been wondering about Gil, and the fact that Fea is refusing to modfire him. What the heck does that mean? Surely he's not a WW- I mean, would she let him legitimately win this thing by not showing up ever again?

On one hand I feel like we should all just agree to ignore him and allow him to count for our favor (most likely) in the tally. But the thought of him winning like that... Gah! I just- I don't think Fea would've made him a WW in the first place.

But why not modfire him if he's just an Ordo?

Okay... I think Fea's just doing this to screw with us. I'm not going to recommend lynching him.

[Thinlómien]

Nog and Shasta, who are you thinking of voting?

edit: xed with tp - sometimes I really wonder why I bother to mark all these x-posts...

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

I am being quiet today, though, for once. I believe it's called "playing the McCaber".

And McCaber was innocent... so you are too? Is that what you want us to read from that?

Sorry Lommy but I didn't quite get your remark...

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Sorry Lommy but I didn't quite get your remark...

I was simply expressing annoyance at your continuing of the Boro-tp discussion...

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by the phantom

And I've been wondering about Gil, and the fact that Fea is refusing to modfire him. What the heck does that mean? Surely he's not a WW- I mean, would she let him legitimately win this thing by not showing up ever again?

On one hand I feel like we should all just agree to ignore him and allow him to count for our favor (most likely) in the tally. But the thought of him winning like that... Gah! I just- I don't think Fea would've made him a WW in the first place.

But why not modfire him if he's just an Ordo?

Okay... I think Fea's just doing this to screw with us. I'm not going to recommend lynching him.

You know tp you're just making me suspect you even more than I do and I have to hold my horses for the possibility of you being innocent... but belive me my trust is running short if you go on like this.

You know who thinks that way: "why not modfire him if he's just an Ordo"?



I'll need to consider your question Lommy. I have thought of going for either Rune or morm to check my theory but I need to check things before I do something.

And if tp continues that way I might indeed not wait for the seer...

[Thinlómien]

++THE Ka

That's the closest I can get to a reasonable vote toDay. She's a submarine the likes of which we can't really afford, and like I've said, she tnds to have more serious stuff to say when she's innocent.

I will be interested to see how this lynch develops, but I predict a catastrophe.

Good night...

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Brin

You both made some pretty bold statements and innocent or not, I don't think you should expect people to instantly trust you just because you claim you've been creating all these ploys to manipulate the wolves.

I never said that I expect or demand that people trust me. It's true what you say- that since people don't know anything they can't assume our intentions are good.

But my whole point is that, if that is true, then it is also true that people have no reason to logically assume our intentions are bad. That is why I was rather frustrated with people. I didn't understand where the suspicion was coming from, as it was just as likely that Boro and I were doing our darn best to help.

But I think that's as much as needs to be said. Enough has already been said about this matter throughout the day, and I'm trying not to talk about it any more.

[Nogrod]

Btw. why I'm getting interested in trying out Rune or morm

Originally Posted by the phantom

Rune and morm- meh. I like having them around to talk to. But of course that has nothing to do with Wolfishness. But morm seems to be making an effort, and his feelings seem genuine. I haven't as much a feel for Rune, possibly because I haven't played with him as much. I'd like to keep him around almost just for that reason.

These I mean are the classics!

And nicely predicted by my theory earlier...

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Lommy, I could vote Phantom today, I'm just concerned about it being called a spite vote.

I could also vote Ka or Boromir, and 'faintly' but probably not Ilya.

Edit: X'd with a lot. Oh...

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Nog

You know who thinks that way: "why not modfire him if he's just an Ordo"?

I don't mean that it would be an advantage tally-wise! I mean that Fea is more than willing to modfire people, so why isn't she doing it in this case, which is as clear a case for modfire as any I've ever seen?

That was my whole point- the fact that the lack of modfire is weirding me out.

I concluded that, most likely, the entire point was to weird us out, rather than there being anything sinister about Gil.

EDIT: punctuation

[the phantom]

Go ahead, Nog. Try Rune or morm.

Lommy asked for opinions and I gave them as honestly as I could. I suppose your opinions on those two are perfectly formulated and impossible to criticize?

[the phantom]

In addition, Noggie- didn't you say hours and hours ago that you were done talking about Boro and I? And yet you've continued.

At least my Gil post had nothing to do with that. I'm trying to talk about other things. But I guess I can't even do that without you turning things back to me.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by tp

I suppose your opinions on those two are perfectly formulated and impossible to criticize?

Just like your ploys or tests...

Don't you see it or are you not willing to?


Boro, morm, Shasta - anyone around?

Greenie -> tp
Kath -> Sally
Lommy -> The Ka

Any ideas?

I'd leave tp to the seer as I'm not confident enough but I must say his posting makes me willing to go for him more and more...

Sally I have no idea of. Kath said she was acting more serious than normally and that was the case when she was a wolf last time. I think I need to take a look on that.

The Ka seems to be the submarine and I'd like to lynch her just to be sure.

And I'd like to test my theory as well with morm or Rune but seeing that morm is having a vote I think that with him it would be a vote wasted unless you all went for it.

Both Rune and Greenie have voted morm for a representative the last two Days... So maybe I was wrong and the wolves really thought it important to get one of their kind into the electorate this early?

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by the phantom

In addition, Noggie- didn't you say hours and hours ago that you were done talking about Boro and I? And yet you've continued.

At least my Gil post had nothing to do with that. I'm trying to talk about other things. But I guess I can't even do that without you turning things back to me.

I'm trying... I'm trying... but you don't actually help me with it...

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by me

I suppose your opinions on those two are perfectly formulated and impossible to criticize?

Originally Posted by Nog

Just like your ploys or tests...

Never said they were perfect, bud. I actually said earlier that Wolf traps misfire.

But seriously, we need to stop this. We're annoying Lommy.

And we're also using the eye-roll smilie way too much.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Nogrod.

You keep saying "Oh, leave Phantom to the seer, leave Phantom to the seer".

How?

There are four or five people right now calling Phantom suspicious; a true Seer hint would be lost in the muddle. And I hate to agree with him, but Phantom probably was already dreamt, so I don't see why you're reiterating so much that we should "leave Phantom to the Seer.

[the phantom]

The votes:

Green +++ Phantom
Kath ++++ Sally
Lommy ++ KA

Left to vote:

Boro- 3
Shasta- 2
morm- 2
Nog- 2

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by the phantom

And we're also using the eye-roll smilie way too much.

With this I agree wholeheartedly. *rolleyes*

Okay I checked back on Sally.

I don't know. I'm not sharing Kath's thoughts of her being more serious or composed than normal. I mean the last time she was a wolf she was indeed being a bit too focused for her own good.

But she did vote Greenie as a representative and then again Greenie's vote for tp was no surprise.

On the other hand - and following that - she decided to go all the way appeasing tp with all that talkabout Dr. Who and the various ways of spelling that.

Like "I try to lynch you via choosing a rep to do that and immediately start playing it personally nice with you"?

Also her post about her suspicions were as follows:

Originally Posted by Sally

People I'd like to see get lynched. ToDay. Mehbe.
Ilya
Nerwen
Morm or Boro or Phantom (preferably one of the former, as then we can get on with our lives. heh.)
Gwath (because we can )

So leaving tp at the end of the list and saying "preferably the former" with the reason we could after that "go on with our lives" - like tp wouldn't be the prime obstacle to that? (Sorry tp - see, no rolleyes!) - but still making sure her representative would be after tp?

That I think is suspicious.


*Needs to think*

[the phantom]

You're right, Shasta, that Seer hints will get lost in the muddle.

Frankly, that's exactly what we should hope for. The minute the Seer hints aren't lost in the muddle, the WWs kill the Seer.

We wish for the Seer to survive and dream as long as possible. That way when they do die, they deliver to us a nice chunk of real information we can use.

So when Nog says what he is saying, I believe what he means is that things will be clear in time when it comes to discovering my affiliation. And since you agree that I have been dreamed of, I believe that Nog's statement is one that you can agree with.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Good night


I don't know what it is with you Nogrod, I constantly get the feeling that you are playing differently and that I should take a close look at you.
The problem is that when I do so, I find very little actual suspicous behaviour and I have actually read through most of your post in search of such.

Maybe you have been more vaugue than normaly, not sticking you neck out too much. . .

Anyways you are on my list over people I am slightly suspicous of together with Ilya, Nerwen, Brinn and Ka.

I already stated what it was that bothered me with Ilya and Nerwen earlier(I think it was yesterday), but comments made by different people have made me lessen my focus on them (I cannot remember by who), plus I haven't had time to deal with much else than Boromir. Brinn's style where she hardly ever gets into a major confrontation, but is liked by most people always makes me wonder and The Ka is hardly ever here, what she posts is fairly resonable. . .but again she is not risking much.

Then there is people like Shasta which I really should pay more attention to, because right now I have no idea what to think and actually can remember no statement made by Shasta. (This is a critique of me, not of you, Shasta)

Farvel

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

*sigh* Phantom always suspects me when I'm not around to defend myself, have you noticed?

Today was insanely busy for me, and it's not over yet. Ask Sally how much work goes into a tech rehearsal two days before opening night.

I am being quiet today, though, for once. I believe it's called "playing the McCaber".

Oh, sweetie.... *hugs you* No killing him. He's got enough on his plate.



Alternatively, I bought the fourth season of Doctor Who today! YAY!


Alternatively alternatively I started this post and then abandoned it to go to dinner, so I've probably got some reading to do.

[Nogrod]

I think I see it now more clearly. You're right tp. I'm agreeing at the moment.

++the phantom for lynch

And remember my theory toMorrow.

It's 3AM here and I'm off to sleep soon.

[Boromir88]

I'm back from my reading endeavors.

[Boromir88]

Well in that case...

++The Ka

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I can't believe I'm doing this, but...

As I've said before,

++Lynch The KA

If Phantom turns out to be a wolf again, and I didn't kill him when I could have, I believe my head really WILL explode.

Edit: X'd with two Boromir. Dang you Boro!

[Boromir88]

Initiate filibuster

Topic: The corruption and Greed of the 3 Modesses

[Boromir88]

Don't you all see it is the 3 moddesses that are at work here. They are the trouble.

They are all making money on us and laughing

[Boromir88]

Let me begin by saying in 2002 Fea accepted a John Mayer CD as payment and never claimed it on her tax returns

[Boromir88]

Darn you Shasta, you just made me waste my filibuster!

[Boromir88]

End Filibuster

I will ask for executive power on this one...wow what a waste.

[the phantom]

Nog all day: Let's not lynch Phantom. Leave him for the Seer.

Nog's vote: Phantom

I believe Noggie just did a Legate.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Shasta

Edit: X'd with two Boromir. Damn you Boro!

Woah there, Shasta! What are you upset about?

You voted for KA, and Boro voted for KA. Did you not want to see KA lynched despite your vote or something?

That said, I'm wondering if your vote makes you look more innocent in my eyes.

You had a golden opportunity to try and get me killed, and no one could have blamed you for it given the personal history and the fact that much of the village was leaning my direction already.

But you passed it up.

I'm very pleased about it, but I didn't expect it at all. I'm shocked.

[Boromir88]

All I really care about right now, is my one filibuster is ruined. I say we lynch Shasta tomorrow.

[the phantom]

Too bad you had to waste that filibuster, Boro. Oh well. At least Fea won't auto kill us now that someone has done one.

What do you make of Nog's vote? And Shasta's vote? They both came as a complete surprise to me.

And morm- even though your vote cannot change the outcome, I'm interested to know which way you would have gone given the chance. What are your final thoughts this day?