WWJ V: The Broken Souls

[THE Ka]

I'm afraid that I must be off to bed soon, and that I must get up early tomorrow and won't be near a computer for the deadline, I think I must give my vote now, as to prevent anymore knives at throats. I know this is a classic cliche way of landing in the suspicion bin, but it is better than not voting at all and ending in it anyways...
Simply, I will not be able to vote by the deadline if I do not vote now. So, bear with me on the account that I have a busy early day schedule tomorrow, and no computer in sight to service me.

By the logical justification of non-writing and voting, there are these players as follows subject to suspicion based upon this fact:

Thinlomien
Witch Queen

That is all I can say upon the matter, because it is the first day, and we have no evidence to use by than that.

Valesse has already written, and thus falls out of my suspicion. So has JennyHallu, and Roe_Aoife. It is the first day, and they have remained to the promise of the rules, and presented themselves as such. So have all of us who have, unless we start to bring ourselves to the cleaners... Hopefully, we won't become that desperate...

Yes, since in first day accordance it is logical to spread the votes due to no evidence that can be evoked is a good plan, but I am afraid we've ran against it a bit too much. To chase all of the foxes out of the holes is logical in finding the needed culprit, it is not wise to only chase a few out and then start to interrogate them as your true suspects snicker off and away. To be random seems to work, but don't run away with your characterization to the point where it's impossible to guess what is happening.

... Aye, first day madness. If only there was enough evidence to stand upon but there never is, except a few fun flings to the wind at suspicions. Which are nothing less than wicked fun with each other's minds...

Al right then, my vote might as well come. I wish I could stay up and read more, but i'm tired and have to go sleep now or I am going to be late, thus ruining my day tomorrow... Sorry, it's a control thing in my mornings, I must have them lock, stock and barrel proof.


My only suspisions, because I am not much of a personality judge, and I only trust evidence in rules when needed are Thinlomien and Witch Queen.
I know, hate me tomorrow, but they have not posted yet, so in accordance with the rules, I have natural suspicion. Gah! I detest first days... Well, I shall leave the rest up to chance by the flip of a coin.

Thinlo = heads

WQ = sails
Here's the coin if you want evidence, though that's all I can give to how it looks like and that it is all that I have on hand.

Heads, well, that's all I can say for now. Hopefully this first day madness wears off and we get some real evidence.

I need some more reason and logic than this, or I shall go insane!... Sorry for the coin business.

++Thinlomien

Goodnight everyone, I will be back at 3 in the afternoon ( PST time...), hopefully before too much development in our game.


Sincerely,

Ka

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Valier

Are ve throwing accuzationz out alveady?

'Twas high time somebody tested the waters.

I vould like to hear vhy you KNOW zhey are ze enemies

'Twas merely a figure of speech. How could I 'know'? I am, for lack of a better word, 'formally suspecting', lacking any real evidence.

[Thinlómien]

It seems that you shouldn't sleep,
or neither should a schoolday you busy keep
- otherwise you'll be you'll be lynched by your own kind
a bit unfair I do that find.

Anyway, I'm here now.

Nogrod, I have a question. You say:

PS. By quieteness I also mean posting nonsense...

. Maybe you'd care to explain what is non-nonsense-speaking on the first day. Because the first day usually is just nonsense and wild guesses.

[JennyHallu]

Ka...I'm afraid I don't agree with your suspicions. Six hours away from the deadline, we still need to give time to those who are silent. With all but one of us now checking in, it is vastly more likely that all three wolves are already busily trying to subvert us. And on the first day, really our posts or no-posts give us almost nothing to go on. I must say, at this point I would be far more likely to suspect Anguirel for obscuring early thoughts in verse, or Valier for brandishing a "vhip" and generally relishing the prospect of pain.

But for this fact: Sleepy did tell us that there were hints in his part of the story. Anguirel makes an excellent point. SO...

I'm going to get busy and see if I can find any clues. I'd suggest you all do the same.

[Encaitare]

Hello all, just checking in. I'm going to review all this later in the afternoon and see if anything at all can be gleaned from what's been posted. My vote will most likely be a random one, though.

[Thinlómien]

Great to see some life in this now quiet village. Jenny, I didn't think of that before, but I think you make a good point. If there's any base to lay the suspicions on it's hiding behind roles Valier's v and Anguirel's poems. I check the thread if there are any more such people.

[Thinlómien]

Okay, all I could make out from Sleepy's posts were:

Roa_Aoife
She sat there counting her money on a park bench by herself. They had called her stupid, they had laughed at her. She would show them who was better, it wouldn't be long now. His steps were quick and noiseless, she never saw him coming but once he stood there in front of her she just looked up in wonder, he smiled. Nobody had smiled at her when she was in one of those moods. "It shall be over soon." He said, his voice was soothing and Roa believed him, it would be over soon.

A vengeful wolf here? Or is this just a tragedy?

"Rise and shine my dears. Its time for the games to begin."

This leads again to Roa, who's a babysitter.

For clearing: I'm not accusing Roa, since I have no basis, just speculating.

My previous post on roles might be nonsense, because on the other hand they just might be people who want to make the village livelier.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Anguirel

The minstrel spoke some sense before he scarpered; of his three, I particularly suspect (on instinct, mind) Witch_Queen and Valesse. Largely because I know that...well, certainly Valesse is capable of expressing herself subtly and ought to have a good deal more to say. I expect she'll lean back on the old Day One excuse.

I'm glad that you don't suspect me, but I don't see a reason why would I be - or actually why was I before I posted anything - less suspicious than WQ. Is it just an instinct, as you say? But surely all instincts have some basis?

[Thinlómien]

Sorry for flooding this thread up but as there's no one else active and I'm rereading the thread and finding new things all the time. And I'm under the impression that editing posts (except because of mentioning cross-posting or correcting typos) is not preferable in a WW game.

Originally Posted by JennyHallu

Six hours away from the deadline, we still need to give time to those who are silent.

I second this! We live pretty much in different time zones. If for example the day's 8 first hours are the hours that someone's sleeping, I don't think it's unfair to accuse him/her for being silent at the beginning of the day. So on this basis I'm giving WQ some more time before accusing her of hiding. And if she doesn't appear even that doesn't mean she's a wolf. She might have problems in RL or then she's just not aware that the game has started. (I assure you, that can happen... )

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

If there's any base to lay the suspicions on it's hiding behind roles Valier's v and Anguirel's poems.

I question my own reasoning. Surely a herald at-arms is no poet? Or do we just have one lyrical soul around?

And Jenny, are you still around? Have you done your analysis? Or is anyone else here? 'Tis creepy when 'tis so quiet...

[Holbytlass]

I have governing appointments elsewhere and shan't be albe to return, I'm a firm believer in voting early then not at all.
This being first DAY and not much to go on I find Valier, JennyHallu and Naria seems especially concerned about 'quiets' being looked at-perhaps wanting to keep open a hiding place? They do make some valid points but it can be said for all styles of posting, as for me, I'd rather weed out those less likely to leave enough to analyze. However, all this is not much to go on but we need to start somewhere...

Originally Posted by Naria

Really now, all this talk about 'taking a closer look' at the quiet ones....and this early in the first DAY...pish-aww!

I think the first DAY is pretty much a wait and see kind of thing--wait and see what everyone has posted and go from there closer to vote time.

So that you could slip under the radar?

++Naria

[Thinlómien]

I know I must seem like a psychopate or something, but please bear with me and my endless posting.

When there's no one else to argue with, I find myself arguing with myself.

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Nogrod, I have a question. You say: .... Maybe you'd care to explain what is non-nonsense-speaking on the first day. Because the first day usually is just nonsense and wild guesses.

I begin to understand your point. Even the first day some posts are more useless than others.

I suspect more the nonsense-posters than silent ones. If now would be the voting time, I'd rather vote for Gil, who has this far posted just nonsense than WQ, who has just been absent.

EDIT: Crossposted with Holbytlass. So I'm not sextet-posting! Hooray!

[Thinlómien]

Glad to see someone here, even if she visits only to leave again.

I have governing appointments elsewhere and shan't be albe to return, I'm a firm believer in voting early then not at all.

I agree with you. Voting not at all doesn't contribute anything to the game, expect suspicions against the non-voter.

This being first DAY and not much to go on I find Valier, JennyHallu and Naria seems especially concerned about 'quiets' being looked at-perhaps wanting to keep open a hiding place? They do make some valid points but it can be said for all styles of posting, as for me, I'd rather weed out those less likely to leave enough to analyze. However, all this is not much to go on but we need to start somewhere..

. I also find some slippiness in Naria and Valier, but I disagree about JennyHallu. Though she hasn't been over useful, I don't think she could be compared with Naria and Valier. But I'm saying again; there's still plenty of time.Time for all of the three to improve their posting. (And for us all - I can't say that I have contributed very much myself.)

[Thinlómien]

-----------------

Originally Posted by Naria

I think the first DAY is pretty much a wait and see kind of thing--wait and see what everyone has posted and go from there closer to vote time.

I agree, though some - it seems - don't. What else is there actually on Day 1?

P.S. It just came to my mind that if they are playing well they're the people no one has yet suspected. So all the same I could go around and accuse everybody and wouldn't probably get any wiser. Though, it's always interesting to see how people react to accusations...

P.P.S. The votes this far:
THE Ka - Thinlómien
Holbytlass - Naria

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Nogrod, I have a question. You say:. Maybe you'd care to explain what is non-nonsense-speaking on the first day. Because the first day usually is just nonsense and wild guesses.

Touché! You seem to have an eye on rhetoric. I could teach you some post-structuralism to enhance your argument destroying abilities furthermore...

Maybe I should answer you this way. What I mean by nonsense-posting, is posting like:
"Hi everyone! Poor Sleepy!!!!! So sad you died! We should do something."
And that being the only contribution of the first day (or anyday, for that matter).

or like:
"Rock-baby-Rock, duubaduuba-diiba-daaba. Ranger wasn't a changer, WOW!!!! Real Danger! Check you out guys! If you are not gone with Sleepy... (wink-wink)"

Etc, etc...

So no-nonsense talk would be something, making a bit more out of it...

But really! Nice interpretation of Sleepy's text! Surely no-nonsense! Although it might be erring surely.

Without better ideas, I could stick to it... Sleepy really told us, there would be hints, and we deconstructionists love far-fetched ones!

EDIT: X-posted with Lommy X 3

[Thinlómien]

It seems we have one more roleplayer in the village, and it's our Touché-man Nogrod.

I'm glad to see someone online.

And I got your (Nogrod's) point on nonsense. The matter's solved. Yet, I wonder, is the "I suggest that we press on the silent ones" posts very much less nonsense. And the choir agreeing to that. I'm not blaming the strategy, I'm just wondering why nearly all agree with it.

[Eonwe]

Lommy, is that a new record on the 'Downs?

Originally Posted by Anguirel

We can't be quite so formulaic.

I can. I'm voting for the person three names below mine...which appears to be LMP

No, I quite agree with you. There is no formula for anything in Werewolf. Play it by ear is all you can do.

Of course, there are some vague catagouies, such as Quite Wolf, Voters In Pairs, etc, that you can be looking out for, but that is about it. I think the best stratagy is usually to wait for the Seer to announce some innocents, hopefully the Ranger can come out, with hopefully a known innocent, and perhaps the Hunter thrown in there somewhere. Of course, you need to be lynching people along the way, and you want to make as sound a judgemtn as you can, but lets face it, sometimes we're gonna be wrong.

Anyway, as nothing really stands out to me - can you believe it! - I will go ahead and vote

++LMP

like I said I would. No hard feelings or anything.

[Thinlómien]

But really! Nice interpretation of Sleepy's text! Surely no-nonsense! Although it might be erring surely.

Without better ideas, I could stick to it... Sleepy really told us, there would be hints, and we deconstructionists love far-fetched ones!

How flattering.

EDIT: X-posted with Lommy X 3

x3? With all the three posts? Or does that mean only the latest one?

[Eonwe]

Most everything about Werewolf is nonscense, my dear Lommy.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Yet, I wonder, is the "I suggest that we press on the silent ones" posts very much less nonsense. And the choir agreeing to that. I'm not blaming the strategy, I'm just wondering why nearly all agree with it.

Maybe a little... (there is no smily for self-irony...)

But as you mentioned it. In the beginning most people seemed to be against it - or at least they were reserved with it. And I'm not so confident with my argumentation skills, that I would readily believe, that I have just convinced them all. So it could be worthwhile looking, whether there are any drastic changing of sides, or sudden silences after perceived "mood-changes" or certain critical posts etc.

Well they surely are shots in the air too, but still better than nothing?

[Thinlómien]

Glad to see you, Eonwe!

Originally Posted by Eonwe

Most everything about Werewolf is nonscense, my dear Lommy.

And the first day is the most nonsense!

(And this my post is probably even more nonsense. )

EDIT: xposted with the Touché-man

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Well they surely are shots in the air too, but still better than nothing?

Sure. As I said they are better. But I was wondering how much better.

[Eonwe]

Take what you can get, I guess...

[Thinlómien]

First - littlemanpoet

Speak, each one of us, for in words the Were
may be found then fettered, and done to death
if luck be our guide. Let us begin.

Second - Nogrod

And just to stress my urge on frank exhange of ideas, I would suggest, that if there is even one among us today, that just hides in the shadows and does not show him/herself to be helpful in getting us out of this misery, we should point our suspicions there.

Then lmp is reserved towards this theory of himself's and Nogrod's:

A reasonable point of suspicion no doubt, but let us not with a single thread weave the pattern of our decision this day. Other just as useful evidences may supply themselves before long.

Anguirel disagrees:

I sometimes prefer silence to artificial noise.

Then Enca agrees and disagrees all in one post:

Some degree of pressure on quiet players is a good thing -- a nudge like "I'd like to hear more from so-and-so" is likely to do the trick. And it's better if everyone talks, because then at least there is something substantial to back up your opinions of people.
However... while there is often one wolf who is one of "the quiet ones," we shouldn't base guilt solely on how much one talks. There are sometimes other reasons for being quiet -- RL conflicts, or as the game gets more heated, it takes a long time to actually read and process everyone else's posts!

Holby kind of agrees:

It seems that the most vocal tend to gain highest suspicion and then are lynched, innocent or not, leaving the village with least talkative and least likely to have left patterns. There is a town message board (Tol-in-Gauroth Jr thread) for extenuating circumstances. Of course, votes should be spread out but it would be nice for the quieter ones to feel the heat sooner than later.

Naria disagrees

Really now, all this talk about 'taking a closer look' at the quiet ones....and this early in the first DAY...pish-aww!

So actually both I and Nogrod were wrong. There was no accepting choir, but it didn't start with suspicions either. Now I'm trying to find a pattern hid in this discussion...

EDIT: x-posted with Eonwe

[Thinlómien]

Reading my previous post, I observe that Anguirel actually is going along the ongoing trend. A bit wolvish, if we assume that wolves don't want to get into the spotlight.

Enca isn't really saying anything, but I'm not blaming her for that. I do it all the time! Being unable to make sound opinions doesn't always lead to wolvishness.

[Roa_Aoife]

OKay, I've read through everyone's posts, and then I went back an analyzed the Opening. I think I've found something interesting.

THE Ka

She lay there on the grass staring upwards at the night sky. Today had in no way been a good day, in fact it seemed life had begun a steady journey downwards. She sighed, things weren't in her hands anymore or so it seemed. His steps were quick and noiseless, she never saw him coming but once he stood there in front of her she just looked up in wonder, he smiled. Nobody had smiled at her for the last few months, it seemed money did buy friends. "It shall be over soon." He said, his voice was soothing and Ka believed him, it would be over soon.

What wasn't in the hands of our dear psychologist? Perhaps the plan to murder us?

And then there was this:

Two months later Sleepy had again vanished, this time his friends decided to take immediate action. Intuition drove them into the abandoned town and sure enough they found Sleepy in the center of the town. He had been impaled on the cupid's arrow that had once provided water for the fountain, it now spurted blood, Sleepy's. Upon further examination it was discovered that his throat had been slashed and his head was just barely connected to his body, when it tilted back a bit a fountain of blood would gush out of his corpse.

Cupid's Arrow? I don't know how many of you know this, but Sleepy and THE Ka are a couple in RL. Was it a lover's crime of passion that killed our beloved friend?

[Thinlómien]

Interesting theory, Roa. It is as good as mine, maybe.

[Thinlómien]

Or actually better, I'd say. But it doesn't close out the possibility of you two being both wolves, though that's very unprobable, since you're directing the spotlight to her...

[Nogrod]

I've been reading Sleepy's characterization of us all. I found the following to be of some, at least half-reasonable interest:

Roa: being called stupid & laughed at, she would show them who was better!

Naria: seems to be a bit mad (not caring of anything real, just laughing alone)

Holbytlass: manages to fake herself with ease

EDIT: X-posting heavily

[Roa_Aoife]

Also, I'd like to point out that THE Ka's opening has nothing to do with her occupation, unlike all the others. And that's exactly the type of subtlety Sleepy would use.

EDIT:Won't be back for a few hours. Mid-terms and all.

[Thinlómien]

I somehow managed not to notice Eonwe's post #57 at all!!

Lommy, is that a new record on the 'Downs?

Five posts in a row, you mean? I wouldn't wonder if it was.

I can. I'm voting for the person three names below mine...which appears to be LMP

What a great way of deciding! I dread what'd happen if we all were that flighty. There's probably as much chance to succeed by analysing posts and voting because of them as in voting a name three names below, but I'm certain that when doing the first mentioned, the game is much more interesting.

No, I quite agree with you. There is no formula for anything in Werewolf. Play it by ear is all you can do.

Usually, but not always.

I think the best stratagy is usually to wait for the Seer to announce some innocents, hopefully the Ranger can come out, with hopefully a known innocent, and perhaps the Hunter thrown in there somewhere.

And you suggest that we all just accuse each other totally randomly before the seer comes out?!? And all the gifteds should come out so that they'd be killed? A very fine theory, Eonwe.

but lets face it, sometimes we're gonna be wrong.

But we can try not to be! I don't think the best way of avoiding a mistake is voting randomly.

And sorry if I sound harsh, that was not my meaning. This is just friendly criticism.

EDIT: x-posted with the Touché-man and Roa.

[Thinlómien]

(All quotes in my previous post were from Eonwe's post #57)

Originally Posted by Roa_Aoife

Also, I'd like to point out that THE Ka's opening has nothing to do with her occupation, unlike all the others. And that's exactly the type of subtlety Sleepy would use.

Quite interesting this is. But have you got any basis on your argument why would Sleepy use just that kind of subtlety?

[Thinlómien]

Her hair was red, stained by blood,
Her smile was terror, those teeth were fangs,
She carried us all away in the horror of the flood,
And on day by day another one of us hangs.

I can't help wondering how is this "she"? Is she one of the werewolves? Or some off-game character?

And I noticed one more interesting thing in Naria's description:

Her small store was rarely visited by anyone, it reeked of the smell of death but that did not bother her, she just laughed as she did her job.

Hmm... But maybe I can't make anything out of that either. Butchers tend to be used to the smell.

[Nogrod]

We seem to have been doing the same thing with Lommy.

I also wondered about that SHE of the first post. She had red hair though - and even though THE Ka's avatar isn't showing red hair, it has that feeling in it...

Thin's point about Naria is worth recalling too. You could also see, that Sleepy had next to the Cupid's arrow, mentioned to have his throat slahed so that his head was almost off. The butcher would have the tools and art to do it...

[littlemanpoet]

I'm very short of time and must vote, because I get done "rehearsing" after voting closes.

Observations:

Thinlomiel:
1. has voiced suspicion of Anguirel based on him following an ongoing trend. I haven't time to verify that assertion. this in post #63
2. appears helpful in post #62 with all those quotes seemingly trying to build up some kind of case the nature of which frankly escapes me (prob. my fault for lack of time)
3. made no defense (that I could find) in answer to my suspicions.

Eonwe:
1. his vote for me in #57, especially giving no reason other than randomness, naturally attracts my suspicious attention.
2. lots of "gifted" talk in #57; also a point of suspicion.

Naria: her "wait and see" attitude as described in #32 seemed a bit opportunistic and therefore perhaps wolfish to me; I am vindicated in this thinking by Holbytlass in her vote.

The Ka:
1. Votes for Thinlomiel after others have voiced some suspicion in that direction, thereby following a trend.
2. She protests way too much in defense of every single possible contingency of which she finds herself able to be accused; that seems rather guilty behavior to me.
3. I notice that others have found other areas of suspicion that I have not yet had time to research.

Witch Queen has not yet posted as far as I can tell.

Valesse seems to protest just a wee bit too much in #29.

The grounds listed above do not amount to much, granted. Nevertheless, it seems that there is more to lay at the feet of The KA than any other.

++ The KA

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

I also wondered about that SHE of the first post. She had red hair though - and even though THE Ka's avatar isn't showing red hair, it has that feeling in it...

Regardless of how serious or not-serious you are, I think you're going too far. I think her hair was red only because of the blood...? And though THE Ka's avvie looks like a maniac, the person in it doesn't have blood-stained hair.

EDIT: x-posted with LMP

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Regardless of how serious or not-serious you are, I think you're going too far. I think her hair was red only because of the blood...? And though THE Ka's avvie looks like a maniac, the person in it doesn't have blood-stained hair.

Well, the EEK!, should tell you...

But you seem very intent in defending THE Ka from Roa's accusations? I admit myself believing, at least for now, that Sleepy's "hint" for Roa is a better case than Roa's against THE KA, but still...

[Thinlómien]

2. appears helpful in post #62 with all those quotes seemingly trying to build up some kind of case the nature of which frankly escapes me (prob. my fault for lack of time)

Probably the fault is that there really is no point in the post. First I tried to prove Nogrod he was wrong when he said that the "lynch the quiet ones"-theory didn't get support at the beginning, but I actually ended up with pointing out that and that I was wrong when I said a choir of voices agreed with the suggestion.

3. made no defense (that I could find) in answer to my suspicions.

You were accusing me because of my absence, and to that I can only say:

It seems that you shouldn't sleep,
or neither should a schoolday you busy keep
- otherwise you'll be you'll be lynched by your own kind
a bit unfair I do that find.

And that's what I said in post #43. You just didn't notice it. If you need me to explain the words "sleep" and "schoolday" for you, just ask.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

But you seem very intent in defending THE Ka from Roa's accusations? I admit myself believing, at least for now, that Sleepy's "hint" for Roa is a better case than Roa's against THE KA, but still...

Haven't you been reading my posts,
Touché-man? I'm not defending Ka, I'm actually accusing her. I just want to keep all doors open. Originally posted by me on THE Ka-theory:
Accusing:

Interesting theory, Roa. It is as good as mine, maybe.

Or actually better, I'd say.

Defending:

Quite interesting this is. But have you got any basis on your argument why would Sleepy use just that kind of subtlety?

Regardless of how serious or not-serious you are, I think you're going too far. I think her hair was red only because of the blood...? And though THE Ka's avvie looks like a maniac, the person in it doesn't have blood-stained hair.

I'm not strongly accusing her but neither defending her. And I realise that you can't see my thoughts behind my posts. Maybe I should have made it clearer, but I find Roa's theory quite solid, and it's probably the best theory here yet. THE Ka is at the top of my suspicions list, but she's no clear number one.

[Nogrod]

I'll have to leave for the choir rehersals, and have to vote.

I'll briefly summarize, what I have thus far (I'll leave those morning's "random accusations" to their own worth = don't have time to go over them any more).

Gil-Galad: one "nonsense"-post, nothing else

WQ: nothing at all

Hints by Sleepy:

Roa: seeks revenge

Naria: the loose madman-butcher? + Sleepy's throat cut

Holbytlass: master faker

Accusation of Roa:
THE Ka: Cupid's arrow + RL romance, different character post by Sleepy

So as I have been saying, I will go for the quiet or nonsense posters, if we don't have any better ideas. Now I do think we have better one's, thanks to someone remembering Sleepy saying that he would give us hints of some sort.

So. I will stick to his hints. And as I have to vote this early, I don't want to make the difference now by voting Naria - she being already voted by Holbytlass (sic!).

So there remains Roa to vote.

++ Roa_Aoife

I have a weird feeling, I have done something like this in some earlier life of mine...

PS. Thinlómien: I admit you being right in that point about your not taking sides between Roa / THE Ka -thing. I was negligent over some of your posts... Sorry.