Isildur's Bane - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Celebdil · 01-23-2007, 12:54 AM

Hello,

I am trying to determine whether Denethor knew that the "Isildur's Bane" from Boromir's dream was indeed the One Ring before he sent Boromir to Rivendell. According to the movie he did know this, but of course the movies aren't known for their accuracy.

When Boromir arrives at Rivendell and goes to the Council of Elrond, he recites his dream and asks for its meaning. When it is revealed to him that Isildur's Bane is the One Ring and has been found, he expresses doubt that the ring Frodo has is indeed Sauron's ring, until its whole history has been told. But the details are fuzzy on whether he actually knew that "Isildur's Bane" referred to that ring until Elrond said: "Behold! Isildur's Bane!"

The fact that Boromir expresses doubt as to the validity of Frodo's ring leads me to believe Denethor never told Boromir that the ring had been found, as it is stated in the movie. But this does not mean Denethor did not know about the ring - he may have just kept the information from Boromir.

Later in the trilogy (I can't remember exactly where), Gandalf says that in the time Boromir was away, Denethor must have given much thought to the term "Isildur's Bane", which leads me to believe Gandalf believed that Denethor did not know what the term meant initially. But this raises the question: how can it be that the people of Gondor did not know what was meant by "Isildur's Bane"? Surely the history of Isildur's death and the losing of the ring must have been preserved in Gondor. However they may not have known that it was the ring that betrayed Isildur and thus got the name "Isildur's Bane".

Later, in ROTK, Faramir returns to Gondor and tells Denethor that he let the two halfings go to Cirith Ungol. Of course Denethor knew about these two from his talk with Pippon so he could have guessed that they had the ring which is basically what he tells Faramir. So at some point between Boromir leaving Gondor (or even before this) and Faramir returning Denethor learned that the ring had been found, but it is never stated exactly when he realized this.

So my question is basically, when did Denethor learn that the ring had been found?

01-23-2007, 12:54 AM	#1
Celebdil Pile O'Bones Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 17	Isildur's Bane Hello, I am trying to determine whether Denethor knew that the "Isildur's Bane" from Boromir's dream was indeed the One Ring before he sent Boromir to Rivendell. According to the movie he did know this, but of course the movies aren't known for their accuracy. When Boromir arrives at Rivendell and goes to the Council of Elrond, he recites his dream and asks for its meaning. When it is revealed to him that Isildur's Bane is the One Ring and has been found, he expresses doubt that the ring Frodo has is indeed Sauron's ring, until its whole history has been told. But the details are fuzzy on whether he actually knew that "Isildur's Bane" referred to that ring until Elrond said: "Behold! Isildur's Bane!" The fact that Boromir expresses doubt as to the validity of Frodo's ring leads me to believe Denethor never told Boromir that the ring had been found, as it is stated in the movie. But this does not mean Denethor did not know about the ring - he may have just kept the information from Boromir. Later in the trilogy (I can't remember exactly where), Gandalf says that in the time Boromir was away, Denethor must have given much thought to the term "Isildur's Bane", which leads me to believe Gandalf believed that Denethor did not know what the term meant initially. But this raises the question: how can it be that the people of Gondor did not know what was meant by "Isildur's Bane"? Surely the history of Isildur's death and the losing of the ring must have been preserved in Gondor. However they may not have known that it was the ring that betrayed Isildur and thus got the name "Isildur's Bane". Later, in ROTK, Faramir returns to Gondor and tells Denethor that he let the two halfings go to Cirith Ungol. Of course Denethor knew about these two from his talk with Pippon so he could have guessed that they had the ring which is basically what he tells Faramir. So at some point between Boromir leaving Gondor (or even before this) and Faramir returning Denethor learned that the ring had been found, but it is never stated exactly when he realized this. So my question is basically, when did Denethor learn that the ring had been found?