Support Group for...RETURN OF THE KING!

[Knight of Gondor]

For all of you who are finishing my 12 Days of RotK, feel free, but just so you know, I already had them all written out, so I will continue to do so. <P>On the seventh day of waiting, an elf-lord gave to me: Seven Umbar Corsairs, six oliphants, FIVE SEABIRD WINGS! Four knights of Gondor, three dormant rings, two midnight shows and a king come to set the world free. (Note: I already did the 9 Nazgul in my 12 Days of LotR last year, so I didn't want to repeat)<P>Now, big long post coming, so ye brave ones, get ready to stick it out. See, I can't read all of the responses online, not all at one time. So I save the site and then read it later when I have more time. Here goes.<P>Unable to read through all the responses until now (my, how Christmas can be busy), I thought that, five days from the RotK release, I’d post my responses to some of the posts here.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> There are a lot of little details you never see in the movie that prove how much Peter loved the stories. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I would have liked to have seen them!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>You did! I’m talking small things, like Dwarf runes in Moria, like the subtle things of Rohan designs. Like references to the older ages of the world. <P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I think Bakshi did a better job of Fellowship in an hour than Jackson did in 3+. The scene with Frodo, Bilbo, and the Ring stands out as a point where Jackson showed his amateurishness: the Bakshi version is a strong, moving scene of pathos, Jackson's is a silly, badly done cheap shock. Again, Bakshi's battle at Weathertop is actually quite atmospheric and spooky while Jackson's is the Keystone Kops in cloaks (or Kloaks).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I really don’t know who this Bakshi is that you like so much, but if you like him, go on back to him.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> The only problem is the director and his total lack of sympathy or understanding for the story's meaning and the characters' development. We don't need Bilbo's bug eyes, Frodo being rescued, Gandalf hiding behind doors in storms and scaring Frodo into an early grave, badly designed wargs, even MORE false deaths, breakdancing wizards with continuity errors, dwarf-tossing jokes, suicidal Elronds, Sauron playing golf, skateboarding elves, horses charging pikes down cliffs, extra bonus orc characters, people being rescued by balrogs, ninja hobbit fighting machines and all the rest of it.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I don’t really have a major quarrel with you personally, but your statement that Peter Jackson had no sympathy or understanding for story meaning/character development reflects a lack of attention on your part, as well as prior bias. I also think you set yourself a standard that no one could come close to.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> The Bakshi version is awful. Okay, it gets points for being amusing, but still; it left out so many parts of the story, some of which PJ left in, I might add, and some of the changes were absolutely horrendous.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I’ve never seen this Bakshi dude, or his film. (Play?) I think that it sounds like a unique adaptation that might please a very select body of Tolkien fans, and if some like it, then you have full rights to like it. Just don’t knock that which the rest of us happen to enjoy, okay?<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> I think you need to give PJ a little more credit. It would be incredibly hard to film the Books exactly; and PJ did the best he could. Sure, some of his alterations weren't the best, but he did what he thought would appeal to the audience. I'll admit, I'm annoyed about a few of the changes myself, such as the removal of the Scouring from the next movie, but I do acknowledge that it takes a lot of work to bring such a deep and complex work of literature to the screen, and so some allowance should be given.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Ditto. We must also remember that Peter Jackson is NOT a separate entity all his own. While this Bakshi fellow may have been sole owner and director, etc., he couldn’t hold a candle to the resources Peter Jackson has. But even he had to answer to someone higher up, and he had to prove himself to the studio company. If it hadn’t met with their approval (and remember that, while upsetting Tolkien Purists it was BECAUSE of some of the minor changes that Lord of the Rings enjoys the success it has today. I can prove this merely by a show of hands who has heard of Bakshi versus Peter Jackson!) then the Lord of the Rings movies that we know today would not be here.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Fair enough. Just pointing at the Emperor's clothes.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Hm, that’s interesting. I almost wonder if, in this case, fools CAN’T see them! Sorry, honestly, I do not mean personal offense to Pandora. But I take note of the fact that millions love (and pay to see) PJ’s Lord of the Rings. And he DOES in fact have clothes. While some may not particularly enjoy the style, most like them. (They like them to the tune of $32 Million – that’s the sum that is expected for Peter Jackson to earn)<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> I'm always inclined to laugh at the Nazgul. They act like escapees from a leper colony.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Where do all these dissenters come from? I thought the Nazgûl were done pretty doggone well. That happens to be what they look like in the books, unless you put the Ring on.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Like, I really can't handle the whole warg attack and "death" of Aragorn, and some people thought the scene was well done and enjoyed it.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Yes, the imagined “death” scene didn’t really happen in the books, you’re right. I think Peter Jackson did that just because he wanted to surprise/shock fans who’d already read the books and figured they knew every move before it was made. But I thought the wargs were brilliant. Seeing as how they were not actually there! What did you want, giant dogs? First, Hulk already did that, and second, you’d complain because they only looked like giant dogs. I don’t recall Tolkien describing wargs to a T.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> I don't think it needs a prologue and I don't find the one in the Book particularly good (nor did JRRT for that matter). Without the one in the films the story regains its brilliant musical flow from the light, carefree world of the hobbits gradually through more and more moments of discord to the dark, deep, brassy notes of the mountains of Mordor (in the book even the vocabulary changes from the start to the end; the words themselves get heavier as Frodo struggles with the ring). The prologue just confuses this and all the material in it that was needed could have been in Elrond's flashback.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>But since we don’t like Elrond, that wouldn’t have worked, now would it? I don’t think you guys are being realistic. This movie would not have had the success it had if it had been changed drastically from the version it is today. <I>I</I> find myself needing a prologue before explaining something to the uninitiated. <P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Maybe but at least it was a subtle evokation of struggling wills, not "I'm a great wizard; eat knuckles you old fool". <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I’m about to shock you, so get ready. Some of the changes, such as the wizard duel, were for the better in my mind. Yes, they may actually differ from the book. But in the book, Gandalf was “taken” and put on top of the tower. As great of a wizard as Gandalf was, he would not have been imprisoned without some sort of fight!! It may be a little unrealistic that it was just Saruman that took him, even though he was powerful enough. The other change that was better in my mind was that Narsil stayed in Rivendell. Aragorn was a Ranger in the wilds for a while, and could not have abided using a broken sword for defense. Not to mention the 800-year-old heirloom doesn’t belong getting rained on, and your average wear and tear in the wild.<P>[quote] I found that a few years ago; it's very good. But Bakshi still did a better job. Especially given his circumstances. [/quote<P>This is a matter of opinion, and I think you’ll find you’re vastly outnumbered to the opposite. I’m sorry to hear about your cat, and I hope you don’t feel like we all hate you for disagreeing. It’s your opinion, and your right to hold it, but it’s also our right to oppose your opinion, and to tell you why. <P>Meantime, folks, it’s only five days until the RotK release! Are we pumped, or WHAT? I’ve already got my costume ready (fabric resembling a chain mail shirt, a tunic, a cloak, vambraces, and an Elven Broach), and as I speak, I am sitting on my tickets. (They’re in my wallet) This movie is gonna be really awesome. And I think we’re a testament to our own will power to wait. I started this thread, what, back in September? Give yourselves a round of applause!<P>Oh, and by the way? I'm on Eastern time zone, so I will see it way before you all on the West Coast! Ha!