books

which books should i read after The Lord of the Rings..the History of the Ring or the Simillarion?

[Meela]

What do you mean by the history of the ring?
i dont know if theres a particular order recommended, but a lot of people talk about how they finish Lotr and start reading the Silmarillion. But it depends on what you prefer to do really, I suppose.

[Meela]

If you can't decide, do what i would probably do and go by the book list I'm posting. Its not in order of reading as far as I'm aware, but its a handy way of getting through all the books and checking them off as you read them:

The Hobbit

The Lord of the Rings
The Fellowship of the Ring
The Two Towers
The Return of the King

The Silmarillion
Unfinished Tales
The Adeventures of Tom Bombadil

The History of Middle Earth Series
The Book of Lost Tales, Part 1
The Book of Lost Tales, Part 2
The Lays of Beleriand
The Shaping of Middle-Earth: The Quenta, The Ambarkanta and the Annals
The Lost Road and Other Writings
The Return of the Shadow: The History of the Lord of the Rings, Part One
The Treason of Isengard: The History of the Lord of the Rings, Part Two
The War of the Ring: The History of the Lord of the Rings, Part Three
Sauron Defeated: The History of the Lord of the Rings, Part Four
Morgoth's Ring: The Later Silmarillion, Part One : The Legends of Aman
The War of the Jewels: The Later Silmarillion : Part Two : The Legends of Beleriand
The Peoples of Middle-Earth

[lindil]

As an expansion upon the list given by Meela, I decided to finally commit the following to cyber-space.

It is designed to minimize the number of times I have to read that someone 'could not get into' the various writings of the Silm, UT and HoM-E. Hopefully it will help with selection and pacing of reading the seriously vast legendarium.

Begining with Meela's [and pretty much everybodies recommended begining points]

A - the Hobbit
B - LotR

then depending on your perceived interest:

*Letters [JRRT's commentaries on Life, Hobbit/LotR/Silm and Religion]

or if you want to dive even deeper into the LotR before going on you can go for Tom Shippey's *'Author of the Century'. Easily the best book 'about' the Legendarium around that is not designed for M-E geeks.

or The Adventures of Tom Bombadil [if you love Hobbits]

or Silmarillion [if you love Elves]
The Silmarillion really ups the ante in terms of the attention demanded in reading it. On page 26 of the 2nd ed. large format pb [opened at randon] I counted more or less 22 words [mostly names] in Elvish. There is a lot of names, places and events usually described in Elvish, and when you are used to that, then you get one of several competing translations.

For example Turin is called: Mormegil, Neithan, Agarwaen son of Umarth, Turambar, and probably at least one more I missed.

If you are the kind of person that absorbs things slowly then no NOT rush into the Silm, or if you start if after only one reading of the LotR take your time, do not be concerned with getting it all the first time [ I know at 13 0r 14 - I did not!] After a few chapters I sensed I really liked it but felt swamped so I just read through it lightly [ as paradoxical as that is] and the second time it all made sense, and ever since I have been most moved by the SIlm and UT [and later the X and XI parts of HoM-E]

After that everyone agrees Unfinished Tales should be next, but if you have not made it to Letters yet, it would be a very good time [before UT that is]. Also re-reading the LotR and Silm again is not a bad idea before tackling UT. UT makes far less sense if one has not got a good grasp of the Silm and LotR appendices. It's footnotes are widely held to be one of the greatest treasure troves of delightful obscurantia in all of the Legendarium.

UT gives one the first taste of the History of Middle-Earth Series [HoM-E]. And is almost a best of, except it came out earlier and CJRT had no plan to issue 'everything' of his fathers at that point, so it is a selection based on CJRT's perceived interest of readers, what he liked apparently and what was considered feasible in terms of the rest of the Legendarium and the Silmarillion.

Also extremely valuable before tackling HoM-E is Carpenters JRR Tolkien: A Biography.

So to summarize at this point we are up to:

A - The Hobbit
B - The LotR/appendices
C- LotR again or Letters or Silm or Road to Middle-Earth or Adventures of Tom Bombadil
D- UT and any of above not yet finished and the Biography.

Again a re-reading of all of the above befoer venturing on to the HoM-E series is hardly out of order. BTW, most of the older posters here at the Downs had no choice but to re-read the LotR before the Silm because it only came out in 77, same with LotR/Silm multiple times before UT [80].


~~~
A note on the HoM-E: it is a huge and sprawling affair, Aiwendil recommends reading it in order to more or less get the story from the begining to end. This is more or less true but the contents in Volume 3 and 12 are especially spread out in time. Now most if you have made it through the above and found that UT especially had a fascination for you, all of the alternate versions, footnotes and Commentary, that is what you are heading for in HoM-E, there is no way to disguise that fact. As CJRT says at one point, the footnotes are 'thick on the ground'. Unlkie UT which was still designed for moreor less popular consumption, HoME is for fanatics and scholars.

E - History of Middle-Earth:[I will refer to them mostly by the preceding roman numeral after this]

I - The Book of Lost Tales, Part 1 the earliest wrinings of the Legendarium and Silmarillion particular. C. 1917-20's
II- The Book of Lost Tales, Part 2
III -The Lays of Beleriand poems dating from just after Lost Tales and before the Hobbit buit with revisions of Beren and Luthien dating to the era just after LotR was written. CS lewis early commentary too, very nice.
IV - The Shaping of Middle-Earth: The Quenta, The Ambarkanta and the Annals
V - The Lost Road and Other Writings [/i] Silmarillion as it stood during the writing of the Hobbit. C. 1930 - the only 2 complete Silmarilion versions that were ever written.

VI-IX The History of the Lord of the Rings~ variant LoTR drafts, lots of them, and a fwe illustrations and maps too.
VI - The Return of the Shadow
VII- The Treason of Isengard
VIII - The War of the Ring

IX - Sauron Defeated [in addition to being the conclusion of pt. IV a radical reworking of the prior Lost Road mateial is to be found called the Notion Club papers, containg vast amount of information on Aduniac and interesting Aduniac centerd Akallabeth varients. Also included is Imram a poem in St. Brendan's seeking 'Elfland'.

we return again to the Silmarilion materials worked on after the LotR


X - Morgoth's Ring: The Later Silmarillion, Part One : The Legends of Aman and much morec. 1950's

XI - The War of the Jewels: The Later Silmarillion : Part Two : The Legends of Beleriand c. 1950's

XIIThe Peoples of Middle-Earth c.1950's and 60's - 72.


The disadvantage of reading it in order is that the Book of Lost Tales [1 and 2] are so different in tone and detail from the Silmarillion that many are put off.

Personally I suggest working more or less backwards [X, XI, XII, V, IV, II, I, II and finally, VI-IX] unless:

you love hobbits and the LotR the most, then go for the History of the LotR of the Rings so called [sold in a 3 and 1/4 book pb version these days][VI-IX] then these varrying drafts of the LotR will probably fascinate you.

If you loved the Silmarillion the most then I would suggest this order: X, XI, XII, V, IV, III, I, II


If you are most interested in the Languages then: V for the Etymologies, XI for Quendi and Eldar and then XI for Aduniac, and XII for the Shibboleth and Problem with Ros. Also www.elvish.org has journal called Vinyar Tengwar, wherein many writings of JRRT on linguistics are now being released via CJRT to a team of editors. Very reasonably priced @ 2$ each.Also the Road Goes ever n is essntial for linguistic matters, now back in print in the UK.

IF you loved the LotR appendices and the last fwe sections of UT the most: XII will be the one for you.


for more info,commets and reviews of UT and HoM-E this thread is the best we currently have.

[ April 04, 2003: Message edited by: lindil ]

[Iarwain]

Nice list, Lindil, it looks exactly like a greek textbook that I own... [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

This is by no means as educated a suggestion as lindil's, but if you've read the Hobbit and LotR, my next choice would be the Silmarillion. It is, as many say, demanding of the reader, but it is also (after the Hobbit and LotR) the most straightforward of Tolkien's books. The History of Middle Earth series is a collection of manuscripts tied in with their commentaries by Tolkien's son Christopher, and can be extremely confusing to the unaquainted reader. You could, of course, read some of the other books, like "the Adventures of Tom Bombadil" or "Author of the Century", but those are perhaps a little distant from the rest of middle earth. It's all up to you.

Iarwain

[Lyra Greenleaf]

Personally I love the Silmarillion, all you have to do is accept that while you may eventually get the people and elves straight in your head you will never understand what every singly character and place are compared to all the others. Just enjoy the stories individually and get to know really interesting characters like Beren, Luthien, Turin etc.

If it says that someone is son of someone, from the valley of something else, but moved to soomewhere, also known as something else just don't bother trying to work it out.

Alternatively keep your bookmark in the family tree and check when you meet a new person!

[Luthien_ Tinuviel]

It seems to me that it takes at least two readings of the Silmarillion with at least one reading of LoTR before, between, and after that to get all the stuff in the Silmarillion sorted out. I first read the Silm after having read LOTR only once, and I loved it but it didn't soak in as much until I read it again two years later. One of teh major advantages of reading the Silmarillion is not only that Middle-Earth becomes more real to you and you get to know its history and many other fascinating tales, but it really helps to explain LOTR. All the obscure and not so obscure references to the Silm that are made in the Lord of the Rings become not inly clear but more meaningful after one has read the Silmarillion.

[lindil]

It seems to me that it takes at least two readings of the Silmarillion with at least one reading of LoTR before, between, and after that to get all the stuff in the Silmarillion sorted out.

Exactly the points I was trying to make above!


Of course everyone will be different but for younger folks [I was 13 or so when I first read the Silm - so I know!] a more staggered approach is certainly likely to be the more enjoyable.