Who's your favourite hobbit...

[mark12_30]

Originally Posted by mormegil

He can't even think of a respectable riddle. I mean what kind of question is "what have I got in my pockets?"? Then he lies to Gandalf. So he's not a good thinker and he's a liar...oh ya a thief too. Withholding the Arkenstone from poor Thorin. Thorin's only desire is to have it and Bilbo holds it back from him. That's almost the greatest tragedy Tolkien wrote you know.

You've almost persuaded me to vote for Bilbo.

[Folwren]

I vote for Samwise!! Why? Goodness, if any of you had any sense you'd figure out why.

Sam has just about all the good qualities that the other hobbits have - he's humorous, brave, honest, selfless, and completely down to earth. He's an excellent poet, and he loved his Gaffer! So, mormegil, I totally agree with your first post concerning Sam. (Except, maybe Bilbo wasn't a senile old coot...)

Originally posted by the guy who be short:
Grr...

Bilbo wasn't always a coot you know. He was young for far longer than the average person (or hobbit)! And Sam probably went senile too... yeah... and did he get to the Und(r)ying Lands? No, didn't think so.

Conclusion: Bilbo Adventurer>Samwise Halfwit

...Sam certainly wasn't a Halfwit.

By the bye, he did make it to the Undying Lands, according to the Appendice.

[the guy who be short]

Actually, Sam did go, after the death of Rosie, it's in the appendices.

Ah, but you didn't read the question properly! Undrying Lands, said I.

In any case, Bilbo got there first.

Sam certainly wasn't a Halfwit

This is in the Appendices too. Sam is apparently Old English for Half, thus Half-wise.

He can't even think of a respectable riddle. I mean what kind of question is "what have I got in my pockets?"?

He's inventive and innovative.

Then he lies to Gandalf.

Everybody lies to Gandalf, poor sod.

oh ya a thief too.

Professional burglar, if you please!

Now that the defence is sorted, the attack may begin.

Samwise is detestable. He symbolises hypocrisy in its strongest form. He rises from a peasant class family to become a member of the nobility. And then what does he do for the peasantly? Nothing! *spits*

And obsessed with cooking like he is... you can't trust hobbits with such bad cuisine.

[mormegil]

Professional burglar, if you please!

Professional burglar indeed! A thief is still a thief no matter the name he gives himself.

Samwise is detestable. He symbolises hypocrisy in its strongest form. He rises from a peasant class family to become a member of the nobility. And then what does he do for the peasantly? Nothing! *spits*

Oh I must have been mistaken in my judgment of character. I thought that giving away all but on grain of his blessed soil so that the shire could grow beautiful again was altruistic. But seemingly it was to further his political career.

Let's not forget that Sam never desired the spot light whereas Bilbo seemed rather obessed with being the center of attention. Writing verse about Elrond's family in front of him and then having the nerve to recite it. Doing that whole party thing so he could be remembered. Seems a bit arrogant to me.

[the guy who be short]

Professional burglar indeed! A thief is still a thief no matter the name he gives himself.

So to steal from an evil dragon is... wrong? The Arkenstone cannot be seen as theft, of course, being stolen to avert a needless war.

Oh I must have been mistaken in my judgment of character. I thought that giving away all but on grain of his blessed soil so that the shire could grow beautiful again was altruistic. But seemingly it was to further his political career.

How do you think he became Mayor seven times in a row? Bah. It's all about politics.

Let's not forget that Sam never desired the spot light whereas Bilbo seemed rather obessed with being the center of attention. Writing verse about Elrond's family in front of him and then having the nerve to recite it. Doing that whole party thing so he could be remembered. Seems a bit arrogant to me.

Bilbo was enigmatic, a wonderful trait. and Sam, not desiring the spotlight? Mr Pay-attention-to-me!-I-have-thirteen-children? Mr Running-off-to-adventure-abandoning-his-gaffer? Mr Mayor-seven-times-in-a-row-so-invite-me-to-your-parties?

[mormegil]

Soon, TGWBS, I worry that you will start calling little Biblo your precious.

Biblo view's are far too simplistic (ie elves singing tra-la-la-lally). Remember that the account we have of his deeds are from his own pen. Of course he will slant them to make him look favorable. "No I didn't steal the Arkenstone I merely tried to prevent war".

He saw a pitiable creature and what did he do? He took the thing it desired most and deprived that creature of it. I am of course speaking of Throin and the Dragon. Let's not forget what he did to Gollum too. I see a disturbing pattern here.

He kept the accursed ring for himself until he found out how personally dangerous it was and what did he do with it? Gave it to his heir and said here's my problem you deal with it!

And in defense of Sam wanting attention you know you are grasping at straws. He was only mayor because he knew he could help the peasant class.

Edit: intentional misspelling of Biblo's name

[Orominuialwen]

++ Sam

Sorry, I couldn't resist! But seriously, he's loyal, humble, funny, a good cook, a family man, a good poet/songwriter, what more could you want?

Edit: intentional misspelling of Biblo's name

Heh, my best friend's last name is Bible, and just the other day she got a piece of junk mail with her name misspelled as Biblo!

[mark12_30]

Originally Posted by mormegil

Biblo view's are far too simplistic (ie elves singing tra-la-la-lally).

Don't mess with my Tra-La-La-Lally here down in the valley Ha Ha.

Best drinking song this side of Edoras.

[Folwren]

It's a jolly good thing this is all under the humor section, or I'd think you guys were serious! As it is, I'm having a hard enough time as it is to keep from getting possitively furious with at least TGWBS.

Originally posted by the guy who be short
Bilbo was enigmatic, a wonderful trait. and Sam, not desiring the spotlight? Mr Pay-attention-to-me!-I-have-thirteen-children? Mr Running-off-to-adventure-abandoning-his-gaffer? Mr Mayor-seven-times-in-a-row-so-invite-me-to-your-parties?

For you to even suppose that Samwise was selfish or hypocritical is horrifyingly unbelievable. Sam didn't want to go off with Frodo, Gandalf made him! Gandalf knew that Sam wouldn't want it - he even called it a punishment to teach him not to eavesdrop and to shut him up properly. He couldn't take his Gaffer with him - it woulda killed him.

And chap doesn't make himself Mayor, either. The people vote for him. Ding-dong!

And as for having thirteen children...that was just as much Rosie's choice as Sam's. A woman doesn't go off and have more than a dozen kids just so that her husband can be in the spotlight.

Samwise is detestable. He symbolises hypocrisy in its strongest form. He rises from a peasant class family to become a member of the nobility. And then what does he do for the peasantly? Nothing!

He certainly did NOT forget the peasants! He spread his gift all over the Shire! He rebuilt the Bag shot Row after the Ruffians had destroyed it and he cleaned up the entire land! He helped with it, mind you, he didn't tell others to do it and sit back to watch.

Sam Gamgee was the humblest, sweetest of all hobbits, and though Bilbo is great in his own way, I don't think he holds a light to Sam's over all character in the books.

[mormegil]

That ninnyheimer wouldn't have made it anywhere without the aid of Gandalf whereas Sam the Beloved was the aid to Frodo, who wouldn't have made it as far as he did without him.

[Lalwendë]

Bah! Nobody would have made it anywhere anyway without Bilbo's actions in sneaking the preciousss out from under the Misty Mountains.

[the guy who be short]

It appears there is much resentment at the truth about Samwise emerging, but I'm afraid that, as long as it is possible to do so, it is my duty to enlighten you misguided followers of the "nasssty hobbit," as one famous opponent once called him.

Now, almost everything Sam did after his return to the Shire was to score political points.

And as for having thirteen children...that was just as much Rosie's choice as Sam's. A woman doesn't go off and have more than a dozen kids just so that her husband can be in the spotlight.

It is a well known fact that, if a man (or hobbit) has children, they are seen as approachable and more likely to be voted for. Now, here's the shocker - Sam planned his children around the political calender to make people more likely to vote for him!

Ludricous? Let us consider the timeline and Master Gamgee's family tree.

1427 - Merry, Sam's son, is born. Conveniently, Sam is elected for the first time soon after on the same year.

1433 - Sam's daughter Primrose born late in the year. Sam re-elected early 1434.

1440 - Sam's daughter Robin born in the ending months. Sam re-elected in the following months next year.

1448 - It is not known, but highly suspected amongst scholars, that Sam forced his daughter Elanor to have a baby in this year, giving him the status of Grandfather. He is re-elected.

1454 - Elanor again forced to have a child, Elfstan. Sam elected following year.

1462 - Sam's son, Frodo, forced to have a child (Holfast) this year. Sam re-elected same year.

1469 - Some other child of Sam's is presumably forced to reproduce this year, resulting in his re-election.


As you can see, each election campaign conveniently had some spawn of Sam's for him to fawn over in front of crowds, pulling in the voters. Carefully choreographed, we can only assume that his offspring rebelled against him during his later years, forcing him across the Sea.

Now, it is late, and further attacks on Mister Samwise and defences of Saint Bilbo can wait for the morrow.

[Folwren]

Originally posted by TGWBS:
It is a well known fact that, if a man (or hobbit) has children, they are seen as approachable and more likely to be voted for. Now, here's the shocker - Sam planned his children around the political calender to make people more likely to vote for him!

What polotics were you ever in to know something like that? Sneak.

But, have to say, on account of the lack of birth control that they had, it's impossible for Sam to have planned his children around the politicial calender.

Ludricous? Let us consider the timeline and Master Gamgee's family tree.

1427 - Merry, Sam's son, is born. Conveniently, Sam is elected for the first time soon after on the same year.

1433 - Sam's daughter Primrose born late in the year. Sam re-elected early 1434.

1440 - Sam's daughter Robin born in the ending months. Sam re-elected in the following months next year.

1448 - It is not known, but highly suspected amongst scholars, that Sam forced his daughter Elanor to have a baby in this year, giving him the status of Grandfather. He is re-elected.

1454 - Elanor again forced to have a child, Elfstan. Sam elected following year.

1462 - Sam's son, Frodo, forced to have a child (Holfast) this year. Sam re-elected same year.

1469 - Some other child of Sam's is presumably forced to reproduce this year, resulting in his re-election.


As you can see, each election campaign conveniently had some spawn of Sam's for him to fawn over in front of crowds, pulling in the voters. Carefully choreographed, we can only assume that his offspring rebelled against him during his later years, forcing him across the Sea.

You moron! You don't 'carefully choreograph' seven births! That is absolutely rediculous! Besides that, I don't even know where you got those birth dates...they're not in MY appendixes...unless I've really missed something.

TGWBS, I have to say that your debating skills are lacking. Either find new evidence against Sam or just give up! These arguments just aren't cutting it.

[Kath]

Ah but Folwren the dates TGWBS has come up with are in fact correct! I just checked the appendices (B and C) and all the dates are in there.

on account of the lack of birth control that they had, it's impossible for Sam to have planned his children around the politicial calender.

Untrue, it would actually make it easier. Just make sure there are no marital relations going on until you want a child to be created and tada! (Well hopefully if everything is working properly ). And once Sam and Rosie got a bit older and couldn't do this anymore that's why their children came in handy. Everyone knows smarmy politicians simpering over babies is a major crowd-puller, at least to those members of the crowd that are senile.

And to continue bashing Sam how come he got to go over the sea anyway? He had the Ring for an incredibly short time and yet still he is somehow granted this blessing, when Merry and Pippin just die! So they never held the Ring, Merry helped kill the Witchking!

[the phantom]

the phantom voted for Bilbo. Why are people still debating?

[Kath]

Because the phantom is supposed to be on holiday until July 30th and so until this date has arrived all comments from him will be duly ignored.

[the phantom]

Because the phantom is supposed to be on holiday until July 30th and so until this date has arrived all comments from him will be duly ignored.

During the first part of my trip I was in wilderness areas where I was lucky to see a person much less a computer. Now, I'm staying with relatives who have computers (though I rarely have the time to use them), so I just might make a post or two before the 30th- and I expect everyone to center threads around what I say just like they usually do.

If you let the Downs slip into mediocrity every time I leave for a bit it's really going to put a lot of pressure on me to be here all the time. You don't want to put that kind of pressure on your lovable neighborhood phantom, do you?

[mark12_30]

Originally Posted by the phantom

During the first part of my trip I was in wilderness areas where I was lucky to see a person much less a computer. Now, I'm staying with relatives who have computers (though I rarely have the time to use them), so I just might make a post or two before the 30th- and I expect everyone to center threads around what I say just like they usually do.

If you let the Downs slip into mediocrity every time I leave for a bit it's really going to put a lot of pressure on me to be here all the time. You don't want to put that kind of pressure on your lovable neighborhood phantom, do you?

Aye, there it is. It's a heavy burden, but somebody must bear it, and fate has chosen you. Consider yourself pressurized, Phanny.

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by the phantom

the phantom voted for Bilbo. Why are people still debating?

All the more reason to not vote Bilbo!

[the guy who be short]

Bilbo was pitiful enough to stay his hand and allow Gollum to live. How noble, and of course, it meant the ring could eventually be destroyed. Even if this were not the case, it was the right thing to do, and he was displaying how merciful he was.

On the other hand, we have Sam the Sadist, who likes tying Gollum up, attacking him, verbally abusing him, etc. etc.

Come on people! How can you vote for Samwise the Cruelheart?!

For my part, I find it surprising that Bilbo has not yet been canonised...

[mormegil]

You call that pity? I think Bilbo lacks any amount of courage. Remember my friend he is the one who wrote the historical narrative we have. No it's not pity it's simply a lack of courage to do the job right. Now look what the little sneak did during the battle of five armies. He slipped the ring on and passed out due to fear. I know that he contrived some far-fetched story but the truth is simple enough for those with the ability to look below the surface.

Samwise the cruelheart? No, calling him this merely shows your ignorance towards the most beloved hobbit. Now if you knew Samwise well enough, you would know that he was a master of psychology. With his knowledge Sam knew that the only way to heal Gollum of his malady was through keeping him still and tough love. You see Sam was merely trying to cure him and it almost worked but that poor wretch was simply too far gone even for master healer Samwise

Edit: For Fordim's sake. I like you TGWBS. Bilbo's okay too, but he still can't hold a candle to Samwise.

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Now people, people, let's try to keep this civil -- the heated nature of this debate is beginning to make it look like the wings/no-wings debacle that surrounds balrogs.

So, say nice things to each other or you're all a bunch of Lothos!!

[Folwren]

Bilbo was pitiful enough to stay his hand and allow Gollum to live. How noble, and of course, it meant the ring could eventually be destroyed. Even if this were not the case, it was the right thing to do, and he was displaying how merciful he was.

I don't think that it was pity that stayed Bilbo Baggins's hand! He didn't have a chance to kill Gollum except when he was behind him and made that final leap to freedom, and if he had killed him then, that would have been nothing less than a back stabbing murder. It may have been the right thing to do, but he didn't do it because he had mercy...he did it because he didn't have the guts to go off and kill something like that (like Mormegil said).

On the other hand, we have Sam the Sadist, who likes tying Gollum up, attacking him, verbally abusing him, etc. etc.

You wanna hear some quotes from the books that prove Samwise merciful? Allow me, gentlemen...

From The Two Towers, Book IV, Chapter One, The Taming of Smeagol:
At last Frodo was convinced that [Gollum] really was in pain; but it could not be from the knot. He examined it and found that it was not too tight, indeed hardly tight enough. Sam was gentler than his words.

(So much for your liking to tie Gollum up! Ha.)

Same book, Chapter Eight, The Stairs of Cirith Ungol:
Sam felt a bit remorseful, though not more trustful. 'Sorry,' he said. 'I'm sorry, but you startled me out of my sleep. And I shouldn't have been sleping, and that made me a bit sharp. But Mr. Frodo, he's that tired, I asked him to have a wink; and well, that's how it is. Sorry.'

And mind that that was right before Gollum's most hideous act of treachery!! If you still doubt me...this one will smash any of your hopes of Sam's lack of pity.

The Return of the King, Book VI, Chapter Three, Mount Doom:
Sam's hand wavered. His mind as hot with wrath and the memory of evil. It would be just to slay this treacherous, murderous creature, just and many times deserved; and also it seemd the only safe thing to do. But deep in his heart there was something that restrained him: he could not strike this thing lying in the dust, forlorn, ruinous, utterly wretched. He himsefl, though only for a little while, had borne the Ring, and now dimly he guessed the agony of Gollum's shrivelled mind and body, enslaved to that Ring, unable to find peace or relief ever in life again. But Sam had no words to express what he felt.

If you doubt Sam's pity and even pretend that Bilbo had more, then just think of all the time Sam had a chance to kill Gollum and he didn't. Bilbo had one chance - one chance to turn down. Sam had several. He didn't love Gollum...Bilbo didn't either...he was just more honest to express what he felt in his words than Bilbo ever was!

For my part, I find it surprising that Bilbo has not yet been canonised...

What do you mean?

Was I nice enough, Fordim? And all this is mostly friendly bantering, is it not? I'm just sharpening my debating skills and my knowledge of both Bilbo and Sam!

[Lyta_Underhill]

Hey! Why doesn't anybody seem to like Pippin? He's all but been forgotten in this poll! Sure, he can be annoying, but I think Gandalf is just too easily annoyed! And who wouldn't want to splash some water around after a narrow escape from Black Riders in the dark of one's own homeland? I didn't see anyone else cleaning it up for him! Plus, he guided Frodo and Sam most expertly through parts of the Shire they couldn't possibly have navigated so well if it hadn't been for the nimble feet and mind of Mr. Peregrin Took! And let's not forget his easy social grace with Farmer Maggot, that kept Frodo from becoming dog food! He may be impulsive, but I think in this he is a more human reflection of Gandalf himself--allowing and causing things to be without a clear reason for them and yet this trait opens new ways and moves great events. Pippin is the upright Fool who becomes the Knight who lightly steps in this world (even laughing a little ere the end...) Even Gandalf said that Pippin SAVED him from a great danger and folly with his Palantir hijinks! And he grows up soon enough and well enough during the War of the Ring to emerge as a stouthearted hero in his own right, one who has great support in the Shire and a way with everyone he meets! Plus, he's cheerful! Look how depressed Merry and Frodo and Sam all become near the end of the War, just because Pippin isn't there to cheer them up!

Now why has everyone forgotten my dear Peregrin Took? And even added hobbits not on the list instead of realizing that Pippin is there, overlooked.

I have enjoyed this rant once again, as I seem to cheer myself up by going on about the merits of the youngest Fellowship member...he has, in recent times (let's say the last few years), alternated with Frodo as my favorite. But since no one has spoken up for him, I thought I'd have a go!

Cheers!
Lyta

P.S. I notice he's got votes, but I had not seen anyone explaining why they liked him! Blame my bad eyesight and hasty ways!

P.P.S.: I notice the Frodo seems to be losing this poll. Does everyone think he's just a tragic hero? I rather think of him as a dreamer who really appreciates the things he has and loves the Shire and woods that surround him! Real Elvish-like, as Sam might say....a seeker after beauty. In other words, a hobbit after my own heart! A pity that stupid Ring keeps people from liking him as well!

P.P.P.S: Haven't voted yet, but still trying to weigh the nature of my affections--similar but different...it is hard to pick a favorite Hobbit! I love them all! (Maybe I'm Gandalf? Hardly!)

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

I've been thinking about this poll, and mumbling on to myself about the problematic task of having to pick a favorite out of the lot. But once past all the grumbling I kept coming back to Sam. I won't go on about specific qualities of his, as it would be highly subjective, (I have a weakness for long suffering characters who don't take themselves too seriously), but Sam was the one hobbit whose presence stayed with me long after I had finished reading the story: a sort of heroic personage of the type you actually meet now and again. And if I could be half the hobbit he was, (and I don't mean stature) well then, I would be very content.

[Folwren]

Yay for Hilde Bracegirdle!!

Edit: I didn't vote for Peregrin merely for the fact that he's not my favorite. He's a dear hobbit, to be sure, and I'm sure everyone loves him, even though they say otherwise on this thread sometimes.

And it was a hard choice for be to pick either Frodo or Sam. As you have probably noticed, I decided on Sam, but Frodo was almost it. Don't worry - Frodo wasn't forgotten, even though the poll may make it appear so.

[The Saucepan Man]

Personally, I like my Hobbits "Hobbity" and Frodo (while most definately a most admirable Hobbit) is, by the end, rather too "unwordly" to get my vote. Perhaps that's the reason for his relatively poor showing in the poll (I'm sure that he would top many others).

Of the "Fellowship Hobbits", I would have voted for Pippin, for many of the reasons that Lyta so eloquently stated. His innocence, sense of humour and curiosity are appealing and his transition from "young innocent abroad" to Gondorian warrior is a great aspect of the story.

But my first introduction to Tolkien was courtesy of Bilbo, when I first read The Hobbit many many years ago, and I probably identify most with him of all the characters in either the Hobbit or LotR (with the possible exception of Butterbur ). So its Bilbo who gest my vote.

[Kath]

I do love Bilbo and he will always have a special place in my affections as he was the first Hobbit I ever discovered and the one that introduced me to the wonders of Tolkien. He was also quite a resourceful little fellow with his plans for getting the Dwarves out of the Elf-kings cellars and for making peace between the Dwarves and the Men. He was completely out of place in their world and still made the best of it, and he remained a Hobbit throughout, always on the look-out for rest and food!

Frodo I found was just not a Hobbit anymore by the end after all that he had been through. He saw the world with a sadness that should just not be inherent in Hobbit's. He was wise and kind and courageous but was always to me the distant hero that you admired but did not connect with.

Sam I found the more down-to-earth and available of the hero's. And he was heroic, he just did it all with Hobbit sense and love for his master. Regardless of TGWBS' views on his later political career he did do the Shire a great service with his gift from Galadriel and he helped to keep the stories alive.

Merry annoyed me at the beginning of the books. It wasn't really until Bree that I began to like him, but by the charge of the Rohirrim he was a beloved character who I wanted to see make it through. His part in the destruction of the Witch King again makes him a hero, and again one of the more accessible ones.

Pippin however I have always had a soft spot for. He is just the perfect Hobbit and sweet and innocent with it. His experience with war and the Palantir changed him in no way for the worse and he still retained his Hobbitness through it all. He was always there to cheer people up and even Gandalf couldn't help but love him by the end. He saved Faramir and Merry and took part in the battle before Mordor even if he did do a Bilbo and passed out before the end.

So I think I'm going to have to go with Pippin.

[WaynetheGoblin]

I like bilbo he is smart and short like me

[Turgon Philip Noldor]

I say Frodo. Frodo was always my favorite Hobbit, though Merry comes very closely in second. I think It might be because Frodo has to go through so much sorrow and pain, or because Frodo seems to be isolated from the rest of the real world. He always seems to be in another place, he is alone. For some reason I really like that (not that he goes through pain, mind you). So I will pick Frodo....

[the guy who be short]

I'm afraid I must bring the ultimate punishment down on Samwise Gamgee for daring to challenge Bilbo.

Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, Letter 246

Sam...Some readers he irritates and even infuriates. I can well understand it... Sam can be very 'trying'. He is a more representative hobbit than any others that we have to see much of; and he has consequently a stronger ingredient of that quality which even some hobbits found at times hard to bear: a vulgarity... a mental myopia which is proud of itself, a smugness... and cocksureness...
Sam was cocksure, and... conceited... his service and loyalty to his master... had an ingredient... of pride and possessiveness.

Even Tolkien disliked the scamp.*

*Slight omissions may have been carried out to portray Sam in a more negative light.

[Folwren]

*flushes red and tears start to my eyes*

That's hard! Cruel hard!

Originally posted by TGWBS:
Slight omissions may have been carried out to portray Sam in a more negative light.

Yes, I assumed that.

I don't think that Tolkien disliked the scamp...he couldn't have. You can't write a book as long as the LotR and turn one of the characters you dislike into the hero of the story.

Besides that, I'm not talking about what Tolkien thought of Samwise, I'm talking about how good Sam is. I'm not even comparing him to Bilbo Baggins. The two are uncomparable, really. Sam is a lot better than Bilbo, but I'm not going to go on and on about that fact. I'll defend Sam to the death (and I don't see that happening any time soon) because if you brought any real complaints against him, I could thwart them as easily as I...squished that caterpillar the other day. (That as gross.)

But what's a chap like me supposed to say when you come up with fragments of a letter I have no way to get my hands on? Fragments, I say, taking what makes Sam appear the worst? I have no possible way to refute what you just said! Do I?

I don't believe that any one in their right mind could dislike Sam, or be irritated by him. No one in the book ever was...besides when he was obviously bad by trimming the grass around the window sills when he wasn't supposed to be listening. (Many people got mad and irritated at Bilbo, but I'm not going into that because I said I wouldn't earlier.)

Honestly, TGWBS, if you're going to argue and rail against Sam, bring stuff from the books!

[CaptainofDespair]

Bah!

Samwise is a cheat! How can you ask us to bring out quotes from the books? We all know that after Frodo departed, Samwise edited everything to present himself in a better light. He is, in actuality, a bumbling fool. And he is a fat hobbit, as well. How on earth does he stay fat, while Frodo withers away? He ate all the food!

Bilbo is like Willy Wonka. Granted, I love Gene Wilder as Willy, but he's creepy. And so is Bilbo. And the whole butter over bread thing is just code for "I'm tired of this, time to pass on the burden to Frodo". And, he helped kill Smaug, my favorite character from The Hobbit.

Frodo is a tragic hero. That instantly garners disrespect, because he couldn't be wise enough to, oh let's say, give the Ring to Boromir.

Merry and Pippin both do horrible things. Merry helped out in the defeat of Wiki (he should have been burned at the stake for such a crime, seriously). Pippin is just...Pippin.

Thus, I will vote for...Pippin. He neither killed Smaug (well, Bilbo helped), nor Wiki, nor Sauron.

[Folwren]

Very interesting arguments, Captain.

I've been considering this problem, TGWBS...

Without Bilbo, Sam wouldn't have been what he was because he wouldn't have been told stories about the elves and things, wouldn't have learned his letters, and wouldn't have met with the upper class at all (Frodo, Merry, Pippin...).
Without Sam, Frodo would have perished before he made it to Mordor.
Without Frodo (or with Frodo perishing before making it to Mordor), the entire quest would have failed and everyone would have died or lived under slavery anyway and everything would have been in vain.

How's that for reasoning? It accepts the three most important and argued over hobbits and...I doubt it will be the case, but it could end the fight.

(I still think Sam's the best!)

[mormegil]

I think we can let the Shire residents themselves answer who the best hobbit was. That would obviously be Sam. How many times was he elected to be mayor? Also in contrast to Bilbo he didn't have to buy friends. Truly the only reason that Frodo acted like he loved Bilbo was to get at his fortune. Speaking of Bilbo buying his friends I find it hilarious that he actually had a small fortune and he gave out much of it and yet wasn't liked one bit by most shire residents. At least, one would think, he could buy some yes men but nobody was even willing to do that.

By the end of his life he was so cynical that he couldn't even give out a gift properly. He had to attack some snide remark to every gift. What kind of person does that I ask you!

[Naz]

I like Pippin. Because... he's Pippin. ._.; He's just kind of weird & "doi doi whutdoaydooo". If you take my meaning. 9_9;

[the guy who be short]

Folwren, you can read the letter in The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, which you can buy or borrow from your nearest library.

In any case, I've noticed the startling trend towards Pippin. I'm willing to ceasefire with mormegil and Folwren until an at least semi-respectable Hobbit is honoured with the position of "Favourite."

*Casts dirty look in the direction of Pippin.* Expect some dirt soon...

[Firefoot]

And then there's Frodo, who has been losing this poll the whole way... come on, people, what's wrong with you!?



Seriously, here's why you should vote for Frodo:

1. He saved Middle-earth...
2. He resisted the power of the Ring all the way to Mt. Doom; not only that, he resisted the power of the Morgul Blade 17 whole days.
3. He could actually keep his wits about him in tight situations (think Bilbo in Gollum's cave... let's just give this dangerous creature our name and address, shall we? Think Sam at Heneth Annun - after all Frodo's careful talking: "he wanted the Enemy's Ring!")
4. Gandalf held him in the highest esteem.
5. Several hobbits held him in the highest esteem (Bilbo and Sam, not least! And the Gaffer, of course).
6. He's thoughtful, not wanting to take his friends into danger with him.
7. Frodo is clearly more popular - you never heard of anyone writing "Sam lives" or "Bilbo lives" or "Pippin lives" anywhere, have you?

[mormegil]

Frodo...No no no. Sam my dear. Frodo was Middle-earth's biggest whiner. This whole thing about complaining about the weight of his "burden". I mean really how much can a silly ring weigh anyway? He wouldn't have made it anywhere without the help of others, Sam's in particular.

All-in-all I like Frodo more than Bilbo but not as much as dear old Samwise, Samwise the True, Samwise the faithful, Samwise the valiant etc...

[Durelin]

Well, I've finally decided after many days of meditation.... I vote for Bilbo. And this is why:

Bilbo is like Willy Wonka. Granted, I love Gene Wilder as Willy, but he's creepy. And so is Bilbo.

Thank you for pointing that out to me, my dear Captain.

I dig the whole 'creepy old man' thing... And I have this thing for doors, and thus I feel a sense of kinship with scary old Bilbo...