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06-16-2004, 11:09 AM | #41 |
Haunting Spirit
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Wow. I should visit my own threads more often. (smiley use excuse)
Kransha and Finwe- Can we revisit the Faramir/Boromir/Imrahil thing? I am still way confused on thier relationship.
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"For God's sake Ed, just take the stupid call!" said Justin. "Hello, Mum, I'm on stage," said Ed casually. "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRGGGGGH!" screamed Justin. |
06-17-2004, 01:02 AM | #42 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Feb 2004
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Imrahil's sister Finduilas is the mother of Faramir and Boromir- thus Imrahil is their uncle. He is also Eowyn's uncle-in-law (as she married Faramir).
Imrahil's daughter Lothiriel married Eomer, making Imrahil Eomer's father-in-law. Faramir is Eomer's brother-in-law, since he married his sister, Eowyn. Here's a rough family tree below, including only Denethor, Faramir, Boromir, Imrahil, Lothiriel, Finduilas, Eomer and Eowyn. Oh, and it also contains Imrahil's father, Adrahil . Don't mind the dots- they're just there to space it out properly. ............................................Adrahil ......................................._____|_____ _ ......................................|........... .......| ..............................Imrahil.............Finduilas = Denethor ..................................|............... ............____|____ ..................................|............... ...........|.............| ...........................Lothiriel = Eomer*..Boromir....Faramir = Eowyn* *Denotes that Eomer and Eowyn are brother and sister.
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Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta. Last edited by Fingolfin II; 06-17-2004 at 01:24 AM. Reason: The spacing of this family tree just isn't happening! |
06-23-2004, 07:30 PM | #43 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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I realized the other day, and mentioned it on the defective weapons thread, that if Frodo had not been healed from being stabbed form the witchking, there'd be 9 huge scary Nazgul, and one little hobbit in a black cloak running around. How funny!
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"'Eldest, that's what I am... Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn... He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside.'" |
06-23-2004, 08:02 PM | #44 |
Haunting Spirit
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Bombadil, there was a whole thread on that very subject in Middle Earth Mirth! I made it very uncool with one stupid post though...
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"For God's sake Ed, just take the stupid call!" said Justin. "Hello, Mum, I'm on stage," said Ed casually. "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRGGGGGH!" screamed Justin. |
06-23-2004, 09:10 PM | #45 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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Oops! How silly of me, I shall look it up!
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"'Eldest, that's what I am... Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn... He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside.'" |
06-25-2004, 01:03 AM | #46 | |
Wight
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Australia
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Or maybe he'd have set up house wioth Gollum. |
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06-25-2004, 04:42 PM | #47 | ||
Animated Skeleton
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'The Shibboleth of Fëanor', note 53:
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07-07-2004, 12:31 PM | #48 | |
Pile O'Bones
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 15
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Uh, oh.
Bombadil wrote:
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But consider this: What if Aragorn had not been so strong, and had taken up carrying the Ring itself? Or what if Aragorn's true lineage had come out earlier - and he had been the one stabbed? Certainly as a Nazgul he would have been formidable! I shiver to think of the horror that would have followed. |
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07-13-2004, 03:36 PM | #49 |
Wight
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: in my hobbit hole
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I just want to send something out into the void. Most think that it was J.K Rowling who came up with the black cloaked deamons and certain phrases but it was really....wait can you guess...YES! It was Tolkien. Many think J.K's dementors inspired the ringwraiths.....please.....look at the years between the books publishings and who came first, we're talking decades here. And the phrase "Something wicked this way comes!" Yeah that was Tolkiens as well. J.K deserves credit for her accomplishments, however, it is possible for writers to be inspired by other writers.
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07-13-2004, 03:59 PM | #50 |
Banshee of Camelot
Join Date: May 2002
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I am sure no one in this forum would think that, ninlaith!
"Something wicked this way comes!" I thought that was Shakespeare! (Macbeth) And where in Tolkien's work did you find that phrase, pray ?
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07-13-2004, 05:16 PM | #51 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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I believe that is Macbeth. Ironic it is too, for the witches say it about Macbeth.
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"'Eldest, that's what I am... Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn... He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside.'" |
07-13-2004, 06:06 PM | #52 |
Wight
Join Date: Jul 2004
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oh don't get me wrong it was in that English play ,however, it was said by Sam in one of the last chapters of ROTK I can't remember for the life of me which but i remember thinking wait...that song in Harry Potter said that...sorry I just have alot of friends who like Harry Potter and choose to pick a fight about who was the better author and who said what first.......sorry. oh well everyone else wins i lose.
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07-13-2004, 06:41 PM | #53 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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That's cool, I didn't know it was used in LOTR. Oi, I don't think you can compare the two authors. J.K. Rowling's books give me a different sort of thrill, one so different than what I get from Tolkien's books, it's easy to find those who are fans of one and not the other.
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"'Eldest, that's what I am... Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn... He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside.'" |
07-13-2004, 06:47 PM | #54 |
Wight
Join Date: Jul 2004
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That's a very good point. I'll warrant there's only one person I know that doesn't like LOTR much but that's because he hasn't read the books yet. And basically that's what most people say but everyone else I know loves both. And they do spark different sort of enchantments on the mind.
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07-14-2004, 01:47 AM | #55 |
Animated Skeleton
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The phrase 'something wicked this way comes' is not in LOTR. I did a search.
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07-14-2004, 04:20 AM | #56 | |
Wight
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Australia
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As for JKR and the phrase, it wasn't even in the novel, only part of a choral piece in the film, based on the Shakespeare text. Tolkien didn't even LIKE Shakespeare and he felt right cheated by Macbeth, especially the Birnam Wood business, which, as we know, was one of the reasons for the Ents, i.e. what if Birnam Wood really did come to Dunsinane? I am quite sure he would have been offended at the notion that he had a character quote from the Bard! |
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07-14-2004, 05:37 AM | #57 | |
Corpus Cacophonous
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Whatever feelings he may have had with regard to Shakespeare's works, however, it didn't stop him nicking and adapting for Aragorn the "All that glisters is not gold" line from Merchant of Venice.
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07-14-2004, 06:09 AM | #58 |
Wight
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: in my hobbit hole
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It's in there. I'm sure you read all three books word for word in the last 24 hours.
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07-14-2004, 06:52 AM | #59 | |
Banshee of Camelot
Join Date: May 2002
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And apropos the witches in Macbeth: in "On Fairy-stories" Tolkien wrote that he thought them tolerable when just reading the play, but on stage he didn't approve of them at all! (And he did write about Shakespeare "Which I disliked cordially" in letter 163) I am quite sure he did not use that phrase! I'm fairly certain I would have noticed and not forgotten about it. (If I think of all the "proverbs" and wise sayings I collected... Have a look at the quotable quotes, ninlaith, you can see that there are people here who do remember lots of sentences literally!)
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Yes! "wish-fulfilment dreams" we spin to cheat our timid hearts, and ugly Fact defeat! |
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07-14-2004, 07:21 AM | #60 |
Blithe Spirit
Join Date: Jan 2003
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Ninlaith, it is also quite easy to do a quick and comprehensive search of LotR if you have a pdf copy of it on your computer desktop...*whistles nonchalantly*
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07-14-2004, 07:42 AM | #61 | ||
Corpus Cacophonous
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Prince Aragorn of Morocco?
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Courtesy of Google: Quote:
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Do you mind? I'm busy doing the fishstick. It's a very delicate state of mind! |
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07-14-2004, 08:17 AM | #62 |
Wight
Join Date: Jul 2004
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so it would fit into his linguistic temperments he phrased it something wicked comes this way. why would i say it was in there if I hadn't seen something like it and I would know I would be dealing with people that knew about his writings as well. that would just be calling for dispute. But I'm done. I'm sorry if I've offended anyone. I lose everyone else wins.
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07-14-2004, 11:34 AM | #63 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
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Not to go off topic, but I've always wanted to start a thread comparing elements of Macbeth to the LOTR. Please let me know if there already have been discussons. one of the obvious main themes in Macbeth is "Fair is foul, and foul is fair." In the chapter Strider, it is said:
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Had to throw that in there, but to get back on topic: My friend told me last night that Legolas was originally one of Gondolin? And that he saved Eärendil? If this information is true, it's kind of odd to look at the council of Elrond and know Elrond wouldn't be there if it weren't for that elf with the bow!
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"'Eldest, that's what I am... Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn... He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord came from Outside.'" |
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07-15-2004, 06:44 AM | #64 |
Princess of Skwerlz
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Bombadil, here's a thread comparing LotR and Macbeth: Glamis? Cawdor? A bookworm's musings
As to Legolas of Gondolin, that appears to be a recycled name, since it cannot be the same person. For more information, please do a search using 'Legolas' and 'Gondolin' - you should find discussions by the experts there.
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'Mercy!' cried Gandalf. 'If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more do you want to know?' 'The whole history of Middle-earth...' Last edited by Estelyn Telcontar; 07-15-2004 at 06:57 AM. |
07-15-2004, 12:39 PM | #65 |
Pilgrim Soul
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To go back a little bit the linking between the Rohan royal family and the House of Dol Amroth is even more convoluted thing is even more convoluted since in addition to the first cousins Faramir and Lothiriel marrying the siblings Eowyn and Eomer which would have made their children first and second cousins!!! Eowyn and Eomer were already akin to Imrahil because their grandmother Morwen of Lossarnach was despite her title a descendent of a Prince of Dol Amroth. Maybe a sister or aunt of Adrahil married teh lord of Lossarnach ....... you just hope they opened this up a bit before the noble visages of the Swan princes were afflicted by a Hapsburg jaw.....
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“But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.”
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07-25-2004, 03:17 PM | #66 |
Wight
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I realized something the other day. In Dante's Inferno there are 9 rings of Hell. There are 9 ring wraiths. Also in The Inferno when Dante went to met the big guy in the sky and the big JC and the mother their radiant light was so blinding and moving that it brought tears to his eyes. Much like Galadriel and Celebor's entrance. I just thought it was cool. They may not have anything to do with each other. It's just neat.
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07-27-2004, 07:33 PM | #67 | |
Wight
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07-27-2004, 10:40 PM | #68 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: May 2004
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my great discovery sam and rosie had 13 children
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Morsul the Resurrected |
08-04-2004, 06:00 PM | #69 | ||
Shade of Carn Dûm
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