Return of the king has a lot to cover

There was so much left out of thye second movie that was in the second book but the movie also has not reached the smae point as where the book ended. so how much will be cut in order to keep the movie from being too long? we may lose some very good parts that i would love to see on screen[QUOTE] <BR>"I'm an investment. I got to protect that investment." Marion Michael Morrison ( The Duke)

[HCIsland]

In terms of raw content, there's not as much material to cover as there was in Fellowship of the Ring (count the pages). We already know that the Scouring of the Shire will be absent and PJ has hinted that he may let this movie be longer then the other two. I don't see any reason it will be more compressed than what has already been done.<P>H.C.

[Gorwingel]

There is definitely a lot of stuff that is going to be covered in ROTK, Peter Jackson has already said that the movie is going to be 3 1/2 to 4 hours long.

[Peri]

What? No scouring of the Shire? But they have to include that! When Frodo looks into Galadriel's mirror, they SHOW us the whole Shire in shambles. Now they have an obligation to include it. Will it probably be on the extended version?

[Inderjit Sanghera]

No, I don't think the Scouring will even be on the extended version. A shame. I think that it still, even though it will be three and a half hours,or however long, may be rushed.

even in four hours it may be cutting it close sam and frodo haven't even met the spider yet

[Horse-Maiden of the Shire]

I went to a site, i forget the address, but it said a lot of stuff. Dont worry, Pippin still looks into the Palantir, but they changed SO MUCH! I wont tell you anything else but if ya want to know PM me and Ill tell ya...<BR>grr, no scouring! i wanted to see the hobbits kicking some ruffian arse

[Calliope and Linus S. Underhill.]

The scouring of the Shire always makes me cry, so in a way I'm glad it's not there . I think instead of making helms deep 40 mins long they could have added the second half of the book! But that's just me griping. I think PJ is capable of it. ROTK doesn't have as much content as the Fellowship, and is actually a much shorter book then the other two, but it looks just as long due to the appendixes.

[Morgul Queen]

I think the reason the Scouring will not be shown is because its too violent...the only reason they got away with the Orc slaughters is because they made their blood black so it dosn't look like human blood, but the Men killed in the scouring are Men...if a bit orkish and so cant be killed on screen unless PJ wants a PG13 movie...oh and slitting dear old sharkys throat is pretty violent too...BUT if they muck up the Havens PJ is wraith fodder, I wont be happy till I see him hanging from a gibbit for the sport of his crows!!!!!!

[Gilthalion]

The "Shire in shambles" scene was depicted in Galadriel's mirror as an "homage" according to PJ on the Extended DVD. In the book Galadriel says that somethings do not come to pass unless those who view them try to prevent them. In the movie she says that this is what happens if Frodo fails.<P>But look at all that ROTK has to cover, even without the scouring!<P>***SPOILER WARNING***<P><B>IN MORDOR:</B><P>SHELOB<BR>ESCAPE FROM ORCS<BR>ROAMING MORDOR<BR>ESCAPE FROM ORCS AGAIN<BR>THE LAST LEG TO MT. DOOM<BR>DEALING WITH GOLLUM<BR>CLAIMING THE RING<BR>GOLLUM TAKES THE RING AND DIES<P><BR><B>ELSEWHERE</B><P>CONFRONTING SARUMAN<BR>PIPPIN & THE PALANTIR<BR>THE PATHS OF DARKNESS<BR>THE MUSTER OF ROHAN<BR>THE DRUADAN<BR>THE FALL OF FARAMIR<BR>THE SIEGE OF MINAS TIRITH<BR>THE CAVALRY OF ROHAN<BR>THE DEATH OF THEODEN<BR>EOWYN & MERRY V. THE WITCH KING<BR>THE RETURN OF ARAGORN<BR>THE HOUSE OF HEALING<BR>MARCH TO THE BLACK GATES<BR>PARLEY WITH THE MOUTH OF SAURON<BR>BATTLE BEFORE THE GATES<BR>THE EAGLES AND THE RESCUE OF SAM & FRODO<BR>PRAISING THE RINGBEARERS<BR>MARRIAGE OF ARWEN & ARAGORN<BR>THE RINGBEARERS TAKE SHIP<P>And somewhere in all of that, Saruman has to die on a wheel (as an early production photo indicated).<P>~~~<P>Surely some of these scenes will be deleted or greatly amended or blended. Even so, this promises to be a nice long movie. Will they make us wait until October 2004 for that DVD? Will PJ die of editing sickness before then?

[Rose Cotton]

I think you all are overreacting. Remember, PJ already filmed all that so he knows how long it is. If he needed more time for the third movie he would have put more in TTT. <P>For one thing I don't think Frodo and Sam's parts will take up too much time. After they enter Mordor they only have a few important scenes. I mean, I love Sam but even I don't want entire scenes devoted to those two hobbits just crawling through a wasteland. <P>As for the other parts, you'd be suprised how much you can get into 3 hours.<P>Don't worry about it.

[Frodo Baggins]

Saruman dosen't die on a wheel, he gets his throat cut by his dear old nasty Worm-creature and is thrown out a window. Or so they say..........

[HCIsland]

Concerning Saruman and the wheel.<P>This picture has been floated around, but I've heard there were multiple deaths filmed, so he may be skewered on the wheel and he may not.<P>As for the content, as I've mentioned before, there is less content then FoTR. As well, there are limited new major characters and locations to introduce. The only major character left is Denethor and the Steward of Gondor has already been talked about in earlier films. The audience will understand where he fits in within seconds.<P>This is very different then in Two Towers, where PJ had to introduce Rohan, Theoden, Eowyn, Eomer and Wormtongue and how all these characters fit together. Doing all that takes time.<P>Of the three books, I think Return of the King will be the easiest to adapt. The characters and locations are mostly established and it builds to a natural and cohesive climax. The story is far more linear then the meandering FoTR and the scattered TTT. <P>If there are people out there that are chess players, the phases of chess are an apt metephor. <P>FoTR was the opening, introducing most of the major characters, their relationships and the world in which they inhabit. Its purpose was to get all the pieces into solid positions so the main bulk of the story can be started.<P>TTT was the middle-game. Middle-game is always the most complex and tricky and I think TTT was the most difficult of the three books to adapt. <P>RoTK is endgame. If the opening and the middle-game were played right, the endgame becomes easy. The pieces are where we want them to be, now it's time for the real fun.<P>Sorry, long post, but I think people should relax. I think Return of the King should definately be the best of the three films.<P>H.C.

[Aratlithiel]

Always count on H.C. for that comforting movie stuff. This was on another thread and helped me relax a great deal about the coming movie and just how much they can cram into it. Made me feel tons better...<P>(Quoting HCIsland)<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>In FoTR, 368 pages of the book was adapted. This includes all of Fellowship minus chapters 6, 7 and 8 of book one (Tom Bombadil) plus chapter 1 of book three (The Departure of Boromir).<P>In TTT, 235 pages of the book was adapted. This is books three and four (normally published as The Two Towers) minus chapters 8, 10 and 11 of book three (Road to Isengard, Saruman and Palantir) and 8, 9 and 10 of book four (Shelob build up and aftermath).<P>That leaves 335 pages left for RoTK which is less then FoTR even after Tom Bombadil was taken out. As well it is only 273 pages to the actual climax of the action. Of the remaining 82 pages (6 chapters) we know a lot will be gone including The Scouring of the Shire. There is some stuff that has to be dealt with, but I think it can be done fairly quickly with the main emphasis being building up to the scene in Grey Havens.<P> <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><p>[ February 12, 2003: Message edited by: Aratlithiel ]

[mollecon]

Several have made good comments here.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>For one thing I don't think Frodo and Sam's parts will take up too much time. After they enter Mordor they only have a few important scenes. I mean, I love Sam but even I don't want entire scenes devoted to those two hobbits just crawling through a wasteland.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I think that's one of the reasons' Shelob was removed to RotK - to get more action involving Frodo & Sam (& Gollum of course) in that movie. And I very much doubt that Frodo & Sam will get caught more than once in RotK. With the leaving out of The Scourcing of The Shire & PJ maybe even making RotK longer than the previous, there should be plenty of time

[Rose Cotton]

The biggist problem I see in adapting ROTK is that the battle in the Pelenior fields is the biggist one in the book. However, it isn't the last one. So PJ had to think of a way to make that a big battle without making it too climatic.

[HCIsland]

Good point Rose. They do have to make sure the Pelenior Fields doesn't overwhelm the climax. I don't think they should do a Helm's Deep here. <P>Luckily they have the more personal battles that they can concentrate on. Denethor-Pippin, Theoden, Eowyn-Merry and the Ringwraith, Gandalf at the gates and then timely arrival of the Aragorn and company. They can concentrate on intercuting between all this stuff and less on the scale of the battle.<P>H.C.

[Naldoriathil]

There will be no Scouring of the Shire because they haven't even filmed it. There was never going to one from the start. Shelob will definately be in the Third film but I don't know about anything else.