Middle-earth Maxims

[Inziladun]

There is possibly a similar thread buried somewhere among these ancient barrows, but I didn't see one. I hope also that I have placed this correctly.
Being a great admirer of the linguistic style of the books, and having read LOTR, The Silmarillion, and Unfinished Tales more times than I could say, phrases from the books sometimes come into my mind as I'm going about daily business.
The one that I think of the most is from UT, Túrin's words to Androg at Amon Rûdh:

Why must you speak your thoughts? Silence, if fair words stick in your throat, would serve all our ends better.

No doubt that one has kept me out of serious trouble at one time or another.
There are other sayings of a non-Tolkien nature, I'm sure, that carry the same sentiment. What I was wondering is this: Do certain lines from the books occur to you on a regular basis as helpful proverbs?

[Morthoron]

I prefer the profound witticisms of the renowned sage Hamfast 'Gaffer' Gamgee"

"It's an ill wind as blows nobody no good, as I always say. And All's well as ends Better!"

"Where there's life there's hope, and need of vittles. "

"Make it short, and then you won't have to cut it short before you can use it [referring to names]."

"I don't hold with wearing ironmongery whether it wear well or no."

"The servant has a claim on the master for service, even service in fear. "

"Elves and Dragons! I says to him. Cabbages and potatoes are better for me and you."

"Don't go getting mixed up in the business of your betters, or you'll land in trouble too big for you."

And now that I am on the subject, I would just like to espouse my firmest opinion that the Gaffer was yet another Tolkien character that Peter Jackson slighted in his films.

[Tuor in Gondolin]

"Never laugh at live dragons."

[Elmo]

"malice that wakes in the morning is the mirth of Morgoth ere night."

[Gwathagor]

"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger."

[Ibrîniðilpathânezel]

"Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment."

Not that I've wanted to kill people on a daily basis , but a point well made, that justice and judgment are not things to be handed out rashly, for people and situations are often more complex than we know.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Ibrîniðilpathânezel

"Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment."

Not that I've wanted to kill people on a daily basis , but a point well made, that justice and judgment are not things to be handed out rashly, for people and situations are often more complex than we know.

Quite, quite - that's probably the best one from the entire book (and really "classic") - although it does not come to my mind "as I'm going about daily business", like the phrasing in the original post was. Maybe because indeed "not that I've wanted to kill people on daily basis", but possibly to a person who is in close contact to such a situation (lawmakers, somewhere judges, army employees...) this could come into mind "on daily basis".

[Ibrîniðilpathânezel]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Quite, quite - that's probably the best one from the entire book (and really "classic") - although it does not come to my mind "as I'm going about daily business", like the phrasing in the original post was. Maybe because indeed "not that I've wanted to kill people on daily basis", but possibly to a person who is in close contact to such a situation (lawmakers, somewhere judges, army employees...) this could come into mind "on daily basis".

Actually, it DOES come to my mind quite often, when I react to the behavior of people I encounter on the streets, in stores, on the road, etc. who irritate the bejeebers out of me. When my knee-jerk reaction is to become angry and judgmental, I try to remind myself to pause and remember that I don't know why that person behaves as they do. It could be plain bad manners and self-centeredness, or it could be something more. It doesn't always work, of course, but once in a while, it reminds me to seek to forgive rather than avenge. I suppose this is partly the product of having grown up in a large abusive family. It was reading LotR and much of the wisdom of Gandalf that helped me try to not become the same kind of abusive, judgmental person as many of those who made my life among them so horrible. One can choose not to carry on the pattern of abuse that so often is handed down from generation to generation.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Ibrîniðilpathânezel

Actually, it DOES come to my mind quite often, when I react to the behavior of people I encounter on the streets, in stores, on the road, etc. who irritate the bejeebers out of me. When my knee-jerk reaction is to become angry and judgmental, I try to remind myself to pause and remember that I don't know why that person behaves as they do. It could be plain bad manners and self-centeredness, or it could be something more. It doesn't always work, of course, but once in a while, it reminds me to seek to forgive rather than avenge. I suppose this is partly the product of having grown up in a large abusive family. It was reading LotR and much of the wisdom of Gandalf that helped me try to not become the same kind of abusive, judgmental person as many of those who made my life among them so horrible. One can choose not to carry on the pattern of abuse that so often is handed down from generation to generation.

Very good for you then, I'd say. Myself, fortunately, I had the upbringing from very childhood to forgive, not to judge or to avenge, but still, Gandalf's words are something that speaks to me even now and which resonates through me - not thinking about it on daily basis maybe, but from time to time, I recall it as probably the most addressing quote of the whole LotR. And actually when looking at this thread first, I could not immediately think of any other quote I could name as anything I would recall (I don't recall any other one even now).

[Guinevere]

Great thread, Inziladun!
I love all Tolkien's "proverbs", "aphorisms" "sayings, general wisdoms or whatever you like to call them. They are so applicable!
Some years ago I started collecting them - I think it was the game in "quotable quotes" that started me on this.

And for many situations in everyday life one of these proverbs comes to my mind.

"Advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise."

Gildor's answer to Frodo one is useful when friends ask for advice in very personal matters...

"Despair is only for those who see the end beyond all doubt."

"All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

Gandalf's wisdom is always a comfort and encouragement in difficult times!

"It's the job that's never started as takes longest to finish"

I use the Gaffer's down-to-earth statement to remind myself, but also for my son who is a master of procrastination!

"For such is the way of it: to find and lose, as it seems to those whose boat is on the running stream."

I love Legolas' melancholy but poetical truth

"There are some things that it is better to begin than to refuse, even though the end may be dark."

Aragorn's words are an encouragement to me


Btw, have you checked out The Gaffer's Mixed-up Proverbs by Esty?

[Groin Redbeard]

"Go not to the elves for counsel..." Although this is only half a quote it's my favorite.

If I was to search for a quote that I really like it would definitely be this one that Gimli said. "Faithless is he that says farewell when the road darkens."

[Estelyn Telcontar]

There was an excellent lecture on Tolkien's aphorisms at Oxonmoot this year; when we were asked for examples, the first that occurred to me was from the end of LotR:

I will not say: do not weep; for not all tears are an evil. (Gandalf)

Tears can have a cleansing, healing effect and can be a sign of positive things happening in our lives.


By the way, Tom Shippey also lectured on proverbs in Tolkien's works at "Tolkien 2005" in Birmingham. For those who would like to read his paper, it has been published both in the Tolkien 2005 Proceedings and in the collected essays of Shippey, Roots and Branches.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Estelyn Telcontar

There was an excellent lecture on Tolkien's aphorisms at Oxonmoot this year; when we were asked for examples, the first that occurred to me was from the end of LotR:
Tears can have a cleansing, healing effect and can be a sign of positive things happening in our lives.


By the way, Tom Shippey also lectured on proverbs in Tolkien's works at "Tolkien 2005" in Birmingham. For those who would like to read his paper, it has been published both in the Tolkien 2005 Proceedings and in the collected essays of Shippey, Roots and Branches.

Yes, the Tom Shippey lecture was particularly fantastic, well worth a read folks! Even though our copy of the papers has still not arrived, and maybe TS Trading could learn from a few proverbs about being tardy?

[Groin Redbeard]

Originally Posted by Ibrîniðilpathânezel

"Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment."

While this quote is good, I think that best quote from that discussion would be when Frodo was talking about how sad it was that the task was appointed to him.

"I wish the Ring had never come to me, I wish none of this had happened."
"So do all who live to see such times, but that is not for them to decide all you need to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you."

This is the quote that I think of most often in my day to day life. When I get a difficult task appointed to me or when I am sorry for myself that I was not in happier circumstances I think of that quote and it reminds me that it is no use pouting about something you can't change and best get the task done.

What Gandalf said resignates a sense of purpose in all that we do. Nothing is left to chance.

[Lalwendë]

I don't think you can go far wrong with the advice in this couplet:

All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;

However my favourite phrase is one that isn't really advice, more of a heavily veiled compliment, and one I've still to find an occasion to use despite it coming to mind most days:

I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.

[Eönwë]

Originally Posted by Lalwendë

However my favourite phrase is one that isn't really advice, more of a heavily veiled compliment, and one I've still to find an occasion to use despite it coming to mind most days:

I have to admit, I've always tried to find a good place for that, but never managed.

And the first half of the Aragorn poem is quite good (especially the first half ofthat, basically, what Lal quoted)